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Outfoxed - Page 2  

post #31 of 1711
I actually see more of the better spoken left on Fox than anywhere else. I doubt anyone can use Charlie Rangle as a punching bag. The disgruntled fox employees that produced this "evidence",were fired for incompetence according to Fox. Reckon they had a bone to pick? As I said the major networks had everything to gain by promoting this DVD, but it didn't get very much exposure among people that have to adhere to a certain standard for truth.

This is not a documentary it is just propaganda.
post #32 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by moore
Chris: I don't know if you were talking to me but if so, don't put words in my mouth.
Wasn't putting words in your mouth, was just asking questions.:D

Chris.
post #33 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by archiguy
Chris, that's not true. Neither candidate "wants" a draft and neither is saying so, nor are the media. It would be political suicide to advocate a return to the draft and everybody knows it. But that doesn't change the fact that the military is stretched thin and are not meeting their recruitment and retention goals.
Actually the military IS AT CAPACITY AND GETTING MORE APPLICANTS THAN IT HAS RECRUIT SPOTS. The SENATE will have to increase military size before this is an issue. (Strange that 2 DEMOCRAT senators are trying to do this.)

Quote:
Originally posted by archiguy
You're trying to support a more general defense of Fox News with a specific example that doesn't relate to the overall issue (a common tactic among Fox defenders). The bias of Fox News as outlined in this documentary is real and disturbing, and most importantly, it doesn't have a counterpart on the other side as you infer. It simply doesn't and most fair observers know this. Rupert Murdoch's views are well known and well documented, and his "news" network furthers his agenda as they are instructed to do. This, too, is documented in the film; nobody's making this up, sadly.
Funny about this, I don't remember FOX having to apologize for a FALSE and FABRICATED piece of evidence. A certain anchorman had to do this very recently. As to why CNN has HALF the viewers as FOX, it is because CNN has lost the trust of the viewers. Before the Clinton years that ratio was reversed.

Chris.
post #34 of 1711
It might be mildly interesting to see what take Outfoxed has on the Fox network. But I'm thinking that I'll have to wait for it to come out on DVD, and then for 2-for-1 day at the rental store, before I'll be able to see it (if even then). I guess that a chance to see a news channel (Fox or any other) have the validity of their reporting questioned, rightly or wrongly, isn't worth a whole lot of money to me.

It does seem, based on comments both in this forum and others, that this is yet another subject where many people cannot find a middle ground. The tone seems to have already been set. If a person doesn't care for Fox, or CBS, then nothing those organiations can do is satisfactory. They aren't allowed to have even a slight lean to the left or right without being demonized as being wholly biased in that direction.

I'd compare the news programs to movie reviews in that you really need to read (or listen) to more than one in order to form a good opinion. And, it helps if you keep an open mind while listening to opposing viewpoints. After all, if you already know what the truth is, then why bother listening, other than to have some ego-stroking consensual validation? Just read the short little factoids that crawl across the bottom of the new channel screens. Most everything else is commentary.

It's been said that we only learn from failure (or in this case from being wrong). If, at least occassionally, we don't find ourselves re-evaluating our beliefs and opinions in light of those which differ from our original conceptions, then we have atrophied mentally and remain in the same place intellectually while the rest of the world leaves us behind.

-- Greg

P.S. There are some wonderful opportunities for commentary tracks with this DVD. How about one from Bill O'Reilly? One with Ted Turner? Al Franken? Rush Limbaugh? Ann Coulter? Ted Rall? ;-)
post #35 of 1711
It doesn't really matter whether FOX is fair and balanced or not. They get better ratings than CNN, CNBC, MSNBC, and Headline News every night.
Period!
post #36 of 1711
Before this thread is closed...

Did anyone notice that the video was jerky? Also this is the only DVD
that I have ever used that the PAUSE button was disabled.

And yes Rupert Murdock is a threat to US democracy. In fact he is
not even a Citizen...

b2b
post #37 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by Aliens
I like the way Al Franken puts it: HANNITY and Colmes
I was going to post the same thing. I got a kick out of seeing it written that way every time the show's mentioned in Franken's book. I'll rent Outfoxed at some point but personally I don't need a movie to tell me how unfair and unbalanced they are.
post #38 of 1711
The news commentary show I want to see is "Carville and Nugent".
post #39 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisMcCarthy
Wasn't putting words in your mouth, was just asking questions.:D
This is not a question:

Quote:
Don't get me wrong, I know FOX has an agenda, but to pretend the other networks are upstanding examples of impartial journalism is so ignorant and idiotic as to make me wonder where you have been for the last 10 years.
You implied that I said something that I didn't, then used it to call me an idiot. Not appreciated.
post #40 of 1711
But then again, I guess that's standard practice when dealing with a disagreeable guest on Fox News.

SHUT UP! SHUT UP !!! CUT HIS MIC!
post #41 of 1711
Gosh...this must be a record for a thread of this nature lasting so long!

I give it till midnight...then the disappearing act!

-Alex-
post #42 of 1711
I think when you're fed the left-leaning media for decades, something more "fair and balanced" is of course going to seem right-leaning...

- Cryo
post #43 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by Cryofax
I think when you're fed the left-leaning media for decades, something more "fair and balanced" is of course going to seem right-leaning...

- Cryo
Amen, like I said, I don't see it. They give about same air time to both sides. Of course that is unbalanced when you have a weak lefty argument.
post #44 of 1711
Thread still open? Amazing...

b2b
post #45 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by celticwolf
The news commentary show I want to see is "Carville and Nugent".
LOL. Armed or unarmed? If armed, I'd put my money on Ted.
post #46 of 1711
I'd bet on the Motor City Madman in either case.
post #47 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by Cryofax
I think when you're fed the left-leaning media for decades, something more "fair and balanced" is of course going to seem right-leaning...

- Cryo
Something "More" fair and balanced or.................... "fair and balanced" ?
post #48 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by b2bonez
Thread still open? Amazing...

b2b
It is "digital software" and that's the title at the top of this forum. It should be open for discussion like any other DVD content. The mixing of entertainment and journalism with no consideration given to anything but ratings is a valid concern.
I'm enjoying this discussion. I hope it's allowed to continue.
post #49 of 1711
Juan Williams sometimes guest hosts some of the shows on Fox, and he's pretty credible. The rest of their "news-o-tainment" staff are basically comic relief. It's a sad state for domestic journalism when a comedy program like The Daily Show addresses news issues more substantively than our "real news". I repeat, there is near ZERO credibility for domestic broadcast news, Fox may be the worst offender by some margin, but MSNBC, CNN etc are almost as bad. It's just lazy, gunshy, incompetent reporting regardless of the network. Thank goodness we have access to foreign news and independent media. It's a VERY sorry state of affairs.
post #50 of 1711
sbddvm writes:
It doesn't really matter whether FOX is fair and balanced or not. They get better ratings than CNN, CNBC, MSNBC, and Headline News every night.
Period!
==============================

Bingo! You are 100% correct, news is now infotainment PERIOD. Watch the 70's film Network, it's far truer than I ever thought it could be. Once news divisions were required to show a profit, and the Fairness Doctrine was abandoned we began this slide towards incompetent, unresponsive, lazy journalism. It has created an environment where something as blatantly disinformative as Fox News can exist. And the other networks fall in line, replacing news with "What We think will sell, and won't alienate our corporate masters". This is NOT news, it's nothing but propaganda pure and simple. It's not just Fox News by ANY means. It's all the major domestic cable and broadcast news sources.

Compare CNN international to CNN domestic. You would be shocked at how little the US public is allowed to see.
post #51 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by uzun
Thank goodness we have access to foreign news and independent media. It's a VERY sorry state of affairs.
And the Internet ;)
post #52 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisMcCarthy
Actually the military IS AT CAPACITY AND GETTING MORE APPLICANTS THAN IT HAS RECRUIT SPOTS. The SENATE will have to increase military size before this is an issue. (Strange that 2 DEMOCRAT senators are trying to do this.)
<heavy sigh> No less than Lt. Gen. H. Steven Blum, chief of the National Guard Bureau which oversees 460,000 members of the Air and Army National Guard notes that recruiting is already being affected. For example, the Guard had set a goal of 56,000 recruits for the fiscal year ending Sept. 30, but is likely to end up with about 51,000. It would be the first time since 1994 that the Guard has missed its signup goal.

The stories are similar for the Regular Services. Some soldiers are not reporting for duty when they receive their recall notices, and not re-upping at previous rates. The Army is thinking of shortening combat tours from 12 months to 7 in hopes of stopping the bleeding.

A Pentagon-appointed panel of outside experts, the Defense Science Board, has concluded in a new study that the American military does not have sufficient forces to sustain current and anticipated operations. And you wonder why they're talking about a draft?

Of course, if you get your news from FOX, you would be blissfully ignorant of these things, as you've shown. Thanks for making my point.
post #53 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by moore
You implied that I said something that I didn't, then used it to call me an idiot. Not appreciated.
Went back and reread your post, you are correct. I originally was NOT talking about your post, but somehow dragged you into this. Sorry.

Chris.
post #54 of 1711
'Now for something completely different'

It appears safe to say ALL of the networks are 'performing to their own music'. Whether you think Fox is worst, or MSN/CNN seems to depend on you political leanings.

I used to blame the media for the sad state of affairs (lack of journalistic credibility). Then I read the Wall Street Journal. Behold, a paper which stays with FACTS. Why do you ask? Because its readership would not tolerate anything less! The sad truth is that the PEOPLE are to blame for the bad journalism. This is business folks! If we did not tolerate bad journalism, those companies would be bankrupt and replaced with what WE WANT. Unfortunately, what the people want is a CIRCUS. Period.

Chris.
post #55 of 1711
I too have found the Wall Street Journal to be one of the few sources of actual FACT in domestic media in general. While the print media is better than broadcast news at this point, I find the Wall Street Journal to be ahead of most print media.
post #56 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisMcCarthy
Went back and reread your post, you are correct. I originally was NOT talking about your post, but somehow dragged you into this. Sorry.
Thanks for the apology. It's rare here. We have all remember that although we can get excited about these things, it's best to respect each other. It's hard to get that across sometimes in internet forums.

All the best to you.

PS - Totally agree about the WSJ - good reporting, except stay away from the op-ed pieces!!! :)
post #57 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by archiguy
Here in Charlotte, the once balanced WBT, formerly "the voice of the south" with their powerful transmitter that could be heard up and down the east coast, has gone all right-wing, all the time. When asked if his conscience bothers him, the new station manager just sniffs "I'm giving them what they want". Any pretense of serving a greater public good by presently both sides of an issue has been abandoned in the ultimate pursuit of higher profits. Some may think this is a good thing; I don't, and I'd be just as offended if the shoe were on the other foot.
It's not an isolated example. It's happened most everywhere in the southeast. As with many radio markets of similiar size, here we have one 24/7 "news/talk" AM station which has dominated the market since World War 2. For many decades it gave us fair minded reporting and it gave us call-in talk which welcomed all opinion.
As it did most everywhere, that all changed solely because of the phenomenal success of one syndicated radio personality. When he started turning in ratings which had never been seen before, everyone scrambled to emulate that success. The result is this station which was once fair minded and open to all opinion has now been reduced to an instrument of policital propaganda from 6 AM until midnight.
It's all driven by money. Not political leaning. If, as you say the shoe had been on the other foot, it would have all probably developed the same way except the propoganda would be a different message.
These very limited airwaves belong to the public. They don't belong to media congomerates and they don't belong to P.T. Barnum. We should now be demanding that they be returned to us.
post #58 of 1711
Thread Starter 
Robert, all I can say is AMEN, bro.
post #59 of 1711
Quote:
Originally posted by archiguy
<heavy sigh> No less than Lt. Gen. H. Steven Blum, chief of the National Guard Bureau which oversees 460,000 members of the Air and Army National Guard notes that recruiting is already being affected. For example, the Guard had set a goal of 56,000 recruits for the fiscal year ending Sept. 30, but is likely to end up with about 51,000. It would be the first time since 1994 that the Guard has missed its signup goal.

The stories are similar for the Regular Services. Some soldiers are not reporting for duty when they receive their recall notices, and not re-upping at previous rates. The Army is thinking of shortening combat tours from 12 months to 7 in hopes of stopping the bleeding.

A Pentagon-appointed panel of outside experts, the Defense Science Board, has concluded in a new study that the American military does not have sufficient forces to sustain current and anticipated operations. And you wonder why they're talking about a draft?

Of course, if you get your news from FOX, you would be blissfully ignorant of these things, as you've shown. Thanks for making my point.
You are missing the connection, less people are signing up to be in the guard and reserves and would rather go straight into the fight. There have always been awol and deserters, even during times of peace, the numbers are no worse now. As for re-enlisting the last time I checked the Army Times their was no problem in this area, quite the opposite.

We are training Iraqi's to fill that void in Iraq, and do not need a larger military at the moment. Those anticipated operations include Iran and NKorea , to defeat NK in a conventional war it would take a force greater than all of Nato to best them conventionally. Trust me I spent a year there in the western corridor. These people are dug in for the long fight with truly awesome offensive capabilities without even having to cross the border. The only way to defeat NK is to beat them in the ground, with bunker buster nukes, which we are developing as we speak.

Archiguy I am gonna guess you choose not to serve. I could be wrong but it seems you are out of touch with the big military picture. Maybe some time listening to Fox military analysts would serve your judgement well.
post #60 of 1711
Thread Starter 
Folks, if this thread is going to stay alive, please confine yourself to the discussion of the movie itself and the issues it raises. If this just becomes a free form political debate, it will get shut down. The moderators have been very tolerant so far, but lets not push our luck.
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