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8300HD and External SATA - It Works!! - Page 274

post #8191 of 8998

For those interested, I posted a 3 page PDF showing all the parts of my "Homebrew Kit" no enclosure External eSATA DVR Expander, WD Caviar Black WD1001FALS.

Cost for parts is approx. $130.00

Build Your Own High Performance External eSATA DVR Expander (pdf/181KB/3pp)


Edited by Bryan_CoxPHX - 6/7/12 at 6:06pm
post #8192 of 8998
Bryan, why do you think you need a cooler? I was very satisfied with my set-up with just a plain case, now you have me worrying. I have all the necessary parts except for the cooler, i.e., the power supply, sata and e-sata and I even have a splitter for the molex. How much did the cooler cost?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

For those interested, I posted a 3 page PDF showing all the parts of my "Homebrew Kit" no enclosure External eSATA DVR Expander, WD Caviar Black WD1001FALS.

Cost for parts is approx. $130.00

Build Your Own High Performance External eSATA DVR Expander (pdf/181KB/3pp)
post #8193 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

Bryan, why do you think you need a cooler? I was very satisfied with my set-up with just a plain case, now you have me worrying. I have all the necessary parts except for the cooler, i.e., the power supply, sata and e-sata and I even have a splitter for the molex. How much did the cooler cost?

The cooler was $6.99 and I figured it was pretty cheap insurance. (although the original sleeve fans started to fail/screech after 1 month. I had to replace the fans with better ball bearing fans, another $2.99 each) My bare drive now never exceeds 90° F as opposed to 110° F w/out the cooler. It also covered and protected the exposed electronics on the bare drive, before I had the silicon protector sleeve. BTW, I tried a couple of HDD coolers and the Vantec is definitely the quietest.

For a few weeks I put my HDD in an enclosure, that I already had. I kept a thermometer on the case and it rose to above 140° F for prolonged periods. So that's why I returned to the bare drive configuration.
post #8194 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

xnappo, Can you explain Shawc's success with an SA8240HDC, Navigator, ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09

Just a lucky break, short lived success??? Interesting the Pre-Made WD My DVR Expander did not work, but the Homebrewed WD Black Caviar did.

I have NO idea. It is very interesting...

xnappo
post #8195 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanatwood27 View Post

so there is no dvr expander that will work with the navigator by time warner is that correct?

Yes and no. The general consensus is they tend to work with 8300HD/MDN versions, but not with any box running the ODN version (all Cisco "HDC" boxes) of Craptigator.
post #8196 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by orion6192 View Post

I had the homebrew Black Caviar 1TB and Vantec case and they are upgrading us to navigator this coming week. I got a letter stating that I could bring my 8240HDC in since I was using the external HD, they knew I had one hooked up - I never told them - they called me 5 times and left messages and then sent a letter, to bring my 8240HDC for a 8640HDC with twice the HD space for free.

So - today I got it and hooked it up. Haven't played yet but it did have Navigator already on it. I figured I was going to lose my ability to attach my homebrew HD so we will see how this goes.

ODN 3.1.3_3 2009/11/19

On the plus side - I do not see the HDMI issue with sound or resolution and it does have the 320GB HD. Not as large as my 1TB external but much better than my 8240HDC.
post #8197 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by orion6192 View Post

On the plus side - I do not see the HDMI issue with sound or resolution and it does have the 320GB HD. Not as large as my 1TB external but much better than my 8240HDC.

TWC
8640HDC Navigator 3.1.3_3 2009/11/19
In limbo: WD 1TB Caviar Black w/ Vantec enclosure

So you did loose the ability to attach your Ext HDD with ODN 3.1.3_3 2009/11/19? What happened when you tried?

I wonder if it will come back with ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09 as "Shawc" did?

You might want to try the Time Warner Cable Direct forum - http://www.dslreports.com/forum/timewarnerdirect
and see if one of the TWC Techs that help out there can/will push your DVR the newer ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09
post #8198 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

So you did loose the ability to attach your Ext HDD with ODN 3.1.3_3 2009/11/19? What happened when you tried?

I wonder if it will come back with ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09 as "Shawc" did?

You might want to try the Time Warner Cable Direct forum - http://www.dslreports.com/forum/timewarnerdirect
and see if one of the TWC Techs that help out there can/will push your DVR the newer ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09

I did not try the external HD - I will tonight.

This was the reply from the TWC Direct forum:

Division has advised that we are still deploying the Navigator software throughout the CNY footprint. Once this is completed the division will be updating box software. Current ETA is Q3.
post #8199 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by orion6192 View Post

I did not try the external HD - I will tonight.[/i]

Be sure to write down your current recordings. Some have lost recordings when they tried to get an external drive to work with ODN 3.1.3_3and no one has reported getting the exernal drive to work.
post #8200 of 8998
Ugh my hitachi 500GB drive that I've had forever just died. Lost a ton of shows. Luckily I had a spare 320GB drive sitting around.
post #8201 of 8998
so yet another reason to abandon time warner's dvr -- they won't let you copy to your vcr/dvd recorder. I asked flat out and they said no -- unapologetically -- i mean they have such a small dvr space with hd recordings and all, they won't allow you to have an expander, they charge for each dvr you have now and now you can't record to your vcr? I was trying it out and some banner comes up saying that the input is wrong. Ugh, i really hate this new navigator
post #8202 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanatwood27 View Post

so yet another reason to abandon time warner's dvr -- they won't let you copy to your vcr/dvd recorder. I asked flat out and they said no -- unapologetically -- i mean they have such a small dvr space with hd recordings and all, they won't allow you to have an expander, they charge for each dvr you have now and now you can't record to your vcr? I was trying it out and some banner comes up saying that the input is wrong. Ugh, i really hate this new navigator

Cox is switching to Passport and I will have to make adjustments to my Copy to DVD procedure, either using the main tuner while watching playback or I've read you can use the second tuner output to the PIP option.

If you abandon TWC's DVR your only real options are a Tivo or a Moxi. Before you purchase either make sure you research and understand the current limitations and frustration when a Cable system uses Switched Digital Video (SDV) on a Cisco based system. Just search the Moxi and Tivo Threads for SDV.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post18787643

The Moxi has 3-tuners but using a Cisco SDV Tuning Adapter the third tuner gets disabled.
With Moxi using the HDMI output disables all other video outputs, so no copy to vcr/dvd there either.

Your best bet for at least a short term solution is to get a new Cisco 8640HDC from TWC it has a 320GB HD, The 8642HDC model has up to a 500GB HD, although I have no idea if TWC has that model available. Then wait and hope you get the newer Navigator ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09. Which one person has said works with an Ext HDD. Still waiting to see others experiences.
Cisco 8640HDC HD-DVR Thread
post #8203 of 8998
Does anyone know why TWC and Cox are all of a sudden abandoning SARA?
Is it simply because SARA hasn't had a real face-lift and its IPG is so outdated or does it have to do with increases in licensing fees or something else.
post #8204 of 8998
I had a power outage earlier in the week, but I'm happy to report that all is well with my external HDD and 8240HDC w/ Navigator ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09. I believe power outages were previously an issue.
post #8205 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

Which one person has said works with an Ext HDD.

Ever since ODN lost HDD capabilities (on first 3.x version deployment) we have had the odd "it works" post. I've NEVER seen any claiming that make another post. I think they see it looking like it will work, but it never really does.

Sooo, it's really best to simply accept the fact it doesn't work, it most likely will never work. We ARE seeing units w/320G HDDs leaking into the field, I'm SURE their unstated attitude is this is sufficient.

The irony is they COULD have for a few years sold/leased customers expansion drives. The OEM hardware cost is VERY small, and they get customers on the fee treadmill, but somehow they missed this boat.
post #8206 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverside_Guy View Post

Ever since ODN lost HDD capabilities (on first 3.x version deployment) we have had the odd "it works" post. I've NEVER seen any claiming that make another post. I think they see it looking like it will work, but it never really does.

.

Shawnc has posting twice... More people need to try on more boxes with 3.2.x!!

xnappo
post #8207 of 8998
I doubt that idea would have had much success. The demand is probably not that great and the the problems that would crop up probably would not have made it profitable. There's a reason cable companies don't want to even talk to you about an external and why they can give a hoot about changing to software that screws up externals. I think sometimes us guys that fool around with this kind of stuff forget that we are in an extremely small minority. Heck, most people I know can hardly deal with a regular box and remote, including my wife.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverside_Guy View Post

The irony is they COULD have for a few years sold/leased customers expansion drives. The OEM hardware cost is VERY small, and they get customers on the fee treadmill, but somehow they missed this boat.
post #8208 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGA$$TV View Post

I doubt that idea would have had much success. The demand is probably not that great and the the problems that would crop up probably would not have made it profitable. There's a reason cable companies don't want to even talk to you about an external and why they can give a hoot about changing to software that screws up externals. I think sometimes us guys that fool around with this kind of stuff forget that we are in an extremely small minority. Heck, most people I know can hardly deal with a regular box and remote, including my wife.

Maybe, maybe not; "success" I measure from the cable co. perspective and low investment with recurring revenue sure is a well known good business move.. I still think even for the technophobes, a "record 40 hours of HD, not 20" is a message THEY might find compelling. Then again, that's a meaage that only appeals to those that watch a lot of TV in the first place... which I suspect ARE a big majority.
post #8209 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by xnappo View Post

Shawnc has posting twice... More people need to try on more boxes with 3.2.x!!

xnappo

Noticed that after I made the post you quoted... don't get me wrong, if external HDD WAS re-enabled in 3.2.x ODN, I'd be quite happy. Not to dis anyone, I'd put more credence in one of the regulars around here if they said it worked AFTER succewssfully using it for a few weeks.
post #8210 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverside_Guy View Post

Noticed that after I made the post you quoted... don't get me wrong, if external HDD WAS re-enabled in 3.2.x ODN, I'd be quite happy. Not to dis anyone, I'd put more credence in one of the regulars around here if they said it worked AFTER succewssfully using it for a few weeks.

I plan to try it again if/when I get 3.2. You have to understand though that most of us who've tried before are a little gun-shy because we lost recordings from our internal drive during the process. If TW waits until the next season to implement 3.2 here, I'm not sure how quickly I'd be willing attempt it.
post #8211 of 8998
i complained to time warner that have these dvrs with small hard drives and inability to transfer to vcrs and it has become ridiculous that you can only record a number of hd programs since they take up so much space -- they said they switched to navigator because it is their own and they can keep up with the new technologies but i feel like they have moved backwards.
post #8212 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawc View Post

Like many people, my Western Digital 500GB DVR Expander stopped being recognized when TWC pushed out the Navigator Software in late 2009 (and at the same time swapped my box from 8300HD to 8240HDC).
So, after totally giving up on the DVR Expander, which is now working fine on my PC, I purchased the Vantec NST-360SU-BK case and WD5001AALS drive. Btw, I really love the new Vantec design as it uses both SATA connections for data and power. The drive slides into place like a docking connection, and needs no cables.

In case you are wondering, here's what I did step by step:

1. Pulled the power plug on the 8240HDC (version ODN 3.2.0_15 12/7/09)
2. Plugged the eSATA cable into both units
3. Powered up the Vantec (and waited 60sec)
4. Powered up the 8240
After completing the boot cycle, the 8240 recognized the new drive and requested that I hit A to format. The TV now displayed the normal TV channel, but there were no special messages on the screen. I did note that the remote control was unresponsive, though. DO NOT TOUCH ANYTHING! After about 1min, the box rebooted. The same message appeared on the screen about the new drive needing formatting (which is odd). I pressed the A button as instructed, the drive lights flashed for 3 seconds and then all background activity appeared to stop. I waited 1min and then tried to access the channel GUIDE and then the DVR LIST. Everything worked, and the % full dropped from 84% to 18%. SUCCESS!

I have also noted that the 8240/remote control is now much more responsive, especially when using fwd/rwd functions and moving through the channel guide.

Good luck with your endeavours!

P.S. A big thanks to everyone on this forum for posting your experiences!

I've been trying to find a solution for weeks ever since TWC in Rochester, NY switched to Navigator.

The above instructions, with minor differences, worked! I'm using an 8240HDC 3.2.0_15 2009/12/07 with an Apricorn EZ BUS DTS with a WD 500 AAKS inside.

I first did a low level format from my computer on the drive.

After plugging the drive in and rebooting the 8240HDC, the prompt to hit the "A" button to format appeared twice prior to the 8240HDC rebooting itself and not afterward. Waiting about ten minutes or so for the 8240HDC to REBOOT ON ITS OWN appears to be the crucial step. In past tries I was too impatient.

Thanks Shawc for your help!
post #8213 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff OTF View Post

I've been trying to find a solution for weeks ever since TWC in Rochester, NY switched to Navigator.

The above instructions, with minor differences, worked! I'm using an 8240HDC 3.2.0_15 2009/12/07 with an Apricorn EZ BUS DTS with a WD 500 AAKS inside.

I first did a low level format from my computer on the drive.

After plugging the drive in and rebooting the 8240HDC, the prompt to hit the "A" button to format appeared twice prior to the 8240HDC rebooting itself and not afterward. Waiting about ten minutes or so for the 8240HDC to REBOOT ON ITS OWN appears to be the crucial step. In past tries I was too impatient.

Thanks Shawc for your help!

I am surprised the SA8240HDC and WD Caviar Blue WD5000AAKS were successful. My experience was that the Caviar Blue series worked, but was too glitchy even without an enclosure.

If you do experience glitching issues, try the WD Caviar Black series.
post #8214 of 8998
FCC granted Motorola/Intel's waiver request, so they no longer have to provide a
Firewire (IEEE-1394) I/F on all HD STB/DVRs, as long as they REPLACE it with an
equivalent Ethernet I/F (or Wi-Fi) to an external networking/recording device....
(e.g. a "suitably equipped" PC with Multi-Terabyte HDDs).

Here's the legal mumbo-gumbo:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...-10-1094A1.pdf

It's an INTERIM waiver....final rules are still "under consideration"...

Current rule mandating that cable operators must offer an HD box
with a (working) IEEE-1394 (Firewire) I/F is still in effect, so current
owners of D-VHS HDTV Recorders can continue trying to justify and
amortize the high cost we paid for that little extravagance:

"We note that we do not waive Section 76.640(b)(4)(i)29 of our rules,
which allows a consumer to request a high-definition device
with a functional IEEE 1394 interface from his or her cable operator."

NOTE THE USE OF THE WORD "FUNCTIONAL"!!!!

Although this has been a MOTOROLA/INTEL technology thrust,
other boxes already have Ethernet I/Fs and could readily apply the
HDCP encryption/copy control software to that I/F. These
agreements allow for COPY FREELY for Clear (OTA) broadcasts,
COPY ONCE for most cable offerings and COPY NEVER for PPV/ETC.

Time to investigate what might be available to record this
new data stream with the requisite HDCP decryption and
copy control software.....

PS: TiVo did NOT get their little "rule clarification" to be
waivered out of the Firewire and/or Ethernet I/F mandate if the
host cable company was already meeting the requirements....

=======================================
And of course, HDCP via IP and Wi-Fi specs, they are a-changing:
http://www.digital-cp.com/files/stat...%20rev%202.pdf
http://www.businesswire.com/portal/s...21&newsLang=en

So I'll bet we'll have to buy a PC with HDCP rules built into the core
processors before we can record encrypted cable programs......
post #8215 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff OTF View Post

I've been trying to find a solution for weeks ever since TWC in Rochester, NY switched to Navigator.

The above instructions, with minor differences, worked! I'm using an 8240HDC 3.2.0_15 2009/12/07 with an Apricorn EZ BUS DTS with a WD 500 AAKS inside.

I first did a low level format from my computer on the drive.

After plugging the drive in and rebooting the 8240HDC, the prompt to hit the "A" button to format appeared twice prior to the 8240HDC rebooting itself and not afterward. Waiting about ten minutes or so for the 8240HDC to REBOOT ON ITS OWN appears to be the crucial step. In past tries I was too impatient.

Thanks Shawc for your help!

That's great news! It looks like the new 3.2 version did something right. I've been using my setup for several weeks with not a single glitch. I even have access to all my previously recorded shows that were stored on the internal drive.

More people should definitely give it a go when they get the new update.
post #8216 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

I am surprised the SA8240HDC and WD Caviar Blue WD5000AAKS were successful. My experience was that the Caviar Blue series worked, but was too glitchy even without an enclosure.

If you do experience glitching issues, try the WD Caviar Black series.

You are right, it is glitchy (a second or two every five minutes or so), but no worse than it was with SARA. All this time I thought is was the fault of the 8240HDC because the same enclosure/hard drive was previously used flawlessly on my primary box which is an 8300HD.

I will take your advice and eventually upgrade the drive, but there is no urgency because I'm barely using it. The 8240HDC is a secondary box in the spare room upstairs. I'll let you all know how it turns out.
post #8217 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawc View Post

That's great news! It looks like the new 3.2 version did something right. I've been using my setup for several weeks with not a single glitch. I even have access to all my previously recorded shows that were stored on the internal drive.

More people should definitely give it a go when they get the new update.

I have the SA8240HDC through TWC. I tried a Toshiba PH3100U-1EXB 1TB drive that the salesman at Fry's recommended. The 8240 recognized the drive, formatted the drive, and let me use the drive. After several hours, however, the 8240 became completely non-responsive; it stayed on the selected channel and played with no problems, but it would not respond to any user input, either from the remote control or from the buttons on the front of the box, including the power button. After a reboot, the 8240 displayed a message stating that there was a "bad drive key." Now, if I reboot the 8240, it will recognize and let me use the Toshiba drive, but after a few hours the 8240 will become non-responsive or give me the "bad drive key" message.

I didn't do much research (e.g., determine the software version on my 8240) before buying the Toshiba. Tonight I'll check the software version on my 8240. If I'm at 3.2, I'll try the WD you recommend and see if it works.

By the way, I'd really like to go 1 TB. Is there any reason to think that a 1 TB (e.g., WD1001FALS) may not work where the 500 GB would work?
post #8218 of 8998
Your symptoms smell like you have Navigator ODN 3.1, which doesn't work properly with external drives. If/when you get 3.2 it might work since we've gotten a couple of reports of it working again (at least with the 8240HDC). I have to say it still bothers me a little that it took so long after 3.2 started to be deployed for someone to report success with it.
post #8219 of 8998
Quote:
Originally Posted by phousley View Post

Your symptoms smell like you have Navigator ODN 3.1, which doesn't work properly with external drives. If/when you get 3.2 it might work since we've gotten a couple of reports of it working again (at least with the 8240HDC). I have to say it still bothers me a little that it took so long after 3.2 started to be deployed for someone to report success with it.

Well that's too bad. I'll check tonight and report back. Truth is, I really only need the drive for college football season, but I bought it now because it sounded like a good Father's Day gift. If I'm on v3.1, hopefully TWC will deploy v3.2 to my box by September.

Also, I noticed that some people in the Navigator database (http://www.baseportal.com/baseportal/xnappo/navigator) are listing "Mystro" as their version. When my 8240 is rebooting, it sends an image to my TV that reads "Mystro." Does this indicate which version I'm on?

Also, about two months ago TWC rolled out a major software upgrade in my area -- new guide and interface and such. I'm not sure if that's relevant to determining my version. Anyway, I'll do the actual diagnostic check tonight.
post #8220 of 8998
mikey40, it took me a while to find the instructions on how to check the Navigator version #. Here's how you do it:

Press and hold the SELECT button on your remote. Wait until you see the flashing Mail icon on the Cable box display. Release the SELECT button and then press the DOWN button (V). Your TV should now show "Diagnostics Loading..please wait." When page 1 of 16 loads, note the ODN Version # near the end of the page.

Also, many people have reported good results with the WD1001FALS. Where the 500GB worked, so should the larger drive.
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