LaCrosse / Wausau, WI - HDTV - Page 7

Monday night football was fine via WQOW in Eau Claire. However, WKBT-DT via charter was unwatchable last night due to frequent freezing and sound problems.

Just got a receiver, I'm in the Rock Falls area. 13-1 comes in with a good strong signal....or nothing at all, I kind of suspect the problem is on their end but they won't even acknowledge emails.

18-1 comes in always, as do 28-1 & 28-2 (PBS Menomonie). What the hell is 28-3?? I get it most of the time and even tho the signal is strong the picture does this little freeze thing every 2 seconds or so. Are they playing around with a new channel or what?

It appears as if WKBT 8.2 is going to be UPN until Fall and then compete for the CW rights. Article Here Does anybody have any news about when WKBT is going to go full power? We had heard last Fall but it never materialized. Also having this UPN subchannel can't be too good for HD quality on 8.1.

From my October post a few pages back on this thread: "Apparently there are two phases to going full power. The new, high-gain, omnidirectional antenna is in the process of being installed. The new transmitter (the thing that feeds the signal to the antenna) isn't slated to be in place until next year. At this point, they don't know what the ERP of the new antenna with the old transmitter will be, but it will likely be a wash (new antenna minus much longer feed line.) What this means is that they will soon be covering a larger area with their low-powered signal, but they will not likely replicate analog coverage, or even approach it, until some time in 2006."

Subchannels can do bad things to picture quality, but they can also be done without harming the primary signal's picture quality at all. It all depends on if they use a fixed or dynamic encoder, and if they use a dynamic encoder, what they set the minimum rate to for the secondary channel. KSTP and KARE in the Twin Cities are perfect examples of how a subchannel can be added with minimal or no difference in picture quality. Their secondary channels are given a minimal (~100kbps) minimum level, and they get more by fitting into the zeros of the primary signal. Average bit rates for HD programming are somewhere in the 12-14Mbps range, but they peak well above 19Mbps (the ATSC 8VSB maximum) with fast motion changes and scene shifts. When the required bit rates go above the maximum output, artifacting becomes necessary, and it becomes more severe the more the scene change is drastic. Watch a football game during kickoff for something that is extremely difficult to do - pan across the screen. Broadcast HD is compressed at something like 45:1, and that's without multicasting.

I doubt we'll hear anything definite about how WKBT plans to fit a second channel in. Most likely it will either be very obvious that picture quality has dropped, or there will be a lot of debate, with some claiming to see something while others don't. Regardless, you need about 2Mbps for a good-looking SD feed.

According to Dennis McSorley from WKBT they are still broadcasting from a sidemounted antenna at low power. They plan on increasing their power and moving to the top of the tower this Spring.

Thanks Dennis for passing on the info to the DTV community.

PS Like sregener I also live in SE Minnesota just north of Rochester. DTV is beautiful. Height is more important than power.

That's amazing, since they took their primary analog transmitter offline for a few weeks while they worked on the tower this fall. But it does explain why my reception hasn't improved.

Can someone tell me what the regular SD DVR costs from Charter? My girlfriend already has a digital package, so I guess I'm wondering on the charge to upgrade to a DVR. Thanks for any feedback.

My charter bill shows:

HDPAK w/HDNET (Movies and Entertainment) - 6.99
HD Integrated Interactive Service - 3.00

So total of 9.99...

I have no idea what the secondline means, anyone???

Also, charter added TNT-HD and UHD this Monday to our HD w/o any notice. Nice timing on adding UHD,
now I can watch even more Olympics in HD.

Got an email today announcing that WEUX is finally on the air, limited power and SD only. They say they've got equipment coming later this year that will boost to full power and add HD capabilities. According to the FCC, they're running just under 2kw, and have a directional bias to that as well.

FCC estimated coverage here: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-serv...DS1107683.html

Was able to get weux-dt SD last night with a pretty strong signal. Still don't know what the hell the problem is with WEAU, no signal more often than not, and they won't respond to emails.

I moved to Marshfield recently & I have a DirecTV HR10-250 in the basement. I assumed I would need a large outdoor antenna to receive anything (antenna web results are blue & violet), but I tried a Radio Shack 15-1878 indoor antenna & to my surprise I am able to pick up 9.1, 13.1, 20.1, & 20.2 with signals in the 65-75 range. The only channel I need that I can't recieve is WSAW-DT channel 7.1...are they up to full power yet?
(and I'm waiting for Fox 55 of course)

WSAW-DT comes in fine at my house. I do have a large outdoor antenna, and am much closer than you, but I think you should be able to get it. It isn't as strong as 9.1 (I think I usually get 93% for 9.1 and 87% for 7.1), but if you put up and outdoor antenna (I wouldn't think it would have to be that large), you should be able to get it.

I have the same luck with channel 7. They are broadcast from the same tower but 9 must put out more power. One of these years FOX will finally get going on the digital signal and I'm sure they will not do HD right away either.

Hey it looks like all my emails to Fox 55 were posted on their web page. Nothing new about the progress to HD though.

http://www.wfxsfox55.com/reception.html

I'm new to this area & am receiving broadcasts from Wausau and Rhinelander via DirecTV--it's digital but not HD. Am too far away to get OTA HD except PBS. Does anyone get other network broadcasts--NBC, CBS, ABC, etc., with programming like LOST, West Wing, Comander In Chief, etc. from the local affiliates in HD via satellite????

I do not think Dish or Direct has local HD channels yet, but you can get them OTA with an antenna. Where do you live?

Thanks for the reply; am surrounded by a sea of boxes so it's taken me awhile to log back on. Am located in Vilas County half way between Minocqua and Eagle River. Do have a tall tower & some directional antennas but can only get PBS 36 in HD OTA; 7, 9, 12 are all snow in analog and nothing in digital. As the crow flies I'm about 65 miles from Wausau and 20 miles from Rhinelander.

Did confirm with DirecTV that locals are not available in HD at this time. Milwaukee is just coming online in April with locals HD. It's the 2nd phase of their update. DirecTV claims by 2007 all locals will eventually be HD capable, and I will need their 5LNB dish to get it.

Quick Question. Is WJFW-DT (NBC 12/DT16) even running? I have seen it listed in a few places but i get nothing. Also, when is WSAW boosting their power? I get that unrelialably due to terrain issues.

According to the FCC, WJFW-DT is running... at 1.3 watts (that's 0.013kw.) You can see the coverage prediction here: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-serv...=DS615316.html

All stations are required to reach 80% of their market area (defined by 1999 population numbers) by 7/1/06, with the possibility of one 6-month extension for circumstances out of the station's control. So I'd guess no later than 12/31/06.

Thanks

Regarding Fox48's digital signal, there's a FAQ on fox25fox48 dot com that can be seen by clicking on Station Info, then clicking on Engineering Q&A:

Do you broadcast an HD (High Definition) or SD (Standard Definition) Digital signal yet?
Yes, we do broadcast a digital signal on WLAX-DT (25.1) and WEUX-DT (48.1) ... it is an "SD/480i" formatted signal. Due to space & equipment conditions, WLAX and WEUX are having to "upgrade" the tower in the La Crosse area, the transmitter building facilities in the Eau Claire area, and the infrastructure for transporting each station's signal to each station's respective transmitter site. All of these upgrades/improvements will require a bit of time to get ordered, delivered, built, installed and tested. However, when those tasks are finally met and the signal is ready to be put on the air, there will be no delay in getting it out to you, the viewer.

Do you broadcast in stereo?
WLAX-TV & WLAX-DT, La Crosse, do not transmit stereo audio. However, WEUX-TV & WEUX-DT, Chippewa Falls-Eau Claire, WI. does transmit a "stereo" signal, but in reality, it is a "pseudo-stereo" audio signal that is truly being heard. Mono listeners will hear the same audio as stereo listeners, with no degradation of the quality.

Folks:

For locating WEUX DT (48.1 - RF Ch. 49), here are the coordinates and RC heights AGL & AMSL:
N43° 57' 24.08803" / W091° 43' 02.96633"
RCAGL: 429.8' or 128.94 m.
RCAMSL: 1,693.3' or 516.12 m.
ERP: 1.94 kW.
Main Lobe: 96° TN. towards the community of Chippewa Falls, WI. ...-

For locating WLAX DT (25.1 - RF Ch. 17), here are the coordinates and RC heights AGL & AMSL:
N43° 48' 15.22744" / W091° 22' 20.57003"
RCAGL: 250' or 76.2 m.
RCAMSL: 1465.0' or 446.53 m.
ERP: 2.64 kW.
Omni Antenna pattern, however, being side-mounted on the east-side of the tower, there's a bit of a null to the west of the tower site ...-

WLAX DT has been on the air since: 09 Dec.'04
WEUX DT has been on the air since: 01 Feb.'06

NOTE: It has been found that DTV signals are better-received if they're broadcast from the tower-site with some "beam-tilting" built into the transmitting antenna. Therefore, some stations may have up to -1.5° tilt in their signal. This will/should improve house-hold/indoor reception of signals in the immediate vicinity of the transmitting sites. Conversely, if the reception is still marginal, the receiving antenna my need to be pointed upwards towards the transmitting antenna's location. This small adjusted has been noted to increase the signal strength by 10 dB.! (I've seen this myself, while performing analog signal measurements in the field!)

ALSO, on a slightly less than related matter:

Contrary to what has been noted in earlier posts in this forum, WLAX, WEUX nor GRANT MEDIA LLC HAS EVER BEEN INVOLVED IN, NOR BEEN PART OF ANY LAWSUIT/FILING/PROCEEDING CONCERNING ANY BUSINESS INVOLVING PORNOGRAPHY OR ADULT-ENTERTAINMENT... It has been noted that there's another company that has the name of: Grant Media, L.L.C. (Note the comma between the word "Media" and the first "L" - in "lawyer-speak" that means a whole different company...). This may be the company that Mr. "sregener" has been referencing in the earlier posts. The "comma" "Grant Media, L.L.C." is not a partner or even a related entity to "Grant Media LLC" - These are two, wholly-separate companies. WLAX/WEUX/GRANT MEDIA LLC is not the pornography company referenced to in these earlier posts.

NOW, in the area (Around Friendship, WI.), there was, at one time, a "subscription-based" OTA-Porno Channel (41) that went "dark" a few years ago. That LPTV-translator was purchased by the WI. Public TV Network and currently acts as a translator for WHLA-TV, and its programming, out of La Crosse.

Outside of that particular situation, concerning any programming on ABC/CBS/FOX/NBC or even PBS, that's about the closest anyone in this area was/is/or will be involved in the porno-industry. If anyone has any questions concerning a particular stations' programming, feel free to call the stations directly and ask to speak to their respective Program Director. I'm sure they will be more than happy to set the record straight. Below, I've listed the main numbers of the respective stations and would like to see folks call first and get their facts straight from the people themselves before they post what they think are facts. It's never been easy to put the smoke back in the wood once the fire's been started.

Here are the main phone numbers:

ABC - WXOW/La Crosse (507) 895.9969
WQOW/Eau Claire (715) 835.1881

CBS - WKBT/La Crosse (608) 782.4678

FOX - WLAX & WEUX/La Crosse (608) 781.0025
WEUX/Chippewa Falls-Eau Claire (608) 781.0025

NBC - WEAU/Eau Claire (715) 835.1313

Thank you!

Mark G. Burg
C.O./C.E./S.Ho.V.A. Czar
WLAX/WEUX/Grant Media LLC (No Comma)
La Crosse/Chippewa Falls-Eau Claire, WI.

"TV - It's Not Oxygen!"
~~~~~~~~~~

It's certainly an understandable mistake. A quick search on "Grant Media LLC" still returns hits related to sex.com. I'll take your word for it that the two are different and separate entities and apologize for any distress or trouble my posting may have caused yourself or your company.

It does raise some interesting questions, as financial hardship has been the reason given for extensive delays by WEUX and WLAX with regards to digital broadcasting, including missing mandatory FCC deadlines. If not due to losing expensive lawsuits, what reason does Grant Media LLC (no comma) have for failing to do what nearly every other station in the country (and all others in the market, including WPT stations) managed to do?

Hey please throw WFXS Fox 55 from Wausau in the mix of stations not meeting any FCC deadlines!

IIRC, WFXS came into existance after the cutoff date for the allocation of digital channels. A search of the FCC database shows that they do not have a digital allocation or construction permit to put up a signal. Thus, they don't have any deadlines to meet. Compare the FCC data on WFXS with that for KYIN, another station that is not on the air yet, beyond the FCC's deadline.

KYIN is another station that cited financial hardship as their reason for not being on the air, and this is no doubt due to the fact that IPTV has several full-power affiliates, but covers a largely rural area and thus doesn't have the fundraising ability to get all the stations on the air in time. All the stations in Denver have failed to meet the full-power requirements there because of politics; the locals literally won't let them build a tower for fear of radiation and "blight."

I understand your frustration, but you can hardly blame a station for not putting up a signal when doing so would violate have to be in violation of the law and the FCC.

In regards to why SD and not HD, why later and not now?

#1.) Many moons ago, Congress told the FCC that they needed to improve TV. Congress, at that time, promised that there would be "loan guarantees" to small-market stations to help in performing the transition to digital. Guess what didn't transpire? Yep, you got it.

#2.) Back in '99, FOX told its affiliates that "...we don't need no stinking 720p/1080i..." They told the engineers that "480i will be what everyone will want to watch and nobody will (be the wiser) know the difference...) S-o-o-o-o,

#3.) Everyone (FOX O&Os & affiliates) went out and bought the 480i stuff. Then, everyone else (except ABC) went out and bought/contracted for 1080i (ABC went 720p).

#4.) FOX and their O&Os decided that they better switch up to 720p and there's the rub...they will "subsidize" their own operations but leave the rest of the mess in the affiliates' laps.

#5.) In the meantime, contracts have to be honored. What was ordered (Based on what FOX originally had outlined as a business plan) still has to be delivered and put up on-air. Then, the next stages of contracts could begin and what gets fixed/upgraded first are the "big boys" in every group around the country, including ours. WLAX & WEUX are the #6 & #7 stations (size-wise, market-wise) in our group.

#6.) Also, our stations' infrastructure (i.e.: microwaves, towers, antennas) are more spread out and extensive than the others in our group. It takes money to upgrade, it takes equipment and time to integrate these changes...all while keeping the analog stuff on the air and still trying to keep everything else running.

#7.) Taking money from Peter, to give to Paul, can only happen when Peter has money to take. Right now, our resources are being used to keep WLAX/WEUX on the air and viable. When the upgrades are produced, then we are able to purchase them and get them integrated. Simple? You'd think so. But, when problems occur (As is usually the case) everything else is put on "hold" until the problems are taken care of first. And many times, those problems have nothing to do with equipment-towers-finances or items related to the task at hand.

As it currently stands, WLAX's & WEUX's "digital" signals are on the air. WHEN the upgrades, for the respective places, can be performed, I've mentioned to the folks that "e'd" me, that I'd try to keep them in the loop. Relax...

Hey, we all can't be driving Cadillacs at the same time. Right?

Remember when "color" TV showed up? How many years did it take to get a "colored" set in all your friends' homes? You mean it didn't happen overnight? Dad had to get a second job? You ate more than the usual amount of PB&J sandwiches? What makes anyone think that there's a "money tree" just waiting to shed cash for every little project that a TV station (even radio has its own little upgrading to deal with) HAS to do because the FCC "asks" it to be done.

Think about this...Along with the current operations that EACH TV station has to keep running in order to CONTINUE to pay the bills, each station is REQUIRED to install, test, operate and maintain ANOTHER transmitter (and in many cases, an additional tower) - all with the same amount of money that was available BEFORE the mandates. The pie didn't get bigger-the mouths got larger and there's more of them.

When all is said and done, remember...

"TV ... It's Not Oxygen!"

Respectfully,

Mark

Thank you, Mark, for this response.

I'm fortunate that I get two other Fox stations, both of which do HD. One is O&O, so you know they had no trouble going live. The other is in Rochester, MN, which is a much smaller market than Eau Claire/La Crosse. They're "only" at 55kw ERP, but that signal covers a fair part of their market. KSMQ, a public television station that serves 800,000 viewers, came up with the money to do a digital broadcast that is HD capable (they don't pay PBS for the HD feed at this time) and is at 20kw ERP. Again, this covers a sizable chunk of their market. It's a little hard to swallow that a Fox affiliate which is being given the HD encoding equipment and the satellite receivers necessary to receive and decode the HD signal for broadcasting can't put out more than 1 or 2 kilowatts of energy. I know the cost per station is well over $1 million, but others have found a way.

I get a pretty clean picture from WEUX (analog) most of the time, and suspect I'll get a fine digital lock on WEUX-DT once your power exceeds 50kw. (I get WHWC-DT most of the time, though it does break up.) Not too shabby for being over 20 miles beyond the grade B contours.

Still, money is what makes the world go round, so I guess we'll all just have to wait for WEUX and WLAX to find some.

sregener, you obviously have a lock on the straight or even slightly crooked stuff hereabouts.

What do you know about the LPTV station KQEG in La Crosse, formerly the UPN affiliate until the CBS station hijacked that network from them, and now an indie? Are they going to go digital or just close up shop, maybe?