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Energy Owners Thread - Page 1123

post #33661 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsceneJesster View Post

My receiver does allow some speakers to be set small and others large. I have always used the small setting for everything though. Are you saying that if I set the towers to large then the crossover I have for the rest of the speakers does not apply to the towers? If I did this, at what point would the receiver stop sending low freaquency to the towers? I know for a fact they cant play 30Hz as well as my sub. Also, do you think the CB-10's could handle a crossover of 60hz? They are used for surrounds and I was thinking that low freaquencies rarely get set to surrounds anyway. Am I right to think that?

Here's my understanding of bass management in receivers that can set speakers to SMALL or LARGE. When setting a speaker to SMALL, the audio stream to that speaker is split in low and high frequency components according to the crossover you specify. The low-frequency component is sent to the subwoofer and the high-frequency is sent to the speaker. This is useful for speakers that have trouble generating good bass. When set to LARGE, the speaker gets the audio stream in its integrality.

This is *on top* of the LFE (low frequency effects) channel (i.e. the .1 in 5.1 or 7.1), which is solely sent to the subwoofer if you have one. So even if you set your speaker to LARGE, the subwoofer will still be used for LFEs.

On some receivers (e.g. Pioneer), you when your speakers are set to LARGE, you can set the subwoofer to YES, NO or PLUS. The PLUS setting takes the low-frequency component of every channel and send it to the subwoofer, regardless of the size setting of the speakers. So even if you have LARGE speakers, the sub is also used for low-freqs other than the LFE channel.

Whether you prefer setting your speakers to SMALL, or to LARGE, or to LARGE + PLUS subwoofer is essentially a question of taste and will depend on the room and receiver also. But with CF-70s, I think I'd use LARGE, and if you have a particularly good sub that you want to hear for music, LARGE + PLUS sub if available on your receiver.

My setup is CB-20 fronts, CB-10 surrounds and a CC-10 center, and the Pionner calibration (MCACC) suggested that all speakers be set to LARGE. This is somewhat surprising, but overall, I like it a lot, altough I decided to use PLUS subwoofer in the end. With the SMALL setting, I think my sub (ESW-C8) sounds mushier than the CB-20s for low-freqs that are not just rumbles.
post #33662 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Well those are rather encouraging comments. However, given a half-price sale, I'd still prefer getting a pair of CF-70s at 500-600$ than a pair of RC-70s at 1000-1200$, if only to match the looks of the other speakers and save money. Of course, given the choice between a 1000$ pair of CF-70s and a 1000$ pair of RC-70s, I guess I'd be a fool to go with the CF-70s.

(Really, FS once sold RC-70s for 500$ each? wow... considering they're asking 1300$ each now, it's almost incredible).

This is all rethorical for now anyway. The only hope is that the probability of FutureShop selling Energy speakers for half the price is much higher than the local store. It's really a shame that FutureShop decided not to get the CF-70s... And alas, I'm not in the market for a 60"+ television either. However I know a friend who might be, so that's an interesting avenue.

To answer Hank's question, the setup is mainly used for tv, games, movies; I'm trying to find the time to actually listen to music but the fact is most of the time, it's net radio background music. So while I enjoy listening to music it's not the main purpose of the setup, and I'm no audiophile. I probably couldn't tell the difference between the CF-70 and the RC-70 anyway (I never heard any of them either). I'm mainly curious about what towers would do in movies and games vs the CB-20s I currently use on the fronts. If I buy towers, I'd probably put the CB-20s as surrounds. My current surrounds are CB-10s; those would probably go in another room. If I use CB-20s as surrounds, with 6.5" woofers, I guess I should stick with -70s (be it CFs or RCs) just to match low-frew responses.

Thanks for keeping your fingers crossed for me! But if anyone manage to find a place in Canada selling CF-70s, online or not, please tell me, as this would double the chances of a good deal and may help bargaining...

That Future Shop sale price was epic. People were trying to sell their used RC-70's for $1800 at the same time!
I wouldn't buy the C's at our full price. If I had to choose, I would buy used or I would go to a whole other speaker brand for my front main towers and centre, and use the C's that you already have for the surrounds. Since you are mostly using your set up for tv, games and movies, I wouldn't be totally set on having all the speakers from the same family or even brand. You should be able to get much better value with another brand in my opinion. I have no idea why Future Shop and Energy don't offer the CF-70's, it really makes no sense and I'm sure it's very frustrating for you. Hopefully they make it up to us.
Also, you would most definitely be able to tell the difference between the RC speaker and a CF speaker. They are very different sounding.
post #33663 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

My setup is CB-20 fronts, CB-10 surrounds and a CC-10 center, and the Pionner calibration (MCACC) suggested that all speakers be set to LARGE. This is somewhat surprising, but overall, I like it a lot, altough I decided to use PLUS subwoofer in the end. With the SMALL setting, I think my sub (ESW-C8) sounds mushier than the CB-20s for low-freqs that are not just rumbles.


I could be wrong on this, but I think running MCAAC always defaults to large, no matter what the speakers or sub. At least my Pioneer always has, and I've run across some discussion (just doing a general google search on the issue) suggesting the same. These discussions suggest running MCAAC and then manually changing the speaker setting to Small, if Small is desired. Again, I apologize if I'm wrong -- just throwing it out there fwiw.
post #33664 of 51538
All,

I'm a happy owner of a pair of original C-6's and an AC-300 center, but my rear surrounds are just some old crappy 20 year old JBL book shelves. I jumped on the Denon 4311 deal a few weeks ago, and it should be here next Tuesday.

Can anyone recommend some Energy (or even Mirage) that will complement my fronts well? In particularly anything from Vanns, since they seem to have quite a few options from both brands on sale.

As much as I'd like to get a set of Veritas 6.3's and the matching center at these sale prices, probably not the wise move since my rears need replacing and don't even have a sub. Yet.

Thanks for any help or thoughts!
post #33665 of 51538
to neutro: The RC-70s are NOT available no matter what the website says. If they ever do get new stock in (like for boxing day) they should be 500-600 each but this may never happen. There hasn't been new stock since boxing day last year. Price was raised to $1200 after stock ran out.
post #33666 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Mardukous View Post

You should be able to get much better value with another brand in my opinion. I have no idea why Future Shop and Energy don't offer the CF-70's, it really makes no sense and I'm sure it's very frustrating for you. Hopefully they make it up to us.

Well frustration-wise, it really looks like a toddler's tantrum when I take some distance. I mean, this is my first non-crap Home Theater setup and I'm still grinning when I listen to the CB-20s and CC-10. So I certainly don't *need* the CF-70, and probably much less the RC-70s. The apparent need only surfaced reading this thread; I fully admit and assume it In Maslow's hierarchy of needs, were high up there working onself-esteem and self-actualization

I'm just curious to try full-range floorstanding speakers and currently have some cash on hand (it's been a while since I gave myself a nice present). Plus, I really think towers would be slightly safer for my 14-month daughter. Considering the furniture in the living room, floorstanding towers could not really be toppled sideways (they'd be stopped by other furniture), and front-wise I guess it's almost impossible. Whereas the CB-20 could really hurt little toes if they felt.

Considering this, I'm not sure I even want to look at other brands, altough if you have suggestions, and we don't risk being linched, I'll welcome them. I few pages back someone mentioned Infinity Primus towers and those are available at Best Buy Canada. But maybe I should just wait until a really good occasion presents itself. The real frustration is that they are much less frequent in Canada itself.

Hey USA, don't you need a 51th state?
post #33667 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post

All,

I'm a happy owner of a pair of original C-6's and an AC-300 center, but my rear surrounds are just some old crappy 20 year old JBL book shelves. I jumped on the Denon 4311 deal a few weeks ago, and it should be here next Tuesday.

Can anyone recommend some Energy (or even Mirage) that will complement my fronts well? In particularly anything from Vanns, since they seem to have quite a few options from both brands on sale.

As much as I'd like to get a set of Veritas 6.3's and the matching center at these sale prices, probably not the wise move since my rears need replacing and don't even have a sub. Yet.

Thanks for any help or thoughts!

I have the C-8's but no centre for them. They are great speakers. What JBL's do you have?
I would say the RC speakers would compliment your C's pretty good. The RC-10's are on sale now at Vann's. What do you mostly use this system for?
post #33668 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by MACinPittsford View Post

I could be wrong on this, but I think running MCAAC always defaults to large, no matter what the speakers or sub.

Ah! that's good to know; I was really surprised that the CB-10 be considered LARGE. Maybe I should listen to the system again with the SMALL setting. Thanks for the information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CalgaryCowboy View Post

to neutro: The RC-70s are NOT available no matter what the website says. If they ever do get new stock in (like for boxing day) they should be 500-600 each but this may never happen. There hasn't been new stock since boxing day last year. Price was raised to $1200 after stock ran out.

That's funny -- so they raised the price on unavailable items, just to make it look like a bigger sale when they'll offer them? I've seen the the reverse before in other stores -- unbeatable prices on out-of-stock items...
post #33669 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Well frustration-wise, it really looks like a toddler's tantrum when I take some distance. I mean, this is my first non-crap Home Theater setup and I'm still grinning when I listen to the CB-20s and CC-10. So I certainly don't *need* the CF-70, and probably much less the RC-70s. The apparent need only surfaced reading this thread; I fully admit and assume it In Maslow's hierarchy of needs, were high up there working onself-esteem and self-actualization

I'm just curious to try full-range floorstanding speakers and currently have some cash on hand (it's been a while since I gave myself a nice present). Plus, I really think towers would be slightly safer for my 14-month daughter. Considering the furniture in the living room, floorstanding towers could not really be toppled sideways (they'd be stopped by other furniture), and front-wise I guess it's almost impossible. Whereas the CB-20 could really hurt little toes if they felt.

Considering this, I'm not sure I even want to look at other brands, altough if you have suggestions, and we don't risk being linched, I'll welcome them. I few pages back someone mentioned Infinity Primus towers and those are available at Best Buy Canada. But maybe I should just wait until a really good occasion presents itself. The real frustration is that they are much less frequent in Canada itself.

Hey USA, don't you need a 51th state?

This thread could make it very appealing for people to spend more money. I'm just glad that I had all but one of my Energy speakers bought before I joined in
I would buy used. I have seen some awesome older systems for great prices. You will end up coming out way ahead if you can find two towers and a centre. Just wait for an occasion like Boxing Day if nothing gets you excited before then.
post #33670 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post


That's funny -- so they raised the price on unavailable items, just to make it look like a bigger sale when they'll offer them? I've seen the the reverse before in other stores -- unbeatable prices on out-of-stock items...

I hate it when stores do that. I heard that S**rs got fined big time for it.
post #33671 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Even if you are prepared to pay these preposterous shipping and handling fees (because let's face it, even including them, it's almost half the price of what you can get in Canada), be sure to ask HiDef that they will, in fact, ship those to Canada. I'm pretty sure that Authorized Energy Dealers in the US are prohibited from shipping to Canada. For example, Amazon.com and Vann's refuse to ship Energy speakers to Canada.

You can get all towers at FS (most of the time) at 50% IF you buy a flatscreen!! I am not ordering them from HiDef, just posting the info for a FYI is all
post #33672 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post


Hey USA, don't you need a 51th state?

I think that Hawaii and Alaska would be happy to have a new bro, but it probably wouldn't help us out too much, for shipping anyways. They could tell us how it all worked though
post #33673 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Mardukous View Post

I have the C-8's but no centre for them. They are great speakers. What JBL's do you have?
I would say the RC speakers would compliment your C's pretty good. The RC-10's are on sale now at Vann's. What do you mostly use this system for?


Ah, I'd love a pair of C-8's. I wish I had gotten them back in '99 or so when I got my C-6's.

This is mainly our HT in our family room. When I listen to music I will typically just put the fronts on and listen while I have a beer, etc.

That being said, our rears or borderline directly lined up with our heads in our usual listening position. The rear right is behind us maybe a foot or so, but the rear left is pretty much lined up with our heads. With the layout, this is about the best we can do in terms of getting them "behind" us. Not sure if this would play into speaker selection or not.
post #33674 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by caper_1 View Post

You can get all towers at FS (most of the time) at 50% IF you buy a flatscreen!! I am not ordering them from HiDef, just posting the info for a FYI is all

Yeah, and not any flatscreen either, it has to be 60"+. Still an intersting offer as while I'm not in the market for a new tv, I know a few people who are. The thing is, FS don't have the CF-70s. Do you think if they offer 600$ RC-70s on boxing day, they would slash the price in half again with a 60" tv? 300$ RC-70s would be very interesting to say the least
post #33675 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Here's my understanding of bass management in receivers that can set speakers to SMALL or LARGE. When setting a speaker to SMALL, the audio stream to that speaker is split in low and high frequency components according to the crossover you specify. The low-frequency component is sent to the subwoofer and the high-frequency is sent to the speaker. This is useful for speakers that have trouble generating good bass. When set to LARGE, the speaker gets the audio stream in its integrality.

This is *on top* of the LFE (low frequency effects) channel (i.e. the .1 in 5.1 or 7.1), which is solely sent to the subwoofer if you have one. So even if you set your speaker to LARGE, the subwoofer will still be used for LFEs.

On some receivers (e.g. Pioneer), you when your speakers are set to LARGE, you can set the subwoofer to YES, NO or PLUS. The PLUS setting takes the low-frequency component of every channel and send it to the subwoofer, regardless of the size setting of the speakers. So even if you have LARGE speakers, the sub is also used for low-freqs other than the LFE channel.

Whether you prefer setting your speakers to SMALL, or to LARGE, or to LARGE + PLUS subwoofer is essentially a question of taste and will depend on the room and receiver also. But with CF-70s, I think I'd use LARGE, and if you have a particularly good sub that you want to hear for music, LARGE + PLUS sub if available on your receiver.

My setup is CB-20 fronts, CB-10 surrounds and a CC-10 center, and the Pionner calibration (MCACC) suggested that all speakers be set to LARGE. This is somewhat surprising, but overall, I like it a lot, altough I decided to use PLUS subwoofer in the end. With the SMALL setting, I think my sub (ESW-C8) sounds mushier than the CB-20s for low-freqs that are not just rumbles.

You have pretty much nailed this on the head. Many people forget there are 2 low frequency "streams". The LFE is a channel of it's own, exclusively for the subwoofer, and the main audio stream also has low frequency data as part of its entire bandwidth. I don't think there is a "right or wrong" setup regarding full-range towers (set small or LARGE) and subwoofer crossover selection. It really comes down to personal preference, but knowing what options you actually have is the key. I am not convinced at a response that upper frequencies suffer due to the power required for low freq reproduction by the speaker. I am convinced that the load on the receiver/amp will be reduced with mains set to small supplemented by a sub.
The BOLD above in your quote ... my Yamaha is different, where "Sub + Mains" will deliver bass to mains if set Large. The "NO" setting for sub is the only one where the LFE will get sent to mains.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Well for americans at least. In the mean time we canadians still got no deals to speak of. Reading these recent discussions in the thread, I was thinking of upgrading my bookshelves to floorstanding speakers..

Yeah, we definitely don't get them as often! I remember an awesome deal on the RC-LCR for $279 at FS !! with free shipping. And see below on the 70's special.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Mardukous View Post

I got my RC-70's when they were being sold at Future Shop for $500 a piece.
I'm thinking that Future Shop will be getting a few more in. Time will tell soon.

Me 2...amazing deal. Got the last pair in-store.
post #33676 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post

Ah, I'd love a pair of C-8's. I wish I had gotten them back in '99 or so when I got my C-6's.

This is mainly our HT in our family room. When I listen to music I will typically just put the fronts on and listen while I have a beer, etc.

That being said, our rears or borderline directly lined up with our heads in our usual listening position. The rear right is behind us maybe a foot or so, but the rear left is pretty much lined up with our heads. With the layout, this is about the best we can do in terms of getting them "behind" us. Not sure if this would play into speaker selection or not.

That's always the case when there is a top of the line model that is available I bought mine used and I have no complaints.
What is your budget for surrounds?
Maybe a CR-10 would work for you, although I haven't heard them myself, the style of them looks about right if you can raise it above your head.
I would also consider trying to get used RC-R's or a V-S if your room and budget allows.
post #33677 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Do you think if they offer 600$ RC-70s on boxing day, they would slash the price in half again with a 60" tv? 300$ RC-70s would be very interesting to say the least

No, that is extremely unlikely.
post #33678 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by caper_1 View Post

The BOLD above in your quote ... my Yamaha is different, where "Sub + Mains" will deliver bass to mains if set Large. The "NO" setting for sub is the only one where the LFE will get sent to mains.

I think we're saying the same thing, I fully agree with your statement.
  • LARGE or SMALL speakers, sub=NO -> everything including LFE sent to speakers
  • LARGE speakers, sub=YES -> only LFE sent to subwoofer, all freqs to speakers
  • LARGE speakers, sub=PLUS -> all freqs to speakers, LFE + under-crossover frequencies sent to subwoofer
  • SMALL speakers, sub=YES -> over-crossover frequencies to speakers, LFE + under-crossover frequencies sent to subwoofer

So with LARGE + PLUS sub, the speakers get a shot at everything but the sub helps with the bass. Not sure if there is a layer of processing other than the low-pass filter to what is sent to the sub it his setting. Some will not like the same content sent to both mains and sub I guess, so they should use SMALL if they want the sub to be used for content other than LFE.
post #33679 of 51538
So I'm about to pre-order the RC-70s from Vanns just so that I'm set when then come in. Then pickup a RC-LCR and use my present take classics for surrounds. With that said I'm sure I'll want to upgrade my surrounds at some point in the future and then much later down the road the sub. Since the RC-minis are hard to come by I'll likely end up with the Veritas mini as my only option. Does anyone see any problem pairing the V-mini with RC mains?

I was thinking about grabbing a couple for V-6.3' from hi def lifestyle but they're out of black which is pretty much a must the room I'm putting them in.

I suppose my other option would be to wait it out to see if the Veritas are indeed going to other re-sellers and if their price will continue to drop. Maybe this is the ideal option although I'm a bit scared of some of the items I've read regarding them needing a quality amp to drive them. Seems like the consensus is that the RC series are more forgiving with a lower powered receiver. I'm using a pioneer VSX-919AH if it matters at all.
post #33680 of 51538
rscecil007,

Where might you be located? If you are close to southern CA (california), johnb4467 has a pair of C-8's in rosewood that I believe he might be willing to part with. Try PMing him.
post #33681 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Mardukous View Post

That's always the case when there is a top of the line model that is available I bought mine used and I have no complaints.
What is your budget for surrounds?
Maybe a CR-10 would work for you, although I haven't heard them myself, the style of them looks about right if you can raise it above your head.
I would also consider trying to get used RC-R's or a V-S if your room and budget allows.

Honestly after buying that 4311 my budget is zero.

But I was just looking and if something was just one of those "shouldn't pass it up deals" on Vanns I was considering splurging. The Veritas Surrounds look nice, and are well over 50% off.

The CR10's wouldn't work, as both rear speakers are on shelves about head high. This is our main/only living area, so there's quite alot I'd like to do that wouldn't get the WAF.
post #33682 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by torht View Post

rscecil007,

Where might you be located? If you are close to southern CA (california), johnb4467 has a pair of C-8's in rosewood that I believe he might be willing to part with. Try PMing him.


Thanks.

I'm in Seattle. As much as I'd like them, be best bang for my buck right now is upgrading my rears and getting a sub. But if I ever find a pair closer where I could drive and pick them up, I might jump on it.
post #33683 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post

Ah, I'd love a pair of C-8's. I wish I had gotten them back in '99 or so when I got my C-6's.

This is mainly our HT in our family room. When I listen to music I will typically just put the fronts on and listen while I have a beer, etc.

That being said, our rears or borderline directly lined up with our heads in our usual listening position. The rear right is behind us maybe a foot or so, but the rear left is pretty much lined up with our heads. With the layout, this is about the best we can do in terms of getting them "behind" us. Not sure if this would play into speaker selection or not.

as an FYI, the surrounds in a 5.1 setup are actually NOT "rears" but should technically be towards the sides.



So you don't have to have them behind you. That said, due to room constraints many people end up with the surrounds behind them, and it can be a problem if they have to be close to your heads as you describe.

Given these constraints, I would second the recommendation of a bipole/dipole type wall-mounted surround like the CR-10. Thankfully, Energy speakers are neutral enough that they will be close enough tonally to blend as surrounds, so you won't have to worry about mixing generations.

My friend's budget rig that I set up for him has C-2's as mains, a newer TAKE FPS as center, and a pair of the Take 1 satellites (from the original Take 5 setup) as surrounds, and it all blends just fine.

EDIT: also if in-wall or in-ceiling speakers are an option for surrounds, there are phenomenal deals ($99 each) on remaining stock of RC in-walls.
post #33684 of 51538
Batpig,

That's what I was thinking (in terms of surrounds being more to the sides than behind), but I've not really been into HT for quite some time (~10 years), so wasn't sure how any of the new processing might have changed they way to look at them when you start having 9 channels, 11 channels, etc.

But the picture you posted is more or less how our surrounds are, so that's good to know, thanks for showing that.

I can pretty much tell you the WAF will be better for the Veritas Surrounds b/c of looks (plus my C-6's and AC300 are piano gloss black.) So in terms of this are they worth $130 more for a pair over the CR-10's?
post #33685 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsceneJesster View Post

I just saw someone bring up crossover settings so I figured I would propose a question regarding them. My receiver is a Yamaha RX-V867 and I believe it can only assign one crossover for all of my speakers. I have been using a crossover of 80 and it sounds pretty good. I have a pair of CF-70's along with a CC-10 up front and a pair of CB-10's for surrounds. I know the CF-70's have no problem but can the rest of my speakers handle a crossover of 80Hz?

the CB-10's and CC-10 can easily handle an 80Hz crossover, no problem.


Quote:


My receiver does allow some speakers to be set small and others large. I have always used the small setting for everything though. Are you saying that if I set the towers to large then the crossover I have for the rest of the speakers does not apply to the towers?

correct, there is no "crossover" on a speaker set to LARGE by definition.


Quote:


If I did this, at what point would the receiver stop sending low freaquency to the towers?

it wouldn't, again by definition the LARGE setting means "full range", so the CF-70's would not cut off the low freq's to them at all, they would get the full signal intended for FR/FL channels.

the only way to then re-route FR/FL bass to the subs (in addition to LFE) would be to activate "double bass" as discussed above by the others.

all that said.... I would stick to your current setting.
post #33686 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post

I can pretty much tell you the WAF will be better for the Veritas Surrounds b/c of looks (plus my C-6's and AC300 are piano gloss black.) So in terms of this are they worth $130 more for a pair over the CR-10's?

if the price gap is only $130 then heck yeah, the Veritas are MUCH MUCH higher quality speakers than the entry-level C-series. The current C's (CB, CF, CR) are nowhere near the quality of your "even number" Connoisseurs.

that said you could probably get CR-10's for much cheaper than that. The V surrounds retail for $1000+ for the pair, vs. only $369 for the CR-10's.

But if you are willing to pony up for the V surrounds then by all means... note that they are pretty massive surround speakers, much larger than the CR-10's (about double the size and weight).
post #33687 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post

Batpig,

That's what I was thinking (in terms of surrounds being more to the sides than behind), but I've not really been into HT for quite some time (~10 years), so wasn't sure how any of the new processing might have changed they way to look at them when you start having 9 channels, 11 channels, etc.

But the picture you posted is more or less how our surrounds are, so that's good to know, thanks for showing that.

I can pretty much tell you the WAF will be better for the Veritas Surrounds b/c of looks (plus my C-6's and AC300 are piano gloss black.) So in terms of this are they worth $130 more for a pair over the CR-10's?

I have the CR-10s and I'll tell you, the WAF is nice. My wife really likes the look of them (with their grills on, or off, but mostly on). They look alot better in person than they do in pictures. The sound is also distributed very nice. I played MW2 (yeah I know, it's not the newest one) last night, and I could tell EXACTLY where guys were when they were behind me.

(Oh and something to keep in mind, the CR-10s are much bigger than they seem. It's a good thing though as they don't weigh too much and can be hung on the wall with a standard screw.)
post #33688 of 51538
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post


if the price gap is only $130 then heck yeah, the Veritas are MUCH MUCH higher quality speakers than the entry-level C-series. The current C's (CB, CF, CR) are nowhere near the quality of your "even number" Connoisseurs.

that said you could probably get CR-10's for much cheaper than that. The V surrounds retail for $1000+ for the pair, vs. only $369 for the CR-10's.

But if you are willing to pony up for the V surrounds then by all means... note that they are pretty massive surround speakers, much larger than the CR-10's (about double the size and weight).

What makes some people say the current C's are better than the old ones and others say the old ones are better? I've never heard the old ones but im curious to know what kind of sound they have. I have also heard some say that the CF-70's are the best sounding C-Series speaker ever made. Why is that and wouldn't you think it sounds the same as the rest of them? Does it sound different due to the extra drivers or does it use different drivers?
post #33689 of 51538
The CF-70 isn't as good as the even numbered C-series speakers made in the late 90's or the C-7, C-9 from the early 2000's. The people that say that probably haven't heard the older Energy models.

Either that or they like brighter sounding speakers which would explain why they prefer the CF-70.
post #33690 of 51538
Has anyone had any success having vann's match high def lifestyle's price on the 6.3 and 5.2 center channels? I'm tired of waiting for the Rc-70s and looking towards the veritas line now.
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