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Problems with 9500LC from CRT Cinema/Projection Systems  

post #1 of 198
Thread Starter 
Hey all--

Wow, what a tough few months it has been! I purchased a 9500LC a little over a year ago from CRT Cinema/Projection Systems in Minnensota-- after agonizing for several weeks, I chose to pay top dollar for a retubed, mint condition Electrohome Marquee 9500LC. For the past few months, though, I've been having problems with it.

First: the projector just quit working, with the H-fail LED coming on; CRT Cinema recommended buying a new Horizontal deflection module, with the caveat that if it the $1200 module did not fix the problem I was stuck with a $240 restocking fee PLUS I would only recieve store credit for the remainder. Needless to say, I explored other options. Dave Harper helped me out, and we were able to rule out the Horizontal Deflection Module as the problem; it turns out it was a bad solder connection on the High Voltage Power Supply which we managed to fix without any further cost.

Second, and most importantly: Mike Parker came by to examine the projector a few weeks ago and made a very disturbing discovery. He found that the filament voltage was never modified on this projector, causing the filament voltage to run too high and basically fry the tubes in little over a year. So now, I'm faced with having to purchase three new tubes AND faced with the cost of modding the filament voltage.

The kicker is that CRT Cinema claims that they are "not sure" what their liability is, as the "original owner" sold the company to them in the time between me purchasing the projector and me having problems with the projector. Clearly it's not a warranty issue; when the product promised is not the product sold, and is defective, the warranty is not a factor. Nor have the new owners changed the name of the company to reflect new ownership--the first I heard of this change was when I asked if they had any inclination to make this right. For them to try and claim that it's "not their fault" and accept NO responsibility for the situation seems ludicrous, and also reflects a contemptible attitude toward their customers. If they purchased the business, they purchased both the good aspects (such as a large inventory, a well-known and fairly established name, a large customer base) AND the unfortunate aspects (such as dealing with issues from those aformentioned customers when they arise). It sure doesn't seem right for them to happily accept the good and simply wash their hands of the unfortunate! Anyway, Mike Parker has been in contact with them since then, and is confident that they will do the right thing, but I'm having my doubts at the moment...

Thanks for letting me vent!

Chad
post #2 of 198
Chad, the filament voltage is quite a discovery and such bad news about the tubes. My condolences to you.
I was not aware the company changed hands. I guess this explains why my emails to Eric concerning G70's on ebay remain unanswered. Kind of weird the new owners will not respond to questions concerning their own auctions.
Looks like another chapter of possible problems with customer relations in the PSI camp..
post #3 of 198
I think any lawyer will tell you that you bought from a company and the company is responsible for the sale. It doesn't matter who the owner was, your relationship was with the company. You wrote a check to the company, so it's the company that you have the contract with.

That said I hope they take it back and fix it for you and if they do the right thing I hope you'll post it here too. Unfortunate that they should be jerking you about right now though....

Good luck.

R
post #4 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by matrix
Chad, the filament voltage is quite a discovery and such bad news about the tubes. My condolences to you.
I was not aware the company changed hands. I guess this explains why my emails to Eric concerning G70's on ebay remain unanswered. Kind of weird the new owners will not respond to questions concerning their own auctions.
Looks like another chapter of possible problems with customer relations in the PSI camp..

Dennis,

That's interesting news. I wonder why he didn't say anything about selling, if I recall, the move was supposed to be to a larger building. I did notice the Ebay listings were a little different.

I wonder if that has anything to do what I was telling you about? In any case Raoul is correct, the company incurs the liability (as well as the assets) of the former owner(s). It's up to the purchaser to KNOW what those liabilities are.

Bruce
post #5 of 198
how LAME, even a small time hobbyist like me knows better then to sell a Marquee without checking that P14 circuit and doing the mod. This is not the first time they have sold a Marquee like this, someone posted not long ago about an M8000 he recieved, luckily he was knowledgable enough to check it himself and fix the problem with his own dime. I am sorry to hear your troubles, that company is terrible, especially when you take into consideration the prices they charge for their machines. Just add this post to the list of horror-stroies:mad: NEWBS TAKE NOTE, BUY FROM A DEALER ON THIS BOARD!
post #6 of 198
Amen!
post #7 of 198
Well,

I'm sorry to hear about your trouble.

And,.. I have a Marquee 8500 with an apparent High Voltage Power Supply problem and would love to know the specifics of that bad solder joint issue you had.

-Brian
post #8 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by Brian Hampton
Well,

I'm sorry to hear about your trouble.

And,.. I have a Marquee 8500 with an apparent High Voltage Power Supply problem and would love to know the specifics of that bad solder joint issue you had.

-Brian
While any spot can have a cold or cracked solder joint, I think they're referring to the where the connector wires are soldered on to the H-deflection board. From moving and bending those heavy wires, sometimes the solder cracks at those pads. You should really check all those heavy wire connectors, like on the focus board also. It can't hurt.
post #9 of 198
Bruce, remember your PM to me concerning the G70 and what you pointed out to me? That is what I emailed to ask the seller and no response. Nada, so I backed off the bidding.
post #10 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by matrix
Bruce, remember your PM to me concerning the G70 and what you pointed out to me? That is what I emailed to ask the seller and no response. Nada, so I backed off the bidding.
Did you see how much it went for? I think there's going to be one unhappy buyer when he sees what he's getting. ;)
post #11 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by techman707
Did you see how much it went for? I think there's going to be one unhappy buyer when he sees what he's getting. ;)
what do you believe to be wrong with it?
post #12 of 198
yes Bruce please do tell, I was watching that one with another member and it seemed Ok to a non-Sony guy like me. how the hell could you tell anything about the machine from just one picture, tell us what dark majic you invoked:D
post #13 of 198
Nothing special, just the tubes were shot, but the tube condition was "added" later in tiny letters that you would have missed unless you were looking for it and HAD to know before you would bid. Yet, in spite of that, it went for A LOT of money. I advise people buying a G70 to either buy one with very low hours and perfect tubes if they can find one, or, a projector in the 5-6k hour range and install NEW OEM tubes. Anything less is just a waste of money since the reason you buy a projector like a G70 in the first place is for pq. If the tubes in my projector is going to get any wear on them, I'M going to be the one to put it there and if not abused, will get at least 5-7k hours before they show ANY wear. I know this from experience. That's why I try to tell people not to use a 1.0 gain screen or run the contrast past 65 for long tube life. Besides, the lower the contrast, the smaller the beam spot.
post #14 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by raoul
I think any lawyer will tell you that you bought from a company and the company is responsible for the sale. It doesn't matter who the owner was, your relationship was with the company. You wrote a check to the company, so it's the company that you have the contract with.
R
After I bought my 8500 from Eric I learned that his company was merging with a company in Minnesota (Eric was in Wisconsin). I was concerned about my warranty and pushed Eric to write a statement that my warranty transfered to the new company. He did so and I thought I was covered. But recently I discovered I may have a problem with my focus board or control board. I contacted via email several people at the new company. Finally I received an email from their sales guy Matt Ballard. He informed me that the warranty is an issue. He stated that Eric sold his assets to their company and that they could sell me the parts I need and I could have Eric reimburse me. I told him that was not what the warranty says. He then gave me Eric's phone number (not in service) and his email address. I emailed Eric several times but no response. The guy said Eric is now living in Florida. So, basically Eric took the money and ran, instead of being in management with the new company.

Assuming what I just wrote is correct, Chad's situation may not be where he bought it from a company that changed owners, but from one company that merged (ceased to exist) to another.

Please let me know if you have any luck resolving your issue and/or reaching Eric. The email I was given is Quaturbo@dwave.net.
post #15 of 198
took the money and ran to Florida like Al Capone, LOL:D Ok, i'm sure it's not funny if you have a broken machine from there :( Bruce, you must be talking about 2 G70s ago, those tubes were listed as 5s and 6s and it sold for over $2500. I believe, which is too much. The last one was listed as 9 or better tubes and it went for $3600., a good deal if that was in fact what the wear really was. They don't post pics so 1 more reason to steer clear:confused: Did anyone else notice they only offer a 30 day warranty now? Hell, I could offer a 30 day warranty for those prices:p
post #16 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by draganm
took the money and ran to Florida like Al Capone, LOL:D Ok, i'm sure it's not funny if you have a broken machine from there :( Bruce, you must be talking about 2 G70s ago, those tubes were listed as 5s and 6s and it sold for over $2500. I believe, which is too much. The last one was listed as 9 or better tubes and it went for $3600., a good deal if that was in fact what the wear really was. They don't post pics so 1 more reason to steer clear:confused: Did anyone else notice they only offer a 30 day warranty now? Hell, I could offer a 30 day warranty for those prices:p
They NEVER posted tube pix. The "last" G70 said "9" Red, "7" Green and "9" Blue and sold for $3350. As far as I'm concerned, "7" is shot (especially from them) and if the Green is "7", the Blue CAN'T be a "9"! :mad: In the past, the pictures of the projector in the listing wasn't the actual pj. In this listing, it appeared to show screen shots, which didn't look too good, but I assume the picture of the pj was an "actual" picture. I'm SURE, somebody going to need new tubes. ;)

As for the warranty, they appear to be using the same corporate name, or at the very least, a DBA. Of course like everything else in this country, you probably have to go to court to enforce your rights. I don't think NOT honoring existing warranties will do anything to HELP the new owner(s) with the company's reputation.
post #17 of 198
New company could have bought the name and the inventory and nothing else. If this is the case, u b screwed. This is very typical in this type of transaction where the new owner does not want to take responsbility for unknown liabilities. It sounds like the buyer had good legal advise...Now if Eric signed a document guaranteeing something for the new owners, that is fraud...

Having read Eric's prospectus on his business when he was trying to sell it, there wasnt much to buy and for sure the money he got aint enough to retire in FLA.

Pablo
post #18 of 198
CRT Cinema doesn't appear to be a professionally run company if its attitude is being reported correctly. Possibly it is in financial difficulties- a successful company (if taken over) should be able to afford to take responsibilty.

Good-will can't be accounted for directly on the balance sheet, but a company that has a reputation for 'getting a customer out of the ****' tends to pick up trade from him and associates at a later date.
post #19 of 198
I note that the word '****' is automatically censored. Try 'faeces'. (Although it's amazing that more than 900 hundred years after the Norman invasion, there remains a distinction between posh and vulgar words for the same thing).
post #20 of 198
Maybe it would be a good idea to put a "sticky" were there is a list with companies/people, which screw people over.

Not sure if there are any legal complications of such thing in the US but these threads comes up every other week or so.
post #21 of 198
There would be legal problems with publishing a list (unfair restraint of trade or somesuch), although the concept is appealing.
post #22 of 198
Or you could call it customer service ?

But if it's a problem someone could put up a simple web page at some free service and put the list there.
Then just add a link in the FAQ.
That way avsforum wouldn't be responsible for it.
post #23 of 198
While a sticky list would be nice, people still learn who the good companies/people are and who the bad ones are. Many of us already knew about C R T Enema before this thread. And I'll be sure to spread the word whenever possible.
post #24 of 198
Still there are many that doesn't ask here first.
Maybe they are reading here but it's not always C R T**** that is the focus but other companies or ebay-scams etc.
post #25 of 198
I think Pablo is correct. I'm no expert. but I did buy a pre existing business once (child care franchise). I made the seller (previous owners) sign a document that provided I not be held liable for anything that occurred prior to my ownership. Why would I take responsibility for their actions? This is pretty typical in these situations.
post #26 of 198
Yeah, regardless of what the previous owner guaranteed, most new owners are going to shut down the business, rename it for a day or two, then reopen under the original name. Why wouldn't they want to protect themselves & investment?

They would, however, do well to help you out as much as they could to bolster goodwill.

good luck
post #27 of 198
Quote:
Still there are many that doesn't ask here first.
yup, thats a fact and those poor souls are as lost as babes in the woods. You almost never hear fo someone who found this forum first wind up with the pooh end of the stick.;) When I e-mail e-bay bidders about scams I always add a link to here with advice like " ask questions on this forum and you will be better off, we make scam-spotting and indoor sport" :D
post #28 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by Fredrik
Still there are many that doesn't ask here first.
Maybe they are reading here but it's not always C R T**** that is the focus but other companies or ebay-scams etc.
Very true. I wish I had checked before doing business with Eric. It's nice that people share their experiences with ebay etc.
post #29 of 198
Thread Starter 
Yes, I made the assumption that they were reputable based on some comments I had read in the forum. Obviously, I should have done even MORE research. As I said, I'm keeping my fingers crossed that things will be made right, but I'm not getting my hopes up too high...
post #30 of 198
Quote:
Originally posted by John Alison
There would be legal problems with publishing a list (unfair restraint of trade or somesuch), although the concept is appealing.
There is NEVER any legal consequences to publishing the truth. ;) :D
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