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Pioneer Elite Pro-510 problem - Page 9

post #241 of 2919
Please excuse my lack of knowledge - So I'm asking for help.

Background
Two weeks ago the approved repair shop took my credit card number but forgot to order the board -AWV 1795- so Wed I ordered it directly from Pioneer and call them to install - which they now say they will not do the install becaused I got the board myself.

Can I install it my self? If so can some one give me a few instuctions. I understand I should unplug the set and not mess with the "angled" back panel just the lower part. But where will I find the old AWV 1795 as I face the back of the set and is there any thing special I should watch or be specially careful not to touch etc. I am over 60, so I'm not too good at this stuff.

Thanks
post #242 of 2919
I'm also a proud owner of a defective PRO510HD. I'm experiencing the dim, intermittent flash, intermittent pops and the latest issue: SELF POWER OFF!.

The unit is powering off at least once a day. I turn it off at the main front switch and allow it to rest before powering back up. Whent it shuts down, only the front red LED remains lit and no matter what you do it will not power up.

I plan to resodder the power supply PCB, but is there a specific PCB or component that is causing the self power off?

Thanks to all who have reported all there findings it has been very usefull and entertaining.
post #243 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandpaJ View Post

Please excuse my lack of knowledge - So I'm asking for help.

Background
Two weeks ago the approved repair shop took my credit card number but forgot to order the board -AWV 1795- so Wed I ordered it directly from Pioneer and call them to install - which they now say they will not do the install becaused I got the board myself.

Can I install it my self? If so can some one give me a few instuctions. I understand I should unplug the set and not mess with the "angled" back panel just the lower part. But where will I find the old AWV 1795 as I face the back of the set and is there any thing special I should watch or be specially careful not to touch etc. I am over 60, so I'm not too good at this stuff.

Thanks

It's so easy. Everybody can do it. Just follow instructions as in this thread.

1. Open Back of TV. Power board is right side of back.
2. Unplug all white connector softly
3. unscrew everything on that borad.
4. replace new board.

I will upload picture when I will get to home.
post #244 of 2919
Pankaj2000

Thanks for your reply. Hope it is as easy as it seems in your instructions-

I have old fat fingers so handling the screws might be a challenge. Hope there are not too many. Picture would be helpful

Thanks again.

Jerry
post #245 of 2919
GrandpaJ,

Why not call a local (not authorized) TV repair guy and tell him what needs to be done. I am sure they would come out and do it for a nominal fee.
post #246 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by pankaj2000 View Post

It's so easy. Everybody can do it. Just follow instructions as in this thread.

1. Open Back of TV. Power board is right side of back.
2. Unplug all white connector softly
3. unscrew everything on that borad.
4. replace new board.


Any of this genre are completely out of warranty by now, so whoever you use, just make sure they know what they are doing. They do NOT have to be factory authorized - industry-speak for being a registered warranty station with that brand/manufacturer - to be excellent techs. Warranty rates are typically abysmal, and I for one do NOT do warranty work for any but a select few brands.


If you do it yourself, let me add one quick note to the above:

UNPLUG IT!

I kid you not, there have been times when even a seasoned pro repair person like myself forgets to unplug a set he's about work on!

And I don't mean just turn it off! UNPLUG IT! There are passive circuits still alive and waiting for commands in there whenever it is plugged in.

And you DON'T want your cat walking over the remote while your back is turned, if you DIDN'T unplug it!


Mr Bob


PS - I would be glad to travel to Ventura and do the whole thing for you, including a masterful calibration.

These units deserve the best treatment. Unlike most brands, Pioneer defaults their Contrast to midpoint on User, while most brands default it to max. Torch Mode.

As such, Pioneers are typically run all their lives at mid contrast light levels, meaning their CRTs are much younger 5 and 10 years down the line than most other brands, unless those other brands are owned and operated by videophiles, who know better.

You easily have another 5 years of life on your unit, if you have operated it under normal viewing conditions and operating times, of looking BETTER THAN NEW - and true videophile quality at all times - if cleaned and calibrated on a regular basis.

Keep it going!
post #247 of 2919
Thread Starter 
Quote:


Pankaj2000

Thanks for your reply. Hope it is as easy as it seems in your instructions-

I have old fat fingers so handling the screws might be a challenge. Hope there are not too many. Picture would be helpful

Thanks again.

Jerry

Some good suggestions. Also, look about midway back in the thread, there are detailed instructions for replacing the board. I'm not good at these kinds of things, yet I was able to replace mine. A few things you might want to be aware of ...

Once you have unplugged the set and removed the back and unscrewed the screws on the board, the board is still attached to the set by 2 screws you can't get to on the back of the board, you must shove, gently, the board up to clear those 2 screws.

Also, I bought a book of labels for electrical wiring from home depot and labeled all the connectors I disconnected. It would be easy to get confused as to what goes where when you install the new board. I put labels on the wires/connectors as well as on the old board where they connected ... so I could go back and look at it as I was installing the new board.

Handle the board carefully as it bends easily, which could damage it.

It took me about 30 minutes and, by working slowly and carefully, I was able to do the install with no problems.

Good luck.

Jerry
post #248 of 2919
Mr Bob

Thank you for reply. I sent you a PM.

Jerry
post #249 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by djguy View Post


Once you have unplugged the set and removed the back and unscrewed the screws on the board, the board is still attached to the set by 2 screws you can't get to on the back of the board, you must shove, gently, the board up to clear those 2 screws.

These are big guide screws on the wooden floor of the unit. They slot into the bottom of the board's metal casing, which you have to remove the board from, via many small screws. This carrier casing has lots of metal on the bottom, impeding easy entry to much of the soldering spaces on the bottom of the board. The board must be completely removed, including all screws except the big guide ones for the slots, for the resoldering at hand. Leave alone those big guide ones, mounted to the floor of the unit.

Be careful of the screws that hold the heatsinks on, some of them are insulated with plastic add-ons.

Quote:

Also, I bought a book of labels for electrical wiring from home depot and labeled all the connectors I disconnected. It would be easy to get confused as to what goes where when you install the new board. I put labels on the wires/connectors as well as on the old board where they connected ... so I could go back and look at it as I was installing the new board.


That would be good on a Pioneer. Mit keeps EVERY plug-in labeled, in both the plug and its jack. Pioneer does not.

Quote:
Handle the board carefully as it bends easily, which could damage it.

It took me about 30 minutes and, by working slowly and carefully, I was able to do the install with no problems.

Good luck.

Jerry


Good tips. A few pages back I did a big writeup on good soldering technique, for anyone who wants to do the soldering end of it themselves.


Mr Bob
post #250 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandpaJ View Post

Mr Bob

Thank you for reply. I sent you a PM.

Jerry


Got it. Sent you one back.
post #251 of 2919
Add another set tp the list. TV just started to go light then dark some what .It does return to normal have not had issues with it shutting down though.

Thanks to all the people that took the time to post procedures on the forum.

Anyone know of a good Tech located in Suffolk Long Island ???
post #252 of 2919
Total number is above 40 elite owners.
It just keep increasing number of TV Owners with problem
post #253 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by pankaj2000 View Post

Total number is above 40 elite onwers.
It just keep increasing number of TV Owners with problem

No, it can't be that many, otherwise Pioneer would certainly have heard of this problem before.
post #254 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty View Post

No, it can't be that many, otherwise Pioneer would certainly have heard of this problem before.

I counted myself in july 2005. Number was 37 and there are couplr of new owner added. If you count from start all number, I bet I am 100% sure it is over 40.
Well pioneer does not know about that but they might know about this thread about their design fault.
post #255 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by pankaj2000 View Post

Well pioneer does not know about that but they might know about this thread about their design fault.


I would not doubt that. They probably don't want to show any sign that they know about this, or they will be expected to do something about it. Who knows, maybe that could mean a massive recall on Pioneer's part...

A few years ago Paul Carleton experimented with his Mits x5 series 65", and came up with tweaks that would solve lots of issues, edge enhancement and YC delay among them.

He notified Mit about it, and they never responded. But the following year all those problems had been taken care of.

No, no admissions of guilt from them, nor were there any congraulations, which might have led to requests for royalties from Paul. Not even a slap on the back from Mit, nor even an honorable mention.

But at least Mit took care of business, and implemented changes.

Hopefully these problems did not extend into the 20 and 30 series of Elites, as they were here with the 10 series.

Unfortunately, the 30 series was the last. Pioneer won't be in the CRT business to kick around anymore, after this year's model run is gone...


I know that I have personally found many cases of coolant leakage of Mit RPTVs in the last few years, causing irreparable damage to their irreplaceable 4 layer signal boards. Their answer? Prorate the cost of the set over 7 years, kiss off the set and take care of the customer that way. If it's 6 years old, you're covered with 1/7 the original value of your set. 5 years old, 2/7 the value. If it's 8 years or older, you're totally SOL.

Since my calibration protocols and professional optics cleaning techniques can successfully keep CRT RPTVs looking better than new - sparkling bright and videophile grade, fully clean and transparent at all critical points and completely dialed in - for well over 10 years, this does not go down well with me at all.


Mr Bob
post #256 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by pankaj2000 View Post

I counted myself in july 2005. Number was 37 and there are couplr of new owner added. If you count from start all number, I bet I am 100% sure it is over 40.
Well pioneer does not know about that but they might know about this thread about their design fault.

I was being facetious about Pioneer not knowing, hence the . Their customer service is either incompetent, or they are deliberately sticking their heads in the sand on this issue. You might as well be talking to the phone company or the federal government.
post #257 of 2919
I just put a plane flight to Long Beach in place, arriving midday Tuesday of next week, departing late in the day Saturday. Got some business to do down there, but will leave lots of free time.

If you would like me to take care of your unit while there and you live in the Southern CA area, contact me and we'll get it done while I am there. There have been 2 inquiries so far - one from Ventura and one from Huntington Beach - but nothing has been set in stone as yet. I have one double calibration set presently on the books while down there, refered to me by someone whose Sony I did while I was last there a couple of weeks ago, but will have room for more.

This would include resoldering the boards affected, replacing them if they've been ordered, and calibration.

Let me know if you want in on this.


Mr Bob
post #258 of 2919
Thanks Mr. Bob, I would like to shedule a date and time next week so you could solder my board and do a calibration on my Elite Pro 710. I will call you to set up an appoitment next week in Huntington Beach CA

Thanks Jeff
post #259 of 2919
Just registered to add another PRO-610 owner to the list that has the blue flash, pop, power problem.
post #260 of 2919
Hey guys......add me on to this list too now......I started seeing the blue flashes and then TV shutting off after 10 mins. I took the PS Board out and took it to an electrician to resolder it, since I didnt want to mess it up. I even told them some of the trouble spots from this forum and so I got the board back and installed it. Who the hell knows what he did but now no audio or video. You hear the power switching on and even the red LED going to green. Its like there is no power going to the audio or the video. So, I took the board back out and checked it out a couple of times. Same results. So, now im just going to replace the board with a new one with much thanks to Mr. Bob who ordered me one. I don't know why I ended up with this kinda result and so many other sucesses. Hopefully a new PS Board will solve the issue.
post #261 of 2919
I have a Pro 710 and took the power supply board out and did the soldering. I did not see any obvious bad solder joints but I did re-solder E3 and E5 connector pins. Be careful these pins are very close to one another and you have to be careful not to get bridges. I used a 7x headset magnifying glases and very fine solder. So far after 3 hours no blue flash and brightness changes. If they reoccur I will order a new board, I do not want to try resoldering those tightly spaced pins again.
Good luck
post #262 of 2919
Well, after resoldering the questionable IC components and all the "E" connectors on the power supply PCB, my PRO510 appears to be back to normal (knock on wood). Two weeks so far and I have not seen the dim, flash or shutdown issues I was experiencing on a daily basis. Good luck to others it is definitely a power supply quality issue. Shame on Pioneer for not acknowleding the issue. Thanks to all who posted their findings.
post #263 of 2919
until this date, Total number around is 45.

45 Elite owners
post #264 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsoly View Post

Thanks Mr. Bob, I would like to shedule a date and time next week so you could solder my board and do a calibration on my Elite Pro 710. I will call you to set up an appoitment next week in Huntington Beach CA

Thanks Jeff


Looking forward to seeing you Thursday in Huntington Beach, as scheduled via our phone call.


Mr Bob
post #265 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinedsa View Post

Well, after resoldering the questionable IC components and all the "E" connectors on the power supply PCB, my PRO510 appears to be back to normal (knock on wood).

Shame on Pioneer for not acknowleding the issue. Thanks to all who posted their findings.

Their techs know about it, and mentioned it to me when I called in as a tech myself the other day.

However, they will ONLY RETURN a call to a tech in the field - and who knows when, usually impossible to get the callback while still on location - and they will NOT talk to any tech who does not have the service manual.

I had ordered one, so I had what Parts had sent me, but there are 3 versions for the PRO 510HD - one of which is strictly adjustments - and mine did not have the protection circuits info, which was what I needed for that particular job. But they were very gracious and willing to fax me out just those pages, without requiring me to purchase another manual version to get them.

I called in and the version I have has the same number of pages as theirs - 123 - and the protection info is in the 200's. Of obviously a different manual.

My impression is that the technical assistance department, at least, is privy to all that's been mentioned here. And then some. The tech I talked to was VERY helpful. (Thanks, Alan!)


Mr Bob
post #266 of 2919
If Pioneer knows of the problem with the Power Assembly board it is shameful that they do not acknowledge this defect and cover it under their warranty and offer a replacement board to affected customers.
post #267 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsoly View Post

If Pioneer knows of the problem with the Power Assembly board it is shameful that they do not acknowledge this defect and cover it under their warranty and offer a replacement board to affected customers.

If I am CEO of Pioneer, then I would think, that for $300 part of $6000 to $8000 TV Price, I would replace power board for all TV sold during 2000-2001.
Less than 5% of pric, atleast Pioneer can regain quality and reliability of TV.

I never gooing to buy pioneer product again and will tell others to do same.
post #268 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsoly View Post

If Pioneer knows of the problem with the Power Assembly board it is shameful that they do not acknowledge this defect and cover it under their warranty and offer a replacement board to affected customers.


My sentiments exactly. These mamas can be kept looking awesome for well over 10 years. They can be looking quite exceptional for well over 15 years.


Mr Bob
post #269 of 2919
My 710HD was manufactured in November 2000 and I bought it in January 2001. Around August (2005) I noticed the blue flash. For me, it occurred maybe 3 times in a 2 hour period, but the set never shut off. I have so many source devices (DVD, VCR, HD-PVR, Satellite, etc.) and they're connected through an A/V receiver and scaler that it took a while to figure out that it was the TV itself with the problem.

I had what appeared to be similar problems with a 25 GE and 35 Mitsubishi direct view sets, which turned out to be dust collecting on the picture tube anode cable, causing an arc and flash. In those cases I cleaned the cable and covered it with silicone grease which prevented the arcing. That fix worked on those sets for years.

I tried the same thing on the 710, but the flashes returned within a day. I was actually searching for something else when I stumbled upon this thread. This past Saturday I opened the set, removed the PS board and looked for cold solder joints. The vast majority of the solder points looked as though they had been flow soldered. They weren't shiny, but they weren't obviously cracked either. There were a few places that had been hand soldered, and a couple of jumpers (which looked like 16 gauge zip chord) had been soldered on as well and then glued with big globs of silicone seal. I touched up a few places that looked suspect, but really couldn't find anything definitive. I put it all back together, turned the TV back on, and it appeared that things were OK. That night we watched a DVD and the flashing returned. Boooooo!

Sunday morning I reread through this thread and noted Dave G's comments on E3, IC202 and IC204. So, I pulled the board again, and re-soldered all the connections on those components, whether or not they looked OK. I'm happy to say as I write this on the following Thursday, after watching approximately 16 hours of TV, that the blacks are black and I have not seen any blue flashes.

So, if you're one of those unfortunate enough to have this problem, follow Dave's advise and re-solder E3, IC202 and IC204. Hopefully you'll be glad you did.

Many thanks to Dave G. and all that contributed to this thread.

Mike
post #270 of 2919
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcherdering View Post

My 710HD was manufactured in November 2000 and I bought it in January 2001. Around August (2005) I noticed the blue flash. I'm happy to say as I write this on the following Thursday, after watching approximately 16 hours of TV, that the blacks are black and I have not seen any blue flashes.

So, if you're one of those unfortunate enough to have this problem, follow Dave's advise and re-solder E3, IC202 and IC204. Hopefully you'll be glad you did.

Many thanks to Dave G. and all that contributed to this thread.

Mike


Where's Arcadia? As of right now I am still in Long Beach if you want a cal done on your 710, now that it's fixed. Just did Kingsoly's yesterday, which among other things included remedying a horrendous amount of green in his darks, on all scanrates. Causing everything to look really sour. It is all well balanced now, with gleamingly clean blacks and grays.

I am presently scheduled to go back to No Cal late Saturday.

Will be glad to stay a little longer if other repair/cal jobs here - or within driving distance of here - occur.


Mr Bob
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