Sony SXRD 50" and 60" - Oct/Nov - Page 25

ptwat:

Looks like the JVC 61FH96 is currently pre-selling at about a 30% savings over the 60" SXRD's unpublished list price of $4999. I had just about decided to bite on the JVC pre-order when I came across information in this thread that indicated Sony's SXRD might support 1080p input. Now I have decided to wait until there is some published specifications on the SXRD sets. I prefer the sleek JVC Cabinet style with minimal width and am not too fond of the possible speaker configuration of the new Sony but the prospect of a better picture would win me over. In the end it will be one of these two sets!

Give me a break... I simply made a mistake and admitted it. Christ, grow up.

And as far as the black helicopters go, I'm not being paranoid or an Oliver Stone conspiracy theorist...I don't really care what the new sets look like on the outside, I'm more concerned about the picture. Do I like the possibility of side speakers? No. Are they going to be a dealbreaker? Again, no. I'm very excited about these new sets and the only purpose of my previous post that everybody had jumped all over was that the information we have so far hasn't been confirmed by Sony, nobody has seen a picture of the new sets, and we don't have enough info to really "flesh-in" what these TVs are going to really be (1080p inputs, XBR line, et al). I'm not trying to be a frickin' naysayer...I'm as eager as the next guy. My only point was that there's still plenty to find out about the SXRDs.

Let's lighten up...

Jason

You can't expect much from us. We're like a bunch of kids waiting for a candy store to open and one of us got a free jelly bean. Now we want to know about every flavor. Some start describing what they will taste like without every having one before.

I totally agree with you, how folks get excited and start making assumptions based on their own expectations. Oh the drama!

Fortunately we don't have to worry about crowd control.

Hey Jason, I am all grown up, I,m not the one posting conspiracy theories. If you don,t believe Skindigs credentials why don,t you simply do what Uninvited Guest told you to do and Email him at Cructhfields and find out for sure if he is who he says he is.

Do we know if the JVC 61FH96 will support 1080p input through HDMI?

I can't believe all the people here who believe in conspiracy theories!

It's gotta be true.... I saw it on the internet.

I never said that I doubted Skindig Steve's credentials...I'm not sure where you're getting that. In fact, as you stated, I apologized to him for mis-stating that Crutchfield had posted an incorrect spec (which I believe I would only do if I believed he actually works for Crutchfield)...it was Amazon.com that posted the wrong information and I corrected my mistake. No harm done...except apparently as far as you're concerned. Additionally, I don't know why you think I'm posting conspiracy theories...I'm actually saying that "we don't know a whole lot." You need to get your facts straight and find someone else to volley pointless potshots at...

Jason

Not yet. Besides that though I don't believe the JVCs have any type of dynamic iris. That will most likely make a considerable difference in terms of contrast ratio and black level.

JVC has indicated they will support up to a 1080i input on the new 1080p sets, and then added that from what they (one individual) understood the competition wasn't going to be offering 1080p inputs either.

I first took the comment (The competition bit) as a sarcastic reasoning for not giving me the answer I wanted to here. For a short while I even had feelings of guilt for my expectations But then I had read speculation that the Sony SXRD might include the 1080p input.

Could the SXRD be the "competition"?

Why would Sony lead the competition into thinking no 1080p inputs on the SXRD?

But then again, it could just as well be that neither of the new 1080p sets have 1080p inputs.

There has been no official set of full/final specifications posted on either of the two manufacturers web sites (as of July) that I'm aware of.

Anyone else care to speculate?

Can someone explain to me what the big deal will be if these TV's only accept 1080i?
Will the TV's deinterlace them before displaying an image?
And if not, will I really be able to notice a difference?

(this all assuming there will be enough 1080p sources to even make it worth
worrying about)

They accept 480i, 480p, 720p and 1080i.


All inputs are converted to 1080p in the TV.


There are no 1080p inputs other than computers at this time.

To some it might be a bigger deal than others. Without the ability to accept the displays native resolution as an input, the TV's PQ will always be limited to the quality of it's built in de-interlacer/scaler(among other things). Sony may capitalize on this fact if JVC doesn't have the 1080p input, but If JVC delivers 1080p inputs and Sony doesn't, I would believe the JVC coupled with a external de-interlacer/scaler might deliver the superior picture. If neither of the sets offer 1080p inputs then the decision to choose between the two would likely be more dependant on other performance comparisons.


The 1080p SXRD and D-ILA sets (without 1080p inputs) would de-interlace all interlaced inputs to 1080p.


There are two disadvantage of a TV not being able to accept it's native resolution as an input.

1) Internal de-interlacing/scaler dependency.
2) In the event we do eventually get 1080p sources it is likely that the 1080p sets (which lack the native input capability) would do what the majority of 720p sets do when they get a higher resolution signal than they are capable of displaying.... a loss of half the higher resolution scaled back up to the sets native resolution 720p/1080p.

If someone dumped out half my beer and topped it off with water I'm pretty sure I'd notice..

But here again it's all a matter of taste.

I was hoping the new sets had the XBR plastic Shield.. Sounds like they wont be XBRs....

The 720p analogy is misplaced. In this instance the sets would not be capable of receiving the 1080p signal. The external source would have to provide the set with a format that it could accept. This leads me to believe that you may still be able to take advantage of an external processor by having it do its magic and provide a 1080i signal to the 1080p set that doesn't accept 1080p. Then, the set simply has to get from 1080i to 1080p.

I haven't heard any discussion of this anywhere, but I have yet to see any deinterlacing issues with the native 1080p sets (well, actually, I have to limit my observation to the Qualia 006) when they are fed a 1080i source.

The reasoning for the use of an External Processors would be it's ability to outperform most internal processors in the Interlaced to Progressive transition, to include proper cadence detection. If you were to decide to use an external processor (with a no 1080p input HDTV) you might get a better result setting the External Processor for a 720-progressive output so that the TV's internal de-interlacer and cadence detection wouldn't have to interfere. It would then just be a matter of scaling to the native resolution of the set (1080p).

If the TV were left to handle the last interlaced-to-progressive transition, you would be defeating one of the core reasons of having the External Processor in the first place.

So if neither of the new native 1080p sets have the ability to accept the native 1080p input, I doubt any would justify the expense of using external video processing equipment.

This would leave the overall PQ between the two sets up to each respective manufacture's capabilities in the separate areas of Display and Video Processing technologies.

IMO: The Sony SXRD might well have the edge if this ends up being the case. Which is why I could see a reason for a JVC surprise.

I guess it may be to the advantage of the HDTV manufacturers to control the final Interlacing-to-progressive transition by keeping it In-The-Set. This would force the consumer into a selection of a HDTV based on it's stronger capabilities, whatever they might be, at somewhat the expense of also having to accept it's weaker traits.

The more diversified/opinionated the better, but only to their (all in one) controlled extent! Besides, the majority of consumers will have the likes of BB and CC to tell them what to look for anyway.

Maybe it's just another first-generation (1080p) thing that can be remedied by this spring, by waiting on the second-generation 1080p sets. While it might be easier for those that already own 720p sets to convince themselves to wait for 1080p native input sets, those of us that are poised to make an investment now, to get into the HDTV scene, would be doing so with the knowledge that we might be investing in our own obsolescence for the sake of the manufacturer's justification of a second generation of 1080p RP sets. By holding out on the native inputs until next year they could market the RP products to be a much less expensive alternative to the SED/FED technology.

Then again the question might be, who stands to gain the most from being the first to offer 1080p native input now.

Given the SXRD and JVC 1080p choice, I would choose the Sony if they offered the 1080p input but only if JVC didn't. If neither offered 1080p input then I would still lean towards the Sony.

If JVC has anticipated the competition's edge (as I have) they might surprise Sony with the 1080p input capability as a feature to be expected MIA on the new SXRD.

If 1080p inputs are a surprise on both sets I might lean towards the less expensive set so I could more easily afford the external video processor.

So in my eyes (IMO) JVC has the most to gain by the inclusion of the 1080p input over Sony deciding to or not.

It will be awhile (if ever) before the HDTV manufacturers will include as good a video processing package as can be had from current external processors. The exception might be the likes of Sony's Qualia line but you'll likely pay at least twice that of what you could expect to invest on a comparable separate Display and Video Processing set up. It would also cost you more, inevitably, to upgrade and you would be depending on the All-In-One-Spare-No-Cost product's ability to stay at the top of the game(s) in each respective category of PQ, else a complete replacement which I'm certain they would be happy to supply.

Interesting is Sony's decision not to have included the 1080p input capability on the Qualia RP SXRD.

Does/Did Sony include 1080p input on front projection products?

If so, I guess the competition may have encouraged it's inclusion more in that FP market than the RP market or it would have been on the Qualia RP SXRD.

We can hope that the same competition will encourage inclusion of it in the RP market as well.

Does/Did Sony include 1080p input on front projection products?

They just came out with a $3000 upgrade to do just that

Roy

Silly question, but there's a very good reason for it...
I know that in certain ways HDMI inputs are limited to 1080i, but what about the HDMI outputs on some high end video cards, and the inputs on some monitors? I'm about to buy an HDMI monitor, and I was thinking about some of what was said on this foorium....conversely, the HDMI website states that HDMI is theoretically capable of data transfer in excess of that required for a 1080p60 signal (although I understand that it is the HDMI input that limits this in reality)
SOOOOOOOO....what gives?

Here's a sneak peak on a print ad that will debut in August.

*Edit*

There is another part of this ad that I don't have, right above the TV there is a little toy color wheel sticking up. And it says something to the effect of why reinvent the wheel. They seem to be mocking DLP.

Looks pretty frickin' awesome! Who'd you have to kill to get a hold of that? It looks like the screen sits pretty high in regards to the base...maybe it's time to modify the TV stand plans...

Jason

HDMI inputs are not limited to 1080i. I believe all HDMI transceivers sold to date can handle 1080i. And the newer receivers can handle it easily.

I fear that ad will mislead people into expecting a flat panel.

But I'm execited that Sony is gearing up ads for what will doubtless be a killer product.

I may be completely off here, but having worked in the video game industry for over 15 years, I've seen more than a few mock-up pics of future hardware to think that this is not the actual set or a real print ad.

I just don't see Sony taking a shot at DLP technology by including the "Zero Wheels" comment in the ad. Sony generally has more class than that. Besides, how many consumers outside these forums will even know what "Zero wheels" is in reference to? There are other aspects of the ad design that seem odd, like the fact that you really have to study the ad for a moment to make out what the object is they are trying to sell.

I would like to get Skingdig's impression of the ad and whether or not the set pictured in it matches up with what he's seen.

Looks like the XS to me... Wasent that a deal breaker for you

Even though it is at an angle if you look closely you can see it is a exact copy of the Sony LCD XS as we were told it would be.

Roy

Now let's hope it's an XBR! Keep yer fingers crossed....

No...I said that I wasn't crazy about the XS series' wings. It was never a dealbreaker, in fact I was ready to buy the XS before my dealer told me that Sony would be releasing SXRDs before the end of the year. Crossing my fingers, I've decided to wait to see what the SXRDs hold. It's unfortunate that they, too, have the winged speakers, but that will by no means be a dealbreaker.

Jason

So it appears that Dumbo ears will rule the day...

Sony and others should learn to debut new products like the auto industry.

Months before the sale of the new Cayman S, Porsche has shown their pre-production car to auto journalists who dutifully ooh and ahh about the car in "exclusive" articles. Pictures and specs are available on their website. It generates buzz. Porsche doesn't seem worried about cannibalizing sales from the 911, no Osborn effect.

In the same way, Sony should wine and dine the press, bring them in to see some demos so they can write glowing reviews, release a few exclusive photos. With high ticket items people will wait to see the next best thing.

Sorry, there is another part of this ad which I could not get my hands on. Directly above this picture is a little toy color wheel, and some words talking about reinventing the wheel. It's kind of mocking DLP.