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The Official Kd-34xbr960 Thread - Page 266

post #7951 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Dubin View Post

Twice in the past month I was getting the continuous blinks with no picture or sound. Both times I unplugged the set from the wall, waited a few minutes, and the problem went away.

I do notice that when the picture does not come on, one does not hear the automatic degausser pop on when the set is initially turned on.

That happened to me last week and I started to freak out. I too unplugged my set and the picture reappeared. Not sure what happened, but I'm happy my set is still working.
post #7952 of 8134
Oh oh, the timers have triggered... eek.gif and tongue.gif to Sony on this one!
post #7953 of 8134
Low mileage XBR910 for $50 in SW Fort Worth (not me), looks pristine based on the pics:

http://dallas.craigslist.org/ftw/ele/3945166713.html
post #7954 of 8134
Hi Guys,

Quick question.

You might recall I purchased a DVD/VCR combo for video tapes and that the DVD player was only going to be used when my DVD recorder was in use.

Because the new combo only ouput 480p progressive scan on component cable, I just purchased a component to HDMI adapter which upscales to both 780p and 1080p. Since the 960 only displays in 1080i, will it take the 1080p signal and just display it at 1080i or will I get a blank screen instead?

If so, I'll output in at 720p but was wondering about that in advance. In either case, I know I'll get a better signal than simply 480p. And since the adapter only cost $30 (not tax or shipping) it was still less expensive that having to by a DVD Recorder/VCR combo at more than twice the price I paid for this one.
post #7955 of 8134
Floydage-

that XBR910 is still a sweet CRT! I wish I lived closer to Dallas.
post #7956 of 8134
Yeah that 910 is tempting JA but since I already have a Panny I'm being real picky and holding out for a 'nice' 960; more recent model, built-in ATSC tuner, and full HDMI. Unless someone claims the 910 is better for reliability or some key features as I do have a pair of HD tuners. Too bad they're not throwing in the stand.

The 970 is the most recent but was that a cost-reduced version? (no SFP picture tube).
post #7957 of 8134
Hi, Joe.

Since no one else has replied yet, I'll take a stab at it: You won't see anything feeding a 1080P signal to the '960. You will need to use the 720P output.

Regards,

Mark
post #7958 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTV Mark View Post

Hi, Joe.

Since no one else has replied yet, I'll take a stab at it: You won't see anything feeding a 1080P signal to the '960. You will need to use the 720P output.

Regards,

Mark

Hi Mark,

After submitting my question I then suspected such since the 960 was made prior to 1080p. Todays 720p models can accept a 1080p signal and down-convert it. Am not going to even try. wink.gif

I'll let you know how the up-scaler works - I read that many use a composite/S Video to HDMI up-scaler for their video games so some might be interested.

Thanks again.
post #7959 of 8134
Update on that component to HDMI upscaler - it didn't work at all. Guess that is what happens when one thinks they can get something inexpensively to do such a job.

As said, the 480p picture on my DVD/VCR combo is excellent though it just lacks the certain punch that an upscaled 1080i picture can produce. So thought for a few extra dollars I could get the DVD up-converted - none of the new ones on the market have 1080i/p up-conversion unless they are recorders at more than twice the price.

Still, the main purpose was to replace an old VCR for playback purposes and this new model shows just what the 960 can do with it's line doubling mechanism and DCR palette.
post #7960 of 8134
Sorry to hear Joseph. I haven't had any luck with upscaling although my Panny CRT only has component inputs max. Both a Toshiba DVDR and a Sony BP look progressively less clear (like there's a haze or something) as I try to increase the format above 480i on DVDs recorded with the Toshiba via s-video input. Now the Sony does do justice to movie DVDs on 480p but CP keeps me from getting anything higher using a component connection. I also have a Toshiba HDD/DVDR and it does good on 480p but that's as high as it goes. I wish I had an HDMI display to try as the first two players have HDMI outputs. I've read that upconversion is complicated and there are a variety of techniques so I wonder if it requires a high-end machine like an Oppo to see the benefit?
post #7961 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floydage View Post

Sorry to hear Joseph. I haven't had any luck with upscaling although my Panny CRT only has component inputs max. Both a Toshiba DVDR and a Sony BP look progressively less clear (like there's a haze or something) as I try to increase the format above 480i on DVDs recorded with the Toshiba via s-video input. Now the Sony does do justice to movie DVDs on 480p but CP keeps me from getting anything higher using a component connection. I also have a Toshiba HDD/DVDR and it does good on 480p but that's as high as it goes. I wish I had an HDMI display to try as the first two players have HDMI outputs. I've read that upconversion is complicated and there are a variety of techniques so I wonder if it requires a high-end machine like an Oppo to see the benefit?

Hi Floyd,

A bit confused. Don't you have a 960? If not, I believe the problem is that up-conversion can only be output through HDMI but your bluray should be able to playback on 1080i if the Panasonic monitor is HD. If it is a matter of just the single HDMI input on the Sony, Monoprice sells HDMI switch boxes for less than $50 which will resolve that problem because it can accept four or five different inputs and output them through one HDMI connection to the set (I use it for the 960 myself).

I have a Panasonic DVD recorder. Once had a Toshiba DVD recorder as well which I had to return because the copy protection kicked in, even when recording from the weather channel using a coaxial input! eek.gif

To be honest, I was not happy with the picture quality of the Toshiba and my DVD-Rs recorded on the Panasonic look way so much better. I too use a S-video cable coming out from my DVR but the Panasonic also has total flexible recording so if I want to record a movie that takes 2 hours and 15 minutes, I just set it to fill up the disc with that amount only. I record from HD stations so the signal going to the recorder is down-converted to 480i and the recording then up-converted to 1080i as the recorder does have it's own own up-conversion through HDMI.

Compared to the original source, I would say the DVD-R would be between a 7.5 and 8 to the HD broadcast ten. And I would never be able to have the collection of films I do have if I couldn't record them from TV. The only real difference is a softer picture - the color and contrast/black level are actually about the same. And if I record from Turner Classic Movies, one cannot notice much difference up to about 3 hours and 45 minutes for the films are older (even if remastered) as opposed to newer films and prints on HBO-HD, etc.

Although they look good on my Samsung 37 inch LED (up-converted to 1080p), these recordings do look better on the 960 I think due to it's still superior CRT technology. The up-conversion does help on both sets for I've seen lesser quality when playing them back at 480p, 720p.

Hope this information might be of help. There are actually up-converting DVD players for ten dollars more than the adapter I purchased, but it was the VHS feature that I needed.
post #7962 of 8134
Hey Joseph,

I'm watching for a 960 but being very picky and not wanting to drive far (most of the goodies are way on the other side of D/FW from me); there's also the issue of needing help lifting. And the fact that I have a Panny CT-34WX50 means that as time passes it may make less and less sense to mess with it at all. This Panny is a pre-DVI/HDMI version of one of these 34" widescreen HD CRTs and without a built-in ATSC tuner (I acquired two HD tuners on the cheap).

The Sony blu-ray can go all the way up to 1080p on its HDMI. On component it can go up to 1080i (copy guarded against 1080p) and it has notes about some copy guarded DVDs/BDs will max out at 480p.

Yeah I could have snagged a Panny DVDR for $10 but too long a drive (tried to plan it as part of a weekend trip to my friend's on the other side of the 'plex but by then it was gone). When I looked the model up the review claimed good PQ all the way up to LP mode - 4 hours sure would be nice.

I do the same type of recording (HD broadcast>ChannelMaster converter box 16:9 compressed mode ('squeezed' into 4:3)>s-video then decompress using the TV's FULL mode). I'd say I get the same 8 PQ on both the Toshiba DVDR and HDD/DVDR; I'm using the XP 1 hour mode. It's not bad on SP 2 hour mode but really starts falling off above that (maybe LP 4 hour mode = 'basic' VCR). I haven't used it yet but I'm pretty sure they have that flexible recording mode where the end of the recording shifts to a lower PQ mode to make it fit (my Sony VCR has that too, pretty nifty). Of course now that I have the HDD I only use the DVDR for dual recording - the HDD is so convenient to just click and go without all the loading of disks, formatting, finalizing, and waiting; plus I can record an HDD recording directly to its DVDR if I want a keeper; another plus is I can watch one thing while recording something else (or time-slip) without having to record at a much lower PQ mode like the DVDR.

Yeah "softer" is probably the appropriate term, the DVDs 'I record' just get too soft as I try to upscale them on the DVDR or blu-ray. They [and the HDD recordings] do look better on the HDD at 480p but that's as high as it goes and it also doesn't have HDMI (OK, compromises...). I did learn to tone down the contrast to really back off that softness.

I dunno, maybe it's up-conversion via component? Someday I'll find out, and the Toshiba DVDR also has HDMI. I used to use the Sony blu-ray for DVD playback but I used up all of my component inputs on the TV with the HDD and HD tuner. Blu-ray disks are a rarity for me anyway.
post #7963 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floydage View Post

Hey Joseph,

I'm watching for a 960 but being very picky and not wanting to drive far (most of the goodies are way on the other side of D/FW from me); there's also the issue of needing help lifting. And the fact that I have a Panny CT-34WX50 means that as time passes it may make less and less sense to mess with it at all. This Panny is a pre-DVI/HDMI version of one of these 34" widescreen HD CRTs and without a built-in ATSC tuner (I acquired two HD tuners on the cheap).

The Sony blu-ray can go all the way up to 1080p on its HDMI. On component it can go up to 1080i (copy guarded against 1080p) and it has notes about some copy guarded DVDs/BDs will max out at 480p.

Yeah I could have snagged a Panny DVDR for $10 but too long a drive (tried to plan it as part of a weekend trip to my friend's on the other side of the 'plex but by then it was gone). When I looked the model up the review claimed good PQ all the way up to LP mode - 4 hours sure would be nice.

I do the same type of recording (HD broadcast>ChannelMaster converter box 16:9 compressed mode ('squeezed' into 4:3)>s-video then decompress using the TV's FULL mode). I'd say I get the same 8 PQ on both the Toshiba DVDR and HDD/DVDR; I'm using the XP 1 hour mode. It's not bad on SP 2 hour mode but really starts falling off above that (maybe LP 4 hour mode = 'basic' VCR). I haven't used it yet but I'm pretty sure they have that flexible recording mode where the end of the recording shifts to a lower PQ mode to make it fit (my Sony VCR has that too, pretty nifty). Of course now that I have the HDD I only use the DVDR for dual recording - the HDD is so convenient to just click and go without all the loading of disks, formatting, finalizing, and waiting; plus I can record an HDD recording directly to its DVDR if I want a keeper; another plus is I can watch one thing while recording something else (or time-slip) without having to record at a much lower PQ mode like the DVDR.

Yeah "softer" is probably the appropriate term, the DVDs 'I record' just get too soft as I try to upscale them on the DVDR or blu-ray. They [and the HDD recordings] do look better on the HDD at 480p but that's as high as it goes and it also doesn't have HDMI (OK, compromises...). I did learn to tone down the contrast to really back off that softness.

I dunno, maybe it's up-conversion via component? Someday I'll find out, and the Toshiba DVDR also has HDMI. I used to use the Sony blu-ray for DVD playback but I used up all of my component inputs on the TV with the HDD and HD tuner. Blu-ray disks are a rarity for me anyway.

Hi Floyd,

That is exactly what I found with the Toshiba - the quality of the recordings fell drastically past two hours - definitely VHS type quality. Right now I am dubbing two films onto DVD-R from HBO-HD - "Chimpanzee" and "Beasts Of The Southern Wild". Combined they take a total of 2 hours and 53 minutes. Already played back a few minutes of "Chimpanzee" and the video quality was really excellent - sharp but just a bit softer than the original.

My user settings are different for watching cable, a store bought DVD and my own DVD-Rs. Use the "movie" mode for DVDs and "Pro" for DVD-Rs with component cables for the DVR (my A/V receiver does not use HDMI and the cable box audio will not transmit Dolby Digital via toslink if the HDMI output is used). I have calibrated the 960 and was able to adjust the user settings for cable using the old INHD station test patterns and for up-converted DVDs with the THX Optimizer. For DVDr's I had to go back and forth between the original source and my recording to get the dubbed version as close as possible to the original - drove my better half nuts as a slight change in brightness would then affect the contrast and then the color, etc. so it took a lot of going back and forth till I was satisfied.

My recorders is only two or three years old but I notice that no more are being manufactured by Panasonic which might present a problem in the future if this one conks out. There are some older models still available and brand new in box which have the hard drive built in.

Do hope you can get a 960 but indeed have two people lift it for you.
post #7964 of 8134
Hey Joseph,

Yeah that's why I wanted that Panny DVDR even though I already had two machines. I remember it had a unique name for its recording process that achieved higher PQ at the longer time modes. Of course $10 is a steal and worth collecting DVDRs anyway. wink.gif

Dual layer recording sure would be nice but I guess is rare for common DVDRs. I know when I was looking for DVD-RW media the DL media seemed almost nonexistent. Those -RWs weren't easy for me to find either at my local brick&mortar stores - not at Walmart, Best Buy, some office supply stores (one had them but too $), and certainly not the drug or grocery stores. Oddly enough I found them at Target and a great price too, only catch is they're Memorex which I'd heard to avoid but so far so good. +RW appears more commonplace. I chose -RW because the Toshiba DVDR manual lists them as 16:9 capable, playable on most DVD players, and can record copy-once programs (no, +RW player only, and no resp. for +RW).

I've noticed somewhat the same issues with user settings. I get differences between DVDs and DVD-RWs&HDD. DVDs don't give me any soft issues, of course they've got two layers to cram more data and they're not sourced from s-video. And I can almost get by with default settings on DVD (480p), blu-ray (1080i), or the HD tuner all via component; blu-rays look fantastic.
post #7965 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floydage View Post

Hey Joseph,

Yeah that's why I wanted that Panny DVDR even though I already had two machines. I remember it had a unique name for its recording process that achieved higher PQ at the longer time modes. Of course $10 is a steal and worth collecting DVDRs anyway. wink.gif

Dual layer recording sure would be nice but I guess is rare for common DVDRs. I know when I was looking for DVD-RW media the DL media seemed almost nonexistent. Those -RWs weren't easy for me to find either at my local brick&mortar stores - not at Walmart, Best Buy, some office supply stores (one had them but too $), and certainly not the drug or grocery stores. Oddly enough I found them at Target and a great price too, only catch is they're Memorex which I'd heard to avoid but so far so good. +RW appears more commonplace. I chose -RW because the Toshiba DVDR manual lists them as 16:9 capable, playable on most DVD players, and can record copy-once programs (no, +RW player only, and no resp. for +RW).

I've noticed somewhat the same issues with user settings. I get differences between DVDs and DVD-RWs&HDD. DVDs don't give me any soft issues, of course they've got two layers to cram more data and they're not sourced from s-video. And I can almost get by with default settings on DVD (480p), blu-ray (1080i), or the HD tuner all via component; blu-rays look fantastic.

Hi Floyd,

I've used Memorex and TDK DVD-Rs and have had no problems. My brother also uses dual-layered recording discs on his computer burner.

Compared the recordings I mentioned above to the original source material and was very pleased. Sharp, rich and colorful with just a slightly softer picture. Again, I have to tribute that not only to the Panasonic recorder but to the 960 itself. A zoom mode does have to be used for playing back in order fill the screen and I notice a slightly sharper picture using the Panasonic's zoom mode fed into the Sony than using the Sony's zoom instead. Maybe you'll find a slight improvement experimenting that way too.

Hope you're able to find one of these babies soon.
post #7966 of 8134
Thanks Joseph, hopefully that quality transferred to the dubya disks as well.

You know I found the quality a little better when I just recorded in 4:3 mode rather than 16:9 (and hence my desire for -RW disks before I discovered this). After further review it kinda makes sense since the source is 4:3 (16:9 squeezed from converter box) so I could have been wasting data on unused sides of the recording. Hmmm, maybe I'd get better PQ if I used my other HD tuner instead of the converter box and recorded in 16:9 mode? (assuming it actually puts out 16:9 on s-video as I haven't checked). The real question is how is the converter box compressing the 16:9 info into 4:3? (lossy?).
Before I had an HD tuner I used a converter box for the TV. I played around with the box's letterbox mode vs. 16:9 squeezed mode and went in favor of 16:9. General quality was similar, geometry slightly different but in favor of 16:9, but the clincher was that I would see weird horizontal lines or gaps in lettering (using a weather sub-channel) which I presume have something to do with interlace. I don't know if it's the source and/or the way my Panny TV expands the images to fit the screen (LB required AUTO and 16:9 required FULL).
You got me thinking I should see if the Toshiba HDD can expand it better than the TV assuming it doesn't need to be recorded from a full 16:9 source. Now as far as a pure zoom goes (i.e. both horizontal and vertical) I typically see everything get worse as the pixels enlarge.

BTW, do the front doors on the Sonys break off easily? Seems many of the pics I see on Craigslist are sans front doors unless the door disappears from view when opened.
post #7967 of 8134
Hi Floyd,

That is a very interesting point about recording in the 16x9 mode which actually squeezes the picture. I can see it reducing picture quality if it requires more "stretching" during playback. It's not being recoded amaphorically so maybe there is indeed less information in the bite size perhaps making the individual bites the size of recording in something twice as long because of the space that is wasted. Does your set have a horizontal stretch mode like the 960?

My front lid on the 960 is fine - no need to open it all that much. smile.gif
post #7968 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Dubin View Post

Hi Floyd,

That is a very interesting point about recording in the 16x9 mode which actually squeezes the picture. I can see it reducing picture quality if it requires more "stretching" during playback. It's not being recoded amaphorically so maybe there is indeed less information in the bite size perhaps making the individual bites the size of recording in something twice as long because of the space that is wasted. Does your set have a horizontal stretch mode like the 960?

It's probably similar: "FULL will display the picture at its maximum size but with sight elongation." [and they show a 4:3 image stretched horizontally to 16:9]. So by magic it works for this too biggrin.gif . I think this is common and why they made them put that squeeze mode in CECBs so that folks with 16:9 TVs without digital tuners could utilize the full potential of their screens.
I may have to give it a try someday, unfortunately my other HD tuner is a little buggy (Motorola HDT100 - their first HD tuner). It temporarily loses memory of subs when it loses power (long story but I can recover them through a 5 minute procedure but I oftentimes procrastinate getting ready to record something until the last minute). And I'm too much of a power miser to leave it on all the time as its standby mode only shaves off a watt or two and this model is known to have heat issues (I touched its brain IC and a couple of other big ones while in standby and they were hot). Goofy design on multiple counts and I used to work for MOT rolleyes.giftongue.gif . Otherwise it's a great piece of hardware from a great radio company.
post #7969 of 8134
Hello all. I have been reading this thread as a guest for months while searching for a KD-34XBR960. Well, I did eventually find one. It's from 2004 in very good shape, with no anti-glare coating problems. Had to drive 200 miles round trip to get it, and transport it face-down in the back of my Prius. Yes, Priuses (Prii?) have surprisingly good cargo space that can hold this beast.

Anyways, it is my first HDTV and today I was looking forward to hooking up my first Blu-Ray player and enjoying some HD content. I bought a Sony BDP-S5100 with HDMI out, figuring that pairing a Sony with a Sony would make things easy. Well, after connecting the HDMI and turning on the unit, I see the Blu-Ray Disc logo while the machine is booting, then the picture disappears and signal is lost. The input source indicator (Video 7) appears and I am left with a black screen. No picture, no sound. When the Blu-Ray logo appears, the XBR960 Display menu indicates 1080i mode.

I hypothesized that there was some output resolution mismatch. Sony's website said to hold the stop button on the BDP-S5100 for 10 seconds, which changes output resolution to 480p. This did not give me anything beyond a black screen, but the TV display now said 480p.

I took the Blu-Ray player to my dad's house and connected it to his computer monitor. The player booted normally and showed the menus, and I updated the firmware. I went into video settings and changed "Output Video Resolution" to 1080i. Then, I discovered another option for "YCbCr/RGB (HDMI)"...these color space options I am not familiar with. It had been set to Auto, so I changed it to YCbCr 4:2:2. I loaded a Blu-Ray and everything played fine.

I took the player home to my XBR960 once more, and was greeted with a black screen. I had written down "blind directions" to be able to navigate back to the video setting submenus, and I believe I tried the RGB setting to no benefit.

The XBR960 is my only HDMI ready display, so I am really at a loss here. I just wanted to watch some movies. What the heck is going on? I do know that my computer's HDMI output worked fine with the XBR960 at many different Nvidia-preset resolutions, so the HDMI port is functional. Now I have to get a DVI-HDMI adapter to use my monitor to change these player settings and test this thing...but I don't know what's wrong in the first place. Any ideas?
post #7970 of 8134
I suspect your BluRay player is putting out 1080p for content, which the XBR960 cannot accept. The player might be set to "source direct" or something like that.

You need to force 1080i out to the 960, or maybe "auto" which will trigger an HDMI handshake where the 960 will tell the player it cannot accept 1080p and the player will automatically send 1080i.

But the black screen from the player is indication of 1080p output. You must send 1080i.

On the audio side, if you're sending sound to the 960 then you obviously cannot send multi-channel DD5.1 or lossless audio. You must send PCM 2.0 stereo. Again, you'd think that would be selectable in the player, or automatic via HDMI handshake.

But the absence of sound suggests that the player is sending multi-channel encoded sound to the 960 over HDMI.

That's my guess. Strange that these issues are occurring using HDMI connection, unless the player is set to force the audio/video outputs I'm guessing you're experiencing.
post #7971 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by warpz0ne View Post

Hello all.

Hello and welcome! Based on what you've posted it sounds like it should have worked somewhere along those settings unless it's the audio scenario DSperber suggested causing a lock-out of both audio and video.
As another experiment try playing a DVD (as opposed to a Blu-ray disk) - maybe it's stuck in Source Direct.
post #7972 of 8134
I agree that it seems a 1080p signal is being output because that would indeed cause the screen to go black. The fact that you can get the machine's logo to appear on screen shows that the 960 is accepting the initial signal. There is a difference between a 1080i signal which is interlaced and a 1080p signal which is progressive - though on the 960 nobody will ever know it by picture quality.

Do you have a HD cable box or dish to see if it works with another source or an up-converting DVD player that can be set to 1080i?

I'm sure this will work itself out, this being your first experience with HD. Being that it is older is the reason why the 960 cannot accept a 1080p signal.

Congratulations on your new set.
post #7973 of 8134
Created with GIMP

After some more testing via Nvidia Control Panel, I have determined that the TV does not have HDCP. The BR player must be requiring HDCP for the menu screen as well (how silly is that!), which explains the black screen.

There is another thread on AVS here about the same problem. It seems that this TV is supposed to have HDCP, but it failed, and I have to swap out a board to fix this...? How does something like this happen, anyway?

Got the set ISF calibrated today. Hope a board swap wouldn't screw up the calibration.
post #7974 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by warpz0ne View Post

After some more testing via Nvidia Control Panel, I have determined that the TV does not have HDCP.
You mean you connected the 960 to your PC, to see if supports HDCP?

I can assure you that there is absolutely no problem playing BluRay movies from ordinary BluRay players to the 960 via HDMI, assuming the 960 is working correctly. I have played BluRay movies to my 960 via HDMI using three different Oppo players... 83, 93 and 103.

Quote:
The BR player must be requiring HDCP for the menu screen as well (how silly is that!), which explains the black screen.
Intuitively, as a long-time owner of a 960 who's played PLENTY of BluRay movies (via Oppo Players) through the HDMI connection to the 960, I intuitively disagree with your assessment here that the 960 is fundamentally not HDCP compliant. It certainly is, at least normally.

Again, I'm more convinced that your Sony player is possibly set to put out "source direct" or "1080p". Again, the 960 cannot accept 1080p, but rather can only accept 1080i which is perfectly fine.

Or, perhaps you've got the player set to put out 24p, which again is something that the 960 cannot accept.

There's got to be some setting which is not right, and which is being FORCED, and which is incompatible with the 960's capabilities.

Looking at the user manual for your S5100, you should double-check what you have in Setup -> Screen settings. I'm positive you're going to find the answer is there, in some item that is mis-set. Please report back here what you have for all of those settings.

But if you use "auto" FOR ALL OPTIONS THAT PROVIDE THAT CHOICE that is generally the safest option as that uses an HDMI handshake between player and 960 to establish what the TV can and cannot accept for that particular option. Then you don't have to worry.

Quote:
There is another thread on AVS here about the same problem. It seems that this TV is supposed to have HDCP, but it failed, and I have to swap out a board to fix this...? How does something like this happen, anyway?
This seems to me to be the lowest probability explanation for an HDMI "refusal" because of an HDMI board failure, although I suppose it's possible. But to me I would look more closely at the setup in your BluRay player first.

Quote:
Got the set ISF calibrated today. Hope a board swap wouldn't screw up the calibration.
Seems unrelated. HDMI input is digital, and the D-to-A processing (to go to the electron guns) should not be affected I would not think just because you replaced the HDMI board... if that is really the culprit.

I'd honestly have a hard time believing this was the problem. First let's exhaust all examination of your BluRay player. Can you borrow a second player and try it as well, to see what happens? How about your DVR/satellite receiver? Does it play via HDMI?
post #7975 of 8134
you might be thinking about the 40" XBR - that monster weighs about 300 lbs! jUCq
post #7976 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by washouts View Post

you might be thinking about the 40" XBR - that monster weighs about 300 lbs! jUCq

Who, what, where, when, why?
post #7977 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by washouts View Post

you might be thinking about the 40" XBR - that monster weighs about 300 lbs! jUCq

Hi Washouts,

After anyone tries to lift the 960, those extra hundred pounds on the 40 inch 4x3 model become inconsequential! biggrin.gif

The 960 is still a standout with superb picture quality - even after having ours for eight years. Don't think any other set from that time - flat screen, DLP or projector - can make such a claim today. And that's all that needs to be said. Again, we are not talking about size but picture quality.
post #7978 of 8134
QUOTE: "I took the player home to my XBR960 once more, and was greeted with a black screen. I had written down "blind directions" to be able to navigate back to the video setting submenus, and I believe I tried the RGB setting to no benefit."



Well, this might be too late, but perhaps you could take the player to a friend's house who has a set that can display 1080P. Then set the output to 1080i or 720p.

Also, you may want to check to see if your player happens to also output to component and/or composite when it's in whatever mode you select (1080i or 720p). That way, if the HDMI still doesn't work when you get home you could switch the '960 to component or composite to continue your troubleshooting. (Maybe you have a bad HDMI cable.)


Regards,

Mark
post #7979 of 8134
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

You need to force 1080i out to the 960[...]
But the black screen from the player is indication of 1080p output. You must send 1080i.
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Originally Posted by Joseph Dubin View Post

I agree that it seems a 1080p signal is being output because that would indeed cause the screen to go black. The fact that you can get the machine's logo to appear on screen shows that the 960 is accepting the initial signal.
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Originally Posted by BTV Mark View Post

Well, this might be too late, but perhaps you could take the player to a friend's house who has a set that can display 1080P. Then set the output to 1080i or 720p.
As explained in my first post, the player's video output was set by me to 1080i and then 480p. It was still a black screen on the XBR960. I believe the HDCP kicks in right after the BluRay logo disappears. The main menu loading animation begins and lasts for half a second before the black screen of death.
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Originally Posted by Floydage View Post

As another experiment try playing a DVD (as opposed to a Blu-ray disk) - maybe it's stuck in Source Direct.
I tried this. When Les Holt was here performing the ISF calibration, we inserted a DVD in the Blu-Ray player. Time counter was progressing. No video, no sound, no change.
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Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

I'd honestly have a hard time believing this was the problem. First let's exhaust all examination of your BluRay player. Can you borrow a second player and try it as well, to see what happens?
I will have to try this soon.
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Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

How about your DVR/satellite receiver? Does it play via HDMI?
I am forced to pay for Comcast "Digital Starter" cable with my monthly rent. Not long ago, I traded in a very old coaxial-only cable box for a new one that has an HDMI output. On the XBR960 via HDMI, It shows the menus but no channel picture or sound - a black screen. Comcast requires subscribers to pay an "HD Technology Fee" in order to see HD content. But...it should still show 480p SD content through the digital connection - only it doesn't do this for me. I believe they have enabled HDCP, therefore I can only watch channels through the absolutely terrible coaxial RF connection (featuring ghosting).
My original DVD player outputs a maximum video quality of 480p over component video, with no upconverting, so it is of no use in testing this problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

You mean you connected the 960 to your PC, to see if supports HDCP?
Yes. My PC uses an EVGA Geforce GTS 450 graphics card that is "HDCP Ready." When connected to my 2008 Samsung monitor that "supports HDCP" via DVI-D, the Nvidia graphics control panel indicates that HDCP is supported by the display. When this same graphics card is connected to the XBR960 via HDMI, the menu changes to show that HDCP is not supported by the display.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

Intuitively, as a long-time owner of a 960 who's played PLENTY of BluRay movies (via Oppo Players) through the HDMI connection to the 960, I intuitively disagree with your assessment here that the 960 is fundamentally not HDCP compliant. It certainly is, at least normally.
From what I've read, the 960 should be HDCP compliant. But this is my TV, and it's not working correctly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

Please report back here what you have for all of those settings.
I would like to do this soon, but understand that it is a PITA to take the BR player to my dad's house just to see the menu settings. My Samsung monitor only has DVI, and I don't have an HDMI adapter at this time...I'd like to get a new monitor soon anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DSperber View Post

This seems to me to be the lowest probability explanation for an HDMI "refusal" because of an HDMI board failure, although I suppose it's possible. But to me I would look more closely at the setup in your BluRay player first.
It sounds unlikely but possible to me. Maybe there is HDCP-related data stored on the HDMI board that can be corrupted by non-standard input or handshake signals, like the poster in the other thread thought.
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Originally Posted by BTV Mark View Post

Also, you may want to check to see if your player happens to also output to component and/or composite when it's in whatever mode you select (1080i or 720p). That way, if the HDMI still doesn't work when you get home you could switch the '960 to component or composite to continue your troubleshooting. (Maybe you have a bad HDMI cable.)
If only the big movie companies weren't so evil, we would still have new BR players released with component HD output. As it is, this player only has HDMI output. When I was comparison shopping for a new BR player, the only way for me to get an analog output would be to spend at least $120 more on the better Sony player - but it is restricted to 480p composite. Twice the price, no real benefit. I can't afford a more expensive player. I only own three Blu Rays right now, so it would be silly too... The new players are all like that now due to imposed restrictions on how HD content is allowed to be displayed. Analog HD = not allowed. They plugged the "analog hole" for everyday consumers.

The HDMI cable is new and came with the cable box. It is what I used to connect the BR player to dad's PC monitor, and it played a Blu_Ray disc just fine.
post #7980 of 8134
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Originally Posted by warpz0ne View Post

As explained in my first post, the player's video output was set by me to 1080i and then 480p. It was still a black screen on the XBR960.
Well, maybe we should begin thinking that your suspicion about a defective HDMI interface on your 960 might be the genuine explanation here.

Quote:
When Les Holt was here performing the ISF calibration, we inserted a DVD in the Blu-Ray player. Time counter was progressing. No video, no sound, no change.
How did he feed the signals for ISF calibration to your set? HDMI, with calibration of INPUT7? Or component video on inputs 5/6?

If he used HDMI, and there was no problem, then your suspicion about the HDCP malfunction factor for your particular 960 could genuinely be the explanation. It's just to my knowledge this thread has never heard of such a reported defect from anyone, which is why I was initially skeptical and much more likely to believe something external as the cause of your black screen symptom..

Quote:
I am forced to pay for Comcast "Digital Starter" cable with my monthly rent. Not long ago, I traded in a very old coaxial-only cable box for a new one that has an HDMI output. On the XBR960 via HDMI, It shows the menus but no channel picture or sound - a black screen.
Well, that's not encouraging. If a second HD source is also producing black screen then that would certainly seem to point to the 960 itself as the issue.

Quote:
Comcast requires subscribers to pay an "HD Technology Fee" in order to see HD content. But...it should still show 480p SD content through the digital connection - only it doesn't do this for me.
There is no 480p content for TV. It's either 480i for SD, or 720p/1080i for HD. But I'd think that the HD versions of your local OTA network channels delivered unprotected via Comcast would not fall into the same protection category, say as their other basic cable and premium cable channels would. I'd intuitively think they should be perfectly visible via HDMI, having nothing to do with HDCP. But I don't absolutely know for sure.

However I wouldn't think that the 480i SD channels (which are quite commonly the SD 480i down-converted and center-cut or letterboxed versions of the corresponding 720p/1080i HD channels) would be subject to the same HDMI/HDCP issues as true 720p/1080i HDTV content... through the same HDMI connection. I don't absolutely know for sure, but it really does seem unlikely. It's only HD that they're trying to protect.

Quote:
From what I've read, the 960 should be HDCP compliant. But this is my TV, and it's not working correctly.
Well I suppose it's possible. But again, this thread has been going a long time and I don't recall a similar issue being reported before yours.

If you have verified that a second HDMI source device (i.e. your Comcast cable box) also produces black screen (and that it is not putting out upconverted 1080p HDMI but rather is putting out 1080i or lower), and you can confirm that your BluRay player works fine on a second TV, and perhaps can also verify that a second BluRay player also fails on the 960, then it would seem a hardware issue with the HDMI interface on your 960 is the most likely explanation.

At this point I would definitely invest in a visit from a service technician. If you don't know who to call in your area, I'd suggest calling Sony for either a visit from a "factory technician" (if they still have them) or a suggestion of a "factory authorized technician" in your area. The set is obviously out of warranty, so this won't be free. But if it's actually a hardware problem and the replacement part can be ordered and installed, then that's the right solution.

Presumably only a qualified service technician will be able to determine if it is (or could even possibly be) an HDMI-related part failure.

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When I was comparison shopping for a new BR player, the only way for me to get an analog output would be to spend at least $120 more on the better Sony player - but it is restricted to 480p composite.
To be technically precise with the wording, 480p is not output via "composite" (yellow). Both composite and S-video are limited to 4x3 480i.

16x9 480p and higher resolutions are available from the component video (3-cable red/green/blue), or DVI, or HDMI.

Anyway, you're not alone. The latest Oppo players (e.g. my 103) have removed analog HD component video output, in deference to "The Suits" who insisted on it on digital-only output for HD in the newest generation of DRM-restricted players.

Quote:
The HDMI cable is new and came with the cable box. It is what I used to connect the BR player to dad's PC monitor, and it played a Blu_Ray disc just fine.
A possibly defective HDMI cable is right down there with the lowest possible probability explanations for most common problems.

At this point, I'd say go to a service technician visit (arranged by you or through Sony) as your next course of action. Explain the symptom, and ask him to bring out a working BluRay player from his shop just to use in a test. If it's actually a hardware problem, and if it can be fixed and you want to pay the cost, that's going to be necessary anyway.
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