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Inifinty speakers and bang for your buck - Page 9

post #241 of 282
Did Infinity ever make a Beta 60?
post #242 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacoboy View Post

Did Infinity ever make a Beta 60?

No. No Beta 60 was ever proposed.

I do seem to remember that the Beta line did include an 8" 2-way when I first became aboard Harman's Consumer Audio Division. That model was scheduled to be called the Beta 30. That model was deleted within the first two weeks I became the Beta series speaker design engineer.
post #243 of 282
In my 11' by 17' room I have Infinity Beta 40s front, Beta 20s rears, Beta C360 center and an Outlaw Sub.
(Onkyo TX-SR606 & 42" LCD).
Can anyone else claim to do a better overkill in a small room?
post #244 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacoboy View Post

In my 11' by 17' room I have Infinity Beta 40s front, Beta 20s rears, Beta C360 center and an Outlaw Sub.
(Onkyo TX-SR606 & 42" LCD).
Can anyone else claim to do a better overkill in a small room?

OK, my room is 12 x 19. A few inches here, a few inches there. Infinity IL-60s up front, IL-36c center, Alpha 20s surround, Definitive Technology PF-1500 sub. Sony db930 receiver powering the center and surrounds. Carver M-1.5t (350wpc) powering the fronts. Panny projector - 92 inch screen.
post #245 of 282
I just started up a new thread called "Speaker Overkill".
Lets see who wins.
post #246 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by plhart View Post

No. No Beta 60 was ever proposed.

I do seem to remember that the Beta line did include an 8" 2-way when I first became aboard Harman's Consumer Audio Division. That model was scheduled to be called the Beta 30. That model was deleted within the first two weeks I became the Beta series speaker design engineer.

Hey, don't know if you remember me but we had a good discussion via PM about spikes when I bought a TSS-750 speaker system.

Well, 2 years later and it looks like my sub is having amplifier problems. I got what I would say was unexpected popping sounds from the sub. I don't think I was driving it too hard. Soon after I also started hearing hissing or screeching sounds from the sub after it warmed up. Also, several months ago I noticed that the sub never switched to standby mode after I turned off the receiver it was connected too.

I am trying to fix this before buying a replacement sub and I was hoping you could help or connect me someone that can. I have the service manual and I tested the driver resistance and sound quality with a low level sweep fed into it. It sounds OK. When I pulled the amp I noted a few things. First, the transformer was very hot and stayed that way for a very long time. Second, there was some sort of beige or brown colored goo or cement between the bottom of the two large electrolytic capacitors and the PCB. Finally, the thermally conductive paste between the FETs and the heatsink looks darkened in some areas but, oddly, only in the area around the thermistor.

Any ideas or suggestions?
post #247 of 282
Anyone here have an opinion on what would make the best replacement for a TSS-SUB750 (if I can't fix it) in my TSS-750 5.1 setup? I am looking at the PS210, the PS212 and the Premier Audio PA-120. I also found a guy on craigslist selling a Cadence CSX-15 but that may be out of my price range. Same for the PS212.
post #248 of 282
Wow, this thread is surprisingly dead.

I decided to get a PS210 to replace my TSS-750 sub. I still have the TSS-750. I am trying to fix the amp but it may not be worth the trouble.

Does anyone have a TSS-750 or TSS-450 or TSS-1100 with a damaged driver/speaker? I would be willing to buy the amplifier off of you. Or, is anyone interested in a TSS-750 for the driver and enclosure, which is still in great condition?
post #249 of 282
Seems everyone Infinity spends all their time and energy at the Primus and Beta threads. Surprises me. There are way more Infinity speaker posts at AudioKarma than there are here. Too bad. I have 10 Infinity speakers. Seems this house has become more advice oriented, instead of regular folks talking about what they've got and how they might make it incrementally better without swapping out components.

Sad to see forums like this become quick fixes for the totally uninitiated.
post #250 of 282
What speakers would be a step up (for the best price) from the Infinity Betas?
post #251 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacoboy View Post

What speakers would be a step up (for the best price) from the Infinity Betas?

Well the Beta 20s can be had for ~$50 shipped from the Harmon eBay store so its pretty hard to beat those prices. Some people would suggest, if you can accommodate the center speaker, buying 5 Beta 20s for your L/R, center, and surrounds. Then find a sub from one of the internet direct companies; eD, HSU, SVS, etc. In the end costs would be around $550-$700 depending on the sub you go with. Only draw back of going with this is that it might take you a bit of time getting 5 Beta 20s since they are sold on eBay through an auction format so you'll have to be a bit patient.
post #252 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestyx View Post

Well the Beta 20s can be had for ~$50 shipped from the Harmon eBay store so its pretty hard to beat those prices...it might take you a bit of time getting 5 Beta 20s since they are sold on eBay through an auction format so you'll have to be a bit patient.

Yeah, it took me a little bit to get mine, but when I started bidding back in Jan and Feb, most all were selling in the 40's (plus 20 shipping). Now it looks as if most sell for 32-35 plus 20 shipping. I've seen one go for as low as 26 I think.

That said, Just 3 days ago, I received a Beta 20 (my 6th one) in the mail...FREE! I didn't even know it was coming. I didn't bid on it and my paypal account wasn't charged.

Maybe if you buy 5, you get the 6th one free?
post #253 of 282
I'm thinking of replacing my Infinity Beta 40s, 20s, C360 with AV123 Rockets 850, 450, 200.
Has anyone compared the Rockets with the Betas?
post #254 of 282
I've never heard the rockets, but I've heard the Vifa tweeter they use in the rockets. I like it! I'd really like to use it on my next...well make that like 3rd in line, DIY project. I need to stop starting projects without finishing previous ones.

The question though, why do you want to replace your current Infinity setup?
post #255 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Looneybomber View Post

I've never heard the rockets, but I've heard the Vifa tweeter they use in the rockets. I like it! I'd really like to use it on my next...well make that like 3rd in line, DIY project. I need to stop starting projects without finishing previous ones.

The question though, why do you want to replace your current Infinity setup?

The Infinity's do a get job, really good bang for the buck.
I'm really getting into the Audio scene, so I'm trying to come up with a good reason, to try different speakers.
I could sell off my current 5.1 for a good price as it would include 2 Infinity Beta 40s, which a few people are looking for and they are nearly impossible to find.
I also recently saw an article were Infinity Classica series (which use the same CMMD drivers as the Betas) was slightly beaten by 3 other brands.
And AV123 has really been dropping the prices of their speakers.
post #256 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacoboy View Post

The Infinity's do a get job, really good bang for the buck.
I'm really getting into the Audio scene, so I'm trying to come up with a good reason, to try different speakers.
I could sell off my current 5.1 for a good price as it would include 2 Infinity Beta 40s, which a few people are looking for and they are nearly impossible to find.
I also recently saw an article were Infinity Classica series (which use the same CMMD drivers as the Betas) was slightly beaten by 3 other brands.
And AV123 has really been dropping the prices of their speakers.

Yeah your setup is pretty good. The mains use the same woofers, mid, and tweet and the surrounds share the same woofers and tweeters. It's about as timbre matched as you can get without having 5 identical speakers.

I can totally understand wanting to try something different. I too like to periodically switch things up. I have a pair of Monitor Audio RS1's, JBL S36's, and the Beta-20's that I like to hook up to my computer for 2 channel music. They all sound a little different and it's fun to swap 'em out...tinkering proves I'm a kid at heart.

Yeah, the Rocket 850's are at a pretty good price.
post #257 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacoboy View Post

What speakers would be a step up (for the best price) from the Infinity Betas?


Hi Tacoboy-

For a step up to the Beta Series I'd recommend taking a look at the Revel Concerta series. Some of the Concerta models use the same crossover boards, but with upgraded parts as well as the same port tubes.

Mark G. was Revel's Chief Engineer at the time I was designing the Betas over five years ago. Revel speakers have always been produced in much lower quantities than Infinity speakers. So it has always made economic sense within Harman's consumer division to share parts across brands whenever possible.

Revel speakers have also historically had a much smaller dealer base, most of whom have proper sound room demonstration facilities. Thus to offer more value/dollar for these dealers Revel was able to spend more on the Concerta Series cabinet rigidity, raw driver motor and cone parts and, as mentioned, crossover parts than I was able to spend on the Betas.

Mark is one heck of a loudspeaker designer but he like myself, always had to have our designs go through Harman's Multi-channel Listening Lab double-blind testing facility and beat, sight-unseen at least three other competitors models, identified by the dealers as being the most often encountered by price and configuration within the dealers' own listening rooms. Like the Infinity Betas Mark's Revel Concerta speakers where never released for production unless every model could sonically outperform any competitor.

Happy listening

Patrick Hart
post #258 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by plhart View Post



Hi Tacoboy-


For a step up to the Beta Series I'd recommend taking a look at the Revel Concerta series. Some of the Concerta models use the same crossover boards, but with upgraded parts as well as the same port tubes.


Mark G. was Revel's Chief Engineer at the time I was designing the Betas over five years ago. Revel speakers have always been produced in much lower quantities than Infinity speakers. So it has always made economic sense within Harman's consumer division to share parts across brands whenever possible.


Revel speakers have also historically had a much smaller dealer base, most of whom have proper sound room demonstration facilities. Thus to offer more value/dollar for these dealers Revel was able to spend more on the Concerta Series cabinet rigidity, raw driver motor and cone parts and, as mentioned, crossover parts than I was able to spend on the Betas.


Mark is one heck of a loudspeaker designer but he like myself, always had to have our designs go through Harman's Multi-channel Listening Lab double-blind testing facility and beat, sight-unseen at least three other competitors models, identified by the dealers as being the most often encountered by price and configuration within the dealers' own listening rooms. Like the Infinity Betas Mark's Revel Concerta speakers where never released for production unless every model could sonically outperform any competitor.


Happy listening


Patrick Hart
Patrick, I wonder if you are still around ?
I go way back with Infinity, owned old Prelude PFR's, remember them ? Then, the Canadiens came (Floyd Tool, Sean Olive, Alan Devantier, etc, etc). I know the Canadiens had contempt for the Infinity Alpha series speakers, lol.

The Infinity IL 60's (I own them) do have 24 db crossovers. Sean Olive told me they were actually beating the Prelude MTS in blind listening tests so badly, they had to turn the bass level on the mighty IL 60 down (They did not want to embarrass the Prelude MTS their boss Floyd Tool helped design) !
I have also owned the Infinity IL 40.
The IL 40 and the IL 60 were much different speakers Patrick! The IL 60 is almost "perfection" in a speaker, absolutely RULER FLAT. Sean Olive sent me thew Labs on it!
It is indeed, an impressive acheivement, IF Flat Response is the goal.
The Infinity IL 40 has what is called "The NRC Curve", as does the Primus 360.
On the very best recordings, and movies, (I have the big IL 36 center) the IL 60 will drop your jaw, but for everyday listening, I prefer the NRC Curve of the IL 40 !

Tell me Patrick, about your Beta series speakers ? Do ANY of them have the NRC Curve built in ?
post #259 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka7niq View Post

The Infinity IL 60's (I own them) do have 24 db crossovers... Sean Olive told me they were actually beating the Prelude MTS in blind listening tests so badly, they had to turn the bass level on the mighty IL 60 down (They did not want to embarrass the Prelude MTS their boss Floyd Tool helped design) !... The IL 60 is almost "perfection" in a speaker, absolutely RULER FLAT. Sean Olive sent me the Labs on it!
It is indeed, an impressive acheivement, IF Flat Response is the goal.
On the very best recordings, and movies, (I have the big IL 36 center) the IL 60 will drop your jaw...

My IL60s and IL36c have been causing involuntary jaw dropping for several years now. My 14 x 19 room is well stuffed. Otherwise I suspect the speakers may have come across as too bright (no name pun intended). I have never been anything but completely impressed with the work Harman did on this speaker. Not that it's anything spectacular to look at. I always thought of it as a poor man's Intermezzo. I may have to rethink that
now. And I DO use RABOS.


Edited by GLBright - 2/18/13 at 3:03pm
post #260 of 282
I'm glad that there has been some recent discussion about Interlude IL60s. As fate would have it, I was just about to make this post asking about them anyway.

I have found a pair of IL60s in the maple finish virtually brand new locally. They were taken out of their boxes to test the sub amps ability to power on, but they are still encased with their inner box packaging so the outer box could simply be slide right back on them.

What would be a fair price for them? Does anyone know how they compare to the Beta 50s? I have Revel F12s, so that is my frame of reference to a Beta 50 comparison. I like the Harman sound as I have Revels and JBLs, and was just wondering how these stack up too.

Edit - I do remember plhart stating something before that the European guys who designed the Alphas were surprised by how much better the Batas were than the Alphas. Didn't the Alphas fall right between the Interludes and the Betas IIRC? If so I assume the Interludes are more similar sounding to the Betas/Revel Concertas than the Alphas?
Edited by 65 Electra Glide - 2/18/13 at 9:00am
post #261 of 282
I will try my best to respond to the last 2 posters.
Yes, the IL 60 and the IL 36 Center will drop some Jaws, especially IF you take the time to use the RABOS equalizer for the bass. W/O using the RABOS on your IL 60, the speaker will sound "Boomy" if you crank up the bass. This is because of the room peak your room, and every room has. Now, if you do not RABOS your bass on the IL 60, and increase the level enough to provide some "warmth", the IL 60 can sound very boomy. To put it as simply as I can, a NON RABOSED Infinity IL 60 can sound "bright".
This is because the Infinity Engineers were "counting on you" to USE the RABOS Feature!
LOL, I Dogged the Infinity IL 60 in a review, stupid me! I was to blame, not the speaker! I had no earthly idea how much the RABOS could effect the TOTAL sound of the Speaker!
I stupidly thought the RABOS effected only the bass! The subwoofer in the IL 60 crosses over at about 125 hz! This means that unless you can turn up the bass, you will have a HOLE up at around 125 hz. Again, w/o RABOS, and because of the low bass capability of the IL 60, you will get BOOM when you increase the woofer level.
It is true, the IL 60 is about the flattest speaker Ever Designed. I have seen the Lab reports. However, the Infinity engineers intended to make a ruler flat speaker with the Infinity IL 60, and then allow the user to crank in the right amount of Bass below 125 HZ for their ears and room. A slight increase in Bass below 125 hz imparts what is known as a "warmth curve", (downward sloping response) and is what makes a speaker more listenable.

IF you can find a pair of Infinity IL 60's, especially with the large Infinity IL 36 center channel, RUN, do not walk, and buy them! If you set them up properly (be sure and RABOS them), you will be hard pressed to find such an impressive speaker system, especially on good recordings/movies!
They were designed back when Floyd Toole and his team of Canadien speaker engineers were still there. Sean Olive told me that Infinity's best engineer, at that time, did the crossovers on them.
LOL, Sean Olive also told me that in double blind listening tests, they were kicking the ass of the Mighty Prelude MTS so badly, that the Infinity Engineers :handicapped: the IL 60, by turning down it's bass level! The Prelude MTS has a good amount of power, on it's woofer section. However, because of it's futuristic looking design, it simply does not have the amount of volume for it's woofer, as the big IL 60 does.

Very very Few speakers can match the sheer bass power and quality of a pair of Infinity IL 60's, but they MUST be RABOSED to achieve this.

I promise you, you will never need subwoofers, with a pair of properly set up IL 60's.

I have seen IL 60's go for about 500.00 a pair used locally, here in Florida. There was a pair on Craigslist with the big Infinity IL 36 3 way center speaker for 650.00.

I think it is a safe thing to say that NOTHING will equal them, or even come close, at that price!
post #262 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka7niq View Post

I will try my best to respond to the last 2 posters.
Yes, the IL 60 and the IL 36 Center will drop some Jaws, especially IF you take the time to use the RABOS equalizer for the bass. W/O using the RABOS on your IL 60, the speaker will sound "Boomy" if you crank up the bass. This is because of the room peak your room, and every room has. Now, if you do not RABOS your bass on the IL 60, and increase the level enough to provide some "warmth", the IL 60 can sound very boomy. To put it as simply as I can, a NON RABOSED Infinity IL 60 can sound "bright".
This is because the Infinity Engineers were "counting on you" to USE the RABOS Feature!
LOL, I Dogged the Infinity IL 60 in a review, stupid me! I was to blame, not the speaker! I had no earthly idea how much the RABOS could effect the TOTAL sound of the Speaker!
I stupidly thought the RABOS effected only the bass! The subwoofer in the IL 60 crosses over at about 125 hz! This means that unless you can turn up the bass, you will have a HOLE up at around 125 hz. Again, w/o RABOS, and because of the low bass capability of the IL 60, you will get BOOM when you increase the woofer level.
It is true, the IL 60 is about the flattest speaker Ever Designed. I have seen the Lab reports. However, the Infinity engineers intended to make a ruler flat speaker with the Infinity IL 60, and then allow the user to crank in the right amount of Bass below 125 HZ for their ears and room. A slight increase in Bass below 125 hz imparts what is known as a "warmth curve", (downward sloping response) and is what makes a speaker more listenable.

IF you can find a pair of Infinity IL 60's, especially with the large Infinity IL 36 center channel, RUN, do not walk, and buy them! If you set them up properly (be sure and RABOS them), you will be hard pressed to find such an impressive speaker system, especially on good recordings/movies!
They were designed back when Floyd Toole and his team of Canadien speaker engineers were still there. Sean Olive told me that Infinity's best engineer, at that time, did the crossovers on them.
LOL, Sean Olive also told me that in double blind listening tests, they were kicking the ass of the Mighty Prelude MTS so badly, that the Infinity Engineers :handicapped: the IL 60, by turning down it's bass level! The Prelude MTS has a good amount of power, on it's woofer section. However, because of it's futuristic looking design, it simply does not have the amount of volume for it's woofer, as the big IL 60 does.

Very very Few speakers can match the sheer bass power and quality of a pair of Infinity IL 60's, but they MUST be RABOSED to achieve this.

I promise you, you will never need subwoofers, with a pair of properly set up IL 60's.

I have seen IL 60's go for about 500.00 a pair used locally, here in Florida. There was a pair on Craigslist with the big Infinity IL 36 3 way center speaker for 650.00.

I think it is a safe thing to say that NOTHING will equal them, or even come close, at that price!

Thanks for the comments. As for RABOS, I am somewhat familiar with it since I have a pair of Revel B12 subs which also has it, although I think Revel has a different name for it. As I understand it however, it's identical. Maybe plhart can confirm this (or deny it).

With that said however, keep in mind RABOS was designed in the days before Audessey Multieq XT 32. That does a much better job IMO of calibrating/integrating the subs than RABOS. I realize that's not really apples to apples since it is comparing a separate sub crossed over at 80 or even 60 Hz to left & right mains as opposed to a powered tower with integrated subs crossed over at 125 Hz, but still, I don't see why XT 32 couldn't do an even better job integrating them than RABOS on it's on.

Edit - just did a search and found that none other than plhart himself also feels this way:
Quote:
Originally Posted by plhart View Post

IMHO Until Audyssey's MultEQ XT came on the scene the splice of any subwoofer to any satellite was a real crap shoot based necessarily on the real world physics of long frequency lengths versus room interaction(s) with the listener at the listening position.


Because the CSW-10 has built-in RABOS it has the potential to smooth it's primary speaker/room interaction peak which in my assessment makes it better able to sound psycho-acoustically to the listener like it is "mating better". Because if the RABOS calibration is done well (at 80-100Hz max) through repeated tries to get it really right in the calibration process the CSW-10 will indeed be mating better with any given satellite.


As I intimated at the beginning though IMO it is only with the additional further precise (but automatically performed) calibration of at least some version of Audyssey that the subwoofer-to-satellite splice has the potential capability of approaching becoming undetectable and "seamless" to the listener(s) at the RABOS + Audyssey calibrated listening position(s). This is because the satellite roll-off curve and the bump or dip the satellite's designed-in curve takes also needs to be smoothed to ensure that seamlessly spliced transition.

Edited by 65 Electra Glide - 2/18/13 at 10:54am
post #263 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by 65 Electra Glide View Post

Thanks for the comments. As for RABOS, I am somewhat familiar with it since I have a pair of Revel B12 subs which also has it, although I think Revel has a different name for it. As I understand it however, it's identical. Maybe plhart can confirm this (or deny it).

With that said however, keep in mind RABOS was designed in the days before Audessey Multieq XT 32. That does a much better job IMO of calibrating/integrating the subs than RABOS. I realize that's not really apples to apples since it is comparing a separate sub crossed over at 80 or even 60 Hz to left & right mains as opposed to a powered tower with integrated subs crossed over at 125 Hz, but still, I don't see why XT 32 couldn't do an even better job integrating them than RABOS on it's on.

Edit - just did a search and found that none other than plhart himself also feels this way:
Well, I have had Audyssey, as well as several other automatic EQ Schemes. I kind of like RABOS better. Here is why. Every room has a big resonant peak somewhere.
Pull down that peak, and you normally get good bass.
My problems with Audyssey, and other auto EQ schemes is this. Go ahead and auto EQ your room. Then, move the mic a 1/4 inch, and you get a whole new set of EQ Curves!
That "cured me" from Audyssey, and YPAO, and the other schemes that EQ your room automatically.
LOL, and I was gonna buy the Trinova Processor!

I am not anti eq, or anti tone controls, I just trust my own ears more then some automatic device.
post #264 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka7niq View Post

Well, I have had Audyssey, as well as several other automatic EQ Schemes. I kind of like RABOS better. Here is why. Every room has a big resonant peak somewhere.
Pull down that peak, and you normally get good bass.
My problems with Audyssey, and other auto EQ schemes is this. Go ahead and auto EQ your room. Then, move the mic a 1/4 inch, and you get a whole new set of EQ Curves!
That "cured me" from Audyssey, and YPAO, and the other schemes that EQ your room automatically.
LOL, and I was gonna buy the Trinova Processor!

I am not anti eq, or anti tone controls, I just trust my own ears more then some automatic device.

Which version of Audessey specifically? Have you actually measured the differences they each made in your room?

FWIW, Audessey can also help tame the biggest peak, and then also still do a whole lot more besides. If you're not already familiar with it, do a search for Audessey XT 32's sub eq capabilities (or, the now discontinued SVS dual sub eq unit, which was basically XT 32's sub eq predecessor and about the same), and read up on it and how you can place the mic in several different listening positions. I realize it's an approximate 10 year older technology, but frankly, RABOS is kind of primitive by comparison.
post #265 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by 65 Electra Glide View Post

Which version of Audessey specifically? Have you actually measured the differences they each made in your room?

FWIW, Audessey can also help tame the biggest peak, and then also still do a whole lot more besides. If you're not already familiar with it, do a search for Audessey XT 32's sub eq capabilities (or, the now discontinued SVS dual sub eq unit, which was basically XT 32's sub eq predecessor and about the same), and read up on it and how you can place the mic in several different listening positions. I realize it's an approximate 10 year older technology, but frankly, RABOS is kind of primitive by comparison.
It was the Audyssey built into a top of the line Onkyo Integra, and also in a top of the line old Denon.
Maybe I did something wrong ? I am open to that.
But seriously, this has been an awesome Infinity thread, it really has! Let's try to stay on topic about Infinity speakers, ok ?
Kind of hoping that Patrick guy who designed the Infinity Beta Series speakers will return to the thread ?
post #266 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka7niq View Post

It was the Audyssey built into a top of the line Onkyo Integra, and also in a top of the line old Denon.
Maybe I did something wrong ? I am open to that.
But seriously, this has been an awesome Infinity thread, it really has! Let's try to stay on topic about Infinity speakers, ok ?
Kind of hoping that Patrick guy who designed the Infinity Beta Series speakers will return to the thread ?

Based on what you're saying, I'm fairly certain it was probably an older version of Audyssey, perhaps even the one with no sub eq at all. If that was the case, then yes, RABOS would obviously have been better through sheer default.

And as far as I'm concerned, we have never left the topic of Infinity speakers when we are discussing ways to make them sound even better.
post #267 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by 65 Electra Glide View Post

Based on what you're saying, I'm fairly certain it was probably an older version of Audyssey, perhaps even the one with no sub eq at all. If that was the case, then yes, RABOS would obviously have been better through sheer default.

And as far as I'm concerned, we have never left the topic of Infinity speakers when we are discussing ways to make them sound even better.
And ...... what Infinity Speakers do you have ?
post #268 of 282
Thanks Ka7niq for your valuable input. My IL60s have been treated with RABOS. I had to buy the kit separately, but it was well worth it. Now I'm in the process of treating the RABOSed woofers, along with a DT PF1500, to a second go round with a BFD 1394. Maybe I can get the low bass really flat at Position 1.

Bought these speakers sound unheard. Best stupid decision I ever made in my life.
Edited by GLBright - 2/18/13 at 3:19pm
post #269 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by GLBright View Post

Thanks Ka7niq for your valuable input. My IL60s have been treated with RABOS. I had to buy the kit separately, but it was well worth it. Now I'm in the process of treating the RABOSed woofers, along with a DT PF1500, to a second go round with a BFD 1394. Maybe I can get the low bass really flat at Position 1.

Bought these speakers sound unheard. Best stupid decision I ever made in my life.
When I did the RABOS, I just concentrated on knocking down the one big bass peak in my room. No matter where I moved the Bass Tester, that one big peak was pretty much evident.

I just ignored the other small deviations from flat response, because their measurements were dependent on where I placed the measurement device.

Once I flattened that one big ass peak, it allowed me to really crank up the IL 60's Woofer level ! The IL 60 has awesome low bass capability! And once the big room peak has been dealt with, no more Boom. But, even more important, I find the IL 60 "needs it's woofer" to help fill out the midrange!
The RABOS reduction of the big room peak, allows me to increase the woofer level on the IL 60 w/o fear of boomy bass, so the speaker has the "warmth" the Infinity Engineers intended it to have.

Suffice it to say, the IL 60 needs, and depends on it's woofer level, since it does play up to 125 hz!

Every IL 60 I have seen for sale used, the owners never bothered to USE the RABOS. I was one of those Idiots, with my very first pair of IL 60's!
Then, I bought a used pair of IL 60's, and called out to Infinity, to tell them how much I liked them, and how much "better" then the IL 60's I Thought they were.

The first question Sean Olive of Infinity asked me was "Chris, did you RABOS them" ?

Then, after nicely telling me what I did wrong, he told me all about how the properly set up "lowly IL 60's" beat the **** out of the "mighty" Prelude MTS, in controlled, double blind listening tests.

I could not sleep, nor could I eat, until I finally found a another pair of the Infinity IL 60's. I had to drive clear down to Miami from here in Tampa to get them.

I still have them, all set up properly, fully RABOSED, and with the IL 36 center channel speaker. That is an awesome center as well!

I paid 600,00 used for the Infinity IL 60's and the IL 36, plus a drive to Miami from Tampa.

Let's say I have 700.00 in them, including Gas ?

I do not know WHAT I could possibly buy, for 700.00, that will beat them, or even come close. My Son, who is 32, listens to Rap, and says they really "Hit".

The Movie "The Chronicles Of Riddick" has some really scary dynamic deep bass. I have literally had my little nephews and niece nearly pee their pants watching it on the IL 60's, and this is in a large 20 by 24 ft room.

I also have owned the big JBL S 412P, and some Polk RTI powered towers, don't remember the model number. I found them to be pretenders, compared to the IL 60.

I also took home some absolutely huge Definitive BP 2000 Bipolar speakers on trial. They did have awesome bass, easily equal to the IL 60, but they were bipolar, and had too much "room sound" for my tastes.
post #270 of 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka7niq View Post

And ...... what Infinity Speakers do you have ?

The NOS Interlude IL60s I just agreed to terms on and will pick up this weekend.

Thanks for asking though. wink.gif
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