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Panasonic announces PX600, PX60 models + 1080p 65" - Page 2  

post #31 of 1075
1/4/06 at 8:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness
I'm still not getting you here. (Sorry, maybe I'm just being thick).

I know that brightness levels can of course factor into contrast ratio. For several years the Panasonic has rated it's ED model at 4000:1 contrast ratio, vs the HD model's 3000:1. There was no difference in black level, rather the ratings reflected the ED model's greater brightness. (This being due to it being easier to get greater brightness out of the fewer, larger pixels on the ED model). So the Panasonic numbers did indeed reflect differences in peak brightness levels when significant.
However, no such brightness differences were apparent in the ratings of the HD models, which all had the same 3000:1 spec.

You seem to be saying that the newer "dynamic contrast" style rating works out to the same old 3000:1 number - i.e. no actual change in the contrast ratio, only in the rating method that changes the numbers.

The question is, if there was any significant difference between the brightness of the 50" HD models and the big 65" display (both the lower res and newer 1080p res) why didn't it come out in the numbers before? Both 65" models and the smaller HD models were rated at 3000:1.

If the newer numbers are just the older numbers "re-jigged" why would there now be a difference between the contrast of 65"/50" models when it wasn't there before?

Thanks.
I never said that it was exactly 3000:1. A dynamic contrast ratio of 10,000 should equal at least to the old 3000:1 ratio "depending" on exactly how they equated their dynamic ratio formula. And also remember that there is no way in hell they are just going to produce a better product for overseas and not provide the same for the "mother land".

The point is, the dynamic contrast formula is very misleading (remember that Samsung actually started the whole thing....did they actually live up to their numbers?). Why did Panasonic jump on the bandwagon....who knows but I think it is a mistake.

If you want further info on dynamic contrast ratios here are some links.....

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=536838

http://www.behardware.com/articles/4...-nutshell.html
post #32 of 1075
1/4/06 at 10:54pm
I don't see anything in the new models to want me to wait for a new Panny.
post #33 of 1075
1/4/06 at 11:29pm
Now, now, guys...not so fast. Patience is the name of the game , and if you can't wait then just buy what's available. Remember, this is the real birth of 1080p in Consumer Electronics whereby new models may or may not have all the bling bling you're seeking. Give this infant a little time to mature, afterall it's only taken us decades to achieve a full 1080p Display.
post #34 of 1075
1/4/06 at 11:44pm
No info on whether or not the USA 65" will accept 1080p input, right?
post #35 of 1075
1/4/06 at 11:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoodlum
"The new plasma panels are capable of reproducing up to 3072 levels of gradation, enabling an equivalent 29 billion displayable colors"
The current commercials produce 4096 with digital inputs.... Something seems amiss.
post #36 of 1075
1/4/06 at 11:59pm
I'm missing all the technical details. What exactly did change in the panel? Did they replace the glass with film like Pioneer and LG did? Did they lower black level somehow? What exactly did they change?

Rich, don't worry too much about contrast ratio on the 65". You wouldn't want to buy the consumer model, anyway, or would you? Let's wait until the fall for the commercial models. Hopefully the 65" will be up to the other displays in contrast ratio by then.
post #37 of 1075
1/5/06 at 12:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by aviators99
No info on whether or not the USA 65" will accept 1080p input, right?
Very unlikely that these models would accept 1080p. Based on other threads here the models that accept 1080p will only be available much later this year at the earliest.
post #38 of 1075
1/5/06 at 1:45am
With such a high contrast ratio of 10,000:1 in some scenes, do you think this would work well with the Xbox 360 or not?

I have heard the higher contrast ratios are bad for video games on plasmas
and I am thinking about buying a TH-50PX600U as I have a 27 inch old CRT from the early 90's.
post #39 of 1075
1/5/06 at 2:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Docwiz
With such a high contrast ratio of 10,000:1 in some scenes, do you think this would work well with the Xbox 360 or not?

I have heard the higher contrast ratios are bad for video games on plasmas
and I am thinking about buying a TH-50PX600U as I have a 27 inch old CRT from the early 90's.
I can't imagine why a higher contrast ratio would be worse for a game. High CR is what helps give a three dimensional look to the image. Maybe what you have heard relates to the concern about burn in. I don't know for sure but maybe there is a concern that it is easier to burn in when the images are so much brighter. In any case, as you will read in this forum, the issue of plasma burn in is drastically exaggerated. There is probably more risk with games because you sometimes have the same image on the screen for hours at a time but, again, all of it is greatly exaggerated and you just need to take some simple precautions. Take a look at the FAQs for more on burn in.
post #40 of 1075
1/5/06 at 4:11am
What is the current number of gray levels on the 65" commercial and industrial models? (I think was 2048). I still wonder how they came up with 11.58 bits of DR.
post #41 of 1075
1/5/06 at 5:33am
:( The long wait for 2007, when they will hopefully have a 50" 1080p model (that actually accepts 1080p).
post #42 of 1075
1/5/06 at 5:44am
Here is a pic of the new 65PX600U. It almost looks like it is 4:3 vice 16:9 but it may be a bad picture of it.

http://www.cnet.com/4831-11405_1-6412231.html?tag=ltst
post #43 of 1075
1/5/06 at 5:44am
I'd like to see what these look like. The statement about the speakers being invisible is nice. I hope they are all black. I don't like plasma with grey speakers.
post #44 of 1075
1/5/06 at 6:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi
I'm missing all the technical details. What exactly did change in the panel? Did they replace the glass with film like Pioneer and LG did? Did they lower black level somehow? What exactly did they change?

Rich, don't worry too much about contrast ratio on the 65". You wouldn't want to buy the consumer model, anyway, or would you? Let's wait until the fall for the commercial models. Hopefully the 65" will be up to the other displays in contrast ratio by then.

They added a SD card interface and a slightly refined outer shell. No new glass filter, no new black level, no single-side panel driver. Basically, the 60/600 series are tweaked 8th gen panels. Thats how they can continue to keep their prices at about $169 over the current 8th gen MSRPs.

I'm very interested in the commerical 65" 1080p. I already have a spot on the wall for it :D
post #45 of 1075
1/5/06 at 6:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by assJack1
What is the current number of gray levels on the 65" commercial and industrial models? (I think was 2048). I still wonder how they came up with 11.58 bits of DR.

2048 for analog inputs....4096 for digital
post #46 of 1075
1/5/06 at 7:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
2048 for analog inputs....4096 for digital
I guess they averaged them for the press release :)

-- Rich
post #47 of 1075
1/5/06 at 7:24am
px60 Series doesnt Have Cable Card!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
post #48 of 1075
1/5/06 at 7:26am
OH man I cannot wait till they come out! Then I might be able to get the PX50 at about the same price as the PX42. Woohoo!
post #49 of 1075
1/5/06 at 7:27am
Given the long shipping delays on the 50phd8uk, i thought i'd see what CES would bring. Nothing too special it appears.

Looks like it's time to bust out the credit card and get in line.
post #50 of 1075
1/5/06 at 7:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack D
Very unlikely that these models would accept 1080p. Based on other threads here the models that accept 1080p will only be available much later this year at the earliest.
So, what will happen if you buy an HD-DVD or Blu-Ray DVD and connect it to this thing at 1080p?
post #51 of 1075
1/5/06 at 7:40am
Hopefully this will put price pressure on Pioneer and other good plasmas which are currently avail. :D
post #52 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
px60 Series doesnt Have Cable Card!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Nope, AND they stripped the PC input. Next thing you know, they'll strip the glass :D Talk about a "bare assed" plasma.
post #53 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKB4C
Hopefully this will put price pressure on Pioneer and other good plasmas which are currently avail. :D
I don't see how with more deletion of features....cable card.....pc input.
post #54 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:16am
They didnt announce an industrial model, which is ok. I know CES is for consumers, but do they usually hold back on that information until spring?
post #55 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by easycruise
I'm disappointed. I would think that Panasonic would learn by now that the TV Guide Program Guide is a bust. I'm beginning to lose count as to the failures. Let's see...just off the top of my head...many of the Sony DVR users returned it because of the guide not working and Sony discontinued the product...Many Mitsubishi 1080 DLP users have said to just disable the TV Guide feature on their set, it is such a failure...and now Panasonic got suckered into including it on their new sets..

Should have partnered with Tivo and got something done with them.
FWIW - I'm a PX500 owner and my TV-guide works great via TWC. While it's annoying that it doesn't order channels, it's still very useful since you can hit the info button and see show title and information while using the cablecard, and you can punch in a channel number to scan through the list, so even though it's not sorted, it's easily navigated. While I agree it needs some tweaking to rival my DVR's EPG, I've had no breakdowns in my listing updates, so it's certainly of value to me.
post #56 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
Nope, AND they stripped the PC input. Next thing you know, they'll strip the glass :D Talk about a "bare assed" plasma.
Panasonic is following the same path as last year... the 600U series has these features for an additional $500. But of course feel free to pay $2000 more for a Pioneer! :D
post #57 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity
Panasonic is following the same path as last year... the 600U series has these features for an additional $500. But of course feel free to pay $2000 more for a Pioneer! :D

Are you ever going to get over your MSRP price difference rant? Everyone is fully aware that the price difference isn't anywhere near 2K.

It's 2006, get some new ammunition.
post #58 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:54am
it doesnt make any sense for the 05 models to have cablecard and fr the 06 models to NOT have it. this ROYALLY sux. i LOVED the fact that you dont need a box, which takes some quality away.

a small chance is that cnet might be wrong in saying that they wont have cablecard. ill have to wait and see what the official Panny page says though.

if they were both the same price would you get the 50u with cable card or the 60u without. i guess we have to wait for some reviews if the PQ added colors and cosmetics are worth it.

how much quality do you lose by using a box then using cable card? of course it depends on the box...

really pissed off...
post #59 of 1075
1/5/06 at 8:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
it doesnt make any sense for the 05 models to have cablecard and fr the 06 models to NOT have it. this ROYALLY sux. i LOVED the fact that you dont need a box, which takes some quality away.

a small chance is that cnet might be wrong in saying that they wont have cablecard. ill have to wait and see what the official Panny page says though.

if they were both the same price would you get the 50u with cable card or the 60u without. i guess we have to wait for some reviews if the PQ added colors and cosmetics are worth it.

how much quality do you lose by using a box then using cable card? of course it depends on the box...

really pissed off...
I think this is a job for optivity...the CC expert.
post #60 of 1075
1/5/06 at 9:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
2048 for analog inputs....4096 for digital
I think I saw some information from panasonic stating that the 4096 only applies to the grey-scale, but the info was buried deep into the literature.
I am no expert but I too am also amazed at how some of our more knowledgable posters are buying into the 10000:1 "Maximum" contrast ratio. I do believe panasonic has improved the real-world contrast ratio but not to 10000:1.
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