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Energy Owners Thread - Page 1641

post #49201 of 51489
I need a little member critique on my setup. I want to expand my 5.2 HT to 7.2. I am currently using Energy CR-3 as surrounds and want to add front height/wide speakers. My dilemma is I am not sure if I should move the CR-3s as front height/wide speakers and use my CR-10s as surrounds or vice versa. What do u guys think? Here is a current pic of my setup. I am waiting on my taperwire to be delivered to use on my surrounds and front height/wide speakers.82" Mitsubishi DLP, flanked by Energy CF-70 towers, Energy CC-10 center, and dual Mirage S10 subs. All powered by Yamaha RX-V773 receiver82" Mitsubishi DLP, flanked by Energy CF-70 towers, Energy CC-10 center, and dual Mirage S10 subs. All powered by Yamaha RX-V773 receiverEnergy CR-3 right surround with Leo ready to take his spot for movie timeEnergy CR-3 left surroundLiving room/HT room
post #49202 of 51489
Btw, sorry about the double pic post
post #49203 of 51489
I would leave the CR-3 where they are. They are awesome surround speakers and they are already mounted nicely.

Wides/heights should really be direct firing anyway, although the CR-10 I'm sure will work fine for heights in a pinch. Have you already bought the CR-10's? They aren't a part of your current setup right?

Either way I don't see wides being a realistic option for you, you've got big hallway openings to either side of your FR/FL speakers.

Side note but with all those tile flooring and bare walls, you could probably stand to improve the acoustics a bit. Looks like you've already got a rug on the floor but that's a lot of naked wall in that room. You can get some nice decorative acoustics panels (either solid color or printed with artwork of your choice) which will help you both acoustically and aesthetically: http://www.atsacoustics.com/panels
post #49204 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

I would leave the CR-3 where they are. They are awesome surround speakers and they are already mounted nicely.

Wides/heights should really be direct firing anyway, although the CR-10 I'm sure will work fine for heights in a pinch. Have you already bought the CR-10's? They aren't a part of your current setup right?

Either way I don't see wides being a realistic option for you, you've got big hallway openings to either side of your FR/FL speakers.

Side note but with all those tile flooring and bare walls, you could probably stand to improve the acoustics a bit. Looks like you've already got a rug on the floor but that's a lot of naked wall in that room. You can get some nice decorative acoustics panels (either solid color or printed with artwork of your choice) which will help you both acoustically and aesthetically: http://www.atsacoustics.com/panels
I do have the CR-10s, I was considering mounting them about 3-5ft above the towers and aiming at the sitting area. I have yet to mount them anywhere though.

I do agree about the bare walls. I have some cool paitnings that i want to mount once I decide speaker placement. Do you think that the wood blinds help with room acoustics? I was thinking of removing them but my wife might have a heart attack.

Also, the CR-10s have a di/bi pole switch. Which would be suitable for my application if I use them as height/wide speakers?
post #49205 of 51489
Quote:
Also, the CR-10s have a di/bi pole switch. Which would be suitable for my application if I use them as height/wide speakers?

Again, they will be heights, not wides. You don't have room for wides. If you mount them up high..... they are heights! In this application you will DEFINITELY want bipole not dipole, dipole will make it even more diffuse.

You should also mount them higher than you are planning. 3-5 feet is barely any separation from the mains, you might not even hear them at all especially with the diffuse radiation pattern. The height effect is enhanced the more vertical separation you get -- after all, the point is to stretch the soundfield VERTICALLY right? Plus it appears you have high vaulted ceilings, why would you not want to utilize that height? You haven't mentioned what receiver you have but for a lot of processing (e.g. Audyssey DSX) a 45 degree angle of elevation is recommended, so if you are sitting for example 10 feet from the front wall you'd want the height speakers 10 feet up.

I wouldn't go to the trouble of removing the shutters, I am no acoustician but I can't imagine their impact is great one way or the other, especially not relative to the vast expanses of bare walls and tile floors. Doesn't seem worth the WAF penalty, and then you'd be exposing reflective glass from the window. ADDING treatments to all those bare walls is the way to go, it will deaden what looks like a very echoey/live room.
post #49206 of 51489
Batpig, yes they will be heights. I always add "wides" in my wording to be politically correct, lol. My HT is powered by a Yamaha RX-V773.
post #49207 of 51489
Politically correct? So wides get mad when you label them as heights? tongue.gif

If it's a Yamaha then technically they are actually "presence" speakers in Yammy nomenclature. You might want to check the manual and/or ask in a Yammy owners thread for the recommended placement of presence speakers, since they will use Yamaha's proprietary "enhanced" processing.
post #49208 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Politically correct? So wides get mad when you label them as heights? tongue.gif

If it's a Yamaha then technically they are actually "presence" speakers in Yammy nomenclature. You might want to check the manual and/or ask in a Yammy owners thread for the recommended placement of presence speakers, since they will use Yamaha's proprietary "enhanced" processing.
I will do that, thanks for your help.
post #49209 of 51489
Hi All,

I will finally have the V-2.0S speakers I have wanted, and I have a bit of a dilemma, albeit a nice one in my opinion.

I now have RC-70's with a V5.2C in the front. The new speakers will replace my V-Minis as surrounds, but my problem is what to do with the Minis. I was thinking about replacing the CC-10 that I now have as a rear with them, or leaving it where it is and using the Minis as "presence" speakers driven by my Yamaha 6190. I wonder if the two Minis will give me better quality sound than the one CC-10 for music......... which is what I am looking for. I prefer to use all speakers for music in 7 channel stereo. Yeah, I know--I only have 6 right now. rolleyes.gif

Also, I wonder which is a "better" speaker--the V2.0S or the V-S. Just curious.

I guess the proof will be just doing it, but your opinions would be helpful.

What do you think?
post #49210 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssthrd View Post

Also, I wonder which is a "better" speaker--the V2.0S or the V-S. Just curious.
not sure exactly what a V2.0S is - do you mean V2.0R? If so, the V2.0R is a better speaker, but the VS' are a better match for the rest of your speakers.
post #49211 of 51489
The V2.0R's use the same tweeter/woofer as the V2.1's. As an experiment, set them on top of your RC-70's and run them in stereo to hear what the V2 series has to offer. Let us know what you think!
Edited by Fears4Ears - 9/12/13 at 12:20am
post #49212 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post

not sure exactly what a V2.0S is - do you mean V2.0R? If so, the V2.0R is a better speaker, but the VS' are a better match for the rest of your speakers.

Sorry brendelac. I got my ares and esses mixed up smile.gif

"The V2.0R's use the same tweeter/woofer as the V2.1's. As an experiment, set them on top of your RC-70's and run them in stereo to hear what the V2 series has to offer. Let us know what you think!"

Great idea Fears4Ears. I'll have them in a couple of weeks and will try it.
post #49213 of 51489
Note that the knob on the side is a volume control for the side firing drivers. At minimum volume the V2.0R is basically a direct firing 2-way speaker.
post #49214 of 51489
Thanks batpig. I don't really understand why the speakers have a volume control. Should I run YPAO first and then play with the volume?
post #49215 of 51489
Looking for comments from V2 series Veritas users that have compared them being driven by an AVR and dedicated power amp. I'm considering a Emotiva XPA-3, but for $700 I'd be expecting a significant upgrade from my Denon AVR-3312.
post #49216 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post

Looking for comments from V2 series Veritas users that have compared them being driven by an AVR and dedicated power amp. I'm considering a Emotiva XPA-3, but for $700 I'd be expecting a significant upgrade from my Denon AVR-3312.


By all means if you have the funds, go for it! Also, I recommend checking out the "Emotiv-eh" board on the Emotiva Lounge site for deals from other Canadian members on Emotiva amps!

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/board/11/emotiv-eh
post #49217 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssthrd View Post

Thanks batpig. I don't really understand why the speakers have a volume control. Should I run YPAO first and then play with the volume?

Its not a volume control for the speaker, its a volume control for the side firing drivers only. This is so you can adjust the amount of dispersion the speaker provides. If you turn the volume knob all the way down, only the main tweeter and woofer on the front of the speaker will be firing. So it essentially becomes a direct 2-way speaker. If you turn the volume all the way up, the side drivers will be firing with the front drivers to provide more dispersion of the sound, which is typically desired for a surround speaker.
post #49218 of 51489
Ah! Got it. Makes sense when it comes from someone who knows what they are talking about!
Thanks!
post #49219 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by deano86 View Post

By all means if you have the funds, go for it! Also, I recommend checking out the "Emotiv-eh" board on the Emotiva Lounge site for deals from other Canadian members on Emotiva amps!

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/board/11/emotiv-eh
Thanks, there is a semi-local generation one XPA-5 for $700. It still has 4 years of warranty, but I think I'd be better off with a brand new XPA-3 for the same price instead.
post #49220 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post

Thanks, there is a semi-local generation one XPA-5 for $700. It still has 4 years of warranty, but I think I'd be better off with a brand new XPA-3 for the same price instead.

Its up to you.... but gettting an extra 2 channels of power for the same price seems like a no brainer for me! Especially with that much warranty still remaining....not to mention it should be worth more down the road compared to the XPA-3, if you decide to sell it...
post #49221 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post

Thanks, there is a semi-local generation one XPA-5 for $700. It still has 4 years of warranty, but I think I'd be better off with a brand new XPA-3 for the same price instead.

In addition to what deano86 said, also keep in mind that importing a new Emotiva product to Canada also requires paying some hefty shipping, duties/import taxes, etc. So that $799 Gen-2 XPA-3 will end up running you over a grand - likely $1,100 - $1,200, unless you are close to the border and can have it shipped to the US side and go pick it up.

So, the local XPA-5 for $700 ends up being by far the better $$$ choice. And if it has 4 years of warranty left, I would not be too concerned about age/use; just make sure the current owner contacts Emotiva to notify them to transfer the warranty to you.
post #49222 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by AC2011 View Post

In addition to what deano86 said, also keep in mind that importing a new Emotiva product to Canada also requires paying some hefty shipping, duties/import taxes, etc. So that $799 Gen-2 XPA-3 will end up running you over a grand - likely $1,100 - $1,200, unless you are close to the border and can have it shipped to the US side and go pick it up.

So, the local XPA-5 for $700 ends up being by far the better $$$ choice. And if it has 4 years of warranty left, I would not be too concerned about age/use; just make sure the current owner contacts Emotiva to notify them to transfer the warranty to you.
I would pick it up from the US and bring it back with me so there should only be tax and the exchange rate to add to the cost. The same seller also has a UMC-1 and is asking $1000 for the pair which is a fair price, but from what I've been reading, the UMC-1 seems to have a few issues which is probably why it was discontinued.

Still not convinced though that I'd be able to justify the cost VS benefit. There are lots of conflicting opinions out there from "best upgrade I've made" to "no difference at all". I wish there was a way to try-before-you-buy.
Edited by brendelac - 9/13/13 at 12:25pm
post #49223 of 51489
I think "best upgrade I've made" folks are likely suffering from a lot of placebo effect, because even if the amp provides benefit it will likely fall into the "subtle" category. More effortless playback at high volumes, less harshness/distortion, more controlled bass... now of course on the internet you have to interpret adjectives with a grain of salt, since one man's "subtle" improvement is another's "night and day!! OMG!" Some people place a high value on subtle improvements. Either way, I wouldn't expect it to smack you in the face, it's not going to make the speakers drip honey and shoot rainbows out of the ports, but it might make them sound a bit better especially if you desire to listen LOUD.

Looking at the facts, the V2 Veritas are NOT the easiest speakers to drive. They are several dB less sensitive than the RC's; the V2.2i is rated at 86dB anechoic and the V2.3i and V2.4i are rated at 87dB. Compare that to the RC-10 (88dB) and the RC-50 (91dB) and RC-70 (92dB). A difference of 3dB in sensitivity would mean you need DOUBLE the power to reach the same SPL.

Furthermore, although Energy rates them as 8ohm nominal, measurements seem to show that this is a generous rating. When HT Mag measured the V2.4 they wrote:
Quote:
The Energy Veritas V2.4's ported cabinet is tuned to approximately 32Hz, and its minimum of 3.7ohms falls at the same frequency. We would rate the nominal impedance at 4ohms. In fact, the impedance remains very close to 4ohms from 30Hz to 400Hz, and rises significantly higher than 5ohms only above 1kHz. It should be a reasonably easy load for any competent amplifier. The V2.4's sensitivity is approximately 85dB/W/m.

Soundstage also measured the V2.4 and their measurements corroborate this data. They rated the sensitivity a bit higher (87dB, but could be a different window) but close enough, but check out the impedance graph:



Note that the graph shows exactly what HT Mag reported -- the impedance sits below 5 ohms basically from 30Hz up to around 1kHz.

Add all of it up, and they are definitely a more challenging load than, say, the RC's. This tells me that, especially if you want to listen loud, the V2 Veritas absolutely WILL benefit from adding an amp superior to those built into a mid-level HT receiver.
post #49224 of 51489
Yup
post #49225 of 51489
Thanks BP, that helps. I asked the seller (obviously his opinion could be biased) and he said that it made a big difference with his klipsch reference speakers - enough so that his teenage daughters noticed as well, but his wife is forcing him to get rid of them. I guess he bought them without her blessing.
post #49226 of 51489
Not to mention that if for some reason you don't feel you are getting your required cost benefit that you wanted with the Emotive amp addition, you will still be able to get a very good price by reselling it! They hold their value very well and any minimal loss that you incur could be chalked up to an amplifier "rental" cost....smile.gif
post #49227 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post

Thanks BP, that helps. I asked the seller (obviously his opinion could be biased) and he said that it made a big difference with his klipsch reference speakers - enough so that his teenage daughters noticed as well, but his wife is forcing him to get rid of them. I guess he bought them without her blessing.
klipsch are pretty darn efficient to begin with. I would say his "big difference" claim is a little to sugar coated. I had the xpa-5 before to drive some 4ohm emo speakers (8.3) in which I saw some benefit, but not with non demanding ones.
post #49228 of 51489
Just finished watching Star Trek: Into Darkness. Must say I loved it (saw it twice in theaters), and the recording was phenomenal in 7.1, a must see for those wanting to expand to 7.1
post #49229 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macstatic View Post

Just finished watching Star Trek: Into Darkness. Must say I loved it (saw it twice in theaters), and the recording was phenomenal in 7.1, a must see for those wanting to expand to 7.1

I only saw it for the first time at home on blu-ray the other day. I loved it! It gives me hope for Star Wars.

But dude, you wouldn't BELIEVE how the bass freaks tear this movie down. They don't think its bass extension is low enough, they say it doesn't have enough dynamic range and, worst of all, it's full of clipping. No joke, the bass forum people absolutely hate STID's audio track, they see it as a catastrophic failure.
post #49230 of 51489
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaviorMachine View Post

I only saw it for the first time at home on blu-ray the other day. I loved it! It gives me hope for Star Wars.

But dude, you wouldn't BELIEVE how the bass freaks tear this movie down. They don't think its bass extension is low enough, they say it doesn't have enough dynamic range and, worst of all, it's full of clipping. No joke, the bass forum people absolutely hate STID's audio track, they see it as a catastrophic failure.

and I say good for them. I know what I saw and heard last night. i thought it was a great soundtrack. they crap on anything that doesn't extend below 20hz.
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