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Dallas, TX - HDTV - Page 206

post #6151 of 6932
1/18/11 at 9:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post

Got a reply back from "HOT", they had an equipment failure and will be back as soon as it's fixed.

Cool... thanks Ed.
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post #6152 of 6932
1/18/11 at 4:17pm
I have noticed this with 2 antennas but, KDAF's signal goes from 90 to 50% every time! What is wrong with KDAF?
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post #6153 of 6932
1/18/11 at 4:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by nukeboy67 View Post

I have noticed this with 2 antennas but, KDAF's signal goes from 90 to 50% every time! What is wrong with KDAF?

I've been watching KDAF's signal for the past 15 minutes. It's been an unwavering, invariant, constant, steady, static, solid (insert more adjectives as warranted) 100% on all three indicators.
LL
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post #6154 of 6932
1/18/11 at 5:19pm
still no news on KTXA 21??
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post #6155 of 6932
1/18/11 at 7:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wreck58 View Post

still no news on KTXA 21??

Crickets.

I've sent e-mail and left phone messages with the CE and the PD. No response. And no one evidently is maintaining any contact on their web page to reply to queries from viewers:

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2011/01/04/t...gnal-strength/

It also appears that CBS has little coordination with its other facilities. Last night, I heard no less than 3 announcements on co-owned sister station KRLD-FM touting the new "one million watt" power on "TXA/21" and an urge to "scan now".

I think their mistake was setting a date (twice), letting it slip both times and offering no explanation other than this sentence:

Quote:


Due to the recent weather conditions, the conversion has been delayed – check back for more information [sic]

In our business, we've learned the lesson to never set a date for delivery of a product or service unless we're 100% sure of being able to meet it and have factored in every contingency we can envision (as well as those we can't).
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post #6156 of 6932
1/18/11 at 7:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

Crickets.

I've sent e-mail and left phone messages with the CE and the PD. No response. And no one evidently is maintaining any contact on their web page to reply to queries from viewers:

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2011/01/04/t...gnal-strength/

It also appears that CBS has little coordination with its other facilities. Last night, I heard no less than 3 announcements on co-owned sister station KRLD-FM touting the new "one million watt" power on "TXA/21" and an urge to "scan now".

I think their mistake was setting a date (twice), letting it slip both times and offering no explanation other than this sentence:



In our business, we've learned the lesson to never set a date for delivery of a product or service unless we're 100% sure of being able to meet it and have factored in every contingency we can envision (as well as those we can't).

yeah, I saw your comments on their website! Crickets is right!!

I'm on Dish Network and need OTA for HD Mavericks/Stars/Rangers etc. I haven't got a signal over 58 for weeks!
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post #6157 of 6932
1/20/11 at 8:43am
They must be doing something today at Ch 11. I was just now watching Price Is Right on RF-11 and the audio and video went away. RF-19 still going strong. Maybe dropping a not so subtle hint to the viewers on VHF?

15min later VHF's back.
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post #6158 of 6932
1/20/11 at 9:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post

They must be doing something today at Ch 11. I was just now watching Price Is Right on RF-11 and the audio and video went away. RF-19 still going strong. Maybe dropping a not so subtle hint to the viewers on VHF?

15min later VHF's back.

Shortly after wreck58 posted a comment requesting an update on the KTXA website, voila! An actual update with a date:

Quote:


We will switch to the new signal on Friday, January 21, 2011.

I just checked with Dan Dobbs at CBS in Ft. Worth who told me the following:

1). Only KTXA will be lighting up at the new location on Tar Road.
2). KTVT's RF-19 facility will remain at the Highway 67 site until 2012.
3). The simulcast on RF-11 (also on the Highway 67 site) will not be ending when the KTXA change is made.
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post #6159 of 6932
1/20/11 at 9:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

Shortly after wreck58 posted a comment requesting an update on the KTXA website, voila! An actual update with a date:



A time has not yet been specified. All of which does beg the question as to whether KTVT will be turning off RF-11 as part of their sister station's switch.

Amazing!!!
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post #6160 of 6932
1/20/11 at 11:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

I just checked with Dan Dobbs at CBS in Ft. Worth who told me the following:

1). Only KTXA will be lighting up at the new location on Tar Road.
2). KTVT's RF-19 facility will remain at the Highway 67 site until 2012.
3). The simulcast on RF-11 (also on the Highway 67 site) will not be ending when the KTXA change is made.

2012?!? Good Lord! Will the simulcast on RF 11 last until 2012 as well?

(KTVT was granted an STA for the simulcast back in July '09, and applied for an extension last February. I can't figure out how long that's supposed to last. Of course if/when it runs out they can always ask for another extension.)
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post #6161 of 6932
1/20/11 at 3:28pm
Sometime this afternoon (prior to 1400), KTXA fired up the new RF-29 facility while simulcasting on RF-18. I don't have an exact time since I wasn't watching when it happened.

The new 1,000 kW signal is good and strong in terms of raw power (a constant 100%) but, at least for now and at my site, is showing fluctuating signal quality readings measured via TSReader and an HDHR tuner.

In contrast the current RF-18 (and temporary) 255 kW facility shows an invariant 100% for both raw signal power *and* quality. I didn't even bother with attaching a screenshot since it's just a solid line on the graph over the time interval measured.

Now the questions are:

1). When will KTXA shut down RF-18?

2). When will KPFW make the move once KTXA vacates that channel?
LL
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post #6162 of 6932
1/20/11 at 3:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post
Sometime this afternoon (prior to 1400), KTXA fired up the new RF-29 facility while simulcasting on RF-18. I don't have an exact time since I wasn't watching when it happened.

The new 1,000 kW signal is good and strong in terms of raw power (a constant 100%) but, at least for now and at my site, is showing fluctuating signal quality readings measured via TSReader and an HDHR tuner.

In contrast the current RF-18 (and temporary) 255 kW facility shows an invariant 100% for both raw signal power *and* quality. I didn't even bother with attaching a screenshot since it's just a solid line on the graph over the time interval measured.

Now the questions are:

1). When will KTXA shut down RF-18?

2). When will KPFW make the move once KTXA vacates that channel?
So when I get home, I can re-scan and get the increased signal from RF-29?
I'm a novice -- which signal will my tuner capture and use? RF-18, RF-29 (or both!)?
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post #6163 of 6932
1/20/11 at 3:51pm
Bob:

Do you happen to know if the current KTVT-19 facility is running at 750 kW or 1000 kW? They've had permits for both from that tower.

- Trip
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post #6164 of 6932
1/20/11 at 3:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wreck58 View Post
So when I get home, I can re-scan and get the increased signal from RF-29?
I'm a novice -- which signal will my tuner capture and use? RF-18, RF-29 (or both!)?
I guarantee you're going to HATE this answer but it's the only honest one.

It depends. :-)

To elaborate a bit, some tuners will get both RF-18 and RF-29 and map both to virtual channel 21. And those tuners will reveal (in some implementation manner) which "real" channel you're looking at in order to disambiguate between the two instances of virtual channel 21.

Other tuners (such as at least Toshiba branded LCD television) will add the first channel encountered, in this case RF-18 and then ignore what the tuner perceives to be a duplicate entry in the virtual channel table and then skip RF-29.

And I've seen at least one other tuner that does just the opposite. The highest "real" channel wins when there are duplicate virtual channels.
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post #6165 of 6932
1/20/11 at 3:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post
I guarantee you're going to HATE this answer but it's the only honest one.

It depends. :-)

To elaborate a bit, some tuners will get both RF-18 and RF-29 and map both to virtual channel 21. And those tuners will reveal (in some implementation manner) which "real" channel you're looking at in order to disambiguate between the two instances of virtual channel 21.

Other tuners (such as at least Toshiba branded LCD television) will add the first channel encountered, in this case RF-18 and then ignore what the tuner perceives to be a duplicate entry in the virtual channel table and then skip RF-29.

And I've seen at least one other tuner that does just the opposite. The highest "real" channel wins when there are duplicate virtual channels.
I was afraid of that!! I'm actually going to be scanning from my Dish Network ViP 212 receiver for my OTA....... hoping for the best!!
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post #6166 of 6932
1/20/11 at 4:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
Bob:

Do you happen to know if the current KTVT-19 facility is running at 750 kW or 1000 kW? They've had permits for both from that tower.

- Trip
The Highway 67 site (ASRN: 1047708) is still running 750 kW (or as an engineer told me a few months back, "...it's almost 800 kW").

More tangibly, check the engineering statement for BMPCDT-20090504AAV, which explains that the existing transmitter (then in use of KTXA) won't make the full megawatt, hence the filing for a power reduction.

Since the move out to Tar Road (ASRN: 1059733) won't occur for quite some time (in spite of KTXA lighting up on RF-29), I doubt CBS wants to bother with increasing the power for a tiny 1.25 dB boost.
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post #6167 of 6932
1/20/11 at 5:09pm
Thanks. I suspected it was 750 kW, but just wanted to be sure.

- Trip
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post #6168 of 6932
1/20/11 at 5:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wreck58 View Post

I was afraid of that!! I'm actually going to be scanning from my Dish Network ViP 212 receiver for my OTA....... hoping for the best!!

All is well!!! At first, I forgot to completely erase the previous scan for my tuner's memory!! The second scan was great (KTXA now at 89).

Just to be sure -- there is no 4-2 (KDFW's second sub-channel) anymore??
I only get 4-1.
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post #6169 of 6932
1/20/11 at 6:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wreck58 View Post

Just to be sure -- there is no 4-2 (KDFW's second sub-channel) anymore??I only get 4-1.

That's correct. 4-2 has been gone for some time.
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post #6170 of 6932
1/20/11 at 7:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post

That's correct. 4-2 has been gone for some time.

Thanks --- I hadn't "erased" the old memory of my tuner before, so it was still showing up as a channel even though it was "empty" for awhile!
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post #6171 of 6932
1/21/11 at 6:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

I guarantee you're going to HATE this answer but it's the only honest one.

It depends. :-)

To elaborate a bit, some tuners will get both RF-18 and RF-29 and map both to virtual channel 21. And those tuners will reveal (in some implementation manner) which "real" channel you're looking at in order to disambiguate between the two instances of virtual channel 21.

Other tuners (such as at least Toshiba branded LCD television) will add the first channel encountered, in this case RF-18 and then ignore what the tuner perceives to be a duplicate entry in the virtual channel table and then skip RF-29.

And I've seen at least one other tuner that does just the opposite. The highest "real" channel wins when there are duplicate virtual channels.

But, you could disconnect the antenna, then do a fresh scan, then go in and add all the channels manually. Unless you have those kinds of TV's that won't do a weak signal installation.
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post #6172 of 6932
1/21/11 at 6:30am
I don't see a way to force my Sony TV to accept 21 on RF-29. During a scan it sees 21 on RF-18 first, stores it, then stores Ch 29 KMPX (RF-30) so it won't tune 21.1 on physical 29 either. My Zenith converter boxes show two "21.1"s in the channels. I guess Sony didn't allow for simulcasting in this case. I can receive 11 on RF-11 and RF-19 since there's not another station named 19.1. Looks like I have to wait until 21.1 on RF-18 is off the air.
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post #6173 of 6932
1/21/11 at 9:50am
You guys getting the new TXA on 29 right now? As of about 10 minutes before this post, we were having some decent tropo with even the normally weak RF18 coming in, but my RF29 is showing nothing. Maybe some last minute adjustments, I hope?
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post #6174 of 6932
1/21/11 at 10:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChocoLab View Post

You guys getting the new TXA on 29 right now? As of about 10 minutes before this post, we were having some decent tropo with even the normally weak RF18 coming in, but my RF29 is showing nothing. Maybe some last minute adjustments, I hope?

At just seconds after noon today, RF-18 just dropped. KPFW has not yet lit up on the now vacant channel.

RF-29 is now the exclusive home of KTXA. Here are some raw power readings made just moments ago comparing KTXA to a few other facilities.

RF Channel Virtual Channel Calls Power dBmV
14 13 KERA 24.5
18 21 KTXA (Old) 13.2
19 11 KTVT 25.9
23 23 KUVN 15.1
29 21 KTXA (New) 24.6
30 29 KMPX 24.5
32 33 KDAF 22.3
35 4 KDFW 19.3
36 27 KDFI 21.3
39 55 KAZD 28.9
40 39 KXTX 23.8
41 5 KXAS 27.2
42 68 KPXD 22.0
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post #6175 of 6932
1/21/11 at 12:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

At just seconds after noon today, RF-18 just dropped. KPFW has not yet lit up on the now vacant channel.

RF-29 is now the exclusive home of KTXA. Here are some raw power readings made just moments ago comparing KTXA to a few other facilities.

RF Channel Virtual Channel Calls Power dBmV
14 13 KERA 24.5
18 21 KTXA (Old) 13.2
19 11 KTVT 25.9
23 23 KUVN 15.1
29 21 KTXA (New) 24.6
30 29 KMPX 24.5
32 33 KDAF 22.3
35 4 KDFW 19.3
36 27 KDFI 21.3
39 55 KAZD 28.9
40 39 KXTX 23.8
41 5 KXAS 27.2
42 68 KPXD 22.0

As of last night, I now pull in 64 channels (and subs) on my tuner. Is that pretty close to what you all get?

(I'm at about Preston rd and Beltline about 30 miles from the antenna farm with an attic antenna)
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post #6176 of 6932
1/21/11 at 12:28pm
Thanks Bob. Just checked it, and still nothing. The tropo is gone now, but I can see a faint signal on most other stations. It might be a function of my antenna, which dips a bit from the mid-20s to almost 40... Channel 33 (32) has always been weak for me, too.

A change in antenna might be in order...
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post #6177 of 6932
1/21/11 at 2:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

At just seconds after noon today, RF-18 just dropped. ...RF-29 is now the exclusive home of KTXA.

18|21|KTXA (Old)|13.2

29|21|KTXA (New)|24.6

19|11|KTVT| 25.9


The differences with your readings pretty much correspond to the signal meter in my Sony TV. New 21.1 RF-29 isn't as strong as KTVT on RF-19.

21 on old RF-18 was 76-82, new RF-29 is 87.

Ch 11 on RF-19 is 98.

Was just watching Ch 11's news and they showed more of the video of the antenna going up. In HD it was incredible!
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post #6178 of 6932
1/21/11 at 3:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post

The differences with your readings pretty much correspond to the signal meter in my Sony TV. New 21.1 RF-29 isn't as strong as KTVT on RF-19.

That did surprise me, too. The new KTXA facility on RF-29 is 1000 kW at 1751' HAAT. KTVT's RF-19 is 750 kW at 1640' HAAT. The raw power readings between the two are close (a slight edge to KTVT). But the BER component of signal quality isn't quite as good on the new plant compared to the old.

By the way, currently the odd-man-out in this transition is low-power KPFW, which has played musical chairs with channels (61 -> 18 -> 29). I just found out that KPFW is supposed to crank things up on 18 sometime on Saturday.

I believe it may have been you, Ed, that discovered KPFW had powered up on 18 several months ago when KTXA was still there.
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post #6179 of 6932
1/21/11 at 7:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post

I don't see a way to force my Sony TV to accept 21 on RF-29. During a scan it sees 21 on RF-18 first, stores it, then stores Ch 29 KMPX (RF-30) so it won't tune 21.1 on physical 29 either. My Zenith converter boxes show two "21.1"s in the channels. I guess Sony didn't allow for simulcasting in this case. I can receive 11 on RF-11 and RF-19 since there's not another station named 19.1. Looks like I have to wait until 21.1 on RF-18 is off the air.

Everyone good since RF-18 went off?
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post #6180 of 6932
1/22/11 at 1:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by re_nelson View Post

That did surprise me, too. The new KTXA facility on RF-29 is 1000 kW at 1751' HAAT. KTVT's RF-19 is 750 kW at 1640' HAAT. The raw power readings between the two are close (a slight edge to KTVT). But the BER component of signal quality isn't quite as good on the new plant compared to the old.

By the way, currently the odd-man-out in this transition is low-power KPFW, which has played musical chairs with channels (61 -> 18 -> 29). I just found out that KPFW is supposed to crank things up on 18 sometime on Saturday.

I believe it may have been you, Ed, that discovered KPFW had powered up on 18 several months ago when KTXA was still there.

I had to tweak my antenna about 3 deg to get enough signal strength on my old Zenith HDTV to pull in the new RF 29. The old RF 18 was a stronger signal on both TV's I have, and as you stated (thanks for the reply on the KTXT site) may be due to the new signal quality, not raw power.

I'm in Prosper, close to where you are and get 68 DTV channels, all of DFW and Sherman, Ardmore, and Ada, OK, about 100 mile radius. I don't have anything on 18 yet.
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