or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Video Components › DVD Players (Standard Def) › Denon 5910 vs Onkyo SP1000 Pro Review
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Denon 5910 vs Onkyo SP1000 Pro Review - Page 3  

post #61 of 837
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Q of BanditZ


Your expectations are incredibly low.

Let me give you the context for my expectation: 95-97. Second only to the Denon 5910, as it should be. As well all know it to be.

Let's take a look at all the players higher that rate 88 and higher. This is the all-time list as of right now.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-b...h&articles=all

[/b]
97? It'll never happen.

My 88 is worst case as I want to be positively surprised. Ok I was hoping for at least 92. But really, I don't care. I am happy with the player and that's that. I also liked the 59 at 88.
post #62 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by nynytony


- When I inserted The Fifth Element (Superbit) into the player, the drive unit created this loud spinning/vibrating sound while the movie is being played. When I change to other DVDs, the spinning noise goes away, very strange.
I'm sorry about your bad luck. This segment right here clued me in that you had an outright defective player. :(



Quote:
Originally posted by mimason
97? It'll never happen.


I know. ;)

Quote:


My 88 is worst case as I want to be positively surprised. Ok I was hoping for at least 92. But really, I don't care. I am happy with the player and that's that.


Amen!
post #63 of 837
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by nynytony
- Awesome sound! Stereo and multi-channel musics sound great. This machine really open my eyes (ears) to what SACD/DVD-A really can do. The cannons in "1812" scared me. But, I think my Rotel RCD-1072 still sounds a bit better for CD playback.

- The player produces top notch video quality on my Pioneer 4350 via HDMI. 720P looks the best to me.

With all these good things going for it, it saddens me to say that I am return it due to the following problems:

- I noted major lip synch problem in Star Wars Episode I, chapter 39 "Duel of the Fates". The audio clearly comes before the video.

- When I inserted The Fifth Element (Superbit) into the player, the drive unit created this loud spinning/vibrating sound while the movie is being played. When I change to other DVDs, the spinning noise goes away, very strange.
Audio will improve after a good amount of run in(40 hrs min). It should outperform your Rotel by a good margin IMO. The Sp1000 performs lightyears better than an Arcam 73.

Lip Sync? It has never been discovered in Pro reviews so you are are wrong.....just kidding. Sorry to hear that. Try using the delay feature using the 7.1 setup since it has a very good decoder.

Vibrations? My first Sp1000 did that with a dvd-a disc. I returned it and my 2nd unit was perfect.
post #64 of 837
Thread Starter 
Kris,

I concur that Star Wars Episode I Chapter 39 has LS issues. There is not a lot of dialog but it is easy to spot.
post #65 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by nynytony
When I inserted The Fifth Element (Superbit) into the player, the drive unit created this loud spinning/vibrating sound while the movie is being played. When I change to other DVDs, the spinning noise goes away, very strange.
My first SP-1000 had this problem with one particular CD I played in it. Because the store where I bought the player was unwilling to pricematch a competitor's price, I returned it and got a second SP-1000 at a lower price.

The second SP-1000 also had the same problem with this particular CD. (It was a budget-priced CD.) After owning the second player for over eight months I've encountered a few CDs and a couple of DVDs that will vibrate loudly as they are played. (They play fine except for this vibrating noise.) I've found that gently bending the CD or DVD so that it sits perfectly flat in the tray sometimes alleviates the problem. Sometimes, it doesn't. I chalk up the problem CDs and DVDs to being poorly manufactured. Also, on these poorly manufactured CDs/DVDs the vibrating sound goes away as the laser moves across the disc--usually within five minutes.

(As a note of reference I've played literally hundreds of CDs and DVDs on the player.)

( I also had a problem with "The Fifth Element", although it was the regular version. One day it just started pixelating and breaking up late in the film and then refused to play in my Pansonic player. I then tried the disc in a JVC player and then a Toshiba player. The same problem at the same place on all three players. This was a factory-fresh copy I had only played once before. Poor quality control on Sony's (the DVD's manufacturer) part, I guess.)

Kris,

Thanks for going the extra mile and shelling out the bucks to pick up the SP-1000 and putting it through the tests. Your insights are always welcome and appreciated. I'm guessing the SP-1000 scored somewhere in the low to mid-eighties. I figure that the player has problems with video-based material since the player has only one all-encompassing play mode with no way to tweak it between film and video material.
post #66 of 837
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Franchot
I'm guessing the SP-1000 scored somewhere in the low to mid-eighties. I figure that the player has problems with video-based material since the player has only one all-encompassing play mode with no way to tweak it between film and video material.

Along with some minor MPEG decoder issues.
post #67 of 837
For deinterlacing tests and component, it is probably like any other SIL50x player, eg. Denon 2900. It can't score as high as the Faroudja based players.

larry
post #68 of 837
Thread Starter 
I am waiting for the "My Oppo's betta than yours, just take a look at the scores". ;) Ignorance is bliss though.
post #69 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by mimason
I am waiting for the "My Oppo's betta than yours, just take a look at the scores" song. ;)
yup!! http://forums.offtopic.com/images/smilies/kekekegay.gif

it's just a matter of time!
post #70 of 837
This thread will be closed by the end of the day. Bet on it!
post #71 of 837
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by joerod
This thread will be closed by the end of the day. Bet on it!
Nah, Just a little humor. We all know the Sp1000 is gonna take a few lumps. It's not Faroudja based, definietly has 3:2 Alt Flag problems, probably ICP too. So it probably will not score high. The irony of it is that it is an awesome player for video and audio but someone will come along and say the Oppo is better because it has a higher score like the XP30 saga all over again. Denon will be targeted too.
post #72 of 837
Good point Mimason...
post #73 of 837
Well you got some of it right. The Silicon Image chip does a tremendous job in this player and is one of the best implementations I've seen. Right up there with the DVDO implementation.

The issues I've seen via component are core performance issues. Definately has some CUE issues and a few other small bugs. But I will say that overall this is definately one of the best players I've seen in quite a while and easily in my Top 5, regardless of the score you see.
post #74 of 837
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Kris Deering
Well you got some of it right. The Silicon Image chip does a tremendous job in this player and is one of the best implementations I've seen. Right up there with the DVDO implementation.

The issues I've seen via component are core performance issues. Definately has some CUE issues and a few other small bugs. But I will say that overall this is definately one of the best players I've seen in quite a while and easily in my Top 5, regardless of the score you see.

This is good news to me as I plan on using the SP1000 480p DVI/HDMI into an Iscan HD+ with my next display.
post #75 of 837
That should yield excellent results. The DVDO will eliminate the CUE issues.
post #76 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by Kris Deering
Well you got some of it right. The Silicon Image chip does a tremendous job in this player and is one of the best implementations I've seen. Right up there with the DVDO implementation.

The issues I've seen via component are core performance issues. Definately has some CUE issues and a few other small bugs. But I will say that overall this is definately one of the best players I've seen in quite a while and easily in my Top 5, regardless of the score you see.
I couldn't agree with you more. :)
post #77 of 837
Thread Starter 
How does the MPEG decoder compare to the 59avi? I specifically recall Ja_o_ at Onexxxx tell me the 59avi's was not as good as the sp1000's when we were discussing SDI mods.
post #78 of 837
When do we get to the real meat and potatoes....ie hdmi.
Only mimason cares about component;)
post #79 of 837
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Earz

Only mimason cares about component;)
Only as much as it affects the IScan HD but I am a forward thinker and a new display is on the horizon after vacation.
post #80 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by mimason
Only as much as it affects the IScan HD but I am a forward thinker and a new display is on the horizon after vacation.
Understood. It sounds like you and I are in the same boat: In the market for a new display. Please keep in touch with me via PM and let me know how your hunt for one goes. Any tips, whatever...all input appreciated. :)

(That's an open statement to anyone reading this, btw.) :)

I'd like to have it done by November, when Xbox360 comes out. That's my "deadline" of sorts.
post #81 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by mimason
Only as much as it affects the IScan HD but I am a forward thinker and a new display is on the horizon after vacation.
You may want to check out straight hdmi first....especially with HD around the corner;)
post #82 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by Kris Deering
Well you got some of it right. The Silicon Image chip does a tremendous job in this player and is one of the best implementations I've seen. Right up there with the DVDO implementation.

The issues I've seen via component are core performance issues. Definately has some CUE issues and a few other small bugs. But I will say that overall this is definately one of the best players I've seen in quite a while and easily in my Top 5, regardless of the score you see.

Kris, not to put words in your mouth or anything, but let me take a stab at your Top 5 players (sub $5k)....http://forums.offtopic.com/images/sm...ingnaughty.gif

Video:
1. Denon 5910
2. Denon 3910
3. Pioneer 59avi (tie)
3. SP1000 (tie)
5. Denon 5900/9000

Overall (Audio, video, Build quality):
1. Denon 5910
2. SP1000 (tie)
2. Denon 3910 (tie)
4. Denon 5900/9000
5. Pioneer 59avi

was I anywhere around the ballpark? http://forums.offtopic.com/images/smilies/drama.gif
post #83 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by mimason
How does the MPEG decoder compare to the 59avi? I specifically recall Ja_o_ at Onexxxx tell me the 59avi's was not as good as the sp1000's when we were discussing SDI mods.
It's not as good. More CUE issues. I can't figure out what they are using since the MPEG decoder is buried but I suspect it's an older Mitsubishi chip.
post #84 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by Earz
You may want to check out straight hdmi first....especially with HD around the corner;)
You do seem to have your priority's right though with a vacation falling ahead of a new display:D
post #85 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by Kris Deering
It's not as good. More CUE issues. I can't figure out what they are using since the MPEG decoder is buried but I suspect it's an older Mitsubishi chip.
Nice build huh?....have you ever seen a smoother transport on a player in this price range?
Maybe a few points could be added for that;)
post #86 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by ssabripo
Kris, not to put words in your mouth or anything, but let me take a stab at your Top 5 players (sub $5k)....http://forums.offtopic.com/images/sm...ingnaughty.gif

Video:
1. Denon 5910
2. Denon 3910
3. Pioneer 59avi (tie)
3. SP1000 (tie)
5. Denon 5900/9000

Overall (Audio, video, Build quality):
1. Denon 5910
2. SP1000 (tie)
2. Denon 3910 (tie)
4. Denon 5900/9000
5. Pioneer 59avi

was I anywhere around the ballpark? http://forums.offtopic.com/images/smilies/drama.gif
I really don't think that in audio the SP1000 will be tie with the Denon 3910.
I think the SP1000 is better in this department.
In terms of video, I agree that it will have a similar score to the Pioneer 59AVi, which is not bad since it got the 2004 Secrets' award for best DVD player .

Kris,

Why is not macroblocking part of the scores?
post #87 of 837
Q's list:

Video:
1. Denon 5910
2. Onkyo 1000/Integra 10.5
_____________________________________________
3. Pioneer 59 (not tied with the Onkyo. Certainly not better. Anyone who uses a properly calibrated display will see this very easily.)
4. Denon 3910
5. Denon 5900/9000

Audio:
1.) Onkyo 1000/Integra 10.5 (We discussed this earlier in this thread or the 1.21 firmware thread I believe.)
2.) Denon 5910
______________________________________________
3.) Pioneer 59
4.) Denon 3910 (tied)
5.) Denon 5900/9000 (tied)

OVERALL:
1.) Denon 5910
2.) Onkyo 1000/Integra 10.5
_______________________________________________
3.) Pioneer 59
4.) Denon 3910
5.) Denon 5900/9000

No ties anywhere except for Denon 5900/9000.

Those are my lists. ;)

Besides my own demoing experiences that lead me to these conclusions, you add this:

If you read any number of professional reviews, the Denons were nowhere close to the Onkyo 1000 or Integra 10.5 in terms of video and especially audio. (Denon 5910 excepted, of course.)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...ighlight=Onkyo

If you check out the first five pages of this thread, before the trolls derailed it and got it locked like virtually every other Onkyo 1000 thread around here, the consensus from upwards of 10 domestic and international professional reviews comes back as this: The Pioneer 59 and Denon 3910 are in a class/tier BELOW the Onkyo 1000/Integra 10.5 (and by extension, the Denon 5910.) Audio, video, build, transport, etc. Across the boards.

The Pioneer 59 and Denon 3910 simply are not in the same league as the Onkyo 1000 and Denon 5910 in any way, shape, or form. You don't need to spend a long time with these units to figure this out, especially if you bother to calibrate your display worth a damn.

Don't get me wrong: At their price points, the Pioneer 59 and Denon 3910 easily rule the <$1000 tier, at least. They're great bargains at their price points. Depending on your display, you can't go wrong with either one of them. AWESOME value for your dollar.

One specific example from that thread would be the review that favorably compares the Onkyo 1000 to the Meridian and Esoteric DV-50.

One reviewer even rated the Onkyo 1000 over the Esoteric DV-50 outright and put the Onkyo 1000 on about equal footing with the Meridian. The Denon 3910 and Pioneer 59 never came close.

In that same review, it's clearly written that all of these players are clearly in a class ABOVE the Denon 3910 and Pioneer 59. You can read it for yourself. The first 5 pages of that thread are really eye opening.

I couldn't agree more with all of those reviews in that thread after my 6 months of demoing, exploring, toying, and research. They're dead-on.

Seeing and hearing truly are believing. :)
post #88 of 837
I don't read reviews of players. I got away from that a few years ago.

There is no way I would rate the 3910's audio performance better then the 5900 or 9000. The 9000 is the best of the 3 followed by the 5900 then the 3910.

I would only recommend a FLI-23xx based player to someone using a display that doesn't show the bug. Otherwise I say pass.

Since I haven't tested the Onkyo with HDMI yet right now it would be about #5 on my list of component based players.

Component out:

1. Denon 5910
2. Panasonic RP-82
3. Arcam DV-27A
4. Panasonic XP-30
5. Onkyo SP-1000

We'll see about HDMI soon. But I would suspect that unless Onkyo screwed something up it will be:

1. Denon 5910
2. Pioneer 59AVi
3. Onkyo SP1000
and no others.

Yes you read that right. And that is because of MB. If your display doesn't show it though:
1. Denon 5910
2. Denon 3910/Pioneer 59AVi tie
4. Onkyo SP1000
5. Panasonic S97

I know a lot of you will scoff but I hate CUE issues and the Onkyo has them. And that would just drive me nuts. I remember trying to live with them with the excellent DVD-2800 and 2900.

I haven't had the chance to sit down and really listen to the Onkyo.
post #89 of 837
Hey Kris,

I agree with you that CUE issues are so anoying, but at least to
me the macroblocking it is as bad as the CUE. And I think
that it should be consider as part of the tests and scores.
Just imagine for any consumer that looks at the scores, and buys
a DVD player that score 90, uses it and has this macroblocking.
Then, if he/she buys another one with a score in 60s such as the
Pioneer 578 that doesn't show it. To them it will look better the
one without it.
post #90 of 837
Quote:
Originally posted by Kris Deering

Component out:

1. Denon 5910
2. Panasonic RP-82
3. Arcam DV-27A
4. Panasonic XP-30
5. Onkyo SP-1000

We'll see about HDMI soon. But I would suspect that unless Onkyo screwed something up it will be:

1. Denon 5910
2. Pioneer 59AVi
3. Onkyo SP1000
and no others.
Assuming all this holds and the Onkyo doesn't "screw up" over HDMI, as you put it...for my education...how in the world does the Pioneer 59 do better over HDMI than the Onkyo 1000?

And I'd love to understand your component list better. I know the Arcam is a beast, but two <$1000 Panasonics also do better over component? I know those Pannys are hallowed gods in the DVD realm but...????

Please educate me. I just want to understand all of this better. :)
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: DVD Players (Standard Def)
This thread is locked  
AVS › AVS Forum › Video Components › DVD Players (Standard Def) › Denon 5910 vs Onkyo SP1000 Pro Review