Definitive Owners Thread - Page 884

Originally Posted by Jetfan516

Hey guys I was looking for some opinions as I have a dilemma. I want to know which surrounds would be better. My current 5.1 set-up consists of BP-2000's in the front, CLR-3000 center, BP10b's as surrounds, with a HSU VTF-3. I'm going to go 7.1 and I've bought bought a pair of BPX's and SM450's. Which do you think I should go with? Either one would be wall mounted as side surrounds with the BP10B's in the back position. Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by Jetfan516

Hey guys I was looking for some opinions as I have a dilemma. I want to know which surrounds would be better. My current 5.1 set-up consists of BP-2000's in the front, CLR-3000 center, BP10b's as surrounds, with a HSU VTF-3. I'm going to go 7.1 and I've bought bought a pair of BPX's and SM450's. Which do you think I should go with? Either one would be wall mounted as side surrounds with the BP10B's in the back position. Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by Jetfan516

Hey guys I was looking for some opinions as I have a dilemma. I want to know which surrounds would be better. My current 5.1 set-up consists of BP-2000's in the front, CLR-3000 center, BP10b's as surrounds, with a HSU VTF-3. I'm going to go 7.1 and I've bought bought a pair of BPX's and SM450's. Which do you think I should go with? Either one would be wall mounted as side surrounds with the BP10B's in the back position. Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by Matts

Anyone had any good demo's with the new StudioMonitor 65's. I have to say I haven't followed much about new speakers coming this year from all the major players. But I had an opportunity for a very quick listen of the 65's earlier this afternoon and I have to say I was very impressed with the size and dynamics of the sound they produced. Very impressive tight bass and nice sweet midrange. For the price these seem even more attractive.

Originally Posted by Joe@Definitive

Hi Matts, the new Studio Monitors have many technologies in them that SM 350 and 450 did not. BDSS drivers, Linear Response Waveguide, cast aluminum baskets in the 55 and 65, crossover networks with mylar caps and Zobel networks, etc. It took much work to get them to their present form, and they were supposed to ship last fall. But I am glad the engineers took the time to get the last 10% right. They sound great. Best, Joe

Originally Posted by yosh7

I have an audessey xt32 question related to my bp 7000 towers. When I am near field, I have noticed my left tower sub driver rattling a bit on bass heavy material. At first, I thought it may be a bad driver (and that may still be the issue), but I decided to do some experimenting. When I turn audessey off or set it to direct, I have no issue on the same material. Unfortunately this is not a cure as everything sounds much better with audessey on. I looked at the audessey graphs on my denon and it appears there is a big low frequency dip on the left side that audessey may be attempting to compensate for. I should snap a picture of the graph... Anyway, what would solutions be? Sound treatments? Moving the speakers back and forth? Flipping the towers so the subs face out and not in? I have also read that sometimes it is better to do 4 or 5 of the 8 readings in one spot. I can see this being a time consuming issue and was hoping to get some advice.... First and foremost, it seems that the towers are so robust, that this issue shouldn't cause so much stress on the driver. I am not experienced with this stuff so I may have mis diagnosed this, but it certainly seems to be an over compensation. I currently have the gains set to about 10:30 and turning it down helps a bit, but it is not a cure. I have the beasts crossed over to my seaton submerssives at 60, so they should not be stressing with ulf stuff. My immediate thoughts are to first try moving the speakers, but I really like the imaging I get with where they are at. My second thought would be to flip the speakers so the subs face out. Room treatments would be a last resort. Thanks for any advice any may have.....

Originally Posted by purplerain

Have a friend who has the following in mint condition/hardly used and wants $400 for all:

Definitive Tech BP-2004 Bipolar Array towers (2)

Center speaker C/L/R 1000 (1)

Pro Monitor 100 pro cinema series loudspeakers (2)

Originally Posted by yosh7

I have an audessey xt32 question related to my bp 7000 towers. When I am near field, I have noticed my left tower sub driver rattling a bit on bass heavy material. At first, I thought it may be a bad driver (and that may still be the issue), but I decided to do some experimenting. When I turn audessey off or set it to direct, I have no issue on the same material. Unfortunately this is not a cure as everything sounds much better with audessey on. I looked at the audessey graphs on my denon and it appears there is a big low frequency dip on the left side that audessey may be attempting to compensate for. I should snap a picture of the graph... Anyway, what would solutions be? Sound treatments? Moving the speakers back and forth? Flipping the towers so the subs face out and not in? I have also read that sometimes it is better to do 4 or 5 of the 8 readings in one spot. I can see this being a time consuming issue and was hoping to get some advice.... First and foremost, it seems that the towers are so robust, that this issue shouldn't cause so much stress on the driver. I am not experienced with this stuff so I may have mis diagnosed this, but it certainly seems to be an over compensation. I currently have the gains set to about 10:30 and turning it down helps a bit, but it is not a cure. I have the beasts crossed over to my seaton submerssives at 60, so they should not be stressing with ulf stuff. My immediate thoughts are to first try moving the speakers, but I really like the imaging I get with where they are at. My second thought would be to flip the speakers so the subs face out. Room treatments would be a last resort. Thanks for any advice any may have.....

Originally Posted by chikoo

Can you not manually tweak the audyssey settings?

Originally Posted by laeriq


Jump on it. Great price.

Originally Posted by chikoo

Are the new sm65 geared for music or HT?

Originally Posted by purplerain

Have a friend who has the following in mint condition/hardly used and wants $400 for all:

Definitive Tech BP-2004 Bipolar Array towers (2)

Center speaker C/L/R 1000 (1)

Pro Monitor 100 pro cinema series loudspeakers (2)

Originally Posted by yosh7

I have an audessey xt32 question related to my bp 7000 towers. When I am near field, I have noticed my left tower sub driver rattling a bit on bass heavy material. At first, I thought it may be a bad driver (and that may still be the issue), but I decided to do some experimenting. When I turn audessey off or set it to direct, I have no issue on the same material. Unfortunately this is not a cure as everything sounds much better with audessey on. I looked at the audessey graphs on my denon and it appears there is a big low frequency dip on the left side that audessey may be attempting to compensate for. I should snap a picture of the graph... Anyway, what would solutions be? Sound treatments? Moving the speakers back and forth? Flipping the towers so the subs face out and not in? I have also read that sometimes it is better to do 4 or 5 of the 8 readings in one spot. I can see this being a time consuming issue and was hoping to get some advice.... First and foremost, it seems that the towers are so robust, that this issue shouldn't cause so much stress on the driver. I am not experienced with this stuff so I may have mis diagnosed this, but it certainly seems to be an over compensation. I currently have the gains set to about 10:30 and turning it down helps a bit, but it is not a cure. I have the beasts crossed over to my seaton submerssives at 60, so they should not be stressing with ulf stuff. My immediate thoughts are to first try moving the speakers, but I really like the imaging I get with where they are at. My second thought would be to flip the speakers so the subs face out. Room treatments would be a last resort. Thanks for any advice any may have.....

Originally Posted by g_bartman

That's a tough one for sure. I don't think treatments are the answer. The next thing I would try is to x them over at 80 to see if that helps. Next I'd try switching the l/r speakers which, as you said, would reposition the subs. Good luck

Originally Posted by yosh7

I have been a big proponent of the new uncompressed 7.1 channel audio codecs. Well holy cow. I just watched Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol last night. This is the best sound mix so far that utilizes the surround back left and right channel independently and impressively. There were several scenes where the action was (for example) right front, then surround right, then surround right back (maybe a car flipping over your head or a dust storm immersing you). For anyone on the fence for getting quality surround back left and right channels, this movie is the perfect example of what Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD have to offer. This has to be one of my favorite reference movies for audio now. This is the reason I am hoping to get a second pair of BP 7000's to perfectly blend these scenes. Don't get me wrong, the Mythos ST's I have back there are doing a more than awesome job, but I can't fathom what another pair of the big BP's would add. Oh, and the lfe was amazing with the Seaton Submerssives. My wife saw the movie at the theater and she knew some of the zinger surprise scenes and she was still shocked/scared by some of the massive lfe from a few surprise explosions, etc. She said that the sound and picture were without a doubt way better at home. (I love hearing this!)

PS - The audessey left front bp 7000 speaker issue did not make itself apparent during this movie, but I have the gain turned way down to maybe 9:00 so that it isn't bad. I am going to play with this issue more this weekend. I think I will flip the front speakers around with the subs facing out rather than in and re-run audessey to see if this improves the situation.

Originally Posted by Matts

When I heard them at Magnolia they were playing Quantum of Solace, blu-ray and were using 65 for LCR and two smaller 55's for the rears. They had a sub in the corner, which I believe was REL, though I may be mistaken. The soundstage was very dynamic and very clear at a reasonably high volume - not reference, but still quite loud. The soundstage flowed from front to back very seamlessly and had a great amount punch and low bass, even when the sub was switched off. Dialogue was crisp and evenly maintained without any trace of compression during loud db peaks. The surrounds were also quite impressive. The sound was very sweet, perhaps more on the warm side, but no obvious coloration. The mids were very sweet and again lots of strong dynamics.

I did get to hear a little music in plain stereo, again with a sub. The 65's were playing 2.1 setup. They played mostly classic music with lots of horns, kick drums, etc. Every thing I heard was very detailed and the speakers did a good job separating the various instruments while not losing cohesiveness. I thought for the price of a pair of 65's or even five 65's the value was excellent. Again not off the charts, insane quality that you would give up a pair of high quality $10k plus speakers, but they held their own against some of the more reasonably higher priced speakers in their rooms that I have listened to many times before.

Put it this way, I could easily live with a set of 65's in my HT setup and feel that I was getting every bit the bang for my buck.

Originally Posted by Joe@Definitive

Hi Matts and Chikoo, we always try to voice speakers for music first. In our view, everyone knows what good vocals, good piano, trumpets etc. should sound like. If we get that right, then it's just a matter of making sure the speaker can hande the dynamic range of movies. Who knows what a movie dinosaur stomp, or inter-galactic space ship, is really supposed to sound like? "Accurate" in that realm is harder to define. I hope this helps - best, Joe

Originally Posted by Matts

When I heard them at Magnolia they were playing Quantum of Solace, blu-ray and were using 65 for LCR and two smaller 55's for the rears. They had a sub in the corner, which I believe was REL, though I may be mistaken. The soundstage was very dynamic and very clear at a reasonably high volume - not reference, but still quite loud. The soundstage flowed from front to back very seamlessly and had a great amount punch and low bass, even when the sub was switched off. Dialogue was crisp and evenly maintained without any trace of compression during loud db peaks. The surrounds were also quite impressive. The sound was very sweet, perhaps more on the warm side, but no obvious coloration. The mids were very sweet and again lots of strong dynamics.

I did get to hear a little music in plain stereo, again with a sub. The 65's were playing 2.1 setup. They played mostly classic music with lots of horns, kick drums, etc. Every thing I heard was very detailed and the speakers did a good job separating the various instruments while not losing cohesiveness. I thought for the price of a pair of 65's or even five 65's the value was excellent. Again not off the charts, insane quality that you would give up a pair of high quality $10k plus speakers, but they held their own against some of the more reasonably higher priced speakers in their rooms that I have listened to many times before.

Put it this way, I could easily live with a set of 65's in my HT setup and feel that I was getting every bit the bang for my buck.

Originally Posted by chikoo

Thanks Matts. I guess it is time to check out my local magnolia store.

Originally Posted by Joe@Definitive

Hi Matts and Chikoo, we always try to voice speakers for music first. In our view, everyone knows what good vocals, good piano, trumpets etc. should sound like. If we get that right, then it's just a matter of making sure the speaker can hande the dynamic range of movies. Who knows what a movie dinosaur stomp, or inter-galactic space ship, is really supposed to sound like? "Accurate" in that realm is harder to define. I hope this helps - best, Joe

Originally Posted by otk

even if we knew what a real dinosaur sounded it like it would be different in an action film. i was watching one of the rocky movies the other day and the punches were very prominent in the LFE channel

Originally Posted by chikoo

Oh...why did I visit the magnolia store....why?

So I get to the Magnolia designer store. They do not have and do not anticipate having the SM45,55,65 speakers for audition at all.

So I look around and audition some bookshelves by Monitor Audio, B&W, Sonus faber, et al.

And I find what I was looking for - exactly what I was looking for in a speaker. Except that a pair will cost me $1000 bucks.

I do not even find them anywhere on ebay or audiogon or local craigslist today.

I will keep looking....but who knows...I may very well end up buying new ones because apparently no one in their right mind is selling them used. Rightly so.

PS: After looking up the specs of the speaker I am in love with, I am so proud of myself. I have always loved the sound of paper cones growing up, and the ones I like I find out are made of "cellulose"...fancy name for paper. So even after 20 years, my sonic memory/love still lives.

Originally Posted by yosh7

I have been a big proponent of the new uncompressed 7.1 channel audio codecs. Well holy cow. I just watched Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol last night. This is the best sound mix so far that utilizes the surround back left and right channel independently and impressively. There were several scenes where the action was (for example) right front, then surround right, then surround right back (maybe a car flipping over your head or a dust storm immersing you). For anyone on the fence for getting quality surround back left and right channels, this movie is the perfect example of what Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD have to offer. This has to be one of my favorite reference movies for audio now. This is the reason I am hoping to get a second pair of BP 7000's to perfectly blend these scenes. Don't get me wrong, the Mythos ST's I have back there are doing a more than awesome job, but I can't fathom what another pair of the big BP's would add. Oh, and the lfe was amazing with the Seaton Submerssives. My wife saw the movie at the theater and she knew some of the zinger surprise scenes and she was still shocked/scared by some of the massive lfe from a few surprise explosions, etc. She said that the sound and picture were without a doubt way better at home. (I love hearing this!)

PS - The audessey left front bp 7000 speaker issue did not make itself apparent during this movie, but I have the gain turned way down to maybe 9:00 so that it isn't bad. I am going to play with this issue more this weekend. I think I will flip the front speakers around with the subs facing out rather than in and re-run audessey to see if this improves the situation.

Originally Posted by koicraft


So...inquiring minds...Bose 301's?