The Official AVS Antenna and Related Hardware Topic! - Page 187

Antennaweb.org for Akron doesn't show a channel 20 or 41. Reception might not be feasible for some reason.

WFMJ-DT 20 and WKBN-DT 41 from Youngstown...

Both are weak, but can be received by analog.

Both are using less power for digital than analog, and their digital antenna are a little lower on the tower than the analog. If you can see a very snowy picture with analog, you probably don't have good enough signal-to-noise ratio for digital to work.

And, at 45 (or so) miles from the towers, an indoor antenna just isn't going to work very well.

Thanks for the advice.


Unfortunately, that will not be possible, as I live in an apartment building.


The ATSC is not too bad when it is out on the balcony, I'm on the 19th floor and have a clear view of the transmission towers for the 2 ATSC channels I get, the NTSC is not as good. In both cases I often have to move it, which is somewhat annoying. That is why I was thinking of hooking it up in tandem with another antenna, and living in an apartment my options are limited.

I was thinking the other day that I have probably installed a thousand or more television antennas over the last 25 years or so.
It is still interesting to continue to gain insight in the field.
I just got back from Naples,Florida. I found myself checking some outdoor satellite and tv antenna connections on the roof of a 14 story condo directly on the Gulf of Mexico. We had initially installed the dish and 4 bay bowtie,but after the hurricanes last year I had a local guy repair the "Gainmaster" dish. As you might imagine warm salty breezes consistently blow in on the rooftop antenna site.
Corrosion potential on all connectors is at an extremely high level,so it is a good test bed for prevention techniques.
The local guy reused our snap and seal connectors,but do not use the "waterproofing" nut with a rubber seal that we had put on originally. Unfortunately he did not tighten the connections on the lnbs very well either.
The end result was internal corrosion to the point of a dead short on the Sat C lnb connector. I cleaned it with "Cramolin" a contact cleaner and for the first time I have observed "bubbles" of cleaning action as the agent interacted with the corrosion. The satellite is fine now
The UHF 4 bay antenna actually has survived a couple of pretty big Hurricanes! The 75 to 300 ohm balun seemed in good condition until I pulled off the boot to check the snap an seal connection. It looked like the bottom of an old boat! Barnacles of corrosion on the outside of the connector. It would seem the boot amplified the corrosion effects. Once inside the boot it sits there and builds up. It would probably make sense not to use a boot under most circumstances when using snap and seals or the like.
The "waterproofing" nut was intact. When I inspected the inside of the connector, it was basically spotless!! The combination of the nut and the general seal of the back of the snap and seal had really kept out the salt. Corrosion was only superficial on the outside of the connector. So it looks like the Snap and Seal with the additional "nut"seal would be highly recommended in any outdoor reception installation and "boots" on baluns may do more harm than good. Hope this helps. Dallas

Here are some pictures of the snap and seal connectors and waterproofing seal. Rather small,but hopefully viewable.

Need some advise. We reside in Edinburg, ND. We are approx. 35 miles S of the Canadian border. We would like to receive CBC Manitoba via OTA. Any suggestions as to what type of antenna system might work?? No real mountains between us and the border (no silo's either), so wondering if it would be possible. Thank you.

Sounds like you were at Pelican Bay.

Forget it. I stripped it of useful hardware, and my enterprising lawn guy got it for scrap. I replaced it with my third 4228. I now have *three* 4228's on my roof, each feeding a single set. The amp is going to E-Bay.

Yes! Our client just bought one of the new condos next door at "Aqua". He currently resides on the top floor of the one of the Pelican Lakes buildings next door.
His new Home Theater is going to be(hopefully) pretty darn cool.
It is a couple of years to completion though

Possible, yes; easy, no. First you need to know the channels and locations.

I use http://www.2150.com/broadcast/default.asp
For your location I used 48.497, -97.862

The data shows CBWT (analog) on channel 27, 1000 KW at 1066' height, 89 miles away at 10 degrees azimuth.

KCPM is also on channel 27 digital, 18 KW at 314' height, 52 miles away at azimuth 134 degrees.

The two channel 27s will interfere with each other. If you really wanted to try it, you'd need a tower (or silo), and a large UHF antenna with a preamp. There is a way to add two Channel Master 4228 antennas together to get slightly more signal, but the combination can also null out the interfering signal from another direction. Here's how to do it: http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/16bay.html
The side by side combination is configured to reduce provide a null for you on channel 27 in the proper direction to eliminate KCPM!

It would be a bit easier to get CKY (CTV) on channel 46, at 984' high, 81 miles away at 22 degrees azimuth.

My antenna is a Terk HDTVo. From the antenna to the ground block is 17', followed by about 18-20' in the house. From there it splits two ways into existing wiring, one back 17' to a TV and the other an unknown distance (but probably about 25') to the main distribution point, where it splits three ways again -- I could reduce this to two ways. The rest is existing wiring which I can't really measure. I believe one of the runs (probably to the upstairs) must split at least 2:1 once more, but I don't know which one. And at one of the TVs, there's a 2:1 split for the DVR. This is all RG-6; the RG-59 was just a convenient cable to test with. Rewiring with a more sensible distribution scheme isn't really an option; I'd have to tear up too much drywall.

Antennaweb results are

* yellow - uhf WPVI-DT 6.1 ABC PHILADELPHIA PA 142° 16.0 64
* yellow - uhf KYW-DT 3.1 CBS PHILADELPHIA PA 142° 16.0 26
* red - uhf WTVE-DT 51.1 IND READING PA 319° 15.3 25
* blue - uhf WGTW-DT 27.1 TBN BURLINGTON NJ 141° 16.2 27
* blue - uhf WYBE-DT 34.1 PBS PHILADELPHIA PA 141° 16.2 34
* violet - uhf WPHL-DT 17.1 MNT PHILADELPHIA PA 141° 16.2 54
* violet - uhf WTXF-DT 29.1 FOX PHILADELPHIA PA 138° 15.3 42
* violet - uhf WPPX-DT 61.1 i WILMINGTON DE 141° 16.2 31

These are ridiculously conservative; I get a few channels not listed, including WHYY-DT (channel 55). With the Terk's internal pre-amp off I get all except WTXF-DT and WHYY-DT. (and maybe WPPX, I don't really care about that one)

I have, but I'm limited being in a townhouse community. I can't attach anything to the roof, and I'm stretching things (at least according to the letter of the FCC regs) by having the Terk hang out over the deck. A CM4221 or similar would likely irritate the heck out of the neighbors.

I was in the process of mounting a CM4221 on the roof of our house this weekend when my wife was complaining on how ugly it looks and that it stuck out like a sore thumb. I thought it was beautiful. Being her nagging began to run into other parts of our relationship, I gave in to her like a man without any balls and remounted it in the attic. Eventhough I was loosing approximately 30% signal strength, I was pulling in all my locals at 100% as I am only 10 miles from almost all the towers.

The SA-2F (a Littelfuse SiDACtor and other similar MOV devices) are solid state devices that gradually self-destruct as they provide protection, esp. when several devices are paralled to increase the current rating--which means that it is difficult to tell how much "life" is left in the device. A simple GO-NOGO test would be to apply greater than 25 volts via a current limiting resistor and verify that it clamps the voltage like a zener diode.

The solid state SiDACtor and MOV devices are not intended to replace the NEC Code mandated high current spark gap devices. I would place the SiDACtor or MOV type device close to the equipment to be protected, which ensures maximum attenuation of overvoltage signals via the interconnecting coax from the spark gap device.

The spark gap device must be installed in accordance with NEC Code requirements, which ensures that lightning and static buildup has the SHORTEST possible (hopefullly OUTDOOR) route to ground. You don't want a lighting bolt running through your house or garage on it's way to a "more convenient" grounding point.

Other than checking for an obvious short and melted metal, I don't think there is any simple way to test how well a spark gap device is working--unless you have experience working with tubes and their high voltage power supplies, you probably don't want to do a test to verify the high voltage breakdown voltage.....

Thanks for the advice, but no need now since my wife took control of the situation (see above).

Hi, I've surfed and surfed but haven't really found any info on this...

I need a hi-band VHF antenna, and the two best candidates are the Antennacraft Y10-7-13 and the Winegard YA1713. The two are similar, and I can't decide which would be best.

The Winegard is a little shorter and has fewer elements.

The Antennacraft is longer, has more elements, and has a folded dipole, which I really prefer.

I know most people might say Winegard right off the bat, but I think that's mainly because they know Antennacraft makes Radio Shack's antennas and they didn't have a good experience with them. But I think Antennacraft has some good designs that they don't make available to RS -- and frankly I like my RS Fm antenna better than the Winegard 6065 I purchased. The Winegard is kind of flimsy and despite being a "better" antenna, it really doesn't work much if any better than the cheaper and smaller Antennacraft-made RS antenna.

If anyone has any experience with these two antennas, I'd really appreciate hearing about it.

Hi All,

Been awhile since I posted here, but after finding out that D* won't give me waivers for ABC and CBS HD, I went out and bought a mast, rotor, amp/preamp, etc. I already have the antenna.

I'm ready to put it up.

The spot I picked out is going to a few feet in the ground up past the peak of my house. The mast will be mounted to the outside wall with standoffs, from the bottom up to the point where the peak of the house is. My main question is, how much higher can I go above the roofline without guy wires being needed (last spot the mast will be secured is a few inches below the roofline) I am kind of in a valley here in Niceville, so height will probably be real important.

Here are the particulars.

I have four 10 foot sections of 16 guage mast, 1 1/2 inch diameter.

Two of the sections from the ground are almost level with the peak of the house, so, once I sink a few feet of it in the ground with concrete, it will be a few feet below the peak, add another section, it will be roughly 7-8 feet above the roofline, then add a little for the rotor and antenna assembly. I would think this would be ok as is, but would like any info you all might want to add.

Now I assume adding in the last ten foot section (making it 17-18 foot above the peak of the house) would be too wobbly if unsecured, or would it? Any thoughts? Could I go even higher, if secured? What are my limitations here?

Thanks for any info you can give me.

Bruce/FL, keep in mind thats it's your local station that wont give you the wavier and it's making you spend your money to set up an antenna. D* will send you a signal if THEY (your station) approve the wavier. Usually HD OTA is better. These posters know their stuff.

This is called a ground mount and is one of the most sturdy installations. I don't see any advantage of sinking the bottom into the ground. Just use a footer of some sort i.e. large flat rock or cement sidewalk tread.

I would recommend using a telescoping mast. I used a 30 footer and installed it upside down so the stiffest part is at the top. This also allows you to raise/lower the antenna very easily for fine tuning the signal.

There's an antenna installation guide at CM's website. I think it says 10 feet above roofline without need for guying with this type of mount. This is a rough estimate and obviously depends on your particulars, primarily how big of an antenna you put up.

I've had my rig up for a couple of years now and it's about 8 feet above roofline without problems. I could go higher but it actually is in the "sweet spot" for signal as is.

I've used both and found them to be nearly equal in performance.The Antennacraft a slight edge at my particular location on certain channels.

If you like the folded-dipole design,I have some Funke PSP.1922's available.They are incrementally better than the above models(13ft length/higher gain/better front/back)).I use two in a horizontal stack with modified booms.They seem to be holding up well to the elements.Here's a pic of one installed(top antenna),courtesy of forum member cpcat.Send me a pm if interested.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attac...chmentid=35151

http://community-2.webtv.net/GregBar...TowerAntennas/

This is my info from antennaweb:

yellow - uhf WHRO-DT 15.1 PBS HAMPTON-NORFOLK VA 261° 11.9 16
yellow - uhf WTVZ-DT 33.1 MNT NORFOLK VA 261° 11.9 38
yellow - uhf WVEC-DT 13.1 ABC HAMPTON VA 261° 9.8 41
yellow - uhf WPXV-DT 49.1 i NORFOLK VA 261° 11.9 46
yellow - uhf WTKR-DT 3.1 CBS NORFOLK VA 261° 11.9 40
red - uhf WGNT-DT 27.1 CW PORTSMOUTH VA 258° 9.7 50
red - uhf WAVY-DT 10.1 NBC PORTSMOUTH VA 266° 12.1 31
red - uhf WVBT-DT 43.1 FOX VIRGINIA BEACH VA 266° 12.1 29


We live in an apartment building on the first floor. It has to be an indoor antenna. We already have the following antenna from radio shack we're using on our old non-HD tv: Antenna @ Radio Shack

Is that going to be enough? I've been looking at the Zenith/Philips everybody has, which looks like it would get us the same channels.

Opinions?

Now that would get a HOA Riled up !!

Cpcat...... Sweet set-up !!

What IS that? I'm guessing the bottom two are ganged VHF yagis, though the extra unconnected dipole looks odd. But why are the UHF yagis on top tripled and at different angles?

Hmm. I could perfectly legally mount such a setup attached to my deck. Then the association would BEG for a simple CM4221 extending off of it :-).

Televes DAT 75's on top (uhf) at 57 in. spacing.

Antennacraft Y10 7-13's on bottom (high band vhf) at 83 in. spacing.

If you're getting good reception on the analog channels with the RS model, the chances are good that you'll have acceptable results with it on the digitals. Have you got a digital tuner yet?

As for the Silver Sensor, it's probably the best indoor, set-top antenna made. Since your stations are basically all in the same direction, and they're all UHF (which is only what the SS will receive), it should be as good a choice as any, if not better. Just find the right (sweet) spot for it and you should never even have to touch it or turn it. If you can find one at a Circuit City near you, you can always return it easily enough should it not do the job.

Here are my results from Antenna Web:

Red-UHF KARE-DT 11.1 NBC MPLS MN 324° 34.8 Miles 35
Red-UHF WFTC-DT 29.1 MNT MPLS MN 325° 34.2 Miles 21
Red-UHF WCCO-DT 4.1 CBS MPLS MN 324° 34.8 Miles 32
Red-UHF KMSP-DT 9.1 FOX MPLS MN 325° 34.2 Miles 26
Red-UHF KSTC-DT 45.1 IND MPLS MN 324° 34.8 Miles 44
Red-UHF KSTP-DT 5.1 ABC MPLS MN 324° 34.8 Miles 50
Red-UHF KTCA-DT 2.1 PBS MPLS MN 325° 34.2 Miles 34
Red-UHF KTCI-DT 17.1 PBS MPLS MN 325° 34.2 Miles 16
Blue-UHF WUCW-DT 23.1 CW MPLS MN 324° 34.8 Miles 22

They suggested a "Medium Directional rooftop with pre-amp"

I live in a pretty heavily wooded area. All things being equal, I'd prefer to try a good INDOOR antenna first. I currently just have a little Jensen indoor, similar to the TV910. It does an "okay" job, but there's frequently a lot of breakup. I have it hooked into my DirecTV H20, and since I have "locals" thru DTV, I just need an antenna to pull in the digital signals that AREN'T part of the locals package: PBS, CW are a couple of those I need the digital signal help with. I already get the "Majors" (ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX) digitally thru DTV.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. If "outdoor" is the way to go, that's fine too.

Thanks.

I keep wanting to get a couple 91xg's and stack them to compare but I've not done it as of yet. I've not seen a report of the 91xg stacked yet either. Forum member MaxHD uses Funke 4591's and thinks they are a little better than the DAT 75's and the xg is basically a clone of the 4591.

Does anyone have any ideas on how to mount a Channel Master 9521A rotor to a Rohn 25G accessory shelf (AS25G)? It's to be mounted inside a 25AG4 top section that includes a thrust bearing. I know the thrust bearing is not absolutely necessary but I have it and I want to use it. I had a bracket built by a machine shop but I'm not happy with the results. The rotor wouldn't turn like it used to since I can't get it lined up perfectly with the thrust bearing. I considered using a heavier duty ham rotor but apparently none of them are capable of using a remote with automatic presets like the Channel Master controller. I've attached a photo of the old bracket. It was basically a pipe welded onto a flat plate which was attached to the accessory shelf. I tried loosening the bolts in the thrust bearing but it still had problems. Any suggestions are welcome.