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Charlotte, NC - OTA - Page 220

post #6571 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

Well I am disappointed to hear this. And surprising because they have just heavily promoted WJZY as FOX-46. And most of their O&O stations use the channel number in branding, such as FOX-5 in DC and Atlanta. And as you mention, FOX Carolinas will be confused with WHNS in GSP, where there is significant overlap. But I guess they don't want to use FOX Charlotte again.
Maybe it is a cost cutting move by Murdoch. i.e. they can use the same graphics. Maybe they plan to do like McClatchy did with its papers in the Carolinas. i.e. Same stories, but with minor changes to some of the details and/or generic AP reposts.

I have noticed that since Murdoch took over WJZY & WMYT, that both channels have gutted most of their late night syndicated programming and replaced it with infomercials. No surprises I guess. IMO, Fox really doesn't believe in OTA like most of the other corporations that own broadcast TV in Charlotte. They are just in it for the fees and nothing else.
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/7/13 at 4:41am
post #6572 of 7653
Hmm. LOL WSOC apparently sent Blair Miller to the Billy Graham birthday in Asheville. Someone from the event was giving an interview to one of the TV reporters/anchors from one of the other stations. I couldn't tell which one, but some of the other CLT stations had microphones listening to this guy too. All of a sudden Miller decides to do a teaser for WSOC, tells them "Sorry Guys" and just starts talking right over the interviewer and interviewee. Sounded like gibberish to me with 3 people talking as the party from the other TV station wasn't having it and kept right on with the interview. I'm guessing WJZY & WCCB will have to cut that part of the interview unless they want to put Miller on their broadcasts.

I've never seen anything like it. Maybe Mrs Manners needs to pay WSOC a visit.
post #6573 of 7653
The Asheville and GSP stations are covering the Billy Graham birthday also. I saw some of the coverage on WBTV, WCNC, and WYFF-4. And 13-WLOS of course.
post #6574 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

I think he is just filling in this week on Charlotte Today. I was sorry when he left because he was one of their better anchors and reporters.

Looks as if he is a reporter for WBZ, channel 4, in Boston now. I saw him reporting on a story there and it reminded me of WCNC's better days.
post #6575 of 7653
I live just south of Charlotte in Fort Mill and I'm getting ready to cut Directv and go with an OTA antenna but I'm not sure which one to get. I plan placing the antenna where my Directv dish is currently located on the garage roof. This is completely new territory for me so any recommendations would be appreciated.

Here's my TV Fool report: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae21ef28b045
post #6576 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by northman11 View Post

I live just south of Charlotte in Fort Mill and I'm getting ready to cut Directv and go with an OTA antenna but I'm not sure which one to get. I plan placing the antenna where my Directv dish is currently located on the garage roof. This is completely new territory for me so any recommendations would be appreciated.

Here's my TV Fool report: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae21ef28b045
An Antennacraft HBU-22 should work for Charlotte signals, which are mostly UHF except for WTVI which is HiVHF. But if you are also interested in WSPA from GSP and WOLO and WIS from Columbia, then there is a larger HBU-33 or HBU-55. And Winegard has a 7694, or a larger 7696 or 7698. But for Charlotte only, even a Clearstream 2V from Walmart should work, but you may need a low gain preamp for long cable runs, or a dist amp.
post #6577 of 7653
Keep in mind the Antennacraft antennas are 300 ohm antennas. You will have to provide a decent balum in order to use coax with it. (great though if you are going with twin-lead wire). I have their 4 bay which is a well constructed, mostly invisible antenna if you want to put it outside on the side of the house.

The problem, which makes reception of all the channels in Charlotte surprisingly difficult in many areas is the 70 degree separation between the two antenna farms as well as VHF if you want WTVI. There isn't a commercial antenna that works well with this combination unless you are willing to modify it. My preference would be an 8 bay due to the beam width, but there isn't a decent 8 bay out there that can also receive VHF-Hi.

If I was purchasing for myself, given that TV fool report, I'd go with the Winegard HDB7697. It's significantly cheaper than the equivalent Antennacraft antenna (nice antenna however) and there is enough beam width & gain where you could point it somewhere between the two farms and pick up most of it. WHKY might be a challenge but if you can't get it, it's no great loss unless you like infomercials and low, hardly watchable resolution. Pointed in this direction you might also score a couple of out of market signals with this antenna.
post #6578 of 7653
Thanks for the advice guys. Someone recommended a Clearstream CS2 and I can get that locally today to test out. If that doesn't work, I'll certainly try your suggestions. I'm just ready to drop Directv smile.gif
post #6579 of 7653
I'm currently looking at getting a signal amplifier for my antenna, at least 4 output possibly 8, does anyone have any recommendations? Right now I'm running straight from the antenna to my AM21N and it works fine, with the exception of some occasional pixellation on a few channels. I'm about to modify that though and add two more cable runs for additional TVs that will be antenna only in two rooms in the house. According to the AM21 my signal levels range from 83% on the high end (WBTV) to 40% on the low end (WAXN) with the rest somewhere in the middle. I think those signal levels are because the AM21N has two tuners and splits the signal internally however. If I plug directly into my TV I have a perfect signal on most Charlotte stations and WSPA. I'm pointing towards Charlotte so that is to be expected, everything else from GSP is off the "Back side" of my 8 bay antenna. My concern is if I start adding additional TVs my signals on the AM21 will get worse, so I need something to boost them. I already have a pre-amp on the antenna.

Anyone have any suggestions?
post #6580 of 7653
Channel Master CM3418 Distribution Amplifier

http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=cm3418&d=channel-master-cm3418-distribution-amplifier-(cm-3418)&utm_campaign=base&utm_medium=organic&utm_source=google_base
post #6581 of 7653
Has anyone noticed more pixelation on WCNC 36.1 in the last 2 days? Signal is strong and audio is consistent but wondering if this is isolated to my setup. Thanks
post #6582 of 7653
I've noticed it. It seems to be an ongoing problem with that station. I watched a recording of "Revolution" yesterday that was recorded a couple of weeks ago and there was a lot of pixelation in it.
post #6583 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by northman11 View Post

Thanks for the advice guys. Someone recommended a Clearstream CS2 and I can get that locally today to test out. If that doesn't work, I'll certainly try your suggestions. I'm just ready to drop Directv smile.gif

The CS2, is pretty overpriced for what constitutes a couple of UHF loops embedded in plastic. (Plastic degrades in the elements.) it's also a UHF only antenna which means no WTVI.

Instead of that antenna, I'd suggest the Channel Master CM-2016 (CM2016). It should work fine for Charlotte based on your report, and it's smaller than the suggestion that I gave above. It will also mount on a satellite roof mast. It's less than 1/2 the price of a CS2 and it has better gain and beam width. This is a newer design which has been optimized for channels 7-50 where most channels are located these days.
post #6584 of 7653
I'm not impressed by the CS2 either. Maybe that is because I have actually held and used one. The 2016 is a better choice for you northman.
post #6585 of 7653
They are talking about the C2-V which is in Walmart and Best Buy, not the original UHF-only C2. Antennas Direct finally figured out that they couldn't ignore VHF and brought out the C2-V more than two years ago.

I got one to use with my camper two years ago. It folds up nicely and is compact enough that I can put it in a closet for storage. It's also tough enough that it won't bend or break as readily as a 2016 which is likely very close in performance. Both antennas use plastic materials, both say they are UV-stabilized. Besides, the C2-V does have a lifetime warranty and Antennas Direct does have a reputation for standing behind that warranty for their customers. I needed a part for my 91XG a while back and they sent it without question or charge. Try that with a CM.

To each their own, I guess...
post #6586 of 7653
If Clearstream 2-V is inadequate, then you could also consider Antennacraft HBU-22 from Radioshack. And there are larger versions, HBU-33 or HBU-55 if you are interested in GSP or Columbia. And Winegard has similar versions, 7696, 7697 and 7698 which are also very good and have better build quality. And the Winegards have a built in balun connection, so no matching transformer is needed.
post #6587 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

If Clearstream 2-V is inadequate, then you could also consider Antennacraft HBU-22 from Radioshack. And there are larger versions, HBU-33 or HBU-55 if you are interested in GSP or Columbia. And Winegard has similar versions, 7696, 7697 and 7698 which are also very good and have better build quality. And the Winegards have a built in balun connection, so no matching transformer is needed.

I've been doing some more research on antennas as my Mom is in the market for one. I have discovered that Antennacraft includes a balum with their antennas now. (at least for the HBU series) The HBU-22 is a good contender for the TV fool report shown my north. I also like the HBU-33 & HBU-55 but word to the wise for anyone wanting an antenna like that, or the winegard that I listed above.... they are quite large. The 33 is something like 7ft long and the 55 is a whopping 12 ft. I'll probably put a 33 up at my mom's house because the only CBS station there is WBTW 13 with their transmitter located in Dillon about 52 miles from Myrtle Beach.

Fortunately that part of the world is completely flat.


All things equal, I'd go with the the antennacraft aerials for no other reason that they are made in the USA.
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/11/13 at 9:07am
post #6588 of 7653
I picked up the CS2-V with the dipole option for the VHF channels. I testing it from within the house and the reception seemed decent. The antenna will eventually go on the garage roof on the back side of the house where our Directv dish is currently located. I'm a little concerned with the plastic pieces of the CS2 so I may order Channel Master CM-2016 and give that one a test run before mounting anything on the roof. Thanks again for all of the advice.
post #6589 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by northman11 View Post

I picked up the CS2-V with the dipole option for the VHF channels. I testing it from within the house and the reception seemed decent. The antenna will eventually go on the garage roof on the back side of the house where our Directv dish is currently located. I'm a little concerned with the plastic pieces of the CS2 so I may order Channel Master CM-2016 and give that one a test run before mounting anything on the roof. Thanks again for all of the advice.
The CS-2V should be adequate for the major Charlotte channels. You may need to add a distribution amp, especially if you have a long cable run or split the signal.
post #6590 of 7653
Winegard antennas are also made in the USA.
post #6591 of 7653
I don't think the cable run is too long but I plan on splitting the signal a few times. Do you have a recommendation for a distribution amp?
post #6592 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by northman11 View Post

I picked up the CS2-V with the dipole option for the VHF channels. I testing it from within the house and the reception seemed decent. The antenna will eventually go on the garage roof on the back side of the house where our Directv dish is currently located. I'm a little concerned with the plastic pieces of the CS2 so I may order Channel Master CM-2016 and give that one a test run before mounting anything on the roof. Thanks again for all of the advice.

If you stick with the CS2-V, I'd be interested to hear how it deals with windy conditions and/or bad weather. There is a lot of multipath in Charlotte city/Mecklenburg, and the plot of that antenna suggests that it isn't particularly good about dealing with it.
post #6593 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by northman11 View Post

I don't think the cable run is too long but I plan on splitting the signal a few times. Do you have a recommendation for a distribution amp?
Channel Master 3414 or Motorola BDA-S4 usually get good recommendations.
post #6594 of 7653
Would the CM-2016 adequately pick up the two areas of signals found in my TVFool report? The CS2-V should pick them up if set around 17 degrees. I was sure of the area of coverage from the CM-2016.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae21ef28b045
post #6595 of 7653
My guess is "probably", but, since CM doesn't provide any polar plots or beam width data, it's just a guess. At least you can go to AD's website and download a comprehensive tech data sheet (it's under "Documents" on the individual antenna's web page. http://www.antennasdirect.com/cmss_files/attachmentlibrary/Technical%20Data%20PDF%27s/C2%2BVHF-TDS.pdf
post #6596 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by northman11 View Post

Would the CM-2016 adequately pick up the two areas of signals found in my TVFool report? The CS2-V should pick them up if set around 17 degrees. I was sure of the area of coverage from the CM-2016.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae21ef28b045
Probably yes. But I still say go to RadioShack and try an HBU-22 Antennacraft. Should be fine for Charlotte. You can always return it if it does not work.
post #6597 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProjectSHO89 View Post

My guess is "probably", but, since CM doesn't provide any polar plots or beam width data, it's just a guess. ...

No guessing necessary. CM does publish this data. It's on their website.

http://support.channelmaster.com/entries/20985077-cm2016
post #6598 of 7653
I agree with tylerSC.

I'd go with the HBU-22 first and the Channel Master CM-2016 next, if the intent is to stick with the smallest antenna possible. Both are significantly less expensive than the C2 model with the addon VHF diapole. They are better constructed with no large amounts of plastic, and IMO will have better multipath rejection which is important for Charlotte. There is no technical advantage of paying 2X for a C2-v and plenty of reasons for not getting it. For the same money you can buy a much more powerful and better built antenna.

The issue here is really WTVI. If you don't care much about that, then I'd recommend a minimum of a 4 bay antenna and hope for the best for WTVI though I suspect that if you found a 4 bay with longer elements, you would pick it up too. Fortunately Ft. Mill is in a very good reception area. (maybe one of the best in the CLT market)
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/12/13 at 1:51am
post #6599 of 7653
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat6 View Post

No guessing necessary. CM does publish this data. It's on their website.

http://support.channelmaster.com/entries/20985077-cm2016

Thanks. I'd been going through the CM Store website and hadn't yet run across the data sheet you provided. I have found the link to it, though, when I looked far enough down the webpage/

Those are some pretty wonky beam widths published for channels 27 and 35. It goes from 60° on chan 14 down to 19° then back up to around 40° for ch 52 and 60, which are no longer part of the spectrum used for TV. The C2V has a nearly uniform 70° BW across the entire UHF band according to it's data sheet. On high VHF, it's a wash as both antennas have a single VHF dipole with very little difference in performance expected. The C2V does have the advantage in that its VHF element can be easily removed from the antenna and, with some extra work and a mast clamp setup, be aimed independently from the UHF section. On my 2 year old antenna, I can see that the rod holder is held on with a single screw.

Since the spread between northman11's towers is in the vicinity of 75° and there are no polar plots that define the reception pattern of the CM2016, does it still look best on the basis of the available data?
Edited by ProjectSHO89 - 11/12/13 at 4:51am
post #6600 of 7653
If you are comparing the just two and asking for my opinion, then yes the CM 2016 is better. These are my reasons.

The CM2016 is $39.99. The CS2V - $74.77. That is a lot of money for a loop antenna with a dipole added. This is basically the same design that I used for the flower pot antenna (see above) and that cost about a $1. I didn't have the plastic however.

The CS2V 70° beam is at the 1/2 power point. Given the limited range of this antenna, this would be effectively out of range for some of the stations listed on that TV Fool report. It's effectiely a big circle and you don't receive much at the far end of the circle unless the antenna is pointed right at it. Furthermore this type of wide beam antenna should be avoided in cases of multipath. With Charlotte's trees and buildings, there is a lot of multipath especially during windy weather.

The main reason for choosing this type antenna over a typical 4 bay is to receive VHF High. I don't think the CS2 offers any advantages in this area especially since the base loops absolutely will not receive channel 11. The added dipole seems like an afterthought. The engineer in me says look elsewhere.

One of my rules for antenna purchasers is "don't pay for a lot of plastic". the CS2V has a great deal of pretty plastic. I'm dubious of an outdoor antenna design that uses plastic to this extent since UV rays and temp swings cause all kinds of degradation of plastic over time. All or mostly metal is preferred. IMO, plastic is used either for looks (unnecessary on a roof) or to hide substandard materials and/or design.


With all that said, everyone's reasons for choosing an antenna are different. These are my reasons and they are based solely on the TV Fool report posted, where the OP said he was going to place said antenna, and what I've seen as reception issues in Mecklenburg. There may be other perfectly valid reasons for making another decision.
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