or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Blu-ray & HD DVD › HD DVD Players › Answers to HD-A1 and HD-XA1 Audio Questions
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Answers to HD-A1 and HD-XA1 Audio Questions - Page 3

post #61 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditcho View Post

What "hints"? There hasn't been a single dedicated music DVD-Audio disc released so far with multichannel 24/192, and you are "hinting" that a video disc (not dedicated audio disc) in the future may contain such track? Keep dreaming! My guess is you'll be lucky to ever see even a 5.1 24/96 lossless soundtrack on an HD DVD/BR disc. Probably most of them will be 24/48.

Well one hint might be that the Toshiba players will output true Dolby Digital HD over the 2 channel output and also the hd-dvd title "Phantom of the Opera" is encoded with DDHD .I believe it's the only title so far with DDHD.
Check out the back of the case at dvdtown.
post #62 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonDono View Post

All this talk about the different formats supported and how we can get them out of the player yet no discussion about how we might only be able to get two channels out of it. This doesn't make sense.

If you haven't already, you might want to read the first post in this thread. It may answer some of your questions about audio options.

The first 3 titles from Warner all include a 5.1 channel Dolby Digital Plus soundtrack, which supports a maximum bitrate almost 5 times that of standard Dolby Digital used on DVDs. This can be output as 5.1 channel analog, 5.1 channel digital PCM over HDMI, or downcoverted to standard Dolby Digital and output over SPDIF coax or optical. So there should be no problem getting more than two channels of high quality audio with the new Toshiba player, it's only Dolby TrueHD that is limited to two channels.
post #63 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonDono View Post

All this talk about the different formats supported and how we can get them out of the player yet no discussion about how we might only be able to get two channels out of it.

That's two more channels of lossless audio than you'll get out of any of the first-generation Blu-Ray players.
post #64 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by steviec View Post

Well one hint might be that the Toshiba players will output true Dolby Digital HD over the 2 channel output and also the hd-dvd title "Phantom of the Opera" is encoded with DDHD .I believe it's the only title so far with DDHD.
Check out the back of the case at dvdtown.

We were talking about hints of a 6 channel 24/192 lossless track. 2 channel 24/192, 6 ch 24/96 and 6 ch 24/48 don't qualify. I think we will never see a 6ch 24/192 track on any kind of disc. And this "probability", "hinted" somewhere was one of the reasons someone here stated as a reason not to purchase an existing HDMI AV Receiver - because it's only capable of 6ch 24/96.
post #65 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditcho View Post

We were talking about hints of a 6 channel 24/192 lossless track. 2 channel 24/192, 6 ch 24/96 and 6 ch 24/48 don't qualify. I think we will never see a 6ch 24/192 track on any kind of disc. And this "probability", "hinted" somewhere was one of the reasons someone here stated as a reason not to purchase an existing HDMI AV Receiver - because it's only capable of 6ch 24/96.

Did you read this post which I linked in my reply above? Someone in the business claims to be working on "some 6 channel 24/192 material for a Blu-ray demo disk". This is one of the hints I was talking about. That doesn't mean that we will ever see one for sale, but it indicates people are looking at the possibilities of these new disc formats. These formats haven't even launched, it's pretty early to be saying "never" about something which is technically possible.

I was just throwing the info out there because it seemed relevant to the discussion in this thread. I never suggested anyone should hold off on buying the current HDMI receivers which are limited to 24/96 for 5.1 channels. In fact I already own a Yamaha HTR-5990 and am not worried about it. I don't know if I could even hear the difference between 24/48 and 24/96, much less 24/192 since I have never done any kind of test.

We don't yet know what quality is used for the 5.1 channel TrueHD soundtrack on Phantom of the Opera.
post #66 of 1871
why stop at 6 channel? why not go to 8? or 9 (7.2)... how about 10.2?

Seriously though, what's the story with 7.1 output streams? Will they be common or supported? I see with analog on the Toshibas, there is only 5.1 outs, can the DACs do a 7.1 stream (of any form)?
post #67 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by orogogus View Post

why stop at 6 channel? why not go to 8? or 9 (7.2)... how about 10.2?

Seriously though, what's the story with 7.1 output streams? Will they be common or supported? I see with analog on the Toshibas, there is only 5.1 outs, can the DACs do a 7.1 stream (of any form)?

The whole audio scene confuses me. For example if I bought a 7.1 receiver will it work if I only have a 5.1 speaker system?
post #68 of 1871
No problem running a 5.1 setup with a 7.1 receiver. You just set the unused back channels as "None" during setup.
post #69 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsturm1005 View Post

No problem running a 5.1 setup with a 7.1 receiver. You just set the unused back channels as "None" during setup.

Thank you. The sales guy at BestBuy couldn't answer that simple question last week.
post #70 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by orogogus View Post

why stop at 6 channel? why not go to 8? or 9 (7.2)... how about 10.2?

Seriously though, what's the story with 7.1 output streams? Will they be common or supported? I see with analog on the Toshibas, there is only 5.1 outs, can the DACs do a 7.1 stream (of any form)?

Both HD-DVD and Blu-ray claim support of more than 5.1 channels. But for the HD-DVD lauch players I have seen no mention of anything over 5.1. I believe the Blu-ray situation is the same, but I haven't seen all the spec sheets. If any of them supported 7.1 you would expect them to be making a big deal about it. If you search around in these forums you will find some discussion of how few movies were ever mixed for a home format at more than 5.1 so it may not matter for a while. Personally I don't care since I have a small theater with no room for rear speakers, but some people in these forums are pretty upset about the lack of 8 channel support in the launch players saying the won't buy until it is available.

7.1 channel support will likely be one of the enhancements in next generation players and future titles.
post #71 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Over in the Blu-ray Software forum there is a lengthy discussion about audio capabilities or HD-DVD and Blu-ray. This post contains a much more detailed description of audio options than I provided in the first post of this thread. I also added this link to the first post.
post #72 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by jschefdog View Post

Over in the Blu-ray Software forum there is a lengthy discussion about audio capabilities or HD-DVD and Blu-ray. This post contains a much more detailed description of audio options than I provided in the first post of this thread. I also added this link to the first post.

Interesting post(your provided link), so it appears there is a difference between the audio capabilities of the A1 and the XA1. If I read it correctly, the A1 can only output the standard DVD audio, DD and DTS, through it's analog 5.1 outputs, whereas the XA1 can output the "converted to analog" HiRez audio streams through it's 5.1 analog outputs. It appears the A1 does not have the audio decoders that the XA1 has.
post #73 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by keenan View Post

Interesting post(your provided link), so it appears there is a difference between the audio capabilities of the A1 and the XA1. If I read it correctly, the A1 can only output the standard DVD audio, DD and DTS, through it's analog 5.1 outputs, whereas the XA1 can output the "converted to analog" HiRez audio streams through it's 5.1 analog outputs. It appears the A1 does not have the audio decoders that the XA1 has.

No, The Toshiba site lists similar DACs in both machines (192/24). It appears there would be no reason you couldn't get the DTS HD and DD PLUS through the analog outputs as the decoders and DACs are there (in the HDA1) to do it!
post #74 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

No, The Toshiba site lists similar DACs in both machines (96/24). It appears there would be no reason you couldn't get the DTS HD and DD PLUS through the analog outputs as the decoders and DACs are there to do it!

That's what I originally thought, but Jonathon Teller's post in the other thread seems to indicate otherwise. He could be wrong I suppose, but the info seems to be fairly detailed as he makes exceptions between the 2 players when talking about outputting HiRez audio on the analog outputs.

I guess we'll know in about a week...I still can't believe there is no manual available for these machines yet..
post #75 of 1871
I'd also like to know if HDMI 1.3 will be possible on either of these machines via a firmware upgrade??
post #76 of 1871
I don't think so, I think it requires some new hardware.
post #77 of 1871
If I have the Denon AVR-5805, should I use the Analog 5.1 outs for the DD+ and DTS-HD? Or use HDMI out of the player Into the HDMI In of the reciever for better sound?
post #78 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

I'd also like to know if HDMI 1.3 will be possible on either of these machines via a firmware upgrade??

I know this is a bit vague and controversial, but my thoughts, based on what I know about digitized audio and what is available on the consumer FAQ page on the HDMI site, I believe that this, and 1080p (whatever flavor), will be provided through a firmware/software upgrade. These new players (both HD-DVD and BD) are relatively powerful computers in their own right.

Just an opinion...please no flaming
post #79 of 1871
okay my receiver has 7.1 analog inputs how can I get 7.1 from a 5.1 analog output?

I know it can be done its really going to be 6.1. My guess would be 2 matrix the analog SR, SL but is there an easier way dvdfile hinted about one. I do not want to introduce any additional gear at this point to do this knowing that my first player will someday be moved into another room when a dual player comes out. However I would still like to somehow activate the ex flags since I have a 7.1 setup.
post #80 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

If I have the Denon AVR-5805, should I use the Analog 5.1 outs for the DD+ and DTS-HD? Or use HDMI out of the player Into the HDMI In of the reciever for better sound?

I would guess that a high end receiver like the 5805 has better DACs than the new Toshiba players, so using HDMI would likely be the best choice.
post #81 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keenan View Post

Interesting post(your provided link), so it appears there is a difference between the audio capabilities of the A1 and the XA1. If I read it correctly, the A1 can only output the standard DVD audio, DD and DTS, through it's analog 5.1 outputs, whereas the XA1 can output the "converted to analog" HiRez audio streams through it's 5.1 analog outputs. It appears the A1 does not have the audio decoders that the XA1 has.

I don't believe that is the case. The A1 spec sheet says:
Quote:


-Onboard Dolby® Digital, Dolby® Digital Plus, Dolby® TrueHD (2-ch), DTS and DTS-HD Decoding with 5.1 Analog Audio outputs
-Multi-Channel 24-Bit/192kHz audio DACs
-Built in multi-channel decoders for Dolby® Digital, Dolby® Digital Plus, Dolby® TrueHD (2ch), DTS and DTS-HD will bring improved fidelity and sonic realism to the soundtracks

See them for yourself at:
http://www.*********************/images/pdf/HD-A1.pdf
http://www.*********************/images/pdf/HD-XA1.pdf
post #82 of 1871
Yes, I've seen that. In the post you linked to earlier is the following statement,

Quote:


Toshiba's HD-DVD players internally decode DD, DTS, DD+ and DTHD. DD, DTS and DD+ are all limited to 5.1-channel output. DTHD is limited to 2-channel output. When these formats are decoded inside the player, they end up as a 5.1 channel (or 2-channel in the case of DTHD) uncompressed PCM bitstream, and that is what comes out of the HDMI connection and goes to your receiver. Alternately, it can be sent through a DAC inside the player and come out the 5.1 analogue outputs on the more expensive HD-XA1 player.

That second underlined part is what confuses me, the poster distinguishes HD-XA1 as being capable instead of lumping the two players together.

Reading into what isn't said in the above, it seems to incicate that the HD-XA1 can pass decoded HiRez audio through the 5.1 analog, whereas the HD-A1 cannot.

Who knows, we'll find out soon enough I guess, still can't believe there is no manual available for these players, especially being days away from being sold.
post #83 of 1871
Just give me lossless 5.1 Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD over HDMI 1.1 ( and
also analog to hold me over until I get the Anthem AVM 40 ) and I will
be happy...
post #84 of 1871
... or give me death.
post #85 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keenan View Post

That second underlined part is what confuses me, the poster distinguishes HD-XA1 as being capable instead of lumping the two players together.

Reading into what isn't said in the above, it seems to incicate that the HD-XA1 can pass decoded HiRez audio through the 5.1 analog, whereas the HD-A1 cannot.

The poster in that other thread seemed very knowledgable, but could still be wrong. I would interpret the quote you included to mean the A1 won't output anything as 5.1 analog including std DD and DTS, not just the new formats. There has been information (or misinformation) posted on the internet which has led people to believe the A1 doesn't support 5.1 channel analog output and he may have read some of that. It has led to a lot of confusion and discussion in these forums. The Toshiba spec sheets are pretty clear and definite that 5.1 channel analog output is supported for all the decoded formats. I would trust it over any other information.
post #86 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by jschefdog View Post

I would guess that a high end receiver like the 5805 has better DACs than the new Toshiba players, so using HDMI would likely be the best choice.

Thanks, but after reading more posts, DD+ and DTS-HD won't pass thru HDMI 1.1, only 1.3. So I guess the analog 5.1 outs are the way to go then? Sorry, I just want to be sure to get the most out of the new format.
post #87 of 1871
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

Thanks, but after reading more posts, DD+ and DTS-HD won't pass thru HDMI 1.1, only 1.3. So I guess the analog 5.1 outs are the way to go then? Sorry, I just want to be sure to get the most out of the new format.

I realize that, but I thought you meant passing 5.1 channel PCM over HDMI. Does the 5805 accept 5.1 channel PCM over HDMI? If it is HDMI 1.1 it probably does, but check your manual. If so, that would probably be a better choice than analog.
post #88 of 1871
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

Thanks, but after reading more posts, DD+ and DTS-HD won't pass thru HDMI 1.1, only 1.3. So I guess the analog 5.1 outs are the way to go then? Sorry, I just want to be sure to get the most out of the new format.

As long as the HD-DVD player decodes the format in the player and sends
PCM over HDMI 1.1 to your receiver you are good to go...
post #89 of 1871
OK, Real Answer people... Am I going to get real DTS HD 5.1 out of the A1 - or the XA1 through Analog? Or just Plain DTS?

-SOWK
post #90 of 1871
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: HD DVD Players
AVS › AVS Forum › Blu-ray & HD DVD › HD DVD Players › Answers to HD-A1 and HD-XA1 Audio Questions