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Samsung 2005 DLP HDTV Discussion --- HLRxxxxW Models - Page 2

post #31 of 6621
I totally understand the HDMI is effectivly the same as DVI, plus some lame audio which I personally can't see the use for :P (i like my toslink cables), but I wonder if it has the capabililty of dual link DVI over it.

-Brian
post #32 of 6621
I'm about 99% sure that HDMI includes the dual link feature.
post #33 of 6621
Quote:


Originally posted by schaffer970
There is an article on Toms Hardware that discusses this in great detail with regard to video cards - but never comes out and says whether 1920x1080p really works all of the time. Link: http://graphics.tomshardware.com/gra...129/index.html

Only if the monitor(tv set) can handle reduced blanking.

Interesting though that the ATI chips pass a cleaner signal.

GeoffQ
post #34 of 6621
Quote:


Originally posted by kyungkim
Richard, i belive you're right.
The hdmi dvi ports are more than capable of handling the badnwidth. But the sony rep said for the port to be "compliant with hdcp" they could not accept a resolution through those ports at anything greater than 1080i. I hope he is wrong and they can infact take in unecncrypted 1080p via hdmi.

The person you spoke with definitely made that up. The HDCP license does not even mention resolution and certainly doesn't restrict it. Though it requires more expensive circuits for HDMI to accept 1080p there is no reason why it can't be done today. Basically the real reason we haven't seen a 1080p HDMI input is that none of the CE manufacturers bothered to order any most likely because of price.

Quote:


Originally posted by schaffer970
I'm about 99% sure that HDMI includes the dual link feature.

Standard DVI can't do 1080p on a single link connection but HDMI can by using a reduced blanking interval of 5% (compared to just under 20% for DVI), which is part of the HDMI specification. Also the HDMI found on consumer electronics is single link though there is an HDMI specification for dual link. Since 1080p works fine on single link HDMI I would be surprised to see dual link HDMI inputs on HDTVs.
post #35 of 6621
Thread Starter 
It looks like the new HLRxx67W's, the 67 series, has a contrast ratio of 2000:1. This is lower than the 2500:1 in the Optoma announcement for their new 720p with the HD4 chip. I guess this leaves us guessing about whether the 67 series is using the HD4 or not.
post #36 of 6621
HDCP, from my understanding, is a handshake that happens between the output unit (dvd, dish, etc..), and the display unit so that unwanted copying doesn't happen. The output deveice asks the display device "are you cool for me to send this digital data to?" and the display device says "yep, i'm in the circle".

This is definitely independant from DVI or HDMI. Though, for DVI or HDMI this standard of communcation has to exist to keep the powers above happy(and video over DVI or HDMI is the same thing). For anyone that has a computer monitr that is DVI, you should know that you have a great digital signal that has NO HDCP protection on it. But you have all the fun of dealing with your PC, instead of just being stick the disc in and watch a DVD.

I've never read or heard anything about HDCP limiting anything accept your ability to copy the orginial source material at a bit rate that your can reproduce with neglible or no effects.

And just to bring things back -- the new Samsungs look awesome. I'm so going to hang out a few months and see how they perform!

Cheers,
Brian


What I'm interetsed is what the HDMI standard did -- why do you need audio and other crap besides video going to your monitor? I'd rather dedicate as much to video as possible instead of hiding behind some random new standard. The HDMI cable is really nice compared to DVI, but other then that, why reinvent the wheel?
post #37 of 6621
Design for the lowest common denominator I suppose. Plug the DVD/HDDVD/Blu-ray/cable box into the back and picture and sound come out. Don't forget those of us on this forum are not quite "normal"
post #38 of 6621
Quote:


Originally posted by schaffer970
Design for the lowest common denominator I suppose. Plug the DVD/HDDVD/Blu-ray/cable box into the back and picture and sound come out. Don't forget those of us on this forum are not quite "normal"

Yeah nobody would want to use these beautiful fixed pixel displays as PC monitors. That would be just silly.

GeoffQ
post #39 of 6621
That's why i want one!

I want a combo of DVDs looking nice and being able to play hi-res video games.

If i'm going to drop a crap load of money on something that even remotely comes close to the resolution of my computer for other sources, then dammit it's a monitor! I'm not fooled by anyone's marketing machine.

I'm getting annoyed with this cross-over of monitor/tvs. They are monitors. And the good ones are really nice monitors.

We are getting to this point.

-b
post #40 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Quote:


Originally posted by cokecan
That's why i want one!

I want a combo of DVDs looking nice and being able to play hi-res video games.

-b

After the HLR5688W comes out in Feb or so, you will want to revisit the ability of the 1080p sets to support hi-res video games. There has been extensive talk about video game play on the current generation HLPxxxx sets. But, as far as I know game play on the 1080p is an untested area at this point.
post #41 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Does anyone know what the story is on the black lacquer cases on some of the DLP's? Is this going to be a production case? If so, any idea on which models it will be offered? From the 720p vs 1080p comparison photo posted earlier, it appears that the entire case is black.
post #42 of 6621
Quote:


Originally posted by UCSB
PEDESTAL MODEL --- 88 Series: :
HLR5688W (56, FEB 2005, $4.999)

> Cinema Smooth Generation 5, DNIe
> Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
> 2 HDMI, 2 Component Video, 1 S-Video, 2 Composite, , [IEEE 1394 - Unconfirmed - Probably Not Offered]
> ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
> AnyNET
> 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
> Dimensions Comparable to Current HLP5685W (HLP5685W: 58.7"(W) x 58.3"(H) x 21.9"(D))
> DLP Chip: per Samsung, Latest 1080p (xHD3, xHD4 - Designation Unknown)
> Contrast Ratio: 10,000:1
> Color Wheel: 7 Segment

Bill,

I believe you have the wrong contrast ratio listed for the HLR5688W... According to this Samsung press release, the HLR5688W will have a 5000:1 contrast ratio, not 10,000:1.

http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/P...106_0000090605

This leads me to believe that the HLR5688W will have the xHD3 chip and the new 68 Series sets due out in June will have a 10,000:1 contrast ratio and a new HD chip. (xHD4?)
post #43 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Quote:


Originally posted by Administrator
Bill,

I believe you have the wrong contrast ratio listed for the HLR5688W... According to this Samsung press release, the HLR5688W will have a 5000:1 contrast ratio, not 10,000:1.

http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/P...106_0000090605

This leads me to believe that the HLR5688W will have the xHD3 chip and the new 68 Series sets due out in June will have a 10,000:1 contrast ratio and a new HD chip. (xHD4?)

Administrator ... thanks for the update! I have changed the spec's at the top of the thread. In addition, since I can not find any other mention of the IEEE 1394 input/output except in the Twice article, I have deleted the 1394 reference that I had in both th 68 and 88 series. This is a shame because I'm sure there are many, myself included that would have been able to use 1394 with the CableCard capabilities on these sets.
post #44 of 6621
Quote:


Originally posted by UCSB
Administrator ... thanks for the update!

No problem! And yes it would be a shame if they don't support IEEE 1394...
post #45 of 6621
Bill,

I also noticed, according to the same Samsung press release, that the HLR5087W will only have a single HDMI port... Not two like the HLR5688W.
post #46 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Quote:


Originally posted by Administrator
Bill,

I also noticed, according to the same Samsung press release, that the HLR5087W will only have a single HDMI port... Not two like the HLR5688W.

Thanks Administrator! I have updated the spec's at the top of this thread.
post #47 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Below are some of the open issues that I feel would be valuable to better understand. If anyone comes across some additional info on the net or in reviewing their photos or notes from the show, please post. If anyone took a photo of the inputs on the 68 series, it could be used to resolve the IEEE 1394 issue.

========================

1. What is the PQ on the new 1080p models?

2. What TI DLP chips are used in the new models? TI and Samsung are not discussing chips, simply referring to 1080p chips and 720p chips. One press release from Optoma talked about a HD4 (720p) chip and therefore it is really tough to understand what is going on with these chips. When TI introduced the xHD3 (1080p) they claimed a 5000:1 contrast ratio, so it would seem they have a new chip since this has risen to 10000:1 now.

3. What are the depth measurements, and or dimensions, on the new models by model number? Even a couple of reference points would allow us to see the trend.

4. Which models will offer IEEE 1394 ports? What will be the capability of those ports? A news report from TWICE mentioned 1394, was it just in error? IEEE 1394 info was from www.twice.com (http://www.twice.com/article/CA491026.html).

5. What is the contrast ratio spec's for the HLR5087W 720p pedestal model?

6. Confirm the number of HDMI inputs on the 67 series 720p models. Will there be 1 or 2 HDMI inputs?

7. Are these all of the planned models for 2005, or will Samsung be adding models later in the year? Last year they announced all of the 2004 models at CES.

8. Why aren't there any 46 or 50 1080p sets? I would really like to see a 50. Many have commented that 1080p is not needed or wasted at these sizes, but that does not make sense to me as I sit here working on a small computer monitor with more resolution than a 1080p HDTV.

9. Which of the current models will be continuing? Specifically, what are the plans for the HLPxx74W, Tantus thin bezel models. Many planning to buy in 2005 might want to know the fate of this HD2+ unit.

10. In 720p vs 1080p image comparison photos from the show, there was an all black 720p unit. Does anyone know if Samsung will be offering all black cases on any of their DLP models in 2005?
post #48 of 6621
The shiny black model is to have something diferent to offer top-end stores and custom installers. I was told the only difference was the finish and the speakers. The width on the HLR 6768W is 62 1/4".
post #49 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Quote:


Originally posted by pjr
The shiny black model is to have something diferent to offer top-end stores and custom installers. I was told the only difference was the finish and the speakers. The width on the HLR 6768W is 62 1/4".

Thanks pjr! I've updated the spec's. The black lacquer case is an interesting idea.
post #50 of 6621
Thread Starter 
I've added the following three questions to our list of open questions at the top of thread:

10. Can the 68 series or 88 series 1080p sets accept a 1080p signal via the HDMI input?

11. What computer resolutions are supported on the 1080p 68 and 88 series sets (1920x1080?)?

12. What is the capability of the 68/88 series 1080p sets to handle computer/video gaming?
post #51 of 6621
It appears that there are three new 2005 bezel designs...

1.) A bezel similar to the old 2004 sets

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attac...336&fullpage=1

2.) A shinny black lacquer bezel (for high end retailers?)

3.) A new "floating screen design"

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attac...736&fullpage=1
post #52 of 6621
Since networks broadcast in 720p or 1080i, how can one realize the full potential of these new units?
post #53 of 6621
There has been some excellent information posted so far (thank you UCSB!). I've zipped all of my pics from the Samsung booth and TV Authority is in the process of updating our site with content. We plan to add all of new models with email notification options and you should begin seeing general product info available in our DLP TV section & CES page in the next day or two. I had a chance to meet a few members at the AVS party and even on my return flight to Seattle - it is always good to put a face with the member name! I'm still filtering through my notes and clearing my desk off but i'll try to post later if i see anything not already mentioned.
post #54 of 6621
Thanks for the info Kirk. I have a 6197 ordered and was anxiously waiting to find out how things will be handled.
post #55 of 6621
Sure thing. That was more of a place holder since there was no official pricing but we are updating with the new models numbers. I'll be sure to have Cambryn contact you today.
post #56 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Quote:


Originally posted by Bodine
Since networks broadcast in 720p or 1080i, how can one realize the full potential of these new units?

Here is how I expect to make full use of the 1080p capabilities:

1. I really enjoy movies and I am looking forward to the release of HD DVD's. I will go to HD DVD's when they are available and it is my hope that the 1080p monitors will be compatible with the new 1080p HD DVD's. This really is my #1 requirement long-term.

2. The units will automatically display (convert) broadcast 720p and 1080i into 1080p. I'm hoping that the 1080i signals that are converted to 1080p will be more detailed than they have on my current 720p Samsung DLP.

3. I will be using the 1080p set with a HTPC. I have my movie library on my HTPC and the 1080p sets have enough resolution for people to browse my movie collection in detail right on the monitor. Plus it will be interesting to see if browsing the net and other computer tasks will make more sense given the high resolution. At 720p, it makes more sense to simply use my notebook computer with its 1600x1200 screen. If you are looking for a way to catalog your movie collection, I can recommend (www.dvdprofiler.com) DVDprofiler.

4. I'm a photographer (hobby only) and I hope that the size of the screen and (1920x1080) resolution will make it practical to display my photos on the monitor. My current 720p system simply does not do a good enough job with photos. This seems like a fun idea. I'm not relying on this, but if it worked out then it would be a big plus. I'll still do all my real photographic work on my hi res computer monitors.

I'm looking at this as a BIG purchase and I want it to be able support the new developments (especially HD DVD) over the next few years. I'd like to get several years of use out of the HDTV. Remember, people purchasing the tabletop models will be making their purchases in the second half of this year. I really wish that Samsung would (and maybe they will before these are released) guarantee 1080p HD DVD compatibility.

ADDED: Plus, who knows ... I expect we will be hearing about people running these things in split screen mode playing a video game in one window and watching football in the other. I haven't done the math, but you could probably run four SD shows in four windows at one time if it was offered.
post #57 of 6621
Kirk,
Do you forsee any kind of a price drop on the HLP5674 with these new models coming out?
post #58 of 6621
Jeez Bill, yer questions get tougher each round.
I'll take the last part first.

Quote:


10. In 720p vs 1080p image comparison photos from the show, there was an all black 720p unit. Does anyone know if Samsung will be offering all black cases on any of their DLP models in 2005?

That sample 720p display was a non consumer model. It was all encased in a ginormo black case to disguise it. I wasnt even sure it was a samsung model until i asked a rep. Since this was the dog turd vs diamonds shootout, i dont think they wanted to put a consumer product they still mfg as the dog turd.

So that shiny bezel tv is not an indicator of a future model to come. It was just a method for them to disguise the tv.

BTW, great work Bill on putting this thread together.
K
post #59 of 6621
How did the perceived contrast and color fidelity of the 67" 1080p model compare to the Qualia RPTV and the JVC 1080p 70"?

What is the cost of the stand for the Samsung 67"?

Has any other manufacturer announced a larger 1080p DLP?

What are the advantages and disadvantages of the 67" 1080p DLP to a 720p LCD front projector with the 80" Sony black screen?
post #60 of 6621
Thread Starter 
Kyungkim ... thanks for the kind words and many great contributions to the thread. Yes, I agree ... the questions are getting tougher ... I guess that means we are making progress.
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