Originally Posted by bsheldon
I appreciate the shots you took at me without merit craig--no offense taken at all. However, I do have to ask, "have you heard them?"
I'm sorry if it came across as me taking "shots" at you. I didn't mean it that way. My comments were intended to be directed at the concept of dismissing a new sub based on the historical perspective of a sub that is 2 generations removed from a new, and completely different design:
No idea on the release date on the new subs, as again I would never buy a klipsch sub.
I took this to mean that you've made up your mind about these new subs before they've hit the street. All I suggested was that the OP wait to pass judgement on them until they arrive.
Granted you didn't specifically say they are great or anything, but you are definately acting as a cheerleadeer for them.
I wasn't trying to be a "cheerleader" for them, but I do think they have some very *interesting* new features that deserve serious consideration. The Klipsch Press Release
is really the only information we have on these subs so far. If you read it, you will see that these subs are truly unique, not just for Klipsch, but for the subwoofer industry as a whole. AFAIK, no other subwoofer uses a 12" driver with two 12" PR's in a small, triangular design that is optimized for corner-loading. (Martin-Logan uses a quasi-triangular design in the Descent line, but they use 3 active drivers in a sealed system and they don't specifically recommend corner-loading). Klipsch has always used "corner-loading" in their speaker designs, (i.e., Klipschorns), however, these are the first subs to be specifically designed for corner-loading. It will be *interesting* to see if this is a useful design, or if it just adds output at the expense of FR anomalies.
They also have a feature called "Adaptive Room Correction" which uses a calibrated mic and DSP to equalize the sub to the room. It appears to use a digital EQ, but doesn't say whether it's parametric or graphical, how many bands it has, and what the boost and cut ranges are. Will it be as functional as Velodyne's Digital Drive/SMS-1 system, or will it be just a single band of EQ like some of the SVS subs? We don't know yet. (In all honesty, I don't expect this system to be any better than most of the other automatic EQ systems out there. For example, I have a Velodyne SMS-1. I have bypassed the automatic EQ mode because I can get much flatter response with the manual mode. I also have a Yamaha receiver with YPAO. I have disabled the auto-EQ because I don't like any of the automated preset programs). It will be *interesting* to see if Klipsch can implement automatic room correction better than some of the other designs.
Right now, I have an Earthquake Supernova MKV-15 and a Velodyne SMS-1. I acquired the two units for a combined price that was slightly more than the MSRP of the RT-12d. If the RT-12d has solid extension below 20 Hz and a functional EQ as good as the SMS-1, it could be a good "value". However, on the surface, $2k seems like a lot of money for a small sub with just one 12" active driver. Although all these new designs and features look like "interesting" concepts, I'll reserve judgement until the units actually hit the streets and I can listen to one.
In terms of your dissatisfying audition of the RW12, if you had the gain "maxed out" and it wasn't putting out sufficient volume, I would suggest there was something definitely wrong, either with the setup, or more likely, with the sub itself, as your experience would be very atypical for that sub. I have a friend who owns it and it really pounds from about 30 Hz up. Max'ing out the gain, if done for a long period of time can have a severe detrimental effect on an amplifier. If this was a long-term, in-store demo unit and the gain had been set at maximum for a significant period of time, the amp was probably shot. It's also possible that the driver was "bottomed" or the voice coil overheated. If you were in fact dealing with a defective RW-12, I would encourage you to reconsider your own opinion of Klipsch subs, just for the sake of fairness, not because I'm their cheerleader.