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Owners Tweaks & Settings Sony KDSR-50/60XBR1 - Page 2

post #31 of 1646
dr_jason

Just a thought, but use the convergence grid that's designed for widescreen. The round circles are obviously stretched instead of being perfectly round indicates that you're using the wrong grid. Don't think it'll make any difference unless somehow the stretch mode is shifting the colors.

What's odd is that with chromatic abberation you are likely to have red to the inside and green to the outside. In the upper riight corner, you've got red to the left (not left and down) and green to the right (instead of on the right and on top).
post #32 of 1646
Thread Starter 
dr_jason: If it's not effecting normal viewing then I would ignore it. I don't have an Avai disk anymore or I would check mine for you. You could always take your grid to a store and run it there to see if a little CA is normal.
post #33 of 1646
Dumb question, But I remember even my stupid old Pioneer Big Screen had convergence adjustments back in like..96? Cant these companies build in some type of convergence adjusting feature in a Sony RPTV, are they single gun as well like the DLP? Maybe its not that easy a feature to have on this.

My thought of seeing that green shift that looks way too much for me to be acceptable but perhaps this is within the normal realms of shift, or, maybe like poster said just being in the widescreen mode is throwing it out of wacky.
post #34 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by HomeGuy View Post

dr_jason: If it's not effecting normal viewing then I would ignore it. I don't have an Avai disk anymore or I would check mine for you. You could always take your grid to a store and run it there to see if a little CA is normal.

I agree, but there some more going on here. Whatever is causing his problem needs to be fixed. It may very well not be the TV. We just don't know yet.
post #35 of 1646
The color decoder check in Avia showed no "red push" in my pro mode after I adjusted everything. I didn't try it for vivid or natural, but I would bet that they also have little or no red push.
post #36 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_jason View Post

Well, looking at it closely tonight, it looks like the green is off by a little to the right and there is some CA on the left lower area but ever so slightly. This what it looks like in the upper right part of screen.

The amount you have seems to be very slight and I doubt that it could impact your viewing on normal material at a normal distance. That being said, I checked mine this morning and see significantly less than you show in your picture. If I look very close I can barely see some green in the bottom left square.
post #37 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

I agree, but there some more going on here. Whatever is causing his problem needs to be fixed. It may very well not be the TV. We just don't know yet.

I'll try that tonight. I didn't think it would make a difference but certainly worth a try. To the naked eye, it looks like green is off to the right, or red and blue to the left. The color to the left of the white line is not red but more magenta (red+blue). In any event, if it is still there with the proper aspect conv screen, what I need to know is:

1) How common is it on Qualia's since it's been out longer? 1 out of 5, 1 out of 100. I would assume that % is small with its TOTL model. One could assume that the less expensive SXRDs are going to have some compromises.

2) Are early adopters of the baby SXRDs seeing it during this first round of TV's?

3) To what degree do they have it. I can see it when I have the Directv guide screen up, sitting several feet away. It is certainly harder with regular program viewing, but since I don't have a perfectly SXRD next to it, I don't know what I'm missing.

I don't think I would obsess about this as much if I didn't have a chance to just simply exchange it.
post #38 of 1646
Now onto tweaks of this set.

I spent some time with the SpyderTV and adjusting the grayscale with my 2910 (latest firmware) thru HDMI. I got most of the color out of it and will post that Bias/Gain adjustments when I double check it with another sensor. I hear it may not be the same for everybody but it is certainly worth a try. If ya don't like it, just hit the reset. It makes very little difference in the picture overall (perhaps because it starts out pretty good in Warm setting) but I am able to appreciate less flesh tone tinting in darker areas and tinted whites in bright areas.

I found that using the dvd player on both HDMI inputs to calibrate, the settings are not exactly the same. Very close, though. Very strange because I thought it would be exact. Could be the sensor accuracy, that's why I want to double check.

I still love the TV.
post #39 of 1646
Couple "tweak type" items from my playing around today. I'm using HDMI out of the HD Tivo for input to the SXRD. Discovered the following:

1). Get best picture by outputting the "native resolution". Use 720p for ABC, FOX, and ESPN. Use 480i for all standard definition. Use 1080i for the remainder. Definitely get a better picture with native resolution than letting the HD Tivo upscale everything to 1080i. This makes sense because it basically restricts the processing to one site, the Sony; instead of processing at both.

2). Used HDnet color bars as input for calibrating the HD Tivo/DirectTV feed. It should be better for that input than a 1080i, HDMI input from my Denon 2910. Granted, the Denon would provide better tools (i.e., Avia and DVE screens); but it would be fed from a different "box" and no two are the same. With the HDnet color bars I came up with the following (take these with a grain of salt because my wife demands "color"--although colors are accurate/in balance with good skin tones):
Mode Pro
Iris 4
Picture 58
Brightness 46
Color 38
Hue 0
Sharpness 21
Color Warm
NR Off
Direct Off
Game Off
Advanced Video
DRC CineMotion
DRC Palette Custom 1 (as is, need to play with this later)
BN Smoother Off
Advanced Iris 2
Color Corr. Off
All remaining Off
White Balance No Change

Turning "off" most of the above items provided a more "film like" image. However, as you can guess from seeing the settings, the image has strong color, strong contrast, and is still bright. Great blacks and shadow detail.

New subject. With the Avia convergence screens, I had a very small hint of color in the bottom left box. With the HDNet convergence screen from the HD Tivo, I had no color at all in the convergence screen. This hints that the source may have some small impact on minor amounts of color in the convergence screens.
post #40 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by rlb View Post


2). Used HDnet color bars as input for calibrating the HD Tivo/DirectTV feed. .

I have the HDnet color bars recorded on my SA8300. How did you fine tune the colors using it (eyeball, color filters, other?)?

Thanks,
post #41 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by rlb View Post

....

New subject. With the Avia convergence screens, I had a very small hint of color in the bottom left box. With the HDNet convergence screen from the HD Tivo, I had no color at all in the convergence screen. This hints that the source may have some small impact on minor amounts of color in the convergence screens.

When/how are you able to see those tests patterns on HDnet? I'd like to double check to make sure it is not a source issue for me. I can see CA when I look at lines on the Guide menu on D* tv.
post #42 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_jason View Post

When/how are you able to see those tests patterns on HDnet? I'd like to double check to make sure it is not a source issue for me. I can see CA when I look at lines on the Guide menu on D* tv.

I had previously recorded/retained the segment for future use. Maybe it is still on. I just copied the following from a 10/6 posting on the Tivo Forum: "The HDNet test pattern doesn't show up as its own stand alone 10 minute program until sometime on Monday. Just make a note to look for it on Monday, and you can schedule it. Or, just set a manual recording from 8:00-8:10 am ET on Tuesday."

Good luck. I've retained it on my Tivo because it is the only tool I have available for calibrating that input.
post #43 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by AkaStp View Post

With this configuration (HDMI from HD Tivo to SXRD) you are not getting audio from the HD Tivo through your TV speakers unless you turn off DD in the HD Tivo, right?
I'm doing the same kind of thing, especially for SD. Too bad the HD Tivo doesn't have a native passtrough mode like the Samsung TS360 D*HD receiver does so can avoid having to change resolutions (I use the Up arrow button).

I've also run a parallel connection using S-Video from the HD Tivo to the Video-1 input of the SXRD so I can configure that Video-1 input appropriately for 480i whereas if you use just the HDMI input you have shared settings for 480i/720p/1080i and so your 480i signal gets the same picture settings applied as for the 720p/1080i signals. As the HR10-250 has just the one set of audio out (RCA) connectors I got a piggyback cable from Radio Shack.

I never use my TV speakers, so I'm no expert regarding turning off DD. But, your understanding sounds correct to me.

In my "playing around" today, it didn't appear to be a problem with shared settings for video 6. My picture looked fine for each of the formats. This may not be valid; but I downsized the Hdnet test patterns to 480i and found that my calibration settings (originally done for the 1080i test patterns) were still valid in video 6 for picture, brightness, color, and sharpness.

However, I originally planned to do what you are doing, except I was going to run the 480i s-video signal through a lumagen outboard scaler and send it 1080i via component into video 4. I removed everything but the HDMI out for the HD Tivo after seeing the results. It also makes it easier because all you need to do is "toggle" for the appropriate format.
post #44 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by AUPigskin-- View Post

I have the HDnet color bars recorded on my SA8300. How did you fine tune the colors using it (eyeball, color filters, other?)?

Thanks,

I have filters that came with both my Avia and DVE.
post #45 of 1646
I should have previously mentioned, there are instructions for "Adjusting your Display with the HDNet Test Patterns" at the following site:

www.smartcalibration.com/hdnetpatterns.html
post #46 of 1646
Thread Starter 
Nice link rlb.
post #47 of 1646
OK, Here's what's going on. I had a Samsung HL-R5078 and took it back because I thought I could do better with a SXRD 50''. Well right now I am not to happy with it. The Sammy kind of wowed me where as the Sony is not. I have this kinda blueish green glow around objects (people, buildings, white type......). The TV is just not sharp is there a SM to go into, if so how. I have played with the settings and can't seem to get rid of it. Any thing any body can suggest would be very helpfull. I have it hooked up HDMI from my HR10-250
post #48 of 1646
duvy56 and AkaStp

Obviously something is up with both of you having the exact same TV with the same cable box come up with differing results.

As I put myself on the sidelines (for the time being), I would like to resolve some of the difference people are seeing.

If AkaStp could PM duvy56 his settings, that may be a start. If that doesn't work and if you both have fairly decent digital cameras, maybe we can figure out if its only a difference in expectations or if some copies of these TVs are actually softer than others.

duvy56, you might also want to verify that your cable box is outputting the correct resolution. Obviously, you don't want HD output at 480i and have the TV stretch it to 1080p. Seems like something similar to that happens fairly often with DVD players that once corrected make a substantial difference.

Maybe we can get to the bottom of this. (detective JimP on duty)
post #49 of 1646
Anyone else using DVI-->HDMI input for their HTPC's. I've seen in the other thread one owner claiming success at 1080P but then radio silent. Can others verify that 1080P over HDMI is possible on these new SXRD's...confirmation would be big news for the HTPC loving crowd. Also, a closeup picture of small (10~12pt) text running through at 1080P would be much appreciated.

thanks,

mv
post #50 of 1646
I too have the HD tivo and panasonic s97 set up to a 60" sxrd. The settings that I found to work best was at the start of this thread. starting at pro and making small adjustments, well you can reread it, but the biggest proformance increasement was from turning the cinemotion on. Maybe you can try that. For the HD Tivo I use 1080I for everything except fox and abc for which I use 720p. I have been especially pleased with the picture quality of this set. Also I found rlb settings abit too bright for my taste especially with a brightness of 46. Rlb thanks for posting your settings so we could try em out.
post #51 of 1646
OK, Upon further review there is definently a jagged edge to everthing witch makes everthing look blurry. Wide mode set to Full and HR10-250 is set to 1080i. Jagged edges are red on one edge and a blue green on the other. Any more ideas.
post #52 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by duvy56 View Post

OK, Upon further review there is definently a jagged edge to everthing witch makes everthing look blurry. Wide mode set to Full and HR10-250 is set to 1080i. Jagged edges are red on one edge and a blue green on the other. Any more ideas.

How about a picture of it if possible. I have some random questions. How does your DVD picture look. What are your settings? Put up a convergence pattern, are the white lines clean? Is the cinemotion option selected?

I have a color aberration/convergence issue on mine and I wonder if that's your issue as well. Mine has a very slight green to the right and magenta to the left.
post #53 of 1646
Anyone know how to adjust overscan on these sets? Is it the same as from the UMR tweaksfor the GWIII/IV?
post #54 of 1646
No not the same . It would be better to get a test DVD to do it as well.
post #55 of 1646
Well after looking at avia my set has some serious red push, I went in to the white balance section and adjusted R gain to -15 and R bias to -4 and all I can say is WOW, I thought this set had the best colors I've seen before and now it is unbelievable! Getting rid of the red push has allowed me to increase the color setting withoutfaces looking sunburn. The color saturation on this thing is sick! I am sure I don't have it 100% perfect but this should hold me over until I can get UMR to calibrate this beauty. Here are my settings calibrated with AVIA with a Denon 2900 at 480I

Iris 2
Pic 45
brightness 31
color 31
hue 0
sharp 35
warm
Cinemotion
custom 2 Reality 1 Clarity 1
BN smoother off
Advanced iris low
CC off
DTE low
CW off
DE off
BC low
GC off
post #56 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by G.B. View Post

No not the same . It would be better to get a test DVD to do it as well.

I have test DVD's (Avia and DVE), and I have the HDnet patterns. The service menu startup is the same, but I can't find the entries to change Horizontal/Vertical size/position.

Anyone know the category/item codes for these 4 settings?

Thanks!
post #57 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkv4 View Post

Well after looking at avia my set has some serious red push, I went in to the white balance section and adjusted R gain to -15 and R bias to -4 and all I can say is WOW, I thought this set had the best colors I've seen before and now it is unbelievable! Getting rid of the red push has allowed me to increase the color setting withoutfaces looking sunburn. The color saturation on this thing is sick! I am sure I don't have it 100% perfect but this should hold me over until I can get UMR to calibrate this beauty. Here are my settings calibrated with AVIA with a Denon 2900 at 480I

Iris 2
Pic 45
brightness 31
color 31
hue 0
sharp 35
warm
Cinemotion
custom 2 Reality 1 Clarity 1
BN smoother off
Advanced iris low
CC off
DTE low
CW off
DE off
BC low
GC off



There is no need to post the same thing in multiple threads.
post #58 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbMagFab View Post

I have test DVD's (Avia and DVE), and I have the HDnet patterns. The service menu startup is the same, but I can't find the entries to change Horizontal/Vertical size/position.

Anyone know the category/item codes for these 4 settings?

Thanks!

You can adjust the Horizontal overscan by going into the Game Mode.
But I think it is only available when used with the component inputs and
not available with hdmi inputs. Give it a try and let us know what you find.
post #59 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

There is no need to post the same thing in multiple threads.

Unfortunately, there are so many god damn threads about the SXRDs that it almost makes sense to post settings to the pertinent (if any) threads. I don't know why the "SXRD Oct/Nov" thread is still going...the set is here! We have an owner's thread (that has been neglected by Bombthroat...faq???) and a tweaks thread that's all over the place. It's frustrating as hell to try to find any information amidst the dozen or so threads and useful comments/posts get lost in the shuffle without exploration or answer. The result is that people start new threads that ask the questions that don't get answered in the main threads...either out of frustration or lack of patience, which then makes it even worse because there's yet another SXRD thread to pour over (can you say redundant?) covering the same info as the other threads. I don't know what the solution is, but it might start with the 2 basic threads...owners and tweakers. There'll certainly be some overlap with just two threads, but it must be better than 6 or 7 or 8 current SXRD threads...

J.
post #60 of 1646
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_jason View Post

How about a picture of it if possible. I have some random questions. How does your DVD picture look. What are your settings? Put up a convergence pattern, are the white lines clean? Is the cinemotion option selected?

I have a color aberration/convergence issue on mine and I wonder if that's your issue as well. Mine has a very slight green to the right and magenta to the left.

Don't have a digital camera. DVD looks crappy (Sony NS755V) hooked up with component. Sorry to say don't know what a convergence pattern is. I used the settings I read here. Yes cinemotion is selected. As this TV is now it is not watchable for the price paid. Suppose to talk to a UE Tech tomorrow.
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