Originally Posted by RobertR
Problem is, subjectivists have been told "ok, YOU pick the ultra "synergistic" system that can reveal the tiniest differences, and we'll go with that AND whatever music you want", and they STILL shy away. :)
Originally Posted by RobertR
Not only that but when they are cornered, they still fail to hear differences :D
Why would ANYONE get excited over a difference so VANISHINGLY small that it takes WEEKS or even MONTHS to manifest itself, AND is highly dependent on the particular "mood, music, and gear"?
I just don't see how they could even do that? After all, I doubt they listen that long in one sitting :D If they don't, every new sit down is a new event, not one, long continuous testing for that elusive difference.
But, poor Shanefield tried and failed on a several month long test :eek:
Shanefield, Daniel, " The Great Ego Crunchers: Equalized, Double Blind Testing,: Hi-Fidelity, Mar 80, pg 57-61.
Well I just typed out and posted a big reply but it hasn't appeared on the thread for some reason.
Anyway I have a theory about listening and DBT....
I can hear bats in a local park to me (CD's get nastier the higher the sound goes in the audio range). Maybe why I can hear a diffrence.
So my theory goes.... It's DBT's that are flawed (just a theory), I know for a fact I am not influenced by brand name, price etc. and always go to a listening test and try out 3 or 4 products at length and can immediatly hear the diffrences.
Now if so many people can't tell the diffrence in DBT's I knwo somthing strange is going on.
When I get really into good music and immerse myself (esspecially with relaxing stuff) I would shut my eyes as I found the sound to improve... I, and others, have surmised it is because you are not being distracted by vision and also it helps because you can't see the speakers and so your eyes aren't telling your brain where the sound is coming from.
Well what if that is wrong? Has anyone considered that the brain may be better at rejecting what it is hearing that it considers not to be what it wants to hear. (in the same way a blind persons hearing and smell are hightened, Or how you can hear someone say your name accross a noisey room - ever changed ear in a conference call and noticed it has taken a min or two for your brain to adjust and reject what it is hearing in the other ear???)..... So what if the brain can more easily manufacture a soundstage and seperate out each individual instuments sound when your eyes are closed??? Well it may explain when we come down to small changes in audio quality why a DBT test might be flawed...
I suggest a DCT (remember where you heared it 1st). A Double concealed test... Instead of blindfolding the listner (blindfolding seems to be the common way of conducting this test probs cos it is the only way to do it with speakers) lets conceal the equipment (put both CD players or amps etc. under big cardboard boxes) and conduct the same test but with the listners eyes open...
It would be intresting to see how the results compare from DCT and DBT. I would suggest if my theory is good we will see a marked improvement in results which may lend some weight to my theory.... I will try it when I am next able (next time I am at the 2nd hand hi-fi shop). Maybe a few others could try this and compare results.
After all is the brain not a very strange little-understood beast that does very strange things (how many of us have had their eyes play tricks on them). So it's no great leap of faith to consider with no visual reference to help the brain is more able to manufacture it's own perception of the sound (and make everything closer to what you think it should be)....
Anyway it's worth considering and may explain why the two sides of the discussion could be correct in what they say and belive but may have to alter conclusions drawn from the evidence.... We could have a situation were there are diffrences in the sound between the two items and due to the brain with our vision removed we can't tell between them in a DBT....