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New NHT Classic line to replace Super Audio - Page 348

post #10411 of 10792
They sell dry sand at Lowes/Home depot, yes. If you're putting in bags, you can basically use anything that heavy and dense.
post #10412 of 10792
Perfect, thanks! What is the most cost effective way of filling them?
post #10413 of 10792
Well, litter, sand, and pea gravel are all pretty cost-effective. If you were close to me, I'd give you some gravel. I have a half bucket in the garage. But, it's cheap anyway.
post #10414 of 10792
post #10415 of 10792
post #10416 of 10792
Perfect, I didn't see any of this when I was at my local HD but it looks like there is plenty in stock.
post #10417 of 10792
I didn't fill mine, I don't have any kids or pets to contend with so they are relatively safe.
post #10418 of 10792
That's actually pretty cool that these stands have a separate channel for the wire. Most are just holes on the top and bottom to run wire through (at least when I was in the market for them, haven't bought some in a while).
post #10419 of 10792
Yeah they are very well made, a bit pricey but a good investment I think.
post #10420 of 10792
Yes they are well made. As far as price, it's actually not bad. In the past (10-20 years) stands of that quality actually ran in the $300/pr range. The one's I'm using (no longer available) ran me close to $300/pr and are not any better than the VPI ones. I had some from VPI, Lovan, and Sanus before. Sanus stands have the same build quality of VPI and are the ones that NHT sells, but their all good (I think they just wanted to sell a version they knew would work with the Classic's rails). I know some folks who use blu-tak (just 2 small 'balls' on each end of each rail) to keep the speaker more firmly planted to the stand. I don't have any pets, so not an issue and my 7 yo son is very good with the equipment (I even set up a system in his room because he's good with it and he love music). Speakers in his room are up higher though, not because of him but because of his friends...
post #10421 of 10792
I don't feel as bad about splurging then biggrin.gif

That is a good point about the blu-tac, my surrounds have feet on the bottom so they do a good job of keeping them secure, but I could see how it would be smart with the NHT Classics.
post #10422 of 10792
Will that blu-tac stuff leave any marks or residue on the speakers?

I don't have any kids but we have nieces and nephews. We have 2 fairly large dogs 90lb Doberman and 60lb English Bulldog. When they get to playing watch out!
post #10423 of 10792
Originally Posted by Randall.White View Post

Will that blu-tac stuff leave any marks or residue on the speakers?

I don't have any kids but we have nieces and nephews. We have 2 fairly large dogs 90lb Doberman and 60lb English Bulldog. When they get to playing watch out!

Them some big dogs!

Anyway, the blu-tac won't leave residue. But, in the case of the Classics, they won't even touch the speaker, just the railings (squish four small marble size balls under four points on the railings). They'll be more stable, but not knock proof - especially against something like a big dog slamming against it. You may want to fill your stands just to make them heavy - looks like you were already on that path.
post #10424 of 10792
Oh yeah, they are good sized. Love it when people come over and are terrified of the Dobe but she is the sweetest girl ever. They know better than to get close to the entertainment center/speakers but just in case they bump it I'd like some extra piece of mind.

How much power can Classic 3's handle? I haven't ran Audessey yet but I plugged one speaker in and it was noticeably quieter.
post #10425 of 10792
Reminds me of one of my friends with a Great Dane - looks scary but just a big teddy bear and loves kids.

The Threes can handle 150w RMS. IIRC, you had horn loaded speakers which are usually extremely sensitive so require much less power. This would be the reason the Threes seem quieter. You'll need to run Audyssey after installing the Classics and that will 'normalize' the volume (Audyssey normalizes the volume so that at '0' you are at the 85db reference with peaks hitting 105db.

For most folks in normal rooms, they are using at most 10-20 watts/channel (with your horn loaded speakers, that can be as low as 1 - 5 watts/speaker, remember the old Klipshorns, they could hit 105db with 1 watt!!!).

So, for your room, after setting up and running Audyssey. listen to your normal material at your listening level - it should be just fine (you have the Denon AVR3313 which has enough power for the Classics). Now, if you are playing at reference levels and you are getting clipping (unlikely in most homes, but if you have a large room or heavily damped), then you may need an outboard amp with a little more power. My room is very heavily treated with broadband traps (plus some high/mid freq traps in several areas) so at reference I did need a bit more power and added the Emotiva XPA3. Another reason is I also needed more amplification to run 11.1, and thought I'd just off load the front three speakers to another amp . At regular listening levels though, the XPA3 is not really needed (especially if I was not running all 11 channels). But, at reference levels, especially with multi-channel SACDs/DVDA or movies with a lot of sound effects, then I can tell in my room.

Here is a calculator for SPL vs Power needed if you want to get an estimate (again, this is an estimate as speaker placement, room furnishings to include carpet and drapes, and room treatment if you are doing that will make a difference).

post #10426 of 10792
Awesome, thanks for the help. My room is pretty big 20x19'. I don't fully understand the wall treatments, do they make some that are living room suitable? or in better words, wife approved? The layout is odd because of all the windows so the speakers will be placed somewhat close together, about 7'. Our listening area is roughly 9' from the speakers, maybe 10'.

So the XPA-3 would be plenty of power for these? I was thinking about ordering one since they're on sale still. Not sure how often Emotiva has sales?
post #10427 of 10792

Your AVR may be all the power you need, you won't know until you run Audyssey and then see if your AVR clips at all while listening to your material. If you are within the specifications of your AVR, adding an amp will make no difference in your sound. If you are having problems with not having enough power, then adding the XPA-3 could fit the bill, but keep in mind that to increase the volume 3db requires double the power. So, you won't even be doubling the power from your AVR.

But, having said that, the sale prices are very good right now and if money is not an issue, I'd jump at the sale (I have in the past).

As for acoustical treatments, there are lots of sites that can make custom versions (you can upload a picture and that will become your panel). That way you can get wife approval first. Making your own is not that hard, but will take some work. Purchasing them can be quite costly. There is a thread here at AVS dedicated to acoustical treatment:


Here are some sites that are good to purchase treatments:







This is not an exhaustive list, there are more. But many of these have a great reputation.
post #10428 of 10792
Hello all! I am in the process of deciding what to upgrade in my audio setup. I am currently using a Yamaha 861 receiver, NHT VT-2/VS-2 speakers with HDP-1 surrounds and a Parasound HCA-1200ii amp driving the built-in subs. I was thinking about replacing my Yamaha with a Marantz SR-7008. I am wondering though, would upgrading my speakers to Classic 4's & 3's would be a more noticeable improvement? Has anyone here had both of these? How long can I expect my VT-2/VS-2's to last? Thanks.
post #10429 of 10792

I can vouch for the Classic 4 & 3's being able to best the VT-2's. They are much more dynamic and have a much larger sound stage then the VT series. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the difference. Even if you kept your current AVR, you would hear the improvement, but upgrading the AVR with one that has the newer Audyssey Room Correction would be a step up.
post #10430 of 10792
Thanks! Yeah it's hard to decide what to upgrade first. The speakers are much older, but new speakers would cost A LOT more than a receiver. I really like the Marantz SR-7008 (especially since NHT recommends it) and I would love to hear what XT32 would do!
post #10431 of 10792
XT32 is nothing short of amazing compared to regular XT. Yes, it's hard to make a choice of which one to purchase. The new AVR would make your current speakers sound like a totally different system. But, so will the new speakers. If you AVR is very old, that may be the one to replace first since a newer one will work with all the newest codecs and has very good room correction.
post #10432 of 10792
Yeah my receiver is HDMI 1.2 and no modern features and the oldest, most basic YPAO. I think the 7008 would be a great upgrade for my system soundwise and features. Hopefully my speakers will last 5+ years longer.biggrin.gif
post #10433 of 10792
Originally Posted by mnc View Post

Yeah my receiver is HDMI 1.2 and no modern features and the oldest, most basic YPAO. I think the 7008 would be a great upgrade for my system soundwise and features. Hopefully my speakers will last 5+ years longer.biggrin.gif

They're still great speakers and can last more than 5+ years as long as the surrounds are intact (they are the things that can go bad in older speakers, especially foam based ones) and not driven beyond their limits. Good luck in your venture and keep us posted!
post #10434 of 10792
Once I run Audyssey is there a break in period of time where I should rerun it? Or am I good to go with the first time.

Got my stands today, they must of updated their design. They have welded support on top and bottom, so only way to fill it is just pour the sand into them. They are fairly heavy empty and have some serious spikes.
post #10435 of 10792

You should be pretty good to go. Having said that, speaker are mechanical devices and many believe that speaker surrounds and spiders have a 'break-in' period, but most well built speakers stay within their specifications from the time you purchased them (some have very stiff surrounds and spiders and even the manufacture recommends a break-in period). It really doesn't take long to re-run Audyssey if you feel like you need to.

Now, if you make any major changes to your room: move furniture, add or remove furniture, add or remove other furnishings (such as lamps), change art pieces that can change reflective properties, etc., then re-running Audyssey is probably a good choice. I'm one of those that do re-run Audyssey when there are changes to a room (that the speakers are in of course), even if fairly minor like adding/changing out a different guitar that is hanging in the room - they are different reflective surfaces. Even things such as Christmas - the living room really changes for 1 month. Do I re-run, yes I do. But, I do a network save on those AVR's that have that function (yours has that) so I can easily re-load the settings after we change it back. If you AVR is attached to your network, I highly recommend doing a network save to you computer. It can save a lot of headaches on re-naming inputs, assigning inputs, and re-running Audyssey if there were to be a glitch and you had to re-set the AVR's microprocessor (which would set it back to default settings). Sometimes things like power surges can cause an AVR to glitch (some have actually had all their settings, including calibration, wiped out with a power surge.

So, bottom line - it's up to you. I'm pretty anal about re-running a calibration if there are changes. Many are happy leaving it as is (especially if in a multi-use room where things will change on a daily basis, then there is no point).

It looks like they found a way to make your speaker stands cheaper as it's much easier just to weld than add screws and machine the threads. Like you stated, they are made of heavy steal so if you feel it's heavy enough you can leave it be. The spikes are great, once you adjust them, the stand becomes firmly mounted to the floor.

Enjoy your new system!!!biggrin.gif
post #10436 of 10792
Originally Posted by Randall.White View Post

Once I run Audyssey is there a break in period of time where I should rerun it? Or am I good to go with the first time.

If you believe in speaker break-in, or you're not quite happy with the sound after some quality time with them, go ahead and run another calibration. I thought my Threes sounded a little smoother after a couple few hours of use, but it may have been as much psychological as anything real. I had to tweak speaker positioning, avr settings, etc., quite a bit before I found the balance and sound I was looking for. That required re-running Audyssey a bunch. YMMV.

One caveat I'd recommend is to take sufficient time for your ears to adjust to each calibration and/or settings adjustment. I jumped the gun once and absolutely ruined a great set-up trying to eek out that last little bit of "performance." Took me a while to find it again.
post #10437 of 10792
^^^ I very much agree! A lot of folks not use to a calibrated system think they sound anemic due to them being used to large peaks in bass and treble regions (you've already used Audyssey, so should be used to a flatter response). Once use to a calibrated system, those that are not just don't sound right. You can always bump up the bass if you want it a bit hotter (do it in the AVR so that the calibration remains intact).

I also agree that speaker positioning is extremely important as defmoot states. You work on that first, with Audyssey off, and once you get it where is sounds the best, re- run Audyssey.
post #10438 of 10792
Thanks! I'm still waiting to bring them out. My local Wal-Mart didn't have any blue-tac stuff. So I'm waiting for that to arrive. Should be able to hook them up tomorrow.

So there is no harm done running Audyssey over and over? I know some people say there is a "break in period" and others don't. I've never owned this quality of speakers before, don't want to damage them.

* Once I get them hooked up, is there a song or movie that really show off how good they are? What do you guys recommend?
post #10439 of 10792

Blu-Tack is available from Amazon:


As far as running Audyssey over and over again, it's never an issue. Each time you run it and save, it re-writes over the old calibration and keeps the new one. If you want to 'keep' and older one, make you you do a Network Save of that calibration.

As for music and movies, there are numerous ones to use. Music is extremely subjective and something of personal taste. I have over 1000 CDs from most genres (Rock, Pop, Oldies, Classical, Jazz, World, Country, and others). So, it really matters on your taste. Having said that, I usually use, for music, a couple CD's that are recorded well and very dynamic (not highly compressed like a lot of CD's).

Kurt Bestor and Sam Cardon : Innovators


Sam Cardon: Digability

Also, I like Sting's "Brand New Day" album (have and SACD version).

Movies (BluRay versions), there are numerous (short list here):

Star Trek (Beginning & Into Darkness)
Die Hard (A Good Day to Die Hard)
Batman (The Dark Knight Rises)
Men in Black 3
Underworld (Awakening)
Flight of the Phoenix
Art of flight

Many others!!! Just chose one with a lot of dynamics and special effects.
post #10440 of 10792
Oblivion with Tom Cruise is one of the best new movies for dynamics and bass, a great way to see what your system is capable of. War of the Worlds and Black Hawk Down are two of my favorites, and as was mentioned Star Trek, primarily the second most recent one, is great.
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