It's November where's my Dragonfly?? - Page 2  

HQV:

Quick question in regard to software updateability, will an end user of a stand alone HQV processor be able to get downloads directly from HQV by Teranex- Silicon Optix, or will the end user be required to obtain software upgrades from the stand alone box manufacturers?

Lon

LJG,

as each manufacturer licenses different algorithms and customize the software, I'm sure SO will not be supplying the software directly to end-users. If they wanted to deal directly with users, they'd be exclusively creating their own scalers and selling them directly.

Keep in mind that each box is different - has different inputs, different menus, different algorithms. SO provides the basic structural design, the basic software, the development tools and licenses the algorithms. The actual development, integration, etc. is up to the specific box manufacturer.

Ofer hit the nail on the head. It's our customers, the manufacturers, who decide whether or not to offer you downloadable-algorithms. That said, it's really up to consumers to request this option and others (e.g. cool effects/features based on the good 'ol Lockheed Martin real-time terrain-mapping and object-tracking algos).

And to the best of my knowledge, SO is still fixing the firmware on its chip. As SO is finding out, HDMI and other things are making this more difficult than rocket science. My guess is beta machines maybe in late February and I am not being processor manufacturer specific here. I am sure we will see great working machines by Cedia next year. And we will see machines with bugs in March.

Car manufacturers come out with prototypes several years before they are ready to ship an actual product, so it's not like this is particularly unusual.

And drug companies take decades to come out with new drugs. What's the big deal here?

So this applies to Gennum (Crystalio II), too? Thanks...

I think he's being specific to the Realta based units in that case.

That's not to say the Gennum based units won't be similarly delayed, of course...

I'm sure some of us will talk with SO and Algolith at CES and get the scoop.

Not a good analogy. Project cars are clearly labeled as such with the expectation that most won't see a dealer showroom. If it is not unusual for a manufacturer to come on an enthusiast forum and actively hype their product to generate present (not future) sales and in another case collect deposit money it certainly should be.

And if the problem is SO making changes to a chip a full year plus after announcing the product ready for use and four plus years after collaboration with Teranex just exactly what were you people looking at last year (CEDIA '04) that so wowed you?

We were looking at an SO designed demonstration board. Was it HDMI? I do not think so. HDMI has been a nightmare for SO and the processor manufacturers. It basicallyexcluded them fro shoving the SO board into a box.

I am sure SO will give Ofer the straight scoop. Yea right. Ditto for Algolith which is under a SO non disclosure agreement.

Ofer, are you leaving for Vegas today? Have a safe and pleasant trip and get some sleep before the show starts. You re going to be my eyes an ears there this year. Please keep us informed. Thanks in advance.

Mark, I am not being argumentative or confrontational in my question and I won’t understand a detailed scientific answer, but why the problem with HDMI? Its newness is relative and it has been successfully implemented to carry a signal from box A to box B in cheapo DVD players and STB’s so why the problem with a processor?

Mark,

Tomorrow morning. I'll try, I'm not sure how much internet access I have down there (historically, there have been many wifi hotspots, but few that were useful). I'm going to be at a customer site afterwards, which means I'm going to be disabled for a few days after the show.

wensteph,

Oh man, you have no idea. HDMI is a catastrophy, even if you ignore the HDCP compatibility issues. There have been length issues, communication issues, protocol issues (lack of color matrix info passing through), resolution issues with the new 480i/576i support, international support issues (50HZ), audio issues (HDMI 1.1/1.2/1.3 correct this last one).

Each manufacturer implements HDMI slightly different and the chipsets are not 100% compliant.

A sad state of affairs. They should have done a logo certification program, just like microsoft has - if you don't support 100% of the approved standard, you can't use the HDMI moniker.

They did attempt that; supposedly HDMI products must all be tested at an authorized testing center (unlike DVI which was wide open). I suspect many manufacturers are stumbling through this certification process along with trying to fix other things. Meanwhile, if they are a smaller company the cash engine begins to slow down quite a lot when there is no shipping product. Eventually some of the smaller ones will run out of money before ever shipping the product IMO.

When you get to CES please ask a Algolith rep when the Dragonfly will be released. Secondly, if they have a demo of the mosquito with hdmi vs non hdmi setup please report if the difference is worth upgrading to. If anyone has any additional information on these to items please post them. Thanks Greg

I'm not suckered in by consumer electronics manufacturers any more than I am by car manufacturers. Sure there is a different dynamic in how the audio/video industry interacts with its consumer base than in other industries, but nevertheless, until a product ships it's still vapourware, and that's the same across the board.

Incidentally, you get preordering of vapourware well before the stuff ships in the boutique end of the automobile industry too. Just think of all the people who waited over a year after fronting with their deposit for a Ford GT before getting one.

As for SO, I think they seriously underestimated how difficult it would be to turn a professional standards conversion system into a mass market video processing chip.

Greg. They do not know when the Dragonfly will be released. Try reading the threads here. SO is still making changes to the Realta chip. Then because of these changes, changes may have to be made to the programming etc done by Algolith. Then there is beta testing which will undoubtedly discover lots of problems which will need to be fixed just like on the HDMI Mosquito. HDMI is a bitch and is definately not all that it is cracked up to be. If you do not need HDMI in/out, stick with the non HDMI Mosquito, There simply is no benefit in using HDMI, it may in fact be worse. HDMI is being shoved upon the consumer market. One will need it sooner or later because they are giving us no choice if we want HDEF content.

Maybe it's just me but the fact that fundamental changes CAN be made to a chip a year after its inception is pretty darn cool. And you know what wouldn't be cool? NOT taking advantage of an ability to evolve. That would be plain wrong. The Realta proved the naysayers wrong with the launch of the 5910 (which, ahem, has been touted by some as the best DVD player ever) and the Yamaha 1300 ain't too shabby neither. Sure it'd be easier for us to leave the Realta as is but since one of our goals is to dominate the high-end, where quality reigns supreme, we won't stop ammeliorating PQ. Ever.

The only thing I'll say regarding HDMI is that it has nothing to do with video processing! It's just a transport interface!! It doesn't matter what I'm running component, DVI, HDMI, S-video out of my Realta board - it all looks good. Award-winning good. :) Check out a Theatersync and try it out for yourself if you don't believe me.

There will be a number of booths showing off HQV processing, I'll try to post the booth numbers before the show opens. Also keep your ears open for some cool announcements. My favorite one: a new projector (with integrated DVD player and a 5.1 channel audio system) that will produce a 100†image from less than 4 feet away and a 60†image from just 2 feet away!!! :cool: :cool: :cool:

Interested in a private demo? Send me a PM!

Hey HQV, thanks for your comment. Would you mind giving us a hint what the new firmware for the Realta improved? That would be quite interesting... :)

It would be "cooler" if the fundamental changes were improvements and not fundamental changes just to get the thing to work. I bet the phone calls from Calibre and Algolith to SO could blister paint.

Madshi: sorry but since there's new firmware releases about every other week it'd be hard to specify the changes.

Wensteph: no, their calls do not blister paint.

No paint on the walls at SO? :) Hey I like SO and HQV. Still going to get a few Realta based processors. I can wait.

go to the gym, eat yer vegetables, check the actuarial tables......this could take awhile.

They should. For whatever influence this forum has, their customer service reputation is quickly going down the tubes. All will be forgotten if they deliver a beautifully executed product, but the bar for doing that is being raised by this episode.

go to the gym, eat yer vegetables, check the actuarial tables......this could take awhile.

Sex, food, good cigars, good beverages, football