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PLV-Z3 Tweak Thread - Page 7

post #181 of 922
Hey Silroc,

Do you have it mounted on the ceiling? I had been noticing this as well over the past few weeks and wasn't sure why? however today I took it down from the ceiling to clean the filters and as I was hooking it up again my girlfriend was walking in the room over the projector and the unit was bouncing all over the place, I'm not sure that this is the cause but I do suffer the same problem.

I have a question for you, now that I've hooked my projector back up I can't seem to get the bottom line straight? the top and sides are perfect but the bottom is way off? the projector is level side to side so I can't figure it out?

any idea?
post #182 of 922
Quote:


Originally posted by crab1664
Hey Silroc,

Do you have it mounted on the ceiling? I had been noticing this as well over the past few weeks and wasn't sure why? however today I took it down from the ceiling to clean the filters and as I was hooking it up again my girlfriend was walking in the room over the projector and the unit was bouncing all over the place, I'm not sure that this is the cause but I do suffer the same problem.

I have a question for you, now that I've hooked my projector back up I can't seem to get the bottom line straight? the top and sides are perfect but the bottom is way off? the projector is level side to side so I can't figure it out?

any idea?

Crab
I am pretty much a newbie - So I dont want to give you any bad advice.

I have it mounted to the back wall in the basement. I suspected wall shaking also as the possible problem, but this is a major load bearing wall, and I assumed it was more fortified from vibration. But since you mention it, I guess thats what it could be.




Regarding your leveling issue - This is my guess as a newbie !!!

Personally I would first start with a completely un modified image (no keystone, no lens shift) and make adjustments to the projector mount to get a perfectly level image - then you I'd move forward with lens shift adjustments and finally keystone if needed to fine tune.
post #183 of 922
Quote:


Originally posted by silroc
Does anyone else have to adjust the manual lens shift a couple of times a week ?

For some reason, every few days, my picture is either too left, too right, up, or down....... It's not a big problem, just wondering if this is common.

I do noticed it too and I usually have to adjust it up or down.
post #184 of 922
Yes, I too have to adjust my manual lens shift usually two or three times a week! It is getting extrememly annoying now, as I have to keep grabbing a chair or step stool to reach the ceiling to adjust.
post #185 of 922
I took some quick snaps of The Incredibles and one from Finding Nemo with the CC20R filter and red push attenuator on. Check my gallery if you're interested.

As to having to adjust the lens shift slightly from time to time, I was having to at first. But then I learned to position it, then back the dial up a little so it sits in that slack area where nothing moves. I've had a lot less of a problem this way. But then, mine is on a shelf over my head, so I can reach up from my seating position and fix it.
post #186 of 922
Where could I buy an attenuator to help with the red push on my Sanyo Z3?

Also, is the Smart III system recommended to help calibrate my projector?

Any help is appreciated.
post #187 of 922
If you're using component video, you simply get a RCA style line level attenuator (typically used for audio) and put it on the Cr lead of the component cable. I got both a 1dB and 3dB attenuator from PartsExpress.com, because I wasn't sure how much I would need. With the 3dB attenuator, it cut red too much. With the 1dB attenuator, it's just right. It's a very cheap fix if you have too much red in the decoder and does not affect grayscale.
post #188 of 922
Quote:


Originally posted by Jeremy Anderson
What you're looking for on DVE is CLIPPING. In other words, you want white to remain white without the upper IRE levels starting to look the same. The segments of DVE's grayscale pattern that has dots above and below represents 0 and 100 IRE. DVE includes information ABOVE 100 IRE so that you can observe where 100 IRE and the step above it appear to be the same color. You want to raise it until they look identical, then back it down until you can see a difference between 100 IRE and the step above it. Then, you need to recheck brightness.

Hi Guys,

I need a bit of help with using DVE as well for adjusting brightness and contrast. The rest is all fine because I bought the projector from cine4home guys and they did all the other stuff (colour, tint bla bla) for me.

According to my understanding the PLUGE pattern test are for the CRT displays as "blooming" is a phenomenon only relevant for the CRT world. For the LCD projectors they recommend to use the "REVERSE GRAY RAMP" which is title 12 chapter 14 and has dots above and below that. The way the ask to set is that get the contrast in the middle (which is 0 for Z3) and move the brightness down till the blackest box (extreme left on the lower bar and extreme right on the upper bar) disappears and than back off a little bit till it reappears. Once you set the brightness right increase the contrast till the whitest box disappears and than back off a little. This exercise is to be repeated between brightness and contrast till the both the blackest and the whitest boxes are BOTH barely visible. I did that and ended up with a brightness of -6 and contrast of +18. BTW I was using low lamp mode with these settings.

Now the problem is that with these settings some movies i.e. topgun looked pretty good but on the other hand "Man on fire" looked like crap (a part of Denzel Washington's face would literally disappear in darker scenes). Ok I backed off a little bit during that movie and contacted cine4home the next day. They said that these things are normal as most of the movies are not mastered very well and therefore you can't have a setting which would work for every movie.

Now my questions are:

1. Am I setting the brightness/contrast in the right way?

2. If the statement from cine4home is true how do you guys keep one setting for all moves and be happy with it?

3. What could be a couple of movies with good mastering that can be used as reference once you have done the calibration?

Thanks in advance for any help extended as I am really in need of it.

Sincerely,
-dollarman
post #189 of 922
It sounds like you're setting brightness/contrast correctly. If you're losing shadow detail, you might want to try raising gamma slightly.

That being said, Man On Fire has a very stylized look and is meant to look very overexposed. It isn't so much that it was poorly mastered to DVD, as it looks very much like the theatrical presentation (meaning the transfer is pretty decent). Man On Fire used a process called skip bleaching to bring out the film grain and make it look gritty. Skip bleaching is just that - they skip the step during the film developing where they bleach off a layer of silver emulsion. This same effect was used on Spielberg's Minority Report and Saving Private Ryan, as well as many others.

The whole point of calibration is to reproduce the DVD on-screen as faithfully as possible. In other words, once you find a calibrated setting, you shouldn't need to change it. If a film looks strange with your calibrated settings, then it was supposed to (barring other variables such as edge enhancement or compression artifacts).
post #190 of 922
Quote:


Originally posted by Jeremy Anderson
It sounds like you're setting brightness/contrast correctly. If you're losing shadow detail, you might want to try raising gamma slightly.

First of all thanks for helping me on this one. About changing/raising the gamma setting is it only by eye or is their more scientific/meausred way of doing. I could not find anything in my DVE disk for gamma correction. If its done by eye what is exactly I am looking for.

I also have another problem which I was wondering could be fixed with a tweak. In some 16:9 format movies (The village, Ladykillers)the picture does not fit the screen perfectly. When the height is perfect the width is about 1-1.5 inches out of the viewing area. Has anyone else encountered such a problem and is their a way to fix it.

Regarding one of my previous questions are there really no DVDs which you could use as a viewing reference.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Sincerely,
-dollarman
post #191 of 922
DVE doesn't have any kind of gamma reference, and the only real way to properly adjust gamma is with a meter (like the SMART III system). Avia, however, has a gamma pattern that works fairly well for getting it close by eye.

In very simple terms, gamma is how quickly the white level goes up in relation to the supplied signal. If the IRE levels above black (0 IRE) look too dark, you lose shadow detail. Raising the gamma level alters the curve by which each IRE level goes up in contrast. In other words, it isn't linear; 10 IRE does not equal 10% gray. Without Avia or a meter, all you can do is just adjust the gamma setting and see if it brings out the shadow details better without washing out the picture.

As for The Ladykillers, The Village, etc. this is because those movies are 1.78:1 instead of 1.85:1. Put simply, the black bars to the side are encoded on the DVD to keep the picture at the proper aspect ratio. The reason most people don't notice this is that most people have a certain amount of overscan (usually around 5%) that conceals the black bars on the side. So if you really want to get rid of the bars on the side, just increase overscan. You'll cut off a bit of the top and bottom of the picture, but not so much that you'll miss anything.

There are many DVD's that people consider visual references, but it's pretty subjective. The only two that immediately come to mind for me are The Fifth Element: Superbit (which is good for checking fleshtone delineation and detail) and Charlotte Gray (which just has a damn nice transfer). Another one that I like that looks so good it seems hi-def is the haunted submarine movie BELOW, which is also very good for assessing shadow details.
post #192 of 922
Quote:
Originally posted by crab1664
Hey Silroc,

Do you have it mounted on the ceiling? I had been noticing this as well over the past few weeks and wasn't sure why? however today I took it down from the ceiling to clean the filters and as I was hooking it up again my girlfriend was walking in the room over the projector and the unit was bouncing all over the place, I'm not sure that this is the cause but I do suffer the same problem.

I have a question for you, now that I've hooked my projector back up I can't seem to get the bottom line straight? the top and sides are perfect but the bottom is way off? the projector is level side to side so I can't figure it out?

any idea?

I suspect it's not aimed exactly perpendicular to the screen on both planes, horizonal and vertical. The two projectors I have owned can be aimed so that the screen has perfectly parallel sides and top/bottom by yawing the projector left and right and pivoting it up and down until the sides are dead parallel.

Ricketty
post #193 of 922
Hi Jeremy,

Thanks for your help again. I have ended up ordering AVIA as every now and than I need to do something which DVE does not do or it does but not as user friendly as AVIA. One question. Is AVIA any better than DVE in setting contrast/brightness as well? I find this DVE pattern to be a little bit confusing and would prefer black/white stripes on the side the way it is for setting CRT displays in DVE.

I am also thinking about Rone's 100 hour setting a try and see how it works for me.

Sincerely,
-dollarman
post #194 of 922
Avia's easier to set contrast and brightness with, in my opinion... but that pattern on DVE is helpful if you start toying with the grayscale. That's actually how I tweaked my grayscale after putting the CC20R filter in place - I put that DVE pattern up on both my RPTV and Z3 simultaneously and compared the two (since my RPTV is ISF calibrated to 6500k). Either way, it's good to have both discs if you're a serious tweaker.
post #195 of 922
I just bought a pioneer dv-575 to go with my sanyo plv-z3 .. I will be using progressive scan through the component output .. Is there anyone that can recommend settings for me? Preferably someone that has a pioneer dv-575 ..
post #196 of 922
Thanks Ricketty!
post #197 of 922
Hi!
I hope someone can help me. I have a problem with my Sanyo z3.
When i tried to turn it on it started to turn red in the warning indicator.
I tried to disconnect the AC power cord and then reconnect it, and turn the projektor on again, but the same thing happened.
The ventilation start a little and thenit goes out and the warning lamp lights red.
post #198 of 922
Hi there,

Welcome to the forum. It looks like that the fan is not working correctly in your unit which is causing that warning light to come on. Better send the unit back to Sanyo for a check up as trying to fix it yourself would probably void your warranty.

BTW for similar questions/issues the PLV-Z3 thread is more appropriate as this thread is mainly for Z3 tweaking.


Sincerely,
-dollarman
post #199 of 922
Hi Dollarman.

Thanks for the respons.
I think I will send it back to Sanyo (

But its just a little wierd because ive only had the projektor in 2 days.

Jacob.
post #200 of 922
Quote:


Originally posted by tompa39
I just bought a pioneer dv-575 to go with my sanyo plv-z3 .. I will be using progressive scan through the component output .. Is there anyone that can recommend settings for me? Preferably someone that has a pioneer dv-575 ..

Noone that can give me any advice? I have tried tweaking the picture abit, but i´m not at all satisfied .. I will buy a DVE dvd in the near future to make the best of it, but in the meanwhile I really could use some pointer .. Thx in advance
post #201 of 922
For the tweakers:
I'm currently using a CC20R filter on my Z3. But I started looking around and found this filter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=102574&is=REG

My theory is that the bulb in the Z3 is mercury vapor/metal halide, so that mercury vapor filter for daylight film ought to do a better job of restoring the color balance of whites (i.e. the weakness of red in the bulb) than a stock color correcting filter. I ordered a 4"x4" variant of this from another place that had it in stock, so I should be toying with this by the weekend. I'll post my conclusions on how this works compared to the CC20R filter. I still haven't ordered SMART III (due to unavoidable car repairs), but I ought to get a pretty good result by comparing grayscale to my ISF'd RPTV.

Most people are using either red color correcting filters or daylight filters for fluorescent (DAY-FL), but I haven't seen anyone try a daylight filter specifically for mercury vapor. At the very least, it'll be an interesting experiment.
post #202 of 922
I have had my eye on one of those filters for a few weeks now. I really like what the CC20R has been doing for me. I ended up using settings similar to your's but backed off on the green to give me a better black.

Have you gived noticed any problems watching The Phantom Menace? I watched it last night and thought the digital image looked nasty. I then watched LOTR and even Dude, Where's my Car and thought the image was perfect (smooth, vivid and crisp).

Menace just looked so gritty.

This is the only movie that I have seen this happen with.
post #203 of 922
Funny you should mention that about the greens. I've since TOTALLY changed my settings, based on Steve Smallcombe's brief comments in Secrets' review. I'm now starting with POWERFUL mode (but with lamp on theater black) instead of Creative Cinema and I'm getting WAY better visible contrast (though it took a little longer to get the grayscale comparable to my RPTV). I'll post my new settings tonight when I get home, because I think you'll like the results.

The Phantom Menace was not a digital transfer; it was scanned from film. It's very grainy and has some visible ringing around contrasting areas (i.e. heads against sky, etc.) that makes it look horrible no matter what you view it on. In other words, your Z3 is properly reproducing the crappy picture on that disc.
post #204 of 922
RINGING!!! TONS OF RINGING!! I am so glad you said that about 'Menace. I was watching it last night thinking one of the kids was messing around with my settings or something (that better not EVER happen).

Thanks for setting me straight on the digital thing too.

I look forward to your settings being "published". Thanks !
post #205 of 922
Jeremy and johnny

If you dont mind me asking, how many hours do you both have on your bulbs?

Have you noticed any dimming?

Thanks a lot
post #206 of 922
I have about 60 hours. No dimming to be had.
post #207 of 922
I have 354 hours as of last night with no significant dimming yet. Between my movie habit, hi-def digital cable and the X-Box, I've put some serious time on the Z3's bulb in a relatively short period of time (less than three months).
post #208 of 922
A little tip for everyone: Make sure Sharpness is set to -7. (Not 0 which is default I believe).

Setting it to -7 removed ALL ringing/edge enhancement effects I seen.
(Not the ones that was applied to the DVD of course)
post #209 of 922
-7 seems a bit extreme to me, and going that low on my Z3 caused softening of fine details (especially noticeable on hi-def material). After comparing DVE and Avia's patterns, I find that -3 is the point where I get even brightness across the frequency sweep without adverse ringing or softening of thin lines. However, I'm checking sharpness with the projector in NORMAL THROUGH and FULL THROUGH modes so that it displays each pattern without scaling (to rule out scaler-induced artifacts). You also need to make sure that TRANSIENT IMPROVEMENT is turned off in the advanced menu, as that seems to create ringing in the higher frequency patterns (almost like scan velocity modulation on a CRT).

Also, the "right" setting for sharpness can depend on your source. Some DVD players don't pass all material unaltered (especially when you get into 6.75MHz patterns). You should always calibrate based on YOUR individual equipment, though sharing settings can be a useful guideline or starting point when we get into serious tweaking.
post #210 of 922
I keep my sharpness at -3 too. It seems to look the best based on the calibrations that I have done. I also noticed that it does soften the HD images. I never knew what transient setting did. Thanks for the info.

Jeremy, man that is some serious bulb time!!!! I got mine before you did and I have 1/5 the hours you have. I try to only use the pj during the weekends and I use my HDTV during the weekdays. Gotta show some love to the "little display".
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