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Samsung 1080p Owner's Thread --- HLRxxx8W DLP Models - Page 23

post #661 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathy View Post

Do I understand correctly that the new 1080p models' picture is not as sharp as those with the HD2+ chip? I saw the HLR5677W in a B&W store, and loved the sharpness of the picture.

You'll need to see a 1080p to find out how you react. I have an ISF calibrated "soft" HLP5063 which I like a lot.

I also like the HD2+ sets.

Starting over, I would take a 1080p set.

Quote:


Does anyone know how much longer the PB will be available for the 1080p models?

In addition to what others have said, I "understand" that you can join the powerbuy and ask for a delay when the powerbuy ends. You can then cancel at a later time or complete the transaction for the powerbuy price. It's always best to use the TVA toll free number to check such "understandings".
post #662 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLApilot View Post

Who should I start with? TVA or Samsung? MY HD-950 looked great with NEMO when the red wasn't present. Got my 942 activated, but HD was depressing with red all over the screen.

Call TVA. If the set is damaged or not working right they will ship a new one and pick up the damaged one. Be sure to tell them about the damage to the box and how the driver handled the set.
post #663 of 12092
The audio was noticably out of sync when watching the Fifth Element. When (if?) I finally get my HD950 I will try it again to make sure it is repeatable. That is the only time I have noticed audio lag on my set.
post #664 of 12092
Clorox: I look forward to your tests and results!
post #665 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by John_Jones_CA View Post

The audio was noticably out of sync when watching the Fifth Element. When (if?) I finally get my HD950 I will try it again to make sure it is repeatable. That is the only time I have noticed audio lag on my set.

Hi John,

thanks for the post. Was this with a 480p output or a 480i output on your current DVD player?
post #666 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clorox View Post


1) Does anyone who is experiencing delays notice a delay with OTA signals (in other words, is scaling from 720p to 1080p or deinterlacing from 1080i to 1080p causing a delay with the audio being delivered by the sets speakers)?

2) What is the delay difference (if there is a delay at all) between using a DVD player that is outputting 480i vs. 480p vs. 720p vs. 1080i? Different DVD players?

3) Do you notice delays at all (regardless of source, setup)?

4) If you are experiencing delays, what is your setup?

1) I have over the air running directly to the 6168. The 6168 is outputting via optical cable to a Yamaha 5760 = no lag, audio does not echo when using speakers on both the tv and the 5760.

2) 3) 4) Outputting at 1080i on both Directv Samsung Sir-160 and Samsung HD850 I hear an echo between the tv's speakers and the 5760's speakers. Setting delay between 80ms and 120ms on the 5760 (I keep delay at 100ms it sounds just right) gets rid of the echo. The 100ms delay also gets rid of the visual lip synch I notice using the HD850 with HDMI and audio sent to the 5760 with optical cable (I have not tried it with component cables).

In summary same amount of delay needed by the 5760 (100ms) between the HD850 and Sir-160 outputting video to the 6168 at 1080i, and sending audio directly from the HD850 and Sir-160 to the 5760. Anything sent to the 6168 using the 6168's speaker doesn't have a lip synch issue unless it's from the source ie Discover HD on Directv (not the 6168's fault). If you send sound from the 6168 back to the 5760 no delay is needed. However the only DD5.1 you will get is from air or cable using the 6168's built in tuner. The HDMI input only appears to accept 2.0 audio.
post #667 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by moss312 View Post

1) I have over the air running directly to the 6168. The 6168 is outputting via optical cable to a Yamaha 5760 = no lag, audio does not echo when using speakers on both the tv and the 5760.

2) 3) 4) Outputting at 1080i on both Directv Samsung Sir-160 and Samsung HD850 I hear an echo between the tv's speakers and the 5760's speakers. Setting delay between 80ms and 120ms on the 5760 (I keep delay at 100ms it sounds just right) gets rid of the echo. The 100ms delay also gets rid of the visual lip synch I notice using the HD850 with HDMI and audio sent to the 5760 with optical cable (I have not tried it with component cables).

In summary same amount of delay needed by the 5760 (100ms) between the HD850 and Sir-160 outputting video to the 6168 at 1080i, and sending audio directly from the HD850 and Sir-160 to the 5760. Anything sent to the 6168 using the 6168's speaker doesn't have a lip synch issue unless it's from the source ie Discover HD on Directv (not the 6168's fault). If you send sound from the 6168 back to the 5760 no delay is needed. However the only DD5.1 you will get is from air or cable using the 6168's built in tuner. The HDMI input only appears to accept 2.0 audio.

Good comments! That's interesting. So the set can process the video signal and delay the audio appropriately for its optical out, but since it only passes 2.0 audio from the optical, that sort of makes it useless, it seems... right?

It seems to me that even lower end Yamaha receivers (the HTR-5730 or 5830 which are only $150-$200) can add up to 100ms delays, so that looks promising if this turns out to be an issue on all of the sets.
post #668 of 12092
Clorox, 6168 will output 5.1 but only from its own air and cable tuners (probably cable card also I would guess). The problem is the HDMI only supports 2.0 input.

I wonder what the firewire inputs are capable of passing. I dont know of any firewire devices except for my video camera which is only 2.0. I think some HD vcr's use firewire but I don't own one. If anyone knows of any firewire devices, besides video camera's, let me know please. I tried looking on the internet but could not find anything. Whats the point of D-net on the tv if supporting devices are not being sold.
post #669 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by spear View Post

It looks like 1:1 mapping is possible on the VGA input (Wide PC mode). I displayed a simple alternating black/white grid and started increasing the picture size using the TV's control. When it reached the maximum size, the b/w grid "snapped" into place and everything was a little sharper. There is overscan at this size, of course -- ~35-45 pixels on the left and right and ~20-30 pixels on the top and bottom.

I then tried displaying the same grid through HDMI/DVI (which is apparently at 1920x1080i). There is no picture size adjusment but it seems the overscan is even greater and there is no 1:1 pixel mapping because there are artifacts in the grid image. Since I'm not sure what the video card/driver is really doing, this HDMI result may be suspect. I won't really have anything else that can drive the HDMI input so I'd be interested in what other people find. However, I've also found that when I play a 1080i feed through the HTPC-VGA and compare it to the same feed playing through the built-in tuner, there is slightly more overscan with the built-in tuner.

Here are three pictures: 1.) VGA with no overscan, 2) VGA at maximum picture size, 3) HDMI. (Sorry about the crappy quality of the pictures but I think you can still see the grid and it's clearly best in picture 2.)

Well, Spear, you rock! Thank you so much for this post. Can you please tell us a little bit more:

1) What HTPC did you use? Is it Media Center 2005 by any chance?
2) What video card and what driver do you have? If it's nVidia, did you use the option to treat monitor as HDTV at 1080?
3) What happens when you try the 4:3 setting on Samsung's PC input?

You are getting about 5% overscan horizontally and vertically with Wide PC once the picture "locks-in". If this is the lowest possible overscan, I am still going to be happy with it. I wonder if the inappropriately (?) labeled 4:3 setting on the PC input can produce slightly lower overscan.

Again, thanks a bunch for taking the time to evaluate this key feature. Great news, indeed.
post #670 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by moss312 View Post

1) I have over the air running directly to the 6168. The 6168 is outputting via optical cable to a Yamaha 5760 = no lag, audio does not echo when using speakers on both the tv and the 5760.

2) 3) 4) Outputting at 1080i on both Directv Samsung Sir-160 and Samsung HD850 I hear an echo between the tv's speakers and the 5760's speakers. Setting delay between 80ms and 120ms on the 5760 (I keep delay at 100ms it sounds just right) gets rid of the echo. The 100ms delay also gets rid of the visual lip synch I notice using the HD850 with HDMI and audio sent to the 5760 with optical cable (I have not tried it with component cables).

In summary same amount of delay needed by the 5760 (100ms) between the HD850 and Sir-160 outputting video to the 6168 at 1080i, and sending audio directly from the HD850 and Sir-160 to the 5760. Anything sent to the 6168 using the 6168's speaker doesn't have a lip synch issue unless it's from the source ie Discover HD on Directv (not the 6168's fault). If you send sound from the 6168 back to the 5760 no delay is needed. However the only DD5.1 you will get is from air or cable using the 6168's built in tuner. The HDMI input only appears to accept 2.0 audio.

From item #1 above it sounds like when both the video and audio signal come into the 6168 in synch, whatecer video processing the 6168 does it ends up outputting the video and audio at the same time. You would expect this.

From item #2 above it looks like when a STB (Sir-160) is used to sned video to the 6168 and audio to the AVR, that the sound comes out of the AVR first. Because delaying it fixes the echo. In this case it also looks like the 6168 is correctly processing the audio and video input and synching them correctly for the video processing delay. The problem is that when the separate audio signal goes from the STB to the AVR, it gets output immediately, and time is not allowed for the video processing that the 6168 is doing on the signal.

I don't think that you can fault the 6168 for that, especially since it handles incoming video and audio correctly internally. It's only when the audio takes a path not through the 6168 that there is a problem.

It's almost like now that TV's are doing "so much" processing of the incoming video, that a system needs to be devised whereby the external AVR can somehow be "told" by the TV how long to delay the sound for. Back when no video processing was done by TV's this was a complete non-issue. In my case, and probably most others, my STB feeds the video to my TV and the audio to the AVR which drives the speakers. My TV is never used for outputting audio.

I don't envy you Clorox, trying to debug the situation by getting information from multiple sources, some of which may not have the technical knowledge to make sure what they are reporting in necessarily correct or not, no offense intended. Probably the best way to accurately test this is by setting the TV up in a lab, and using multiple sources, into the various TV inputs, and generate a comprehensive report. Even beyond the level of testing done by your typical A/V magazines.

I would think that Samsung would have done this level of testing and has the results. If nothing else, I would think they might want to provide a warning in the users manual that routing audio through an external path might require an AVR capable of putting delays in. They certainly know how long the video processing takes, but I don't know if that is in the manual or not. And it certainly could vary by source depending on the incoming data format.

I'm not an owner but have been following the thread to see how the computer input is working. I'm thinking of getting the Sony 50A10 for use primarily as a computer monitor as I have no HD feed.

Having spent a lot of time debugging hardware issues this entire discussion seems more like being at work than enjoying a new TV

Robert
post #671 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by spear View Post

It looks like 1:1 mapping is possible on the VGA input (Wide PC mode). ...

Great!

How does text look with the desktop at 1920x1080 60Hz,
wondering how smoothpicture compares to say an LCD monitor, is the text soft ?

Also, how does 1280x720p look over VGA via the PC,
and other resolutions, does the set scale well?

What about focus in the center vs the edges?
post #672 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthJersey View Post

actually there is good evidence, that on the sammy 720p models, the lip sync issues were present when the incoming feed did not match the tv's native res. Therefore 480i and 480p feeds had lip sync issues because the tv's circuitry had to upscale the image to 720p. Samsung even confirmed this issue.

I think video delay is more complex. For example in my setup I can consistently induce video delay by inputting 480i over component from my SA 8300 HD into my HLP. I get no noticeable delay on 480p, 720p or 1080i inputs. I also get delay from by SD Tivo via s-video. However, I do not get any noticeable video delay from the 480i via component input from my old Pioneer DV-525, which significantly predates progressive scan DVD players.

I believe that 100ms of delay will be adequate for the vast majority of video delay issues. I was told by Samsung tech support that the original HLNs were speced to have no more than 60 ms of delay and that the "fix" would lower that spec to 40 ms. At the time some AVS members actually measured the delay up to 90ms, but there were some reports of occasional delays much greater than that.

Of course, all the above assumes that there is no mismatch between the video and audio from the source.
post #673 of 12092
This might sound like a basic question but can you look at the PIP using both HDMI inputs? How many inputs can you look at concurrently with PIP?

I have considered getting a cable card and a cable box, will the cable card allow HD viewing?
post #674 of 12092
Here is an article from Audioholics from over a year ago. Pretty much gets exactly to the issue we are discussing here...What I take from it? Buy a Yamaha, Denon, HK etc. receiver if you need a new receiver.

Audio Lip Sync - The Next Big Feature?
Receivers that Help Your Audio and Video to Sync on Newer Digital Displays
By: Clint DeBoer
4/23/2004
In the "good ole days" of pre-HD CRT displays, audio and video processing took about the same amount of time resulting in almost no significant delay problems. Back then, no one had to worry about video taking longer to process than the audio that was being heard. Fast forward to HDTV and the era of video scalers, deinterlacing, and 2:3 pull-down and you are entering a time when video frequently takes longer than the previously 'acceptable' <16.6 milliseconds (1/2 video frame, or one field in interlaced systems).

What Does it All Mean?
With the new digital televisions and improved video processing it is becoming more frequent to have fixed delays in video that make the audio appear to be ahead of the picture by as much as 4 frames (133.3ms). This is not to be confused with inherent delay problems coming from the cable or satellite company's transmissions (which can only compound the problem). In addition to this, some digital technologies, like direct view LCD televisions already have inherent delays of as much as 15-20 milliseconds, prior to any video processing. Some plasma screens even need to put data into internall memory before displaying picture, which can result in 20-60 milliseconds of delay.

Compounding this problem even further is the potential for varying delay times associated with what scaling or deinterlacing functions of video processing are engaged at any particular time (switching from 480p to 1080i inputs for example).
Mid-priced and higher-end displays already come with audio delay circuitry built in to match the audio and video signals and prevent lip sync. Unfortunately, many lower-end models do not, and even the higher end units do not account for the problems that occur when you route audio through a home theater processor or receiver.

Identifying the Problem
We have not yet thoroughly tested out the various setup DVDs to see if they address lip-sync issues as of yet, but you should be able to notice a consistent audio delay where the audio appears to be behind the video picture. At the very least you should look at your screen and feel that something is "off". We'll be providing updates in the future with a means for accurately testing and addressing this issue once the proper tools for doing so (other than your eyes and ears) are confirmed.

How to Solve the Problem
Solving the problem will best be accomplished on the shoulders of the processor/receiver manufacturers. Since the video processing cannot be made faster (at least not until the technologies improve over time) the audio companies will need to provide a means of delaying audio to compensate. For now, a global lip-sync delay should be enough as most people onl have one monitor in their rooms (I won't be presumptuous at this point and take issue that some of us have projectors as well as HDTV televisions.) Look for at least 100ms delay capability. Here are some current manufacturers who provide lip sync delay for their processors and receivers:

Yamaha
Denon
Harman Kardon
Rotel
Arcam

Alternatively, DVD manufacturers can help the problem by providing players that have A/V sync options as well, though this is a less desired solution as it does not help with broadcasts originating from other sources. There are several manufacturers offering lip-sync delay on their DVD players.

Summary
This is a real problem, and one that is starting to rear its ugly head more and more as digital displays are gobbled up by the consumer (many of them towards the low-end pricepoints). Our suggestion to manufacturers is that they take this seriously and give the user easy access to lip sync delay right from a hard button on the remote control. This is something that needs to be easily accessed, and not hidden in a 7-layer menu system. With what we've seen from Yamaha (RX-V1400/2400 & Z9) and Denon (AVR-3805) and Harman Kardon (AVR 430/630) it looks like the manufacturers are on the ball and aware of this important issue.
post #675 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdv5 View Post

1) What HTPC did you use? Is it Media Center 2005 by any chance?

It is a Linux (Fedora Core 4) system running MythTV.
Quote:


2) What video card and what driver do you have? If it's nVidia, did you use the option to treat monitor as HDTV at 1080?

It's a Gigabyte/nVidia 6600 card and I'm using nVidia's 0.7174 drivers. These drivers have an option to set the "TV standard" to HD1080i or HD1080p but I think it's for the component output. Since I'm using VGA, I did not try that option.
Quote:


3) What happens when you try the 4:3 setting on Samsung's PC input?

Then the picture shrinks horizontally. Bad for 1920x1080 but good for 800x600 or other 4:3 resolutions.
Quote:


You are getting about 5% overscan horizontally and vertically with Wide PC once the picture "locks-in". If this is the lowest possible overscan, I am still going to be happy with it. I wonder if the inappropriately (?) labeled 4:3 setting on the PC input can produce slightly lower overscan.

I'm not sure what you mean. With the default settings of Wide PC mode, I got no overscan (actually some underscan) but no 1:1 mapping. I don't think there's a way to get both without adjusting the optics. I prefer to have the 1:1 mapping and can live with the overscan since most video content expects it and for computer use, I can compensate by having a slightly smaller desktop size.
Quote:


Again, thanks a bunch for taking the time to evaluate this key feature. Great news, indeed.

I was pleasantly surprised with the quality of the VGA input. I had been concerned because of the lack of HDMI 1080p and because I wasn't very happy with VGA compared to DVI-D on my LCD flat-panel monitor. I haven't even tried using a high quality VGA cable yet. One issue is that many of the picture controls are disabled for VGA input. I have not done any calibration to see if this is going to be a problem.

I am a little bit puzzled about the apparent scaling going on with the built-in tuner and the HDMI input, though. I hope people can do some tests on these.
post #676 of 12092
Clorox, Thanks that is the article I was looking for.

I have slight video lag on everything. It is marginally objectionable for me. My guess is that most people wouldn't find it objectionable. I confirmed it by using the echo test. There is little or no lag when using the TV speakers. Having both the TV speakers and the surround speakers on at the same time, creates a distinct echo, which verifies there is a time difference.

Output/Connection Video lag
TV 6168
DVR SFA 8300 480p component yes
1080i component yes
1080i HDMI yes
DVD player Sony DVP-S560D 480i component yes

I am using an optical cable to drive the surround system. I used standard red & white audio cables for the TV except for HDMI, where it's not necessary.

This subject is really an old one and is common among most if not all manufactures. The more video processing being done the worse it will be.

This is from Samsung's FAQ: If the sound and video are unsynchronized, it's highly likely you have either a DLP TV or a TV connected to a Home Theater System (HTS). Solutions for this problem for both are presented below.
Unsynchronized Sound And Video With DLP TVs
If the sound on your DLP TV is out of sync with your picture and the TV is not connected to a home theater system, a Samsung technician can adjust the sound synch function on the TV so that the sound and picture are in synch.
To arrange a service call to adjust the sound synch function, call Samsung Customer Care at 1-800-SAMSUNG (1-800-726-7864).
Unsynchronized Sound And Video With Home Theater Systems
If the sound on your TV - and this can be any kind of TV - is out of synch with your picture and you are using a home theater system (HTS), things become more difficult. In many setups, the television signal comes into a set top box. The set top box audio output is connected directly to the HTS and the set top box video output is connected directly to the TV. Consequently, the audio portion of the signal is sent directly to the HTS without passing through the TV, and the video portion of the signal is sent directly to the TV without passing through the HTS. The two signals are separated, processed at different rates, and cannot be synched by adjusting the sound synch function in the TV.
If your system is set up as described above, you still may be able to resolve the sound synch problem. Check your HTS user's manual to see if your HTS has a Sound Delay function. If it does, you may be able to adjust the Sound Delay so that the sound and picture are in synch.
If your HTS does not have a Sound Delay function, you may be able to purchase an audio delay device, such as the Felston DD540, that you can put into your system between the set top box and the HTS. You should be able to adjust the audio delay device so that the sound and picture are in synch.
post #677 of 12092
can an ISF tech correct these audio delays in the tv system settings ? I wonder is there is a hidden setting to turn off DNiE
post #678 of 12092
Just got my 6168 today. I just noticed that the manual that shipped with the unit was for the xx67 series. Everyone else get the right manual?
post #679 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthJersey View Post

can an ISF tech correct these audio delays in the tv system settings ?

That's not their job.

There is an audio delay setting in the SM but it only effects sound from the TV.

Quote:


I wonder is there is a hidden setting to turn off DNiE

It may be possible for an ISF calibrator to minimize DNIe using a combination of settings. No one has found an on/off switch for DNIe in the SM.
post #680 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by bakken View Post

Just got my 6168 today. I just noticed that the manual that shipped with the unit was for the xx67 series. Everyone else get the right manual?

My 6168 came today as well, and My owner's manual states HLR6168W.

I've got it set up with my TW CAble SA 8300HD DVR using component and the picture quality is amazing...can't wait to get an HDMI cable and see what the improvement looks like, I can't imagine it getting better!

SD stuff looks pretty good too.

My kids are currently playing xbox hooked up to the tv via the xbox hd component pack and using wireless controllers - no lag at all between movements on the controllers vs what you see on the screen - happens just like it should.

No problems with lip synch, but I'm not splitting the audio out to a reciever (yet).

Everyone still waiting for their sammy to show up should be VERY excited, this is one amazing looking set!

Kyle
post #681 of 12092
OK, maybe I posted a little too soon about the lag with the xbox controllers on the 6168.

My kids were playing Lego Star Wars, not a true FPS, but enough action that we thought we'd notice it if there was any lag. We didn't notice any. Later my teenage son put in Halo 2 and we played multiplayer thru 480p...definite lag, but nothing that we both couldn't adjust to after a few rounds. we even tried using a wired controller and found that the lag wasn't as pronounced as with a wireless, but still there.

After some experimentation we discovered that as long as you don't whip the joystick from one side to another, the lag isn't so bad....move your character with the joystick a little more carefully and the lag seems to almost disappear...hard to really explain until you try it yourself.

This does not in any way make me sorry for getting this TV. My kids and I are frequent gamers and will get much enjoyment from it, even though we might have to adjust the way we play slightly. This does not take away at all from the fact that THE PICTURE and CLARITY were AMAZING!!!

Hope this helps some of you xboxer's looking for answers.

Kyle
post #682 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by bakken View Post

Just got my 6168 today. I just noticed that the manual that shipped with the unit was for the xx67 series. Everyone else get the right manual?

It appears that the "Quick Start Manual" is for the 67 series while the thicker "real" manual is for the 68. At least that I what I received. A tiny bit annoying but what the heck at least we got the set.
post #683 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackLT View Post

How does text look with the desktop at 1920x1080 60Hz,
wondering how smoothpicture compares to say an LCD monitor, is the text soft ?

I don't think it's as sharp as an LCD flat panel but it's still pretty good even with small fonts from a distance. Considering I'm normally farther from the TV than from a monitor (even accounting for screen size), I'd probably want to increase the font sizes if I had to do any extended computer work.
Quote:


Also, how does 1280x720p look over VGA via the PC,
and other resolutions, does the set scale well?

I have not tried this. Currently, the video card is doing the scaling for 720p content. I'll probably try and check it out this week.
Quote:


What about focus in the center vs the edges?

I didn't notice anything obvious but I would probably have to pay more attention. Are there any good 1920x1080 test patterns for checking focus and distortion?
post #684 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clorox View Post

It seems to me that even lower end Yamaha receivers (the HTR-5730 or 5830 which are only $150-$200) can add up to 100ms delays, so that looks promising if this turns out to be an issue on all of the sets.

Actually, it looks like the 5830 doesn't have this feature, but the 5840 does.

I was originally thinking I would just wait and see if there were delay problems with the 6168, and then buy an add-on delay box then. But there are some nice features on these Yamahas that my existing receiver (a Kenwood VR-607 that came with an HTIB) doesn't have (like mapping different audio and video inputs separately), so I may just spring for one anyway...
post #685 of 12092
I got my HLR6178W today and set it up to a few inputs so far.

The set looks great! It is definitely more attractive to my eye than the HLM/HLN/HLP sets. I like the glossy black bezel. I don't like the small "pedestal" underneath and likely will remove this soon. I'd imagine it is attached with screws.

I had an HLN617w before and had lots of lag problems. So far, with minimal testing, I don't notice lag on HD Comcast from a Motorola 6412 or cable through a Replay TV. I've yet to test OTA HD, cable not through a box, games or PC inputs yet.
post #686 of 12092
Don't forget, that Samsung has had delay settings in the service menu dating back to the lipsynch fix for the HLN series (a firmware upgrade and digital board swap). The very nice local Samsung tech told me he updated many sets and most people were satisfied with the result. There were very few recalls for more fixes. Sure he is a Samsung employee, but my gut says he was being honest.

Thus, those with delay problems perhaps should look in the service menu first. I recall three different delay settings on my set after the lipsynch fix.
post #687 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by rictus View Post

Actually, it looks like the 5830 doesn't have this feature, but the 5840 does.

I was originally thinking I would just wait and see if there were delay problems with the 6168, and then buy an add-on delay box then. But there are some nice features on these Yamahas that my existing receiver (a Kenwood VR-607 that came with an HTIB) doesn't have (like mapping different audio and video inputs separately), so I may just spring for one anyway...

I think your plan is a wise one. I.e., if one is thinking about/needing a new AVR, then it is certainly wise to get one that allows for a variable delay. If one already has a relatively new one that one is satisfied with, then adding the Felston box is good alternative. The latter is ~ $230, so everybody can make the calculation about which way they perfer to go. Either way, to me at least, I think we can bury the 'lip sync' problem and call it effectively eliminated.
post #688 of 12092
Problem with HLR 6178W on setup!

Upon initial setup, the set turned on normally to the TV Guide setup screen. Within a minute the set turned itself off spontaneously with the lamp indicator blinking.

After this, I could not turn the set on again. The lamp and temp/standby lights were blinking indicating a problem with the lamp door. I was also worried about the lamp as it had just been shipped from wherever. (Interesting note- the set was manufactured in Mexico!) I unplugged the set and took the lamp assembly out and inspected it. The lamp door was solidly closed and the lamp looked pristine. Plugging things back in myself with great care didn't change anything. Now I was scared.

One more time into the lamp area didn't initially reveal anything. I next inspected the switch which must be pushed up by the lamp door. I took it out and found that the small wire end header plugged into the adjacent board was not snapped in completely. A satisfying click later and the set is up and running!

So, check those switches if you run into the same situation.
post #689 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

I think we can bury the 'lip sync' problem and call it effectively eliminated.

Seeing as the user would be required to spend an additional $230 on top of already spending $3000+ for a "state of the art TV", I don't think we can say that.
post #690 of 12092
Quote:
Originally Posted by Failsafe View Post

I got my HLR6178W today and set it up to a few inputs so far.

I don't like the small "pedestal" underneath and likely will remove this soon. I'd imagine it is attached with screws.

Welcome to the club! I think the pedestal comes off with two screws in the back and a couple of push in clips on the back also. Haven't taken mine off yet but plan to. Enjoy the set.
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