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Swapping tubes between a Barco Graphics 808s and a Barco RetroGraphics 808s?  

post #1 of 20
9/3/04 at 1:53pm
Thread Starter 
Hi there I have a question for you tweakfreaks out there.

I have a Barco Graphics 808s with a fried green tube. The tubes in this one are regular 07MFP02 tubes.

I also have a Barco RetroGraphics 808s with fresh tubes. Just a slight notion of wear on the green tubes.
It's the L-shaped RetroBlock with HD-8 lenses on. With lots of extra functions such as green convergence, contrast modulation, geometry axis adjustments and so on.
The problem is those tubes are Panasonic MEC tubes. They are called

P16LXW33RJA (red)
P16LNQ57HKA (green)
P16LXW33BMB (blue)

I was wondering if someone in here has ever made an attempt to put these tubes into a regular Barco Graphics 808s and what electronic components would need to be swapped from the RetroBlock to the regular 808s to make it happen?

I am considering doing this since I got both projectors really cheap and was hoping I could do this conversion and get me a nice and fresh regular Barco Graphics 808s in the end.

What do you think?
Can it be done?

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post #2 of 20
9/3/04 at 4:01pm
You're saying you have the L-shaped retro 808s with HD8 lenses?

I thought the retro had liquid coupled lenses (HD114?), and was U shaped.

But anyway, if both projectors are complete, the swap would be real easy. just swap the tube AND the R-G-B amplifier (neck board) together, and it should work like a charm. That's all there is to it.
And of course a complete geometry/convergence and gray scale job after wards.

You may also need to adjust some pots, such R&B H + V center.

Just keep the tube and the neck board together, and your fine.

Reinier
post #3 of 20
9/3/04 at 4:20pm
just out of curiosity what is the RGB input board number on the retro if you know it.
Thanks
post #4 of 20
9/3/04 at 5:35pm
You are burning a new trail if you pull this off. I agree that the neckboards and crts in all probablity is all you need to do from an electronics standpoint. However, if it has been done before I haven't seen it mentioned here. So there is a small possibility that you might burn something out. However 90% of the parts in the various 808 models are the same.

The greater challenge you will face is that the Retrographics is liquid coupled and has short throw lenses. Your 808s front projector is not liquid coupled. Therefore you are going to have to remove the hardware mounted to the front of your P16 tubes out of the retro and attach the nonliquid coupled hardware from your Sony tubes in your Graphics 808s, or more likely, have to get donor parts from a 808 Data/Graphics or 808s Data that uses MEC tubes. The reason I think it is the latter is that I believe the Sony tubes have different mounting hardware that may not work with the MEC P16s.

Bottom line I think it can be done but you are going to face some challenges.
post #5 of 20
9/3/04 at 5:37pm
are those p16xxx tubes the same as those used in G70 and XGLC?
and if the swap succeed, will it be the cine 8 "onyx" clone?
post #6 of 20
9/3/04 at 5:46pm
Quote:
Originally posted by wonsug
are those p16xxx tubes the same as those used in G70 and XGLC?
and if the swap succeed, will it be the cine 8 "onyx" clone?
I cannot answer your first question though I bet they are close if not the exact tube (i.e., the pinouts could be different).

It won't be a Cine8 Onyx clone, because he cannot keep the liquid coupling. Or at least I don't think he can. I don't believe that the HD8 lens will working with the liquid coupling, but I could be wrong. If they would that would be awesome, and I would have to start hunting for a retro graphics myself. He cannot reuse the lens out of the Retrographics because they are short throw and furthermore will not focus on the larger front projection screen. So I think he is going to have to lose the liquid coupling. Also the Cine8 Onyx had color filtered lens, and the HD8s on his 808s are not.
post #7 of 20
9/3/04 at 6:33pm
thanks, secstate.
I thought all rear projection crt use the LC tube.
A crappy low end crt rear pj I know uses ES 7'' LC tubes. its c -elements are even color filtered. they say all three tubes + lenses cost several hundred dollars (i mean new one!!)
post #8 of 20
9/3/04 at 6:49pm
Thread Starter 
No I'm not trying to make an Onyx Cine8 clone. =)
Yes I have the L-shaped RetroBlock and no it's not liquid coupled it's equipped with the standard HD-8 lenses. So they are AC-coupled.

This gives me hope. =)

I actually have 5 of each but traded one retroblock without lenses against a minty fresh fully equipped Barco Graphics 801s with 2000h on the tubes as a favour to a friend of mine. So I have 4 RetroBlocks and 5 regular BG808s.
All of the regular 808s are TOAST (there's a large oiltanker on the green tube on one of them. ;) Do I need to mention that they were from a shipsimulator?) They have regular Sony 07MFP02 tubes though.
All of the RetroBlocks have excellent red and blue tubes and some slight wear on the green tubes. None of which is visible through the lenses.

R.Bauer:
So you are saying that all I need to do to get this show on the road is to swap the MEC-tubes with their neckboards and adjust some pots?

secstate:
If I just swap the whole thing with the neckboard then I shouldn't have to worry about the pin outs should I?
Which components should I keep a spare of if this goes south? ;)

odskaggs2: Could you perhaps show me a picture of the RGB-input board and tell me which one it is? =)

It's a bit odd though that an BG 808s will work with MEC-tubes if they're from a 808s RetroBlock isn't it?

There's no difference in the elctronics on the motherboards? Even though the convergence boards is bent 180 degrees and put on the fron of the PJ?
post #9 of 20
9/3/04 at 7:44pm
The RGB input/switching board has several green leds on it. They light up and tell you what source is being used. Not very important was just wondering if my retrodata 808s used the same board.
Thanks
post #10 of 20
9/3/04 at 7:53pm
Thread Starter 
Ah ok, I think I found it and it was the same as in the regular 808s R762719.


Hehe I just noticed something funny.

I tried starting up the RetroBlock with the nicest tubes on itand it started up nicely but I didn't get a picture. Just some lines at the very bottom of the tubes so I thought, "Damn, the RetroBlock is broken." Then I opened the hatch for the moudles and checked if it reported any errors. Then all of a sudden it dawned on me... There's NO HV-cables going to the video module! I looked at the neckboards and sure enough. There's NO cable to be found on EITHER neckboard!


Somebody has stolen my HV-cables! =)
Any clue where I can get a set of three new ones?
post #11 of 20
9/3/04 at 9:25pm
"Somebody has stolen my HV-cables! =)
Any clue where I can get a set of three new ones?"

I just got one from VDC. $50 delivered to my door. Their number is on their website.

Good Luck
post #12 of 20
9/4/04 at 1:13am
Quote:
There's NO HV-cables going to the video module! I looked at the neck boards and sure enough. There's NO cable to be found on EITHER neck board!

Somebody has stolen my HV-cables! =)
No no, you have just discovered another difference between Sony and mec tubes. With (some) Sony tubes, a focus voltage is needed, although they are EM focus tubes. I have seen that before on BG1200 projectors.

So Sony tubes have a focus lead, an MEC's do not.
So when you are moving a MEC tube to a SONY chassis, just remove the focus leads, that's all!
Quote:
However, if it has been done before I haven't seen it mentioned here. So there is a small possibility that you might burn something out.
You say it hasn't been done, because it hasn't been discussed here.
Well I have 'transplanted' several MEC's for Sony's and vice versa in the BG 1200 AND in the BG1209s chassis. And before everybody starts saying BG1209s have only MEC tubes, they are right. But a Sony tube will work nicely in there, believe me.

You see, sony and MEC tubes are compatible, they are just not pin-compatible, and Sony's need a focus voltage, although they work just fine without one.

So you really only need to keep the CRT's and the neck boards together, and away you go!

MrKing, I see you live in Göteborg, well as a coincidence, I will be going there in two weeks time to visit my brother who lives 20km from you. I will be glad to come by and have a peek at your project.

Reinier
post #13 of 20
9/4/04 at 6:04am
Thread Starter 
Yes I have noticed that this has never been mentioned on here and I think that's really cool if it turns out that little ol' me is the first one to post a thread about this subject. =)

R.Bauer:

Aha, so that's what's that all about. =)
You are right I just noticed that the HV-cables were missing in action on all of the RetroBlocks.
So I should just remove the HV-cables from the regular 808s from the focus module or videomodule or what's it called and then I'm in business?
post #14 of 20
9/4/04 at 8:18am
Quote:
Originally posted by mrking


secstate:
If I just swap the whole thing with the neckboard then I shouldn't have to worry about the pin outs should I?
Which components should I keep a spare of if this goes south? ;)
No if you reuse the neckboards don't worry about the pinouts. My reference was to antoher poster wanting swap P16 from a Barco Retro into G70/XG.
post #15 of 20
9/4/04 at 8:22am
Quote:
Originally posted by R.Bauer

You say it hasn't been done, because it hasn't been discussed here.
Well I have 'transplanted' several MEC's for Sony's and vice versa in the BG 1200 AND in the BG1209s chassis. And before everybody starts saying BG1209s have only MEC tubes, they are right. But a Sony tube will work nicely in there, believe me.

Reinier
Actually I was fairly confident it has be done or tried by somebody, just I wasn't aware of the results. I have swapped a lot of parts between a lot of Barcos and even when the part numbers were different older EHT board, horizontal shift board out of a 1208 into an 808, etc...., they have worked. I just wanted to proivde some caution that while experimentation is fun but he might damage something. However if I had his collections of spares I wouldn't worry about it ;-).
post #16 of 20
9/4/04 at 12:46pm
Thread Starter 
Ok, I swapped the tubes and the neckboards from the RetroBlock and seated it in the regular 808s. Hooked everything up.

SUCCESS!!!!

So people. You CAN put MEC tubes into an Barco Graphics 808s!!
post #17 of 20
9/4/04 at 2:13pm
Let here it for the Crazy Swede! Thanks for letting us know.
post #18 of 20
9/4/04 at 2:23pm
Thread Starter 
[post deleted]
Sudden stupidity detected. =P
post #19 of 20
9/8/04 at 3:56pm
There we go, we have yust swapped in another set of MEC tubes in a BG808s

yust a little scary though... got som HV sparks of the tube at the first startup .. found the image on green and blue to be out of the fosfor... moved the image and it have never sparked again :)
post #20 of 20
11/27/04 at 1:57pm
Sounds interesting!

Did anyone else try this?

Anyone know if the neckboards from bg808s can be modified to fit mec crt's?
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