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RS-MMMaxx questions - Page 10

post #271 of 540
[quote=pb_maxxx]ktaillon,

you can certainly use hardboard or sheet rock but you'll want to use an ultra pure white gloss paint as your basecoat. you'll also likely need to do some sanding before the final coat of basecoat to get it as smooth as possible before applying the topcoat mix.QUOTE]

So you don't sand the final coat of base -- only the second-to-last coat of base, right?

Also...

What's up with some people using SM as their base? I have 2 coats of UPW base on there now... what would be the benefit of putting some SM on there? I presume the advantage to SM is enhanced contrast, at the expense of color reproduction, maybe at the expense of gain?

I know I don't sand the final coat of RS. Am I supposed to sand any of the first few coats?
post #272 of 540
SoapySmith,

"So you don't sand the final coat of base -- only the second-to-last coat of base, right?"

that's absolutely correct.

"What's up with some people using SM as their base? I have 2 coats of UPW base on there now... what would be the benefit of putting some SM on there? I presume the advantage to SM is enhanced contrast, at the expense of color reproduction, maybe at the expense of gain?"

you would get enhanced contrast and slightly higher ambient viewing. black levels would slightly increase but at a small expense on white levels. for lower lumen pj's, gain would be decreased... but for higher lumen pj's which can more easily penetrate the semi-transparent topcoat and make efficient use of the metallics, a slight gain will result.

"I know I don't sand the final coat of RS. Am I supposed to sand any of the first few coats?"

for a better end result... consider also sanding the 2nd-to-last coat of RS.
post #273 of 540
Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post

SoapySmith,

"So you don't sand the final coat of base -- only the second-to-last coat of base, right?"

that's absolutely correct.

"What's up with some people using SM as their base? I have 2 coats of UPW base on there now... what would be the benefit of putting some SM on there? I presume the advantage to SM is enhanced contrast, at the expense of color reproduction, maybe at the expense of gain?"

you would get enhanced contrast and slightly higher ambient viewing. black levels would slightly increase but at a small expense on white levels. for lower lumen pj's, gain would be decreased... but for higher lumen pj's which can more easily penetrate the semi-transparent topcoat and make efficient use of the metallics, a slight gain will result.

"I know I don't sand the final coat of RS. Am I supposed to sand any of the first few coats?"

for a better end result... consider also sanding the 2nd-to-last coat of RS.

Okay, so if I want to use the SM base, is the recommended formula just straight SM over my current UPW, or should I mix the SM with the polycrylic? With an AE900 at 120", that should be enough lumens to get some gain out of the SM, no?
post #274 of 540
Pb,

I just purchased a infocus sp5000 and bought a oversized piece of drywall from my local builing supply. The drywall measured 120"x54". I cut it to size and painted with Behr SS. I do like the blacks but had to adjust my color levels cause of the blue push. I am very happy with the picture quality but........as always I am always striving for perfection! I know you get tired of repeating yourself but after reading for two whole days and about a thousand posts I am burned out and confused. I am going to try a BFLF. I am going to purchase a acrylic mirror and was wondering if you could post the best formula for my particular projector with fairly good ambient light control. Can the recipe be simple enough to take to home depot and have them just mix it for me? Thankyou for your time.


. Newbie!
post #275 of 540
@SoapySmith,

i recommend using a little bit of minwax polycrylic and water (about 4oz of each per quart)as a thinner/viscosity agent... regardless of whether you choose to go with a silver metallic base or a upw base. it prolongs the working time of the mix and aids in achieving a smoother finish from one coat to the next... which also results in less sanding time.

your AE900 at 120", that should be enough lumens to get some gain out of the SM. (don't skimp on the minwax polycrylic in your RS mix)

yes, you can put the delta silver metallic directly over the upw. you'll need to do a couple of coats for good coverage.
post #276 of 540
cluttered_mom,

as a newbie, and not having ever painted a mirror i presume, and if you don't have experience with spraying... i'd like to direct you away from black flame for the time being.

if you like SS and you're looking for something better... then i'd direct you to rs-maxxmudd instead. a number of changes have recently been made to it that maximize the gain relative to the amount of upw within the mix. unfortunately, there haven't been any screenshots posted of the most recent rs-maxxmudd mixes (the ones with a slightly higher concentration of metallics coupled with little to no deep base). as the deep base was hampering too of the gain and contrast of the metallics.

if you still want to do a black flame screen then i'd recommend using a white translucent #2447 acrylic... which is about $75-100 less than a mirror in the 120"x54".

the mix on the first page of the thread is the latest update. i've refined or re-allocated the components to other areas so that making a mix of the 'color components' is about as simple as i can make it. i still want to update the mix with an exact millimeter measurement for the pthalo blue.

home depot will not mix the components for you. you will have to do that yourself.
in any event, shoot me a pm and i can direct you through the process and give you all the tips you'll need.
post #277 of 540
pb_maxxx,

How does the paint mix (rs-mmmaxx) compare with just plain polyboard(parkland)?
The reason I'm asking is because it is now available in my area. But after seeing the plastic I can't imagine it working as good as the paint mix or as good as the matte white screen that I'm currently using now.

Will there be a nice step up in the picture using paint over my matte white screen?
The projector is an AE-900 at 80", dark room. I will be making a fixed screen using either the matte white or the paint.

Thanks
post #278 of 540
from ideal viewing postions, the parkland is like watching a slightly fuzzy/slightly out of focus screen. basically it lacks contrast and detail. however, the slight fuzziness it exhibits will help to minimize SDE. obviously, since you got it on hand, you can verify that for yourself.

the lastest updates to RS are a definite step up from plain polywall and upw matte. the colors on both of these, even in a completely controlled room will look washed out compared to RS. what you'll get is better contrast and detail. better black levels. and with an AE-900, your white levels will also exceed upw.

besides, aside from getting the metallics at michaels and the upw & minwax at home depot... the mix couldn't be more simple. paint the RS directly on the polywall... no basecoat needed.
post #279 of 540
Got a real problem here...my grandson or one of his buddies put a huge mark on my screen...looks like he ran a stick or something along the entire screen. I will have to re-paint the entire screen. I have the older version of the LL formula from 2 months ago. Can I simply just paint the newest formula over the existing old screen. I have a Infocus 4805.
post #280 of 540
jwv651,

hopefully it's a mark and not a gouge... in which case you'll have some sanding to do.

if it's a dark mark then sand the mark and the area around it to lessen the darkness of the mark.

otherwise, you can absolutely paint a couple of coats of the new mix right on top.
post #281 of 540
Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post

jwv651,

hopefully it's a mark and not a gouge... in which case you'll have some sanding to do.

if it's a dark mark then sand the mark and the area around it to lessen the darkness of the mark.

otherwise, you can absolutely paint a couple of coats of the new mix right on top.

It is not gouged...it is a real faint scratch...it just sucks as I was so happy with the results of my screen...I guess I could mask the 2" border and re-paint the screen...does this new LL formula have any added benefits over the older LL formula. Thanks for all your help.
post #282 of 540
jwv651,

the deep base is completely removed resulting in better contrast and slightly higher gain. i feel it's definitely better... but the final determination of that and the only opinion that counts is yours. i look forward to hearing your thoughts when you're done with it.
post #283 of 540
Hi all,

Well I finally got around to painting my doable screen. I am using this version that I found in another post.

24 Oz. Behr UPW Flat
24 Oz. Minwax Polycrylic
16 Oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior
24 Oz. Delta Ceramcoat Pearl
24 Oz. Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver
12 Oz. Distilled Water

I am applying this mix straight to my doable board with no base as suggested. After the second coat I will wet sand and apply the final coat. I am using a 3/16 nap roller to roll the mixture on. The first coat went on pretty good. As noted in the post this mix does very well with some ambient light and will help the black levels.I am using a HDPJ 52 projector.
First question what is the shelf life of the mixture? I read that some are using the minwax polycrylic as a top coat. Should I consider this approach? What are the Pro's and Con's to doing this? Finally do you recommend sanding the final coat? I have read where some have tried it but wasn't sure if that was with RS-MMMaxx or not. Thank you for any information you can provide me.
post #284 of 540
Ciscokid,

we've found that using the minwax polycrylic lengthens the shelf life considerably. it appears that a couple of month is certainly no problem at all.

i wish we had gotten to you with the lastest updates before you started but no matter... the older mix that you are using is still quite good.

i would not advice using straight minwax as a topcoat on rs-mmmaxx.

sanding the final coat is not adviced.
post #285 of 540
Latest updates? Is this something that I can add to the mix I already have? If so can you give me the ingredients please. Thanks again.
post #286 of 540
Ciscokid,

unfortunately... there's nothing you can add...
basically the lastest mix actually removes the deep base altogether, increases the metallics, and decreases the upw.

i think you'll be quite pleased with what you've mixed already so stick with that.
post #287 of 540
The 8 oz Delta paints are impossible to get where I live. The only thing anyone has within 30-40miles are the small 2 oz bottles. So I started hunting for some on-line; and just to make sure before I place the order that these the right ones?

Pearl:
http://www.createforless.com/product...roductID=39478

Silver:
http://www.createforless.com/product...roductID=11680

Gold:
http://www.createforless.com/product...roductID=10532


Does anyone know of a better place to buy them?
post #288 of 540
Mavrick007,

the first two are correct. however, the gold metallic is incorrect.
the url you have is for the 'pure' gold metallic. you want the 'pale' gold metallic #02624.
i believe the pale metallic gold only comes in the 2oz. bottles... which is fine... because you only need 2 oz.
post #289 of 540
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mavrick007 View Post

The 8 oz Delta paints are impossible to get where I live. The only thing anyone has within 30-40miles are the small 2 oz bottles. So I started hunting for some on-line; and just to make sure before I place the order that these the right ones?

Does anyone know of a better place to buy them?

In a pinch, substituting 4 - 2 oz. bottles for 1 - 8 oz.er is acceptable, especially if the smaller ones are going for 0.88 ea. as they often are. Place smaller bottles in a sink of hot water for 10 minutes before emptying to allow the paint to flow out mo' easy.
post #290 of 540
Cool! Thanks Guys!
post #291 of 540
so, 3 days and thousands of posts of reading (starting with the 2004 SS post ! LOL) i'm down to this:


-hardboard backer (smooth side) 4x8 sheet cut to size
-UPW gloss mix as base
mix 1 quart of UPW gloss,
1/2 quart of Minwax Polycrylic Gloss,
1/4 quart of water)-
x 3 coats (sand all but last one)
-RSMaxxMud as top-coat, 1/4" fine (for stains/polishes) nap rolled
24 oz. Delta Pearl Metallic #02601 (Michael's Crafts sells)
16 oz. Delta Silver Metallic #02603 (Michael's Crafts sells)
16 oz. UPW flat white ext. (Behr)

16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic - Satin finish
10oz. distilled/tap water
2-4 coats, no sanding

320 grit sanding sponge/block
Squirrel cage mixer.
Paint Can
9" x 3/16" nap roller


so, my image size used to be 106" at our old house. but we moved an now a beam bisecting my room from West to East means my PJ must go before it, so my throw limted to 93" diagonal. My DaLite Model B CSR started waving really bad after the move (seems it jiggled loose in the moving van, internal to the housing) and now the annoying waves drive this project.

other info: basement, two 18" x 24" windows fully blacked out when needed, Z2 i run in economode now for noise/bulb-life reasons. Seated about 12' from a 9.33 foot throw distance.

So, as i think of the frame, is there any benefit to curving it, by placing, say 1x4's vertically along the edges, and the horizontal pieces behind them, while gluing the screen's middle to the horizontal? Seems like no biggie, so just wondering..
post #292 of 540
hakalugi,

i don't think at the smaller size that curving your screen is necessary... but maybe someone who has a more intimate knowledge of the Z2 can chime in... especially from a 9.3 ft throw.

a couple of minor suggestions...

a) definitely use the 3/16" nap smooth synthetic roller...
b) you might consider lightly hand sanding the second-to-last coat of the rs-maxxmudd. the result should make for a smoother final coat and finish.

it's a lot easier than it appear. most of all. just have some fun doing it.
post #293 of 540
Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post

hakalugi,

i don't think at the smaller size that curving your screen is necessary... but maybe someone who has a more intimate knowledge of the Z2 can chime in... especially from a 9.3 ft throw.

a couple of minor suggestions...

a) definitely use the 3/16" nap smooth synthetic roller...
b) you might consider lightly hand sanding the second-to-last coat of the rs-maxxmudd. the result should make for a smoother final coat and finish.

it's a lot easier than it appear. most of all. just have some fun doing it.

will do. i'll try a frameless flat and then try to curve it with shims on the side and see if there's a diff. if there is i'll post pics.

thanks,

Hak
post #294 of 540
hakalugi

What are you trying to acomplish by curving your screen ?Do you have a specifc problem you are trying to fix ?

You seem to have a smaller screen and have a low gain difuse screen which is not the best for torus screens .

Bruce
post #295 of 540
ambient light rejection. for movies, it's pitch black for my tastes.

i put some sconces in on a dimmer and my wife needs a 'bit' of light to stay awake so based on the SS thread, curvature seemd to help with ambient rejection, no?
post #296 of 540
Yes with side light rejection it will help .
But could amplify ambient light if there is a bulb somewhere in front of the screen

If the lights are off to the side no prob but a higher gain will help the torridal shape reject ambiant light .

A higher gain surface generally works well with torus screen .

Build it and see how it looks

Bruce
post #297 of 540
oid vs. us

i assumed one was bent on 1 axis, the other on 2, but based on these:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toroid

torus = 2
Toroid = 2 + external axis, too

torus animation: http://www.cut-the-knot.org/do_you_know/torus.avi

is there an AV specific definition you can pass along?
post #298 of 540
I hope you caught the actual message

Yes there is toroid and torus but if you dissected a section it would make a small difference in the actual dimensions of your screen.

You caught me on definition and spelling but you are still making a toroidal style screen which is called a torus screen here and not a sperical screen.

Since you know how to search
I would search all you can on torus screens, and pay particular attention to what surfaces and gains are used as well as the actual dimensions people are using .

Have fun



Bruce
post #299 of 540
didn't mean to "catch you"

just was trying to see if there were discrepancies between "in the field" and "textbook" def's. I saw this years ago when i did RA & PE training for a trade association vs. shooting video footage of masons/carpenters actually building the structures.

what the architects and engineers used, nomenclature wise, the actual builders often did not...

but my take away: Tor__ vs. spherical, the former for HT screens, my size prob. negligible. but based on my sconce location (not on side, rather near my PJ on the cross-beam mentioned above) it may actually hurt.

thanks, tho.
post #300 of 540
just a little bump keeping the rs_maxxmudders together

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Time View Post

The following two mixes were recently posted by pb_maxx.

16 oz. Delta Silver Metallic #02603
16 oz. Delta Pearl Metallic #02601
10 oz. UPW
10 oz. tap water

16 oz. Delta Silver Metallic #02603
16 oz. Delta Pearl Metallic #02601
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic - Satin Finish
10 oz. UPW
2 oz. Delta Pale Metallic Gold #02624
10 oz. tap water


Quote:
Originally Posted by kengm View Post

I just finished putting on the second mix listed above. That mix is pbmaxx's recipe for rsmaxxmud. The only thing I changed was I halved the whole recipe. I painted over a 3 coat SS screen that in my opinion was too dull. I will post some before and after screenies that I took after 1 coat that hadn't really dried yet.

These pictures don't do the screen justice...in short I am extremely happy with the results. I feel like I lost none of the blacks I had with SS yet gained a LOT of upper end that makes the colors just pop off the screen. The colors are beautiful.

I will be putting on the final coat tomorrow. And more importantly, I think I'm finally at the end of my quest for a great DIY screen. Thanks to everyone's input.

Sanyo Z4
120" diag screen
SS base + RSMAXXMUD topcoats

pictues

having a brighter version of the silverscreen right now makes this tempting but leaning to the black flame, it looks like the old screen needs to be buried by a high gloss paint first ( bye old buddy ). Rooms going to start closing in on me with all these coats.
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