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Energy Owners Thread - Page 1639

post #49141 of 51511
Is your space conducive to wall mounting? I went back and forth on stands for quite a while, and just decided to wall mount (although speaker position may not be optimal), because I just couldn't bear the thought of a stand tipping over. Also, how is the Oppo? You and I have almost the exact same setup minus the RC 10's, I'm using some older Polk Monitor 30s for my back surrounds. Wish I would have jumped on some of the RC 10s while they were still available AND on sale!
post #49142 of 51511
RC-R really should be wall mounted if at all possible.
post #49143 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by grizimes View Post

Is your space conducive to wall mounting? I went back and forth on stands for quite a while, and just decided to wall mount (although speaker position may not be optimal), because I just couldn't bear the thought of a stand tipping over. Also, how is the Oppo? You and I have almost the exact same setup minus the RC 10's, I'm using some older Polk Monitor 30s for my back surrounds. Wish I would have jumped on some of the RC 10s while they were still available AND on sale!
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

RC-R really should be wall mounted if at all possible.

Wall mount would work on one side, not sure about the other as the "theater" portion of the room has another open, connected area on one side, unless I rethink the configuration.

As I understand it, optimal placement for the surrounds would be on either side of the main listening area, in this case a sofa, would you agree with this? So people must be wall-mounting these fairly low, 2-3 feet? Any mount recommendations?

grizimes, the Oppo is remarkable. I've been messing around with it for the past few days, playing SACD's and lots of audio. Last night was the first time I tried it with the Energy setup, so I threw in Lord Of The Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring and cranked it up pretty well. I was blown away by the opening sequence and would up watching the first 20 minutes or so of the movie. Last night was also the first run with the 12" sub, and I was amazed at the amount of air that thing moves. This setup is on a whole different level for me, so still largely in discovery phase.

Image-wise and sound wise, the Oppo definitely outpaces anything I've owned previously, and the build quality is very evident, even down to the remote.
post #49144 of 51511
Upgrading one of my TRIO12's (The one with the APR 15) to SDX12. Driver arrived today !!
post #49145 of 51511
I've actually got my VS surrounds directly on the side of my main listening position. On one side I was able to mount it on the wall, and did so at about 5 1/2 feet. I was unable to mount the other side surround on the wall as I have a brick fireplace on that side, so I just have it sitting on the mantle. It sits a bit higher than the other. Again, not optimal for best sound, but I was trying to work with what I had, and did not want to risk putting my speakers on stands (and I don't have little ones or dogs big enough that would knock something over).

I've been considering an Oppo for some time now, although it is third on my upgrade list (sitting behind upgrading my panel to a Panny ST60 and probably a Denon X4000). This hobby never ends because once I upgrade my AVR, I will probably look into external amplification from Emotiva.

Sonic Nirvana....biggrin.gif
post #49146 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by grizimes View Post

I've actually got my VS surrounds directly on the side of my main listening position. On one side I was able to mount it on the wall, and did so at about 5 1/2 feet. I was unable to mount the other side surround on the wall as I have a brick fireplace on that side, so I just have it sitting on the mantle. It sits a bit higher than the other. Again, not optimal for best sound, but I was trying to work with what I had, and did not want to risk putting my speakers on stands (and I don't have little ones or dogs big enough that would knock something over).

I've been considering an Oppo for some time now, although it is third on my upgrade list (sitting behind upgrading my panel to a Panny ST60 and probably a Denon X4000). This hobby never ends because once I upgrade my AVR, I will probably look into external amplification from Emotiva.

Sonic Nirvana....biggrin.gif

Yeah, I can see that road ahead. Already want an x3000 or x4000 to replace the Onkyo, and have been eyeing SVS and Outlaw subs for a while now.



I'm going to take a hard look at the listening area tonight and see if I can make wall mounts work.
post #49147 of 51511
I know it's not the thread to say this on, but you NEED to seriously consider Outlaw. I own an EX and a Plus. Could not be more satisfied.
post #49148 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjoelo View Post

Yeah, I can see that road ahead. Already want an x3000 or x4000 to replace the Onkyo, and have been eyeing SVS and Outlaw subs for a while now.



I'm going to take a hard look at the listening area tonight and see if I can make wall mounts work.
SVS PB-1000 is outstanding, $530 delivered.
post #49149 of 51511
Those subs will all be a consideration, but that's a way's out for the time being. Hoping to audition both of them somewhere beforehand.

Speaking of subs, I really liked this article from SVS:

http://www.svsound.com/digital-bass-management
post #49150 of 51511
I just bought a Denon 2808ci on ebay which comes with Audyssey MultiEQ XT with Advanced Low Frequency Correction (ALFC). I can't wait to try it out whenever it arrives in the mail. I am absolutely in love with my new B&K amp and what it did to my Energy speakers. Now I am just wondering just how good is XT with the Energy RC-70's? Should the difference be just as dramatic as the amp or will the sound quality differences be more subtle? Not really sure how much of an impact this will have but Dynamic EQ and Dynamic volume didn't come out until the 2809ci model so I won't have that.
post #49151 of 51511
I've got a 2809 and 2807 and tried both with my RC-70's. I like what the 2809 did better. Maybe its because of Dynamic EQ, I'm not sure. But I also read MultEQ XT was improved from the 2807. Not sure where your 2808 fits in.

The 2807 has Room EQ and your 2808 has ALFC? Are they similiar? Were there enhancements made to XT from 07 to 08 models?

Is your B&K just an amp? If so what processor or receiver was connected to it?
post #49152 of 51511
I don't know how much XT was improved but the 2807 measures 6 pts and the 2808ci that will be arriving has 8 pts of measurement. So I think there should be a difference.

As far as the 2807 vs 2808 goes the 2808 has Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio. Other than that it is pretty much identical to the 2807. I think it does have better Audyssey for the speakers though but I am unsure. I did more research and apparently the ALFC is an improvement for sub frequencies.

My B&K is just an amplifer. Not an integrated amp so no real volume control other than volume level matching knobs on the back which is why I need the Denon as a processor and preouts. I connected it to an Onkyo 509 surround back pre-outs and ran it in all channel stereo mode.

Was just wondering since everyone says EQ is so good and necessary for these speakers and so many like Denon how much of a difference it should make. I am quite please with the way they sound right now. The only very minor thing is that voices when watching movies at low volumes can be a little too smooth and hard to hear. Other than that I really like them now that they have ample power.
Edited by Porthos01 - 9/5/13 at 7:55am
post #49153 of 51511
EQ isn't necessary for your speakers, per se, it's because of your ROOM. Room acoustics have a profound influence on the sound you hear and that's the point of these systems, that's why they are really known as "room correction" systems. The end result is that your speakers should have greater clarity and overall integration, and you thus hear the source more accurately.

The 2808 (as with all the other xx08 models) did receive a couple of improvements to Audyssey MultEQ. Most importantly, the ALFC (adaptive low frequency correction) technology was added to MultEQ by Audyssey, which allowed for much greater subwoofer filter resolution. The original version of MultEQ XT had 16x resolution filters on the satellites AND subwoofer channel. ALFC allowed for an 8x increase in subwoofer resolution to 128x, so there is much finer correction of the subwoofer frequencies (which are the most susceptible to room acoustics). The most benefit from this is gained by running your speakers at a higher crossover (80Hz+) to allow more bass to go to the hi rez filters in the sub channel.

The two other small changes were the increase in DSP resources allowing for 8 measurements instead of 6 to feed the system more data, and also the change from the "puck" shape microphone to the current "eiffel tower" shaped, which delivers more accurate results in the high frequencies.
post #49154 of 51511
I just got my two EAS-6Cst's today. It will be a while before I install those, but for the sake of others in this tread, I wanted to give you a few comments about that product. I think EAS stands for Energy Architect Series? Anyway this series use drivers from earlier Connoisseur lines I think. The 6Cst are stereo speakers, meaning they got one woofer but two tweeters, independently playing the content from two speaker-level inputs (the low-frequency part is summed for the woofer). By the way, they're not plain white but a very light beige-gray. So on a pure white ceiling, they'd need to be painted to really fit.

The goal for these are two play stereo content on a single speaker, which is especially useful for spaces that are limited in size or which do not have a particular preferred orientation. I bought two, but each one will be playing stereo content on its own. I'm not trying to create stereo separation by using two speakers -- the exercise would be pointless in an L-shaped diner and kitchen area.

Because of the name, I thought however they would be pretty similar to the Energy RC-6Cst, which is the (by now discontinued) RC-series stereo in-ceiling speaker. I really ought to buy those instead a few years ago when Crutchfield had the last ones still in stock. Anyway. The RC-6Cst were neat because 1) the tweeters were independently aimable, 2) you could use either one or two inputs, and 3) with one input you could use both tweeters in either bipole or dipole mode. Thus in a pinch they'd make great surround or surround back speakers.

Those feature are not there at all on the EAS-6Cst however: the tweeters are in a fixed position, both firing directly downward (so no fancy angles to get stereo effects from reflections); there are not bipole or dipole mode on these speakers. I can't yet comment on how they sound, but they look well built. They would just be a poor choice for any home theater use however because they seem to require dual inputs and the tweeters can't be aimed at the listening position. For any home theater use, in the absence of the RC in-ceiling speakers, the EAS-6C and EAS-8C would be better choices.
post #49155 of 51511
@ batpig : Does changing the microphone supplied with any receiver for room correction would help it giving a more accurate "repair"? Pretty sure the answer is yes, as these puck microphones look dirty cheap... Good alternative to REW, for those among us who are pretty new to the audio passion? I could go that way, if it is a good idea, for sure.

@ neutro : You sure that you won't install them before years? They seem to intrigate you a lot, and a audio-lover with a new gadget sleeping in the closet? I don't believe it's going to happen hehe =D
post #49156 of 51511
I'm not sure I understand your question. If you are asking if you can improve the calibration by using a different mic, then the answer is no. The calibration file for the given mic is pre loaded into the receiver. Even if you got a higher quality mic it wouldn't improve the calibration because the receiver doesn't know the freq response of the superior mic.
post #49157 of 51511
Ahhh dang, it was precisely my question. Sorry for being unclear, my french dude english has its limitations haha!

Seems like I won't have the choice to delve into REW and it's complicated graphs haha!

Thanks for the answer
post #49158 of 51511
So I now join those family Energy users with their children's artistic creations added to the beauty of their speakers. My daughter decided to take an orange crayon to beautify my LCD screen, the top of my RC-LCR and part of the grill to the RC-LCR as well. Any tips on getting crayon off? I didn't want to touch it at all in fear of damaging it. A damp cloth took the crayon off my LCD screen. I left the TV on for a while to heat up the screen so the crayon partially melted off and came off easy enough, but I fear for my speaker grill. The crayon might come off easily from the speaker itself too, but again, don't want to use something that would mark or damage it more.
post #49159 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macstatic View Post

So I now join those family Energy users with their children's artistic creations added to the beauty of their speakers. My daughter decided to take an orange crayon to beautify my LCD screen, the top of my RC-LCR and part of the grill to the RC-LCR as well. Any tips on getting crayon off? I didn't want to touch it at all in fear of damaging it. A damp cloth took the crayon off my LCD screen. I left the TV on for a while to heat up the screen so the crayon partially melted off and came off easy enough, but I fear for my speaker grill. The crayon might come off easily from the speaker itself too, but again, don't want to use something that would mark or damage it more.

Maybe try some warm/hot water and a microfiber towel and slowly try to get it off? I wouldn't use anything abrasive or any chemicals on the finish of the speakers. If you can't get the crayon off the grill, a replacement should be relatively cheap
post #49160 of 51511
I would think the grill would be easy -- take it the back yard and hose it off. Once it dries it should be back to new.

For the speaker you should be able to wipe it off with a damp microfiber cloth as suggested above. You may be able to carefully pick off any big chunks of wax with your fingernails or maybe something soft (like a wooden popsicle stick?) and then wipe the rest off. A microfiber cloth won't damage the finish so you can rub with some decent pressure.
post #49161 of 51511
Is Energy coming out with a new energy speaker line? For a while everyone seemed to be excited about that.

NOTE: My little comparison below was with the RC-70 3-way vs V-5.2 2-way. AND no Audyssey.
I just got done comparing my RC's and Veritas speaker now that I have them hooked up to the onkyo surround back preout with bass cut-off at 80hz and 100hz. I must say I now favor the RC's. They seem fuller and more balanced. The Veritas seem clearer but the treble is a bit too much. Seems to overpower many other frequencies and lose fullness (I have no idea how the V6.3 compares but I did cut off low bass frequencies with the LCR). The high end is louder, sweeter and more detailed though. Definitely not strident or harsh. Many in the polk website forums seemed to love B&K since it seemed to tame bright speakers. So the sweetness of the tweeter may be due to that.

I would say the Veritas treble is a tad too much. On the other hand it had the better high frequencies. A new Energy speaker like the RC's with the treble somewhere between the old RC and newer Veritas. Then add the current Veritas tweeter and there would be the perfect RC speaker.

Also does cutting off frequencies below 80hz and 100hz make a good comparison (negate advantages) between a 2way and 3way? The RC's had greater detail separation. The Veritas on the other had more detail, just blended together more.

BTW this contradicts what I said a few months ago but back then I wasn't powering them correctly. I am a noob and this has been a learning experience for me. My opinions of these speakers will likely change again when I get to try Audyssey XT smile.gif.

Also one last thing. The RC-70's are bass monsters. I left the room and went into the wide open area of the house. Cranked the speakers as loud as I dared (VERY LOUD) to "Suavamente" and "Salome" Latin mix. No distortion and my feet could really feel the bass when I was outside of my bedroom (I am upstairs). Since I wasn't even in the room I was very impressed. Just to be safe though I set a 60hz bass limit on my speakers afterwards. I wouldn't have even dared to do this without an amp and won't even dare trying it again without the crossover set. I don't want to push my luck just in case I over-estimate my amp.
Edited by Porthos01 - 9/6/13 at 7:36pm
post #49162 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porthos01 View Post

Is Energy coming out with a new energy speaker line? For a while everyone seemed to be excited about that.
They say they are, but there is a lot of skepticism about what they will be offering. Likely soundbars and/or entry level speakers.
post #49163 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menasor View Post

Maybe try some warm/hot water and a microfiber towel and slowly try to get it off? I wouldn't use anything abrasive or any chemicals on the finish of the speakers. If you can't get the crayon off the grill, a replacement should be relatively cheap

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

I would think the grill would be easy -- take it the back yard and hose it off. Once it dries it should be back to new.

For the speaker you should be able to wipe it off with a damp microfiber cloth as suggested above. You may be able to carefully pick off any big chunks of wax with your fingernails or maybe something soft (like a wooden popsicle stick?) and then wipe the rest off. A microfiber cloth won't damage the finish so you can rub with some decent pressure.

Awesome suggestions guys, thanks. I will definitely do this.
post #49164 of 51511
Hey guys,

The V-5.2-C arrived today. I haven't hooked it up yet, I'm still trying to figure out if it fits or not.

Just how close can the speaker be to the TV? What are the negative effects of it practically touching it (literally a fraction of an inch of space there). It's a plasma (panasonic 65" vt50) if it matters.

The shelves to the stand are glass. I'm currently trying the mousepad option mentioned a few pages back for angling the speaker upwards. If it isn't necessary, I'd prefer actually putting it directly on the glass so it gives enough space to slide it around underneath the TV (which it doesn't have with the pad). What are the downsides to just putting the speaker on the shelf apart from the direction of the speaker not aiming directly at my head? Or is this all a moot point and the proximity of the speaker to the TV is too close and there are issues involving either vibrations or electro-magnetism interference type stuff?




Edited by SynestheticGoat - 9/7/13 at 8:54am
post #49165 of 51511
Leave it angled up. You will get the speaker aimed more directly at your ears and avoid reflections off the glass surface. If you had it flat and pushed back farther there would be more surface in front of the speaker to reflect sound creating muddiness in dialogue clarity. Plus the rubber of the mouse pad will provide some isolation from vibrations of the glass.

You don't have to worry about interference with flat panels, they are not magnetized like older CRT displays. But I would recommend plugging the rear port because otherwise you will get boomy sound from the port firing into the "cave" behind the speaker.
post #49166 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Porthos01 View Post

I would say the Veritas treble is a tad too much. On the other hand it had the better high frequencies. A new Energy speaker like the RC's with the treble somewhere between the old RC and newer Veritas. Then add the current Veritas tweeter and there would be the perfect RC speaker.

What you are describing is the REAL Veritas, the 2nd gen (V2.2, V2.3 etc). It offers the best of both worlds. Superior detail, transparency and clarity than the RCs without any of the harshness of the Klipsch Veritas.

I would not recommend holding your breath for the current Audiovox owners Energy brand to come out with a speaker that is anywhere in this league.

To your other question I would recommend comparing the speakers full range, not cutting off the bass. 3 way vs 2 way doesn't have much to do with the bass, it's more about the midrange. That's why you are hearing the greater separation on the RC-70.
post #49167 of 51511
this thread sure is massive and i just know the info i need is in here somewhere... but i couldnt find it.

With the RC LCR being completely non existant anymore, what are people recommending as the best match for RC10s? (i have 2 rc 10s and the rest of the 7.1 are Micros). I sure wish i could yank out the micro center and drop in an LCR but i havent been able to find one.
post #49168 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Leave it angled up. You will get the speaker aimed more directly at your ears and avoid reflections off the glass surface. If you had it flat and pushed back farther there would be more surface in front of the speaker to reflect sound creating muddiness in dialogue clarity. Plus the rubber of the mouse pad will provide some isolation from vibrations of the glass.

You don't have to worry about interference with flat panels, they are not magnetized like older CRT displays. But I would recommend plugging the rear port because otherwise you will get boomy sound from the port firing into the "cave" behind the speaker.

Okay. Thanks! After the money spent getting it, I'm kind of glad to be squeezing it in there and will be capable of using it. It's not clear from the picture, but I do have the blu-ray players to the left of the cc speaker. Those shouldn't have problems being close either, right? There's an inch and a half to two inches between them.

The second of the bookshelves just showed up and I picked up the stands this morning, so I guess I've got something I should be doing this weekend.
post #49169 of 51511
Quote:
Originally Posted by cityinruin View Post

this thread sure is massive and i just know the info i need is in here somewhere... but i couldnt find it.

With the RC LCR being completely non existant anymore, what are people recommending as the best match for RC10s? (i have 2 rc 10s and the rest of the 7.1 are Micros). I sure wish i could yank out the micro center and drop in an LCR but i havent been able to find one.

Patience. The RC-LCR is the BEST match. There are others that may work, but many will tell you the same thing: wait, and search craigslist and eBay daily smile.gif
post #49170 of 51511
I have been searching everywhere for just about a year. Ive been kicking my self literally non stop ever since i passed up on it being on sale for like 250 or 300 last summer. UGGggg! /wris
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