Energy Owners Thread - Page 307

There are many comps of RC-10 vs. C-3 (as well as other RC vs. C-odd# like RC-30 vs. C-5) earlier in the thread, as well as a specific comparison in this pro review:
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/energy_rc10.htm

I haven't heard the C-3 (I had the C-2 and now RC-10's), but from others' reports the C-3 has more bass, whereas the RC-10 is a little smoother and more refined in the high end. The build quality on the RC-10 is better also.

I wondered about that too. K_40K, do you scoot your chair back a few feet when listening? Those V2.2i's are HUGE bookshelves... Talk about "nearfield" placement!


For less than $1200 shipped you can!

Seriously, that is one SICK computer setup... probably approaching $4K msrp in terms of amp/preamp + speakers/sub.

Would seperates be needed for those veritas?

separates are never "needed". you can always spend more $$ in search of improvements of course

I'm guessing the people that drop the coin on some veritas, probably have no problems dropping money on seperates.

we all have budgets there are some who will argue that separates inherently sound better, others will be skeptical of such blanket claims especially with a nice, higher end AVR.

the bottom line is the Veritas are 8ohm nominal with average efficiency, so any reasonable well-powered receiver can drive them to loud volumes. they are definitely less efficient than the lower level models so you do need some more power if you want to blast them really loud without distortion, but separates are most certainly not "necessary". whether you want to go beyond that in pursuit of additional, ostensible quality improvements in the sound is up to you..

That's great, I was considering some used veritas, but I didn't want to spend all this extra money for seperates.

I have an onkyo 806... hopefully this will be enough.

Hmmm, maybe you already assumed this but just in case you didn't, I was watching the game on regular cable (although it was actually on ABC in HD). I don't have a cable box at my house so it was connected via coaxial cable to my tv, with my tv outputting the audio to my receiver via regular RCA stereo (red/white) cables. So the receiver was receiving only 2-channel input and was matrixing the sound to 5.1 using the surround decoder (i think it was Dolby Pro-Logic IIx). So are you implying that it may possibly be just some bad 5.1 decoding on the receiver's part?

the 806 is a $1000 msrp receiver with plenty of beef in the amps. It puts out 107 W/ch with 5 channels driven continuously and 186 W/ch with 2-channels driven:
http://hometheatermag.com/receivers/...er/index3.html

That is certainly more than enough clean wattage to power the Veritas to good volumes.

If you decide at some point down the road you want MORE, you can always try out a separate 2-ch amp utilizing the pre-outs and see if you think it sounds better.

well, no, because we didn't know that the receiver was doing a 2.0 > 5.1 upmix.

what we were implying was that the sound FROM THE CABLE was a poorly mixed broadcast. applying PL IIx to a badly mixed stereo signal can definitely make things sound like garbage -- again, not the receiver or speaker's fault, just a bad sound mix.

did you try flipping the receiver into STEREO mode to see if it was the Pro Logic that was exacerbating the problem?

Perfect... I can put my tax return to good use.

It's also possible that by having the sound come through you're stereo it made the problem more pronounced then running through you're TV's speakers. Just do a test tonight as there are a few games on tonight.

Well that's why I tried the regular stereo TV speakers originally after turning off the receiver and it sounded clean when the "buzzer" went off. I honestly don't remember if I tried the receiver in STEREO mode though so that means I probably didn't. I've watched other games previously before Sunday and there was nothing that ever stood out like that so it could be a poorly mixed broadcast like you said..it just threw me off that it would sound normal on the tv's speakers and not on my awesome new system

Hey, all! Really enjoying this thread! My first HT speakers were the original Take 5 + sub. Loved it!

I recently picked up some RC-10s from AA. They replaced Paradigm Atoms in my bedroom system. Wow. So beautiful and they sound so nice!

Tried the Veritas v2.2s in my home theater to replace some Paradigm Studio 40s/20s I have never really loved. This is with an Anthem AVM20 going into a Bryston amp. Don't get me wrong: the Paradigms are amazing speakers. Very articulate. Just a little too bright and forward for me.

I liked the sound of the Veritas. Definitely smoother. More polite. Plus minus on definition compared to the Studio 40s. But to be honest, I was underwhelmed with their cosmetics, especially after seeing the beautiful fit and finish on those Rosenut RC-10s! I mean, what gives? Am I the only who thinks Energy dropped the ball (in this regard) with their flagship speakers? So many others look so much better, including the entire Reference Connossieur line and my Paradigm Studios (with real cherry sides).

I know it's a small point and not really what speakers should be about, but for me it was a deal breaker, and the Veritas went back.

I did not want to give up that sweet Energy sound, though, so I ordered a pair of RC-70s and an RC-LCR, all in cherry! They will be here next week!

Now I just have to decide between RC-10s or RC-Rs for the surrounds....

I am hearing a lot of "wows" and "crazy" for my computer system, Thank you everyone!

Now to address the comments/questions...

Adam.C, Justin73
I do not like headphones for gaming, I prefer speakers, always have. Games in 5.1...I can always expand, don't tempt me I also have my PC hooked in my HT so If I really want 5.1/7.1 I'll just move over there and play PC games on the HT with my RCs.

yashiro81,
I am in the same boat as you. I don't listen to music on the HT much, most of that is done in my car system or on my PC. Good sound is important if you enjoy audio. I don't know if you would want to put all your eggs in a basket for PC sound, HT is also important, at least to me it is. I have never heard tube amp sound but I'm not about to switch now AA is selling Veritas for half their normal price, and I was told they are moving fast, so jump on board fast or scourer the used market.

afrogt, batpig,
It is a great speaker/sub combination! I do move back when listening to music, for games I don't because I need my concentration I get enough sound at this "nearfield placement" or if I feel lacking I just turn it up until I'm satisfied . Once I move I'll have more space for proper placement/room layout ...everything will be different.

batpig,
Yes, it wasn't cheap but I try not to think about it. I enjoy my music/games and thats all that really matters. I am very happy with the Parasound product and if I ever decide to upgrade, it will probably be to the HALO line


Probably true, but everyone has budgets. If audio is a priority then you focus your money accordingly...some people drink, others buy audio equipment!

I have a satellite that is not blown, but it seems as if the speaker is "smooshed" to one side. The surrounds are intact, but there are 2 places where it is "pushed in". At mid-high levels I can hear the speaker resonate.

Thing is when I slightly put pressure on the speaker surround to "slide" it to make the center cap more center, speaker performs the way it should. I put a small piece of masking tape to hold it where it needs to be, but its not holding it enough to keep it from resonating. At least not for a long period of time...

with tape




without tape



I don't know how this happened or if the speakers were already like this. The grills were on. I have played them loud with music but have not noticed it until I watched a movie for the first time last night. (just moved into a new house) I bought them from circuit city about a month ago so I don't know how the warranty thing will hold up.

Should I just go to Energy and see if they are under warranty? Should I find a local or ship to a good speaker repair shop? What should I do? I don't have my receipt from circuit city... my wallet was stolen a couple of weeks ago.

I guess I should post this in speaker repair forum as well.

thanks for the help

They have a 5 year warranty so you're covered there but I don't know how you prove you purchased at CC w/o a receipt. Call them up and see what they say. It can't hurt.

Circuit City was advertising that all manufacturer's warranties will be honored as they were going out.

I posted pics of my setup a few weeks ago but I forgot to show the sub and surrounds. I'm bored now so I took more pics of those. Sub is an Outlaw LFM-1 Compact and the surrounds are rc-minis.





The sub is a good size for my room. I made my own gramma/subdude type riser for the sub and it seems to have made the bass a little cleaner (it wasn't bad before). Mostly I did it because the discs under the spikes on the sub would move and the spikes were digging into the wood floors and leaving small marks. The rc-minis work great as surrounds. The all RC setup with the Outlaw sub is awesome for home theater. It can shake the walls if needed (Iron Man is a good workout for the sub) but I turn it down a bit, I like rumble not rattling . Sounds great for music as well.

I just bought a used pair of Energy Veritas v2.2i's, but the sticker on the bottom says V2.2HB-1. Does that mean they are the non 'i' version? Is there any other way for me to tell the difference?

they are under warranty, all you need is proof of purchase. even though you don't have the physical receipt, you probably bought them with a credit card or debit card. check your purchase history and you should be able to provide proof of purchase from CC.

I actually agree with you that the RC's are better looking than the Veritas.

One thing to remember though is that the current Veritas lineup came out years before the RC's, they were more contemporaneous with the older C-3/5/7/9 lineup when Energy was going for a more "space age" black and silver look. I bet if Energy produced a "flagship" speaker today (which it sadly looks like they won't, post Klipsch takeover) I'm sure it would be a stunning, real wood look in line with current offerings like Paradigm Signature, Monitor Audio Gold, Mirage OMD-28, etc.

At this point, almost 8 years in, they do look a tiny bit dated to me, whereas I think the RC's have a more "classic" look in the real-wood finish that will hold up better over time. Also the Veritas always were criticized for the aesthetics of the rubber cap + the gloss sides... I think the cherry finish is better looking personally but I have an all-dark-wood living room so that would never work.

Not that they are bad looking at all, I would love to have them in my home, but I agree that current options (not just Energy) with gorgeous real-wood veneers have surpassed the Veritas in the looks department.

Ok, I'm pulling the trigger tomorrow on my energy setup and I'm thinking of changing it up a bit, let me know what you think.
Originally thinking to go with the wwstereo deal for $450
2 x c-300's,
1 x c-c50,
2 x c-r100's
Sub will come later

But since I have two boys at the house, one 5 year old and one 2 year old I'm slightly concerned about the c-300 floor speakers.
Would the following setup work well at all? This configuration would allow the fronts to be hung on the wall away from curious fingers!!
2 x c-c100 (fronts)
1 x c-c100 (center)
2 x c-r100's (rears)
Still wait a bit on the sub

The C-C100 doesn't have the threaded mounting hole the C-100 has, so you can't use the usual wall mounting brackets mentioned here.

I'm sure there are other mounts that will work. Anyone tried a three wall mounted C-C100s setup? What did you use to mount them?

Koui......running the numbers here and it looks like using the 3 c-c100's as center, left and right will put me out of my budget. My budget is a tight $450 for the speakers minus the sub, that's why I was looking at the wwstereo deal. But the floor speakers had me a bit concerned with the kids but I haven't ruled them out yet.
That being said, I think I can go with either of the two scenarios below. The big question is if I will be missing out alot by not getting the c-300's. Thoughts anybody?? This system will be primarily used for movies with just a bit for music.

Scenario 1
2 x c-300's (fronts)
1 x c-c50 (center)
2 x c-r100 (rear)

Scenario 2
2 x c-100's (fronts)
1 x c-c100 (center)
2 x c -r100 (rears)

Further observations with C-Series...

I notice still some slight cracking with various frequencies, especially with the sounds of men yelling from the C-C100. Example, when Peter Parker screams "Nooo" towards the end of Spider-man 2 when the roof is about to fall on MJ, the whole sound is accompanied by a subtle yet fairly audible crackling noise. This was at about -20dbs volume. While the speakers seem to perform reasonably well, I still think this shouldn't occur at only -20dbs! Granted, this seems to only occur with specific frequencies. It could be the speaker wire connection for all i know, that has had subtle effect in the past. Again, no huge deal breaker, but at the same time I don't recall my older and less expensive DCM center doing this as much. Judging from others experience with these speakers on here I haven't read this particular issue so maybe it's just with me.

I also noticed something else with regard to Audyssey and sub calibration. Since I've run Audyssey with the new setup something always seemed odd about the bass. As we all know Audyssey might add a few feet to the subwoofer "distance" to account for rooms/delays etc. I played around with different settings and lo and behold the ACTUAL distance of the subwoofer sounded best. This really brought back that sychronization of the sound back. I have sensitive ears and will always notice if something is off. It is both a blessing and a curse. I will say that setting delays to the last half-foot is vital for every speaker. It defines the imaging much more. In the future I may just manually bypass the distances set by Onkyo/Audyssey for the sub alone.

Overall though, these neutral-sounding speakers coupled with the Onkyo 706 seem to take a step towards that type of sound I hear in THX-certified theaters. What I mean by that description - as high as the volume level might be the sound is not overbearing due to its extremely balanced nature. I also have much less fatigue than before. I'm sure my room curve is not a perfect X-curve by any means, but it certainly sounds like it's in the ballpark. This has taken time getting used to, as my previous speakers have usually been bright and boomy.

The RC-R's is a more versatile speaker for surround duties. They can be used in bipole, dipole and direct radiating modes. They're also easier to mount - the easiest mounting system imaginable.

I had a nasty experience at American Electronics yesterday. I went in to get a price on the RC-10 with their special "half-off-regular-markup" sale. Saturday, the RC-10s were $220 each (which is where they've been priced for a while). Yesterday, they had been marked up to full retail - $299. With the discount, they were $240.

No one I knew was in the department at the time, but today I'm speaking with the store manager. It reminded me of the Circuit City going-out-of-business sale, where they hiked the prices up past other stores' regular prices for the "sale."

I was wondering what you all thought of using the Take Classic (instead of, for instance, C50's) as surrounds in a 7.1 system as follows:

C300's for left and right ($125 each at wwstereo)
CC100 for center ($114 at buy.com)
ESW-8 Sub (already purchased for $120ish)

*AND*

Energy Take Classic without sub ($199 at wwstereo) as the 4 surround speakers (discarding the included center channel)

Do you think this setup would work well? Would the speakers blend well? Would this successfully upgrade the Take to 7.1 while adding more umph (especially right where it's needed, in the front)?

I would like to note the main reason I want to do this is for space and ease of setup, not cost (I could buy 4 C50's for the same $200 as the Take Classic, but C50's are 6.6 pounds and the Take sats are 2.9 pounds; because of their increased size and weight it would make the setup more than I think I'm willing to tackle right now).

Opinions?

Joseph,

Thats not okay and as a Retail Store Manager I am not sure that is legal.
If you don't get this issue resolved to your liking you can always threaten to file a complaint with Weights and Measures who will come out and inspect the pricing and advertising practices of the company. We get these on a regular basis and can cost the company big $$$ in fines if the pricing in the store isn't correct and the advertising practices are dishonest.
I do not know it it will help you get your price but it is a last resort pitch before leaving and never going back there again.

Good Luck and any good Store Manager would make this right for you if they value your repeat business and the money they will make in the future from a loyal customer.

Please post what happens.