mabuttra;17235136]Something that I've never been able to find out is if the TVG1 data stream contains separate data for V8, V9, and V10 devices, or do they all use the same data? If they are separate, it makes sense to me that the V8 data could be missing pieces while the V9, and V10 data are complete.
I don't know myself, but I think that the data is the same for all devices that run on TVG1. You have to remember that the host station has a fixed bit rate in their 6 MHz channel so TVGOS can't keep adding data to their stream because this will cut into the bit rate for the host stations video feed.
I have an assumption that the later version 8 devices, 08.01.65 and up, have the two update patches, an additional set of host start up flags to work with TVG1, and the download sequence is digital first and analog second, already included in the base version. Where as the earlier version 8's and down are strictly analog dependent. I do believe that most to all version 8 devices can be upgraded to run on TVG1 since they all have mpeg decoders built into them.
I'm with you so far. I won't question whether the Sony gets a grid from the legacy stream or TVG1 stream, because I have no way of knowing that for sure. Are you saying that we should have 2 download schedules (1 legacy, and 1 TVG1)? Because I only have one. Why can the sony easily read the TVG1 to get listings, but can't read it for the other data?
Theoretically, yes but it was never intended by Rovicorp that these devices were to run directly from the legacy stream. I can decode the legacy stream with my version 8 RCA DLP in the evening only and I also get a 5307 download schedule. For some reason my version 9 Pioneer ignores the legacy data and only sees TVG1.
Both the analog and digital download schedules have the same DLID (download identification number) numbers, which are type 27, 70, 81 which the guide is hardcoded to understand. The problem is the time and duration of the schedules happen at different times and for different lenght of times. Also the digital download has an additional DLID number which is 96. So when your guide sees type 70 it downloads it because it understand what it is and also your guide can decode an mpeg data stream, which what TVG1 and the legacy stream is.
I think you're getting ahead of yourself here. I don't think the download schedule is used at all until you have a host channel, and a grid. That is the only time the DLTimer, and LastDLStart fields start getting updated, and the download history screens start getting filled in. Also the 3 day cycle you describe is actually 4.5 days if the host channel isn't set. It is possible that the Sony is trying to find data in two different places, which would cause it to miss some of it. However, as others have pointed out, the data that my sony receives successfully here, is missed in other places around the country. While certain data packets that are infrequent here, are received in large numbers elsewhere. This is why I still contend that there is definitely a difference in the data that is sent out here, and the data that is sent out in other places.
What I was talking about here is after you get listings and you lose your channel line up (grid). The guide will use the current download schedule to retrieve the missing information to receive a new channel list to give you back your grid. But if the data you need is in the legacy stream and you have a TVG1 download schedule, your guide will be looking at the wrong time and possibley the wrong place for the information it needs to restore a working grid.
You also have to remember that every person uses their device at different times and for different length of times so they may keep missing the vital peices to restore the grid. Also this is a recorder so even when the person is away the device can be still in use whereas my device is a tv and when I'm not home it is not in use.
I agree with you that the download schedule is not used until you get a working grid, after you pick your channel line up. The guide will keep downloading data continuosly until it gets the data it needs or the device is turned on which will stop the download. That is why you are told to leave the devices off for 24 hours when you first set up the guide.
Are you sure about no TVG1 data being transmitted in the evening? I know that the data for listings isn't sent out in the evening, but there is other activity going on. Does your TV have an ATSC Slicer screen that you can see the data packets counting? Are you saying in the evening you can go to that screen and see no packets counting?
Yes I have the same ATSC splicer screen that you got when you installed the sony update patch. I do have activity going on but this is the legacy stream running and my guide dumps all the data which is about four packets per second. The legacy stream runs into the evening and stops about 7:30pm to 8:00pm and restarts about 10:30pm to 11:00pm.
As I stated before, if I do a full system reset after 5:29pm nothing happens until 12:51am. I don't even get a clock set.
For reference my two pioneer 5010's have a version 9 (09.01.46) 8 day guide with out the record feature and my RCA DLP has a version 8 (08.01.44/08.06.46) 8 day guide with the record feature. My pioneers are running off of TVG1 from KYW in philadelphia and my RCA is dataless since february 5th.
I'll save everyone here a lot of time. Here are the recovery times for my DVR since May 20. All but the last one was with the 1.2.21 firmware
. Also note that my DVR apparently doesn't have to switch between the legacy data and the TVG1 data (if that is what it is doing), since it always recovers in 3 days, or less.
||< 24 hours
||< 36 hours
||< 24 hours
||< 3 days
||< 17 hours
+ = Reset To Factory Defaults, but maintained patch 08.06.44
* = Restore Factory Defaults, and re-upgrade to 1.2.21
$ = Restore Factory Defaults, and left at 1.2.13
Would you say that my DVR can consistently
recover from a reset? Doesn't it make sense that, if these are Sony problems, that everyone's DVR would at least recover just as fast (or slow) as mine?
Your three day recoveries are identical to when we had analog downloads. My version 9's can recover consistently from a full factory reset in 3 hours as long as TVG1 is running.
Yes everybody's dvr should recover like yours if they followed your reset procedure to the tee. But if they interfere with the process it will skew the results. They will have to do the procedure the same exact way you did yours. Any variation will skew the results.
The "00000" zip code reset doesn't wipe out the grid on the Sony (or my panasonic DMR-E95H recorder). If your DVR has lost it's host channel, it will start a new search for one, but it doesn't touch the grid.
You maybe right mark because I hadn't tried this in a while. If I remember correctly, after you put 00000 in the zip code, you turned off the device for 15 minutes and then turned it on and entered your correct zip code and this was supposed to throw away your channel line up (grid) and the guide will have to aquire a new one. I will have to make a note to test this when I do another full reset of the guide.
Is there a simple way of throwing away your grid without losing the 08.06.46 patch?
Although, I don't agree with 100% of what you have said, you have provided an interesting take on what could be happening.
I am also not ruling out that there maybe data problems in certain areas but I'm trying to use a process of elimination first, like comparing this TVGOS embedded device up against other TVGOS embedded devices to see if it is a widespread TVGOS device problem or a single TVGOS device problem.