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Charlotte, NC - OTA - Page 226

post #6751 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by snippits75 View Post

Good to hear. HBU33 is definitely getting good reviews around the web.

Thinking about pulling down my Winegard 9032 yagi and buying a HBU33. Got a pbs station to the north at 34 miles, and my yagi is ponted southeast. Most of the time the pbs station(real 17) comes in just fine execpt during bad weather or temperature inversions. I am going to buy a rotor, but I think a smaller antenna like the HBU33 would be less strain on a rotor than the 114 inch 9032.

Here is my tvfool. http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46aef492690a4c
While I like the HBU 33, I'm not sure that I would trade a Winegard 9032 for it. That Winegard is a pretty good antenna and you would be trading UHF performance for VHF capability (my mom needed to receive RF 13 for CBS) which shouldn't be needed in Hickory.

Maybe you should consider one of the newer 8 bay style antennas with good gain. Some of them have a pretty good back lobe where you wouldn't need a rotor. The antenna craft with the bar style reflector is an example that receives well from the back.

If it was me, I'd probably go the other way and put up a 91xg.
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/26/13 at 2:33pm
post #6752 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by snippits75 View Post

Good to hear. HBU33 is definitely getting good reviews around the web.

Thinking about pulling down my Winegard 9032 yagi and buying a HBU33. Got a pbs station to the north at 34 miles, and my yagi is ponted southeast. Most of the time the pbs station(real 17) comes in just fine execpt during bad weather or temperature inversions. I am going to buy a rotor, but I think a smaller antenna like the HBU33 would be less strain on a rotor than the 114 inch 9032.

Here is my tvfool. http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46aef492690a4c
To get UNC-TV on RF17 all you should need is a good UHF antenna. The smaller 43XG should work fine. But, with the HBU-33 you would stand a chance at WSPA RF7 and WLOS RF13. And they make larger versions, HBU-44 and HBU-55, although you prefer to keep it smaller.
post #6753 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat6 View Post

The built in amp and mini coax are what I consider another defect of this design. You should only consider an amp if your distribution network has a lot of loss. An amp will not make a dipole pick up more than physically possible and there isn't much possible with this foil stuck inside a plastic box. Furthermore the amp will also amplify multipath and add noise to your system which ironically makes it more difficult to receive stations. With this design you have no choice but to go through their tiny PCB based amp/balum combo whether powered or not. (what if you need more amp?)

,,,

 

I have to disagree with you a little bit regarding amps, at least for indoor antennas at the fringe of the coverage area. I'm about 20 miles from most of the transmitters in my area, and closer to 25 miles away from one transmitter. I have an indoor antenna equipped with a variable amp, and having the amp does make a difference. Some of the stations show no difference between amp on and amp off, but there are a couple that cannot be received reliably if the amp is off.

post #6754 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by veedon View Post

I have to disagree with you a little bit regarding amps, at least for indoor antennas at the fringe of the coverage area. I'm about 20 miles from most of the transmitters in my area, and closer to 25 miles away from one transmitter. I have an indoor antenna equipped with a variable amp, and having the amp does make a difference. Some of the stations show no difference between amp on and amp off, but there are a couple that cannot be received reliably if the amp is off.
An amp won't put more signal on your antenna.

Without a TV Fool report and knowing how you have it wired, it's difficult to say why this is so. My guess is either bad wiring/connection, a marginal receiver, or some other noise that is getting in on your wiring. I suppose in those cases an amp might have its uses but it's very situational. You might achieve the same result by moving the antenna.
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/27/13 at 2:04am
post #6755 of 7641
An amp will make what's already there more pronounced. I've had the same experience.
post #6756 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndThenScottSays View Post

An amp will make what's already there more pronounced. I've had the same experience.
They are recommended for long cable runs, splitters and the likes where there are distribution losses. But I was referring to using an amp on an indoor antenna where conceivably, none of these should exist. They are a bad idea here for two reasons.

First it adds more noise to the system which will cause otherwise receivable stations to become un-receivable. Furthermore if you add an amplifier to an indoor antenna, where there should be little loss, then what happens is your receiver will look at the strongest station and adjust ITS amplification down. So what you have achieved is to trade the amp in your $1500 TV with one attached to a cheap antenna. While they may use exactly the same circuit, it's still money being burned for nothing. IMO it's best to simply get a better (proper) antenna for the location.
post #6757 of 7641
Sometimes an amp will help, whereas other times they do more harm than good. They are mainly recommended when you have a long cable run or multiple splitters to help avoid signal loss. And if you have a mix of strong and weak signals, then only a low gain amp is suggested. Because too much power can overload the amp or the tuner and wipe out a signal. Winegard recently replaced most of their higher gain preamps with a more moderate gain version, the LNA-200. It is supposed to have lower noise specs around 1db and separate amplification of VHF and UHF signals.
post #6758 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

Sometimes an amp will help, whereas other times they do more harm than good. They are mainly recommended when you have a long cable run or multiple splitters to help avoid signal loss. And if you have a mix of strong and weak signals, then only a low gain amp is suggested. Because too much power can overload the amp or the tuner and wipe out a signal. Winegard recently replaced most of their higher gain preamps with a more moderate gain version, the LNA-200. It is supposed to have lower noise specs around 1db and separate amplification of VHF and UHF signals.
The reception situation should be the determiner for external amps. I have no full power TV stations within 30 miles of me. Overload will not be a problem.
I have a bedroom receiver with its own indoor antenna. For several reasons, I want it that way. I use an amp to keep the signal level high enough to decode. Without it, I'll sometimes get a few seconds "over the cliff ". I resisted for quite a while using amps, but, I am sure I want them on both my inside and mast mounted antennas.
Really good solutions for other situations are available, but not as varied as would be today if manufacturers confidence in OTA weren't so low.
post #6759 of 7641
I have an attic antenna but cannot receive all channels without a preamp. Due to signal loss from the cable run and 4-way splitter. I get 3, 4, 7, 16, 21, 29(9), 40, 49, and 62 without an amp. But I need the preamp to get 13, 36, 46, and 55. The only distant Charlotte signal I get without an amp is WBTV. And the amp takes it from 65-70% up to 100%, and all local signals are strong as well. I currently use a Kitztech 200 preamp, which may perform slightly better than the original Channel Master 7777 I had used previously.
post #6760 of 7641
I have two antennas in my attic. A large DB8 and a much smaller homebuilt that is roughly equivalent to a DB4.

Interestingly I need an amp on the DB8 because it's connected to RG6 coax. I don't need an amp on the homemade antenna because it's connected with twin lead. Both cable runs are the same length, run through the same cable vault, and both terminate onto a hdhomerun (1 each). Both hdhomeruns are located in the same structured cable rack.

Proof enough, I would say, what a pre-amp can provide and what they don't provide. i.e. An amp will not put more signal on your antenna.

As further proof I have a 3rd antenna outside that is also connected via twin lead directly to my mythtv htpc's tuner card (HVR 2250) and there is no amp there as well.
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/28/13 at 2:08am
post #6761 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat6 View Post

I have two antennas in my attic. A large DB8 and a much smaller homebuilt that is roughly equivalent to a DB4.

Interestingly I need an amp on the DB8 because it's connected to RG6 coax. I don't need an amp on the homemade antenna because it's connected with twin lead. Both cable runs are the same length, run through the same cable vault, and both terminate onto a hdhomerun (1 each). Both hdhomeruns are located in the same structured cable rack.

Proof enough, I would say, what a pre-amp can provide and what they don't provide. i.e. An amp will not put more signal on your antenna.

As further proof I have a 3rd antenna outside that is also connected via twin lead directly to my mythtv htpc's tuner card (HVR 2250) and there is no amp there as well.

I have two large Winegard UHF antennas on my roof. One is pointed to Asheboro the other splitting the axis for Charlotte, no amp with a total of 55 channels.
post #6762 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by ybsane View Post

I have two large Winegard UHF antennas on my roof. One is pointed to Asheboro the other splitting the axis for Charlotte, no amp with a total of 55 channels.


I'm some miles north of you. I use a 4 bay with reflector screen aimed at Charlotte. I get the Triad stations off the back with no problems. I need the amp to receive WTVI; and, I need it to capture WHKY reliably.. I have little doubt that with the 4 bay and a dedicated VHF antenna I would not need the amp. I may do this, but for now, I prefer the certainly.
post #6763 of 7641
Took down my Winegard 9032, and mounted a Channel Master 4221hd that I got from BestBuy for $49.99. That's an excellent price by the way.

Got it pointed at compass 135. WSPA(7) Spartanburg is at 241 and WLOS(13) Asheville 263 are just about locking basically off the back side of the antenna. Both of those channels are high VHF so the little bow tie has got some high vhf gain for sure. Getting 30(real 15) out of Rock Hill, SC at 64 air miles just as good as I got with the Winegard 9032.

I am really impressed with the 4221hd. I did do one hack to it. I pulled the built in balun box and the phasing bars that it is attached to away from the boom over a half inch. I did not remove the the plastic pieces covering the bow ties.

Since it is so light and nimble with excellent performance, I am going to buy a rotor, so that I can point it north when channel 17 out of Linville, NC acts up. Got my mind set on a RCA rotor from Lowes with the remote and all that jazz. At least it has a one year warranty. Every other cheap rotor only had a 90 day warranty. Really wanted an Alliance u100 from Norm's Rotors, but it's $149 plus shipping for a rebuilt one. If anybody has any suggestions for a decent rotor, let me know.
post #6764 of 7641
Looked like the parade on WBTV was finally in HD. Anyway looked good.
post #6765 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

Looked like the parade on WBTV was finally in HD. Anyway looked good.

Thanks to Raycom Unit 2 used mostly for sports. A friend of mine knows the crew.m Between Raycom Sports, Fox Sports, and NASCAR Media Group there is a lot of video capability here in Charlotte.
post #6766 of 7641
Antenna saved the day at my sister's house yesterday for Thanksgiving. She had not gotten cable boxes for Charter digital upgrade on downstairs TVs. Only 2 upstairs. Grandpa was getting mad, no football, no TV in family room. Sister said "please do something" about the TV. So fortunately, I connected antenna cable from attic antenna I installed 4 years ago. Antennacraft MXU-59 UHF antenna and Winegard 8780 preamp. All GSP and several Charlotte channels now came in crystal clear HD. Basic Samsung 51inch 720 plasma. Looked great. Grandpa was satisfied, we now had TV. Watched WBTV parade, Macy's parade, and football. Everbody happy. Previously my sister did not care much about the antenna I put in her attic, but it indeed helped out yesterday. They didn't want to move a cable box downstairs because they had an ordeal getting it activated, and it was difficult to get to because of where it was placed on the shelf. People don't think much about OTA until it becomes the only option. Then they are often pleasantly surprised.
post #6767 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by W4DXL View Post

Thanks to Raycom Unit 2 used mostly for sports. A friend of mine knows the crew.m Between Raycom Sports, Fox Sports, and NASCAR Media Group there is a lot of video capability here in Charlotte.

Nice that they actually showed it on the day that it took place. It seems to me that a few times in the last few years they didn't either bother. I just wish they would give it priority over showing the parade in NYC which I don't care about at all and show it live. This is the one time that I would approve of them pre-empting CBS content which I think was redundant anyway since it was also on NBC.

I believe, at one time back in the JP days, WBTV was one of the main sponsors of the Charlotte Carousel Christmas Parade. It used to be a big deal on local TV but they grew so apathetic towards it that it almost didn't happen this year. I'm glad that Raycom has reversed course somewhat.
post #6768 of 7641
As usual HHG guy was pushing the wrong type of antenna. Lady wanted an indoor model for her new HDTV. She was about to buy a doorbuster Seiki LED. Until I talked her into the doorbuster LG 720 plasma, 50 inch for $349. Better price, way better pic quality. And the Samsung version was $429. The plasmas were much better doorbuster deals than those lesser name knock off LEDs. They also had great deals on the 1080 plasmas. All that pushing and shoving at Walmart for a generic brand LED with poor pic quality. As for the antenna, they tried to talk her into a RCA flat panel. But I told her the Terk HDTVa would perform better, especially for VHF with rabbit ears. Needed for 7 and 13. And told her to try with amp turned off as well as turned on, but must be plugged in. I don't think the salesman was too fond of me, but the lady was very appreciative. And I got a Samsung 43 inch F4500 plasma for my mother in the bedroom. Great TV for OTA pic quality and reception. And no mob scene at HHG at 4:30am today. Got in and out very easily. GVL, SC.
post #6769 of 7641
I'm not sure that a 50" TV that is limited to just 720p is such a good deal.

Yeah, there is no way I would go near a Walmart on Black Friday. Worst of humanity is in there fighting like animals over some Chinese made junk.

Charlotte media coverage at least from what little I watch of it over the last few days seems to be limited to putting a news reader in the parking lot of Southpark where maybe more calm prevails. I'm reminded of the event a few years ago when a local portly morning personality encouraged a stampede at Concord Mills where several also very heavy people got hurt in the crush of people. I noticed all the other TV stations gleefully reported the event complete with youtube video, but ironically no mention of it by the involved station. LOL. I guess all of them learned a bit of a lesson from that.

TV news always runs the same stories during the Thanksgiving holiday. Anchors told to repeat "busiest travel day of the year" & "busiest shopping day of the year" over and over and over. Show a picture of a rush hour highway & send a reporter to the airport even though TSA won't let them show anything. Show hungry people lined up somewhere to get free food. (why are these hungry people always fat?). Show same hungry people next day charging into stores to buy junk. Bonus - show some more obese people camped out at Best Buy for the last two weeks so they can be the first in the door. Good lord. It's depressing.
Edited by blackcat6 - 11/30/13 at 2:46am
post #6770 of 7641
Actually the 720p plasmas look surprisingly good for local antenna reception, even the 50 inch sizes. Even better than many of the 1080p LED's. No ghosting, clouding, or side angle vision fade. And better black levels. But if you prefer the 1080p, then they also had some very good deals on those plasmas as well. But the 43 inch, 720p Samsung plasma I put in my mother's room has excellent pic quality, and even she likes it better than the EH6000 LED it replaced. There were indeed some good deals on specific brand name models, if you carefully researched. But some folks were just all about fighting for the cheapest no name TV in the biggest size, without regard to pic quality. And that too me was just plain foolish, but to each their own.
post #6771 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat6 View Post

I'm not sure that a 50" TV that is limited to just 720p is such a good deal.

Yeah, there is no way I would go near a Walmart on Black Friday. Worst of humanity is in there fighting like animals over some Chinese made junk.

Charlotte media coverage at least from what little I watch of it over the last few days seems to be limited to putting a news reader in the parking lot of Southpark where maybe more calm prevails. I'm reminded of the event a few years ago when a local portly morning personality encouraged a stampede at Concord Mills where several also very heavy people got hurt in the crush of people. I noticed all the other TV stations gleefully reported the event complete with youtube video, but ironically no mention of it by the involved station. LOL. I guess all of them learned a bit of a lesson from that.

TV news always runs the same stories during the Thanksgiving holiday. Anchors told to repeat "busiest travel day of the year" & "busiest shopping day of the year" over and over and over. Show a picture of a rush hour highway & send a reporter to the airport even though TSA won't let them show anything. Show hungry people lined up somewhere to get free food. (why are these hungry people always fat?). Show same hungry people next day charging into stores to buy junk. Bonus - show some more obese people camped out at Best Buy for the last two weeks so they can be the first in the door. Good lord. It's depressing.

I agree! It's turned into the Hunger Games on steroids. Black Friday is now into Thursday because of greed. These people actually think stores send their help in and pay them on Thanksgiving to lose money by giving everyone such "bargains"? Come on.
post #6772 of 7641
The trouble with 720p TVs is that they are really 768. This means everything has to be scaled up or down. Some sets have good scalers, but the low end bargain sets from the no-name companies usually don't.
post #6773 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgcss View Post

The trouble with 720p TVs is that they are really 768. This means everything has to be scaled up or down. Some sets have good scalers, but the low end bargain sets from the no-name companies usually don't.
The Samsung and LG 720 plasmas look good and seem to have decent video processing. And I'm sure Panasonic as well. But I do question the video quality on some of those doorbuster deals from some no-name company. Although some of the Insignia and Vizio models are decent. A few years ago, the Insignia plasmas at Best Buy were Samsung panels.
post #6774 of 7641
It's probably not as much an issue if you have your TV hooked up to cable TV or even satellite. They hardly push the boundaries of TV resolution. The only consistently good HD that I ever saw on one of these systems was for the short time that I had access to VOOM which had stunning video on the plasma that I had at the time. ~2006-2008 These days it's a lot less than that and from what I could see, at least on TWC, it's pretty bad. So maybe one of these TVs might be OK there.

On the other hand, if you have it hooked to a HTPC & OTA or directly to OTA it's probably not going to be that satisfying. 1080p content via blu-ray or via streaming or via HTPC sources wouldn't be that desirable either. Netflix, Vudu, Amazon and some others all have this level of content now.

(It's ironic that people spend huge sums each month for cable/satellite and end up with the crappiest picture.)
post #6775 of 7641
The network logos are still incorrect for WJZY and WCCB on TiVo and certain Smart TV interfaces such as Samsung guides. Although program listings are correct. Still the old logos almost 6 months after the affiliate change. Someone needs to update Tribune Media and other databases so the correct logos will finally correspond with the channel listings.
post #6776 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

The network logos are still incorrect for WJZY and WCCB on TiVo and certain Smart TV interfaces such as Samsung guides. Although program listings are correct. Still the old logos almost 6 months after the affiliate change. Someone needs to update Tribune Media and other databases so the correct logos will finally correspond with the channel listings.

Accedo now takes care of both Samsung & Tivo, they are a little slow but are getting things done with some nice updates.
post #6777 of 7641
I don't care for the generic "Carolinas" paradigm of WJZY branding now, so I stuck their 2002 logo onto my DVR.
post #6778 of 7641
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcat6 View Post

I don't care for the generic "Carolinas" paradigm of WJZY branding now, so I stuck their 2002 logo onto my DVR.
They apparently want to appeal to the larger Carolinas market, not just Charlotte. But at least they still use FOX-46 so as not to be confused with FOX Carolina, WHNS-21 in Upstate SC where signals overlap.
post #6779 of 7641
Yeah I understand the notion, I just disagree with it. It's as if they feel that Charlotte hasn't graduated to something other than a big Bugtussle. It's a bit of an insult. In Atlanta they say Atlanta and not Georgia on their logo. The actual city of Atlanta is only about 450,000 people.

post #6780 of 7641
To call WJZY Charlotte is not technically correct anyway. They are licensed to Belmont.
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