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post #391 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_Greer
NHL has been getting good treatment on there over the past few years?
considering that the news of ESPN declining the NHL right didn't come until the 59th minute of the sportscenter repeats the other night, the answer is NO
post #392 of 567
http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey...orts-headlines

ESPN doesn't take bait so NHL reels in OLN
August 19, 2005

The NHL's three-year, $207.5-million cable TV deal with Comcast's OLN announced yesterday holds promise of growth for each side.

For OLN, the reborn, post-lockout NHL may help transform the former hunting-and-fishing channel into a larger all-sports destination that could eventually include some live NFL games.

In turn, the NHL pockets tens of millions more than it would have received from former partner ESPN and finds a platform to launch wide-ranging enhancements: the ability to televise games in high-definition, to mike players and coaches and conduct in-game interviews, to provide live streaming video of games to computers and build a video-on-demand archive.

The pact also envisions a dedicated NHL channel in the United States in two years, NHL commissioner Gary Bettman and Comcast executives said yesterday.

But for some hockey fans in the New York market, one of the league's largest and most significant, the OLN deal has flaws.

For example, unless you receive OLN - formerly Outdoor Life Network - a digital channel on your cable system that sometimes costs extra, you'll miss the Rangers-Flyers regular-season opener Oct. 5. MSG Network, the team's local rights holder, is blacked out. Concerning the Rangers-Flyers opener, a league spokeswoman said, "We are aware of that situation, but no one should draw any conclusions just yet."

If OLN chose to show the Bruins hosting the Canadiens, MSG could carry Rangers-Flyers. But anytime OLN, which will televise 58 NHL regular-season games nationally this season - primarily on Monday and Tuesday nights - decides to televise a Rangers, Islanders or Devils game exclusively, New York metro area viewers without OLN will not see it. That is, unless they subscribe to digitial tiers on Cablevision or Time Warner.

Although OLN is available in 64 million homes across the United States, often as part of basic or extended cable packages - as are ESPN and ESPN2 - OLN is on a digitial tier for Cablevision and Time Warner Cable subscribers. Cablevision charges $4.95 a month for a sports tier that includes OLN and nine other channels.

OLN-less hockey fans won't want to hear this, either: OLN is televising a majority of the Stanley Cup playoffs, up to four nights a week in the first, second and third rounds and Games 1 and 2 of the Finals.

Will sports fans who can watch hundreds of Rangers, Islanders and Devils games on MSG and FSNY pony up for OLN? Maybe not until the playoffs, although NBC will televise some weekend playoff games and Games 3 through 7 of the Finals.

Next season, OLN and the NHL will schedule only one game in the entire United States on Monday nights, and televise that as an exclusive, Bettman and OLN executives said, which would eliminate the conflicts.

Comcast, which owns four regional sports networks, as well as a majority share in the Philadelphia 76ers and Flyers, thinks it has invested in a winner.

As for ESPN, it decided it could live without the NHL, refusing to match OLN's offer late Wednesday night. "We worked very hard to build and sustain our relationship with the league and would have liked to continue," ESPN president George Bodenheimer said in a statement. "However, given the prolonged work stoppage and the league's TV ratings history, no financial model even remotely supports the contract terms offered." ESPN averaged a 0.5 rating in 20 games and ESPN2 a 0.2 rating in 50 games during the 2003-04 season.

That 0.5 average, however, is higher than any regular series on OLN, where "Survivor" reruns and bull-riding events are currently the top programs. To improve on that is a job not only for the players, but for the promoters and marketers at Comcast and the league.

Heard around

Reggie Miller, who played with the Pacers for 18 years, has joined TNT as a game and studio analyst. He turned down an offer from ESPN/ABC, opting for the familiarity of working with his sister Cheryl, with whom he worked WNBA games on Lifetime, and his friend Charles Barkley. "Now I can say all the things I want to about the commissioner without getting fined," Miller said during a conference call. We'll see. He also warned that he would single out referees who gave him unjust technicals in his career ... State Supreme Court Justice Helen E. Freedman has dismissed a suit brought by Cablevision last year that sought to block the Mets, Comcast and Time Warner Cable from rolling out a regional sports network that will televise 130 Mets games next season.

Copyright 2005 Newsday Inc.
post #393 of 567
According to this morning's LA Times, there will be no RSN games on Monday nights:

http://www.latimes.com/sports/hockey...adlines-sports

Quote:
Another drawback is that, according to Bettman, the plan is to make Monday nights exclusive to OLN.

So Monday night games cannot be shown on local television.

The Kings, for example, have 12 games scheduled on Monday nights this season that can't be shown locally on FSN West.

They can be televised nationally only if picked up by OLN.

Bettman said that in future seasons, fewer games would be scheduled on Monday nights.

"Everyone should keep in mind that for this season, we did our schedule before we had this relationship," he said on a conference call.
So this means LESS HD if you have FSW HD.
post #394 of 567
I'm pretty sure that's a bad interpretation.

If the Kings games are the national OLN game, they'll be on OLN and there will be no RSN broadcast.

If the Kings games are not the national OLN game, the LA RSN can show it.

Next year, they'll only schedule one game on Mondays to avoid this kind of situation.
post #395 of 567
Yeah, any game can be shown locally. But FSN SW might be blacked out outside of the local viewing area if that particular game is on OLN.

That's the way I understand it at least...
post #396 of 567
Read the article. There will be NO LOCAL GAMES on Monday nights.

1/7 of Center Ice just disappeared before your very eyes.

If it was what you are saying, then why would Bettman call it a DRAWBACK that they will FIX WITH THE SCHEDULING NEXT SEASON?

You can kiss 8-12 RSN games goodbye in each market.
post #397 of 567
Putting hockey up against football on Monday night sounds like suicide to me. When given a choice, the generic U.S. sports fan who watches sports, any sports, on TV will tune into football 99.87% of the time. Bengals vs Cardinals will stomp a Flyers vs Red Wings in the ratings.

When I'm put in charge the NHL will be on a dead sports night. "Wednesday Night Hockey" has a nice ring to it.
Tom
post #398 of 567
That's what I thought. But apparently they think they may be able to capture the Monday Night crowd once football ends in January. Hockey still has 3-4 months to go.
post #399 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRMan
According to this morning's LA Times, there will be no RSN games on Monday nights:

http://www.latimes.com/sports/hockey...adlines-sports



So this means LESS HD if you have FSW HD.
What a freakin' joke. Their gonna screw millions of fans out of watching their team. It's one thing to not have any games available nationally like the NBA does on Sundays with ABC. But not allow games on local markets? I don't kow whether to laugh at how rediculous this idea is or throw a puck down Bettman's throat along with the other fans in the league.
post #400 of 567
From HDBeat.com

http://www.hdbeat.com/2005/08/18/oln...and-carry-nhl/

OLN HD to launch in October and carry NHL
Posted Aug 18, 2005, 2:43 PM ET by Kevin C. Tofel
Filed under: Deals, News, Programming


We indicated earlier this month that Comcast was working with the NHL to carry games in HD. Looks like it's a done deal and will coincide with the launch of OLN's new HD channel, aptly named "OLN HD". OLN will carry at least 58 regular season hockey games nationwide, with most games on Mondays and Tuesdays. Watch for the first face-off on October 5th, when OLN broadcasts the Rangers vs. the Flyers.

I'm glad to see another HD channel, but I'm curious about a few things. What happens to the "NHL Center Ice" premium package that some providers used to offer? This package was comprised of numerous PPV (Pay Per View) channels that carried 1,100 hockey games each season. How will local blackout rules apply to the new OLN coverage?

Gee, just when we get hockey back, I get the funny feeling I still won't get to watch the local team, especially in HD. I do receive OLN on my Dish Network feed, but what are the odds that OLN HD will get picked up by a non-Comcast provider?
post #401 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkunces
What a freakin' joke. Their gonna screw millions of fans out of watching their team. It's one thing to not have any games available nationally like the NBA does on Sundays with ABC. But not allow games on local markets? I don't kow whether to laugh at how rediculous this idea is or throw a puck down Bettman's throat along with the other fans in the league.
Why do those things have to be mutually exclusive? I say we laugh maniacally while shoving pucks into every orifice of his body... sharpened pucks... made from steel... ahh screw it, let's call them tire rims. :)

So it looks like Monday's will remain a no-TV night for me even after the season starts. Watching Pro football is like watching Women's basketball to me.... only not every other player is on probation in the WNBA. ;)

Regs,
Jeff
post #402 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRMan
Read the article. There will be NO LOCAL GAMES on Monday nights.

1/7 of Center Ice just disappeared before your very eyes.

If it was what you are saying, then why would Bettman call it a DRAWBACK that they will FIX WITH THE SCHEDULING NEXT SEASON?

You can kiss 8-12 RSN games goodbye in each market.
Wow - I think people need to chill. ONE of the posted articles indicates that the monday exclusive starts this year, while the others indicate that this will only happen next year. We need clarification for sure, but I don't think it's justifiable to jump to the conclusion that the LA Times is the gospel on this.

The NHL isn't the brightest set of guys on the planet, but I really don't think that they're *quite* dumb enough to throw ~15% of all RSN coverage out the window to get one national game. To me, the explanation of a transition year where the National game will blackout RSN coverage only for the involved teams makes a lot of sense.
post #403 of 567
In fairness, several TV sports columns in Friday's papers indicate the Monday RSN blackout take effect this year.
Newsday is another source I can recall off hand.
(And Long Island, primarily served by Cablevision will be hard hit: OLN isn't offered at all.)
post #404 of 567
The Newsday interpretation of the OLN-NHL deal:

ESPN doesn't take bait, so NHL reels in OLN

Steve Zipay Newsday August 19, 2005

The NHL's three-year, $207.5-million cable TV deal with Comcast's OLN announced Thursday holds promise of growth for each side.

For OLN, the reborn, post-lockout NHL may help transform the former hunting-and-fishing channel into a larger all-sports destination that could eventually include some live NFL games.

In turn, the NHL pockets tens of millions more than it would have received from former partner ESPN and finds a platform to launch wide-ranging enhancements: the ability to televise games in high-definition, to mike players and coaches and conduct in-game interviews, to provide live streaming video of games to computers and build a video-on-demand archive.

The pact also envisions a dedicated NHL channel in the United States in two years, NHL commissioner Gary Bettman and Comcast executives said Thursday.

But for some hockey fans in the New York market, one of the league's largest and most significant, the OLN deal has flaws.

For example, unless you receive OLN -- formerly Outdoor Life Network -- a digital channel on your cable system that sometimes costs extra, you'll miss the Rangers-Flyers regular-season opener Oct. 5. MSG Network, the team's local rights holder, is blacked out. Concerning the Rangers-Flyers opener, a league spokeswoman said, "We are aware of that situation, but no one should draw any conclusions just yet."

If OLN chose to show the Bruins hosting the Canadiens, MSG could carry Rangers-Flyers. But anytime OLN, which will televise 58 NHL regular-season games nationally this season -- primarily on Monday and Tuesday nights -- decides to televise a Rangers, Islanders or Devils game exclusively, New York metro area viewers without OLN will not see it. That is, unless they subscribe to digitial tiers on Cablevision or Time Warner.

Although OLN is available in 64 million homes across the United States, often as part of basic or extended cable packages -- as are ESPN and ESPN2 -- OLN is on a digitial tier for Cablevision and Time Warner Cable subscribers. Cablevision charges $4.95 a month for a sports tier that includes OLN and nine other channels.

OLN-less hockey fans won't want to hear this, either: OLN is televising a majority of the Stanley Cup playoffs, up to four nights a week in the first, second and third rounds and Games 1 and 2 of the Finals.

Will sports fans who can watch hundreds of Rangers, Islanders and Devils games on MSG and FSNY pony up for OLN? Maybe not until the playoffs, although NBC will televise some weekend playoff games and Games 3 through 7 of the Finals.

Next season, OLN and the NHL will schedule only one game in the entire United States on Monday nights, and televise that as an exclusive, Bettman and OLN executives said, which would eliminate the conflicts.

Comcast, which owns four regional sports networks, as well as a majority share in the Philadelphia 76ers and Flyers, thinks it has invested in a winner.

As for ESPN, it decided it could live without the NHL, refusing to match OLN's offer late Wednesday night. "We worked very hard to build and sustain our relationship with the league and would have liked to continue," ESPN president George Bodenheimer said in a statement. "However, given the prolonged work stoppage and the league's TV ratings history, no financial model even remotely supports the contract terms offered." ESPN averaged a 0.5 rating in 20 games and ESPN2 a 0.2 rating in 50 games during the 2003-04 season.

That 0.5 average, however, is higher than any regular series on OLN, where "Survivor" reruns and bull-riding events are currently the top programs. To improve on that is a job not only for the players, but for the promoters and marketers at Comcast and the league.
post #405 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredfa
In fairness, several TV sports columns in Friday's papers indicate the Monday RSN blackout take effect this year.
Newsday is another source I can recall off hand.
(And Long Island, primarily served by Cablevision will be hard hit: OLN isn't offered at all.)
That is true and makes sense... but what doesn't make sense is that ALL Monday night games will not be televised, eventhough the LA Times columnist implies that.

I still see him as the only one interpreting the situation that way.
post #406 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by goman
That is true and makes sense... but what doesn't make sense is that ALL Monday night games will not be televised, eventhough the LA Times columnist implies that.

I still see him as the only one interpreting the situation that way.
I've seen others...

If your team is playing on OLN on Monday, basically you have to have OLN to watch it, because your team can't broadcast it on an OTA or RSN...
post #407 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by tec1271
From HDBeat.com

http://www.hdbeat.com/2005/08/18/oln...and-carry-nhl/

OLN HD to launch in October and carry NHL
Posted Aug 18, 2005, 2:43 PM ET by Kevin C. Tofel
Filed under: Deals, News, Programming


We indicated earlier this month that Comcast was working with the NHL to carry games in HD. Looks like it's a done deal and will coincide with the launch of OLN's new HD channel, aptly named "OLN HD". OLN will carry at least 58 regular season hockey games nationwide, with most games on Mondays and Tuesdays. Watch for the first face-off on October 5th, when OLN broadcasts the Rangers vs. the Flyers.

I'm glad to see another HD channel, but I'm curious about a few things. What happens to the "NHL Center Ice" premium package that some providers used to offer? This package was comprised of numerous PPV (Pay Per View) channels that carried 1,100 hockey games each season. How will local blackout rules apply to the new OLN coverage?

Gee, just when we get hockey back, I get the funny feeling I still won't get to watch the local team, especially in HD. I do receive OLN on my Dish Network feed, but what are the odds that OLN HD will get picked up by a non-Comcast provider?
Too bad it's only 5 hours of HD programming per month and it's a VOD service!
Click the article at the top of the post, then scroll down to read the fine print. Don't get too excited about HD hockey on OLN.

I for one am still waiting for an HD Center Ice announcement.
post #408 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdrabik
I've seen others...

If your team is playing on OLN on Monday, basically you have to have OLN to watch it, because your team can't broadcast it on an OTA or RSN...
That is what I am saying. And that makes sense for this year. But if your local team is not picked up by OLN then the RSN can televise it. I will stick with this interpretation until the TV schedules are released and we will all know for sure.
post #409 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by luebster
Too bad it's only 5 hours of HD programming per month and it's a VOD service!
Click the article at the top of the post, then scroll down to read the fine print. Don't get too excited about HD hockey on OLN.

I for one am still waiting for an HD Center Ice announcement.
As someone else has pointed out on the thread I posted in the main forum, this may be only VOD HD. But it may not. Think about it, who would pay $60M and then not show this live in HD.
post #410 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdrabik
I've seen others...

If your team is playing on OLN on Monday, basically you have to have OLN to watch it, because your team can't broadcast it on an OTA or RSN...
Right...which is what I was trying to say, but never quite did.

If your local team is playing on Monday AND it's broadcast by OLN, no other station (local or otherwise) can broadcast it. (Which seems opposite of MLB. My local FSN has rights over ESPN, WGN, et.al.)

If your local team is playing on Monay AND it is NOT broadcast by OLN, the local rights holder may broadcast it in the local area.

What I'm not sure about is a out-of-town market seeing a local RSN (like someone in PA trying to catch a Kings game on FSN SW).

Of course next year this is all moot.

EDIT: Need to type faster than goman ;)
post #411 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by tec1271
As someone else has pointed out on the thread I posted in the main forum, this may be only VOD HD. But it may not. Think about it, who would pay $60M and then not show this live in HD.
I completely agree, especially when most of Bettman's statements have included an emphasis on televising games in HD.

People should not get worked up about OLNHD until it proves to be a legitimate channel and not a VOD highlight reel.
post #412 of 567
From what I have read Chris' interpretation is correct. I just wonder if people pony up for CI package if they will not be able to see the Monday night games that are not on OLN.

I think that the NHL took the best deal they could make (and they got an awful lot more money than they were going to get anywhere else) and as usual didn't give a f*** about the fans. For the past few years the NHL executives have been talking about the importance of HD for expanding the TV audience for hockey. The problem is people who don't know the game can't follow the play or the puck, and no amount of fancy "miking the players and net cams" is going to change that. HD does. I've seen it. So, the NHL makes a deal with a company that doesn't currently do HD and even if it starts to will not be able to broadcast that HD signal to many markets. Now we hear that it is likely that the Monday night game will be exclusive on OLN and fans will not be able to see their favorite teams on another broadcast. How does that help the game or the fan? Clearly they did it for the money and once again don't care about the fans.

Hockey is truly the only sport I am really passionate about and care about. I can tell you that if I weren't a hockey fan, nothing that's been done to this point would get me to care about the game.

SMK
post #413 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by tec1271
As someone else has pointed out on the thread I posted in the main forum, this may be only VOD HD. But it may not. Think about it, who would pay $60M and then not show this live in HD.
Some of Comcast's games WILL be broadcast in HD. It's just that they won't initially be on a full-time OLN HD channel.

The opening-night game will probably be broadcast in HD since it's in Philly and they can use Comcast's HD mobile production truck. The SD feed will go to OLN and the HD feed will be provided to all carriers that currently have OLN -- it will be up to the carriers to somehow get it out to their subscribers. Comcast will probably provide the game on INHD1 or INHD2 -- unless they decide to dedicate a new channel for the HD feeds - like they have done for FSN regional HD broadcasts.
post #414 of 567
some of those articles make it seem like fans would be blacked out from seeing their local teams on Monday's when not broadcast by OLN. i can't imagine that would actually happen. if after years of watching every single rangers game (when not at the garden) i couldn't watch them on MSG because OLN was broadcasting a Pittsburgh/Philly game i would be more than a little pissed. i just can't see that happening.
post #415 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredfa
(And Long Island, primarily served by Cablevision will be hard hit: OLN isn't offered at all.)
Not true, Cablevision offers OLN as part of a 10 channel sports tier that costs $4.95/mo
post #416 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyGBiv
...
Hockey is truly the only sport I am really passionate about and care about. I can tell you that if I weren't a hockey fan, nothing that's been done to this point would get me to care about the game.

SMK

I completely agree.

AND I don't give a damn about people that AREN'T hockey fans when it comes to hockey on TV. PERIOD.

I DO NOT CARE if they EVER learn to care about the game. Really, why should I? Are "home repair" shows on TV to convince everyone to learn to fix up their houses, even if they AREN'T INTERESTED? WHY IS HOCKEY DIFFERENT?

I want the NHL on TV to serve ME... the hockey FAN. I want better, in-depth coverage of the sport, and I want more of it.

I DO NOT want the NHL on TV to serve people who are not interested, or aren't sure if they're interested. Why should we bother with them, and ruin my experience? Let 'em learn the same way I did, by watching and figuring it out.

THAT is what this is all about people.

Finally, we have a decent shot at getting BETTER service to the real fan. In the short term, some fans will get shafted... but most will not. You might have to pay an extra few bucks... if you're a fan, its a ridiculously small price.

It's a GREAT day for the NHL and real NHL fans.

(yes, I have swallowed every last drop of kool-aid, and it is very very good) :)


ps. didn't I read somewhere that there will be one HD broadcast each week?
post #417 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveInBerlinNJ
I completely agree.

AND I don't give a damn about people that AREN'T hockey fans when it comes to hockey on TV. PERIOD.
This is unfortunatley rather short sighted. The only way we are going to get sustained, good quality hockey on TV is by growing the product's market. What is going to happen in two years when OLN realizes they made a mistake and the money they spent to show the NHL wasn't worth it? We will be in exactly the same situation we are now, hoping someone will pick up national contract and be willing to show hockey on a regular basis. ESPN and ESPN2 had such a contract and let it go because nothing was done by the league to improve the TV product/market (in fact, everything was done by the league to make it worse), and with the low ratings, ESPN didn't want to prolong its partnership with the NHL. Now we hae OLN, but two years from now we won't have anyone else, unless HDNet is big enough at that point to really step in. Mark Cuban at least seems to get it. :D

SMK
post #418 of 567
Correct, RemyM, sorry for the error. I misread Zipay's column.
post #419 of 567
Some of you are missing the point on Comcast and OLN. THe NHL deal is just the beginning. Comcast will not even lose any money on this deal as the increase in rights fees will offset what they are paying the NHL. Comcast is looking at competing directly with ESPN. All sports leagues and NASCAR are watching this very closely as competiton for ESPN only helps them all in the long run.
post #420 of 567
Quote:
Originally Posted by luebster
Right...which is what I was trying to say, but never quite did.

If your local team is playing on Monday AND it's broadcast by OLN, no other station (local or otherwise) can broadcast it. (Which seems opposite of MLB. My local FSN has rights over ESPN, WGN, et.al.)

If your local team is playing on Monay AND it is NOT broadcast by OLN, the local rights holder may broadcast it in the local area.

What I'm not sure about is a out-of-town market seeing a local RSN (like someone in PA trying to catch a Kings game on FSN SW).

Of course next year this is all moot.

EDIT: Need to type faster than goman ;)

I found this in the Philly Inquirer.

"The first NHL on OLN game will be Oct. 5, opening day of the 2005-06 season, when the New York Rangers play the Flyers at the Wachovia Center. It will not be blacked out locally. Comcast says no Flyers games carried on OLN will be blacked out locally, even to satellite customers.

Flyers games will still be shown on Comcast SportsNet, although a few during the season will be shown on OLN."

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/12420031.htm
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