The Toshiba DLP (HM/HMX) Owners Thread - Page 10

All these pages and 2 of my key interests never came up once.

1. No one seems to have done any real calibration of their sets.
For instance does the standard menus allow for overscan correction?
What about fixing the 3 color configuration?

2. No one has listed available access to the service menus.
Does anyone know how to access them?

My short list is down to the Toshiba and the Panny.
The Panny thread has numerous calibrations, pictures, and access to the service manual posted. It is very reassuring that I can tune out any minor imperfections.

Even with that said the Toshiba is still at the top of my list for a few strong reasons. I am just hoping I can tune it like it should be so I can get the most out of the set.

Best Of Luck to you and keep me informed about it..

Wrong about interest #2, it did come up. Access to the service menu was covered. Search this thread for "service menu".

Has anyone done any geometry / convergence tests on the Toshiba xxHM84 or xxHMX84. A forum member from another thread did it on a JVC. Below is a picture of his test.

Geometry Test

If so, how did the Toshiba do? Was the geometry / convergence good?

After my 100 hour 'burn-in' time is up...I'll be putting my HMX through the Avia calibration so I'll check geometry at that time.

'Convergence' is a non-issue on these sets as they're single-chip DLP and do not have multiple lenses to focus/align.

What's the 100 hour burn-in supposed to accomplish?

--T.

Supposedly the nature of the DLP lamp is such that the bulb outputs slightly different light after the first 100 hours or so (I'm sure this is an arbitrary time, but most seem to use this as the benchmark). If you calibrate your set before that time, the light output/composition change of the bulb will skew some of your settings. Consequently, if you wait until you have about 100 hours on your set and calibrate, the settings supposedly stay truer longer.

(Then, of course, when you get to the end of the lamp's life the same thing happens as light output and composition slowly decay...but that's closer to the 8000 hour mark, or whatever the specs are for your particular bulb.)

YMMV

David (or anyone else who owns an HMX), does the HMX series have any additional features in the user menu over the HM series? Are there any kind of RGB adjustments in the user menu other than the standard tint? Any information would be helpful as I'm deciding between the HM & HMX model. I want the HMX but I'll have to drive about 2 hours to get it and I'm not sure if Pieratt's will deal as much on the HMX as my local HH Gregg will on the HM.

Well I came to my senses and bought the 52" instead of the 62" and am I ever glad. One of my viewing seats is 10' max and the other 13'. More later.

My local dealer called last Friday to tell me the 52 was in if I wanted to come down and check it out while waiting for the 62. It was in a darkened room with a similar Samsung to one side and other various CRT, DLP and LCD sets in the same room....all RPTVs. I can't say that the picture was drastically different than those around it but it did seem to have a somewhat sharper, more three dimensional look. Let's just say that all things being equal, this is the set I would have bought if I had just wandered in off the street.

It was sitting on its stand and as a result the side speaker stigma (SSS) was basically a non issue.

I was watching a continuous loop HDTV off of a Zenith DVR and sat directly in front at about 15', which is two feet further back than I can sit at home. It was plenty large. I immediately came to my senses and said "when can you deliver it" and it arrived yesterday.

This is not my first RPTV. I had a 53" HDTV ready 4x3 Toshiba with seating at 12' up until my move about a year ago. Thus, I realize that when a picture doubles and triples in size, so does the blemishes.

Sooooo, here are my initial impressions.

1. For all the Standard Definition viewers out there (my girlfriend included); sorry, there is no magic elixir. I believe this set does as good, if not better than any other set of this size, a job of displaying the image as transmitted. What I am saying is that programs I receive via Dish Network 6000 HDTV receiver vary from pretty good and certainly watchable on USA to downright terrible and painfully watchable on the locals (transmitted from San Antonio) via Dish. This is not the problem of the TV but rather transmission policies. If SD if your only thing, stay with 32" direct view. The Toshiba stretch mode is great; I already don't notice it unless I remind my self.

2. Moulin Rouge, the dvd. Exquisite! And I mean right out of the box. After toning down the contrast it was sharp but similtaneously velvety. The colors explode, not bloom or bleed. I'm no expert, but the blacks are sure black enough for me. I then tuned it up (medium temperature, film mode, preference setting) with the AVIA disc, but with the exception of contrast and sharpness, it was pretty much right on. Once again I'm no expert but I didn't notice the "red push syndrome" (RPS).

I then put in Tina Turner in Amsterdam, a non anamorphic dvd, and played it through my Panasonic RP-91 and there were the expected jaggies but an otherwise good picture considering the source material. I then played it in the non-progressive mode to see if the set could do a better job on its own and I felt the picture was somewhat lacking and the jaggies were certainly as bad if not worse.

3. High Definition is where this set (and others) really shine. However dear viewers, there are also source material caveats here to be considered. Material filmed for HD come off much better than most movies and the such. HDNet is awesome; it sparkles with clarity as does most Discovery HD and live sports broadcasts. Law and Order SVU (OTA via my 6000) was very sharp and detailed. Do not however expect this same picture on TNTHD with 5 year old reruns of Law and Order or movies. I would describe TNT as being Half High Def (HHD). A really good picture but not in the class as HDNet or a live sporting event......kinda like an ok (not great) dvd. Also, this morning I watched "Intolerable Cruelty" on HBOHD. This was a terrible picture color-wise. Everything was pink (could it be the dreaded RPS?). I rushed over to HDNet and all was well and beautiful. Once again, source material. After knocking down the contrast in half and adjusting the color and tint, it was an alright picture; pretty sharp but still not near stellar.....have you ever noticed the scar on Catherine Zeta-Jones-Douglas throat? Thryoid at a young age I imagine.

4. I personally have no desire to go into the service menu. I have already messed up enough things; I'll leave it to the experts. In fact, after I get a couple thousand or so hours and the technology is more commonplace, I may look into an ISF calibration. Maybe, maybe not. It is mighty sweet just as she sits. By the way....Overscan. While I was watching all the tvs together at the store, this set seemed to have less or the same as the others. There were a couple that really lost a considerable amount of the picture but I didn't note which they were. Also, on all sources, this unit seems to not lose any definition around the edges or in the corners.

Gamers: Sorry, that's not my thing so I have no info for you there, other than to say that action sequences in HD came off very well.

I am happy with my purchase. With the coming years of "all HDTV all the time", it is a good thing. I think we are reaching a point of diminishing returns when it comes to video transmission. There is only so little much more the human eye can detect and assimilate.

Is this set better than the rest? I honestly believe it is as good as any of the others; I don't know about better. I liked the Mits 65" that was on the floor. The Sony LCD (?) was superb. The Sammies looked quite similar to the Toshiba, just not quite the clarity. The RCA lacked a little something and I couldn't recommend it.....maybe it just needed tuning up. They were no Panasonics. None of the CRTs on the floor had as crisp a picture as the Tosh or the Mits.....convergence issues which can be continually corrected; probably. So, do the research on reliability, factory tech support, overscan and other possible concerns which may be brand specific and uncorrectable. The thing is, once you get your choice home, there is nothing with which to compare it to. It will absolutely, without a doubt, be the best looking TV in your living room/home theater.


Think I'll go eat now. Regards.

DemonSVT, No offense but why would you want to fix something that aint broken. Atleast that is my philosophy. Ofcourse talking about myself and my set, I can barely see any imperfections on a good HD signal or good DVD, so I am not really motivated to get into the service menu and see if there is anything else to be done. May be there is, but I am not interested to do right now. I am really busy watching the set and enjoying it :-) However, I did check for geometry imperfections using the calibration disk (video essentials) and I could not find any.

There are instructions in this thread about how to get into service menu, do a search.

I don't see anything in the UM that seems any different than the HM (although without an HM to compare to side-by-side, there could be minor differences).

As far as RGB/picture controls go, though - they seem the same.

I can't imagine there would be any variation in the software governing the RGB adjustments. It would only please a very small minority of buyers and give the technicians headaches. Not very cost effective.

I liked the earlier post stating "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". I compare this new "don't need to fiddle with it" technology with the older cars that had to routinely have the plugs, points, carb etc. serviced. Now it is 100,000 miles of voooomm before one has to worry with it. I, for one, am fond of this new technology......I am quite happy that I don't have to recalibrate my new set every quarter.

I'm down to the same two sets. What are the "few strong reasons" for you to favor the Toshiba?

I just received the 52hm84 today and SD looks pretty unwatchable, but the HD channels look very nice.

I did expect the PC to look amazingly good, but to my surprise, it looks like crap and I will be returning the TV back to best buy and just use my crt monitor instead. At first I had a little trouble even getting the tv to show anything at all from the PC, so I had to hook up my monitor to select the correct resolutions which took some time. And now if I want to play a PC game I can't see the intoductory scenes because the resolutions change automatically and sometimes even the options menus don't display because of different resolutions; so if anything other than the desktop resolution is displayed, the picture won't show up.

Overall I am disappointed by this set and all other dlp's and lcd's and have reallized that this technology is not quite ready yet but probably will within five years, so I will stick with my CRT TV until then.

Well, I got a Sharp 37g4u for my office 2 weeks ago, and it is great. Does loose PC sync occasionally when the picture changes, and I have to autosync it again, and this is annoying, but playing games and dvds from pc,and hdtv looks terrific, depending on source material, and I really dont have much desire to look at SD analog anymore, but it is not that bad. I just have no desire to look at it because SD digital, and HDTV particularly look so great.

Obviously I am very pleased. I bet an LCD rear projection would work as well. I notice playing games with the contrast ratio "limitations" of lcd, I can see a lot more detail than I did on my 19 inch Princeton monitor. I wonder why that is? adjustment of the monitor?

Now I go in dark rooms in first person shooter games, and I see what my competition cannot see.

Yes the blacks are not as black as other new technologies, but it works for me. Life is too short to wait!

Jim

I have been looking at rear projection DLP TV's (Samsung HLP5063W and Toshiba 52HM84) and notice a bowing of the image (similar to pincushion distortion) near the top and bottom of the image when viewing 4:3 formatted video. Was told by local service rep this is inherent to RP-DLP... Is this true? Anyone else experience the issue? If it is a known issue, why do the manufacturer's not identify it?

Own the 52hm84 and have no idea what you are talking about.

Interesting. I hadn't noticed this till your post. I measured it and found on my 62 inch there was indeed a bowing of less than a 1/4 of an inch at the mid point. That means the top and bottom are roughly a 1/4 of an inch wider than the middle.

Weird. And now that I see it, it's irrating.

--T.

Damn. After about 40 hrs worth of reading on this site in the last month I certainly did miss it. (maybe I've started scanning too quickly???)

Page 2 - dated 8/31

Thank you. I think that seals the deal.

I also see the bowing of the image of 4:3 material and actually saw it the first time I powered up the TV, and I would also find it irritating if I knew that I would keep the TV.

What's up folks,

My full-featured review of my 52HMX84 is not ready yet, as I have to optimize everything still. Today, I got the TV delivered and I hooked everything up (Silver TechCraft matching stand, very nice).

I have yet to even read 10% of the manual. I have yet to use AVIA (kinda did the basic stuff but that's essentially useless compared to the advanced things as well as doing ISF calib).

I also got my Denon DVD-1910 player and a DVI-to-HDMI cable, and hooked it up. I am not sure what to say about it right now. I perhaps shouldn't cuz I still am yet to figure many things out. But I'll leave you with the following (PLEASE again let me note I need to properly configure EVERYTHING before I can make useful info-sharing with you guys):

* There is DEFINITELY a *HUGE* difference between 480p and 720p
* I could not tell any diff between 720p and 1080i
* I did not see any "shimmering" or "2-3 pixel positions dancing" effects when displaying 1080i which several on this forum have reported with the 1910 (not specifically with our HM/HMX sets, but just in general in the DVD Player threads)
* There definitely appears to be this "clay face" phenomenom going on with my TV as with others here in the thread. I fiddled with settings a bit and seem to have lowered it, I dunno, is this a major issue for us Tosh DLP HD2+ owners? I need to eliminate this, if I am to be a happy camper...

Oh, I didn't try any 720p Xbox titles yet. Just 480i/p quick tests for xbox, ps2, and gamecube. I have previously used S-video on a 32 inch Sharp SD CRT, and I cannot tell much diff right now.

Ok well, the only thing "worrying" me now is the grainyness "clay face" of the picture, but even there I'm not sure if I'm smoking something. See, in the store, on display, I noticed it too once, but I noticed that on ALL the TVs in their display room too! LCD DLP you name it, Sony XBR, Hitachi, Samsung, etc. so when my friend noticed it too and mentioned it to me, I told him that it must be the source signal, cuz look, all the TVs showing this grainy film kinda in front of the pic. A week before, I went to the same store and I saw a gorgeous pic on the HM/HMX on display (46 inch though) and an AMAZING hi-def PQ.

I dont have hi-def yet but Voom is coming to be installed on Friday.

Ok sorry for the long post, but just a heads up as I know some of you were waiting for my review of my HT with this TV. I am admittedly a NOOB when it comes to advanced display configuration and "artifact hunting" but I think I will learn very, very quickly in the next few days, and from even further reading.

Last but not least, no, I am not freaking out about anything, even the denon 1910, I ain't returning anything, I need to make sure what's really up and what's the best I can display with calib and what not. Besides, even if it turns out the PQ of the Denon is disappointing and pretty much unacceptable, I am gonna KEEP it and get at a future date perhaps the Zenith 318 and/or the upcoming Sammy HD-941 to compare. Dammit, it sux not to be filthy-rich btw.

I AM a newToshiba DLP (62HMX84) owner, Set will be here next week cant wait. Am a Newbie at this so help would be greatly appreceated. Question runnen the PC to the TV VIA HDMI i know there is no device yet that conects HDMI into the PC but what about DVI to HDMI. There are such devices in PCs that enable DVI to HMDI to work just need to know the cheapest and best way to go if there is any way to go LOL since TV i will have has 2 HDMI outputs. I know the wire isnt cheap cause i have to run 35FT of it that being HDMI cable and another quesrion is that too long of a run Foe HDMI and wouild it lowere the sinal i heard it will not just wondered if anyone else knows of anyone runnen that length or more having any problems just need to know which way to do it, That is run PC to TV. there has to be out there a reasonable priced card or soloution just need some help thats all. I now have a radieon7000 with tv out but does not have DVI out just rca and svideo and do not want to have to take it out thought there might be someother expansion card tuner card what ever that has DVI that way i can get a DVI to HDMI conecter and run HDMI cable to TV as long as i dont lose the sig quality in that far of a run. Help Please Sprincar

Got dvigear.com, they have a great selection of cables/adapters. I personally got a DVI-to-HDMI cable for my DVD player and it works perfect. Also got a DVI-to-HDMI adapter for the DVI-DVI cable that comes with my Voom receiver, so I can use it with the TV. I have not yet tried my PC, maybe in a week or so I will try it (using the DVD cable).

Thanks ndahbar for imfo just wondering if there is a cable superstore in Canada will kill me in charges for shipping and exchange if i get from USA. The other question is can u make a run with HDMI cable of 35 RT and get a good signal to run the PC to TV. I heard throught he grapevine HDMI has virtually no sig loss just a rumer i heard though what ya sugest for a card expansion card with DVI out or tuner Card with DVI out. I know cable for HDMI is fairly expensive just have spent so much on new TV budget is dwindeling LOL thanks again for your fast reply maybe someone has some more answers i hope
Sprintcar

Sprint, read this: http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/...ts/DVIHDMI.php

But then, I think you're all set, check the bottom of this page:

http://www.gefen.com/kvm/support/dvihdmi.jsp

Look at www.bluejeanscable.com and www.ramelectronics.net for DVI-HDMI cables.

You can find 40ft for ~170 USD and 50ft for 185 USD at bluejeanscable. An option is to use a cheaper DVI cable and a DVI-HDMI adapter (30 USD on www.pricegrabber.com), but someone more experienced or knowledgeable will need to advise you on possible signal loss for these lengths.

Thanks so much for that site ndahbar that helped me out so much but am sad to learn that with that length i am SOL so much for useing my new Toshiba with my PC god damn that was a real good artical on that i guess next best soloution would be to bye another PCset it next to TV, network it to my PC upstairs and run the net and MOvies from it that will be costly though **** another $1000. Right now i have a radieon 7000 tv out card hookes just basic rca's from PC video out card upstairs to 10 yr old Hatachi 36 in TV downstairs and have a logtech wireless keyboard and mouse which i use downstairs too or upstairs as i have 2 recievers one for upstairs and one for downstairs. Desktop shows up good on Hitachi TV with 40 ft of cheap RCA cable runnen to it can see icons but hard to read the writing as it is small andf resolution and picture quality is poor but it plays my movies great good pic good colour and so on sound is bad though but every thing is in anolog sig card to TV etc just thought when i get my new Toshiba 62HMX84 picture quality would improve with the right cables and card but i know now that runnen 35 ft will be a problem maybe someone else on site has done this application with longer length and has used HDMI to DVI and can help before i have to go out and spend another $1000 and get another PC for downstairs . Once againdahbar and ru4real thanks very much for your imfo and prompt reply get back to me if ya hear anything else guys
Sprintcar

Guys what would be a resonable card to use with a DVI out so when i get this HDMI cable if i get it lol. The budjet is sinking LOL. I guess the cards will be expensive to hey? Just want to find the most inexpensive but good card to use if that makes sence.
Thanks Again Sprintcar

Hey Sprint, I would suggest u just live with the TV sans PC for now, and then like in a few months get yourself a 2nd PC or laptop which would sit right by your TV.

Hell, I think *I* am gonna do that (Jan/Feb get new PC).

Finally have my 52HMX84 in-house and largely set up - haven't had time for a thorough review, although detailed impressions are pending...stay tuned.

In the mean time, for those who are interested - you can check out my "Gallery" (link at the top of this message) for some interim shots of the HMX in action. Some of the shots are less than thrilling...but that's more or less the fault of my photography skills and so-so digital camera than it is the TV.

So far...the HMX is *gorgeous*.