or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Receivers, Amps, and Processors › Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 468

post #14011 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikefl52 View Post

This has got me thinking how ARC works with dipoles. I have a pair of B&W DS8S speakers set as dipoles for my system and the sound from those speakers is very diffuse, lots of reflections with a direct null close to the listener position as it should be. I have an ARC system on order (has been for 5 weeks now) and was wondering how it will handle these reflections from the dipoles. Does anyone have a dipole set up for their surround speakers and has used ARC? Does it manage to handle the reflective nature of the sound?

I would think ARC would work very well indeed with dipoles. Apparently a key part of what it does is to try to separate out room response from inherent speaker performance. And the less directional the speakers are the less the various mic positions will be affected by directionality -- which means what's left, i.e., what's making up any measured difference from mic position to mic position, must be room response.

=====================

ETA: I see we've passed 14,000 posts in this thread! Pretty good for a 2 year old product. Maybe we should have a party for 15,000.
--Bob
post #14012 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

Hank,
Have you replaced your Ruby bulb?

What D2 ver are you running?

What Sony proj is using an 800 watt Xenon lamp....have you seen it?

Peter

Same Bulb as original.

D2 FW is 1.11

I have no idea What Sony proj is using an 800 watt Xenon lamp
post #14013 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

Hank,
Have you replaced your Ruby bulb?

What D2 ver are you running?

What Sony proj is using an 800 watt Xenon lamp....have you seen it?

Peter

The Sony Qualia uses a 700W Xenon lamp... But rumor is there is a brighter Xenon model on the way .
post #14014 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

Same Bulb as original.

D2 FW is 1.11

I have no idea What Sony proj is using an 800 watt Xenon lamp

I am about to go to my third lamp........I believe the second seemed to degrade at a faster clip than the first. I'm at 1400 hrs which is about 500hrs beyond the acceptable UN standard for technologies available to primates taller than three feet!!!!

I asked about the D2 version as I'm also about to jump from 1.10 to the latest 'approved' full prod build 1.3.2. and I have what amounts to a quantum leap. I'm going to just pull the HDMI cables, close my eyes, and hit the enter key. I just picked up my ARC but I think I'll wait to deploy that for a few weeks to verify some sense of normal system behaviour before I jump into those waters.

There have been a number of observations here that the move from 1.11 to 1.3(x) has improved PQ and I figured I would check to see if you had that experience before I changed the bulb. Clearly, you haven't as I assume you have committed to reduce global warming by NOT changing your bulb and proving that watching a movie with only three candle power is not impossible even with a Ruby!!!!

So I guess its change the bulb, then change the D2 and then the ARC finishing with the PS3 which you and Bob have finally convinced me to do.

Really Hank, how can you possibly watch anything with your ruby? Oh, I get it, you're wearing night goggles!

Peter

PS. the 800 watt bulb is real.
post #14015 of 42717
deleted, badly formated message
post #14016 of 42717
zzzzdoc

The "Power" button on the remote is the discrete "ON" code, I don't believe they have a toggle "Power" code or button.
post #14017 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

Really Hank, how can you possibly watch anything with your ruby? Oh, I get it, you're wearing night goggles!

Peter.

It is NOT about the BULB.

I learned that back in 1996 when I built my Theater
using DIM CRT PJ's. It is about Light Control and then
the NASTY Secret no one talks about.

It is ABOUT the High-Gain SCREEN.
post #14018 of 42717
I have the D2 without the ARC. Is it just a matter of me buying the ARC kit or does Anthem need to physically retrofit the unit to make it work with ARC?

Also, What is the difference between a D2 with ARC vs a D2 retrofitted with ARC? Is ARC easier to use on a D2 that already includes it?

I guess it's worth it from the responses in this thread...that's great?
post #14019 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by MStanic View Post

I have the D2 without the ARC. Is it just a matter of me buying the ARC kit or does Anthem need to physically retrofit the unit to make it work with ARC?

Also, What is the difference between a D2 with ARC vs a D2 retrofitted with ARC? Is ARC easier to use on a D2 that already includes it?

I guess it's worth it from the responses in this thread...that's great?

Get your unit serial number and order the ARC via your dealer. That's it. There is no difference between New D2 with ARC and Kit version. There is no retrofitting involved (no opening of the chassis).
post #14020 of 42717
When calibrating your video display, do you first calibrate the television then the D2. Or, do you calibrate the television(using the televisions's controls) through the D2?

I have my D2 set to extended RGB for the PS3, with PS3 hdmi set to full RGB, is this correct?
post #14021 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I would think ARC would work very well indeed with dipoles. Apparently a key part of what it does is to try to separate out room response from inherent speaker performance. And the less directional the speakers are the less the various mic positions will be affected by directionality -- which means what's left, i.e., what's making up any measured difference from mic position to mic position, must be room response.

=====================

ETA: I see we've passed 14,000 posts in this thread! Pretty good for a 2 year old product. Maybe we should have a party for 15,000.
--Bob

Bob

Thanks for the response. What you say makes sense. Now I have to just hope that my ARC comes soooooooon!

Mike
post #14022 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

It is NOT about the BULB.

I learned that back in 1996 when I built my Theater
using DIM CRT PJ's. It is about Light Control and then
the NASTY Secret no one talks about.

It is ABOUT the High-Gain SCREEN.

Hank,
You really are so much fun. I had the first High-Gain screen in 1980 before it was even known as a product differentiator. My 'model one' demanded full ambient light control or it was fog city!
I honestly feel you are missing the 'wow' factor that I know I experienced when I slipped the new bulb in the first replacement. Also the D2 doubly enhances that experience due to the significant software evolution post 1.11 if you believe half of what you read in this thread.

Since you drive the second fastest production car in the world surely you can afford to fully exploit that phenomenal environment you have created and use your new bulb. Think about it.......you might even half way catch up to Bob!

Peter
post #14023 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

Since you drive the second fastest production car in the world surely you can afford to fully exploit that phenomenal environment you have created and use your new bulb. Think about it.......you might even half way catch up to Bob!

Peter

I'm OLD - I need to save my eyes from excessive brightness
post #14024 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by bballer View Post

When calibrating your video display, do you first calibrate the television then the D2. Or, do you calibrate the television(using the televisions's controls) through the D2?

I have my D2 set to extended RGB for the PS3, with PS3 hdmi set to full RGB, is this correct?

Bob P will answer this question as he has soooooo many times in this lengthy thread. I can tell you that it is highly recommended that you calibrate the projector to the source material available in the D2 then calibrate the various source devices to the D2 and do NOT touch the projector. As has been noted before wherever possible let your D2 do the heavy lifting. Bob and or Hank can answer your ps3 question as I haven't mounted mine yet.

Also for anyone 'lurking' or first time posters I have some advice that may bear fruit for some............At the top of this thread there are a number of very generic subjects covered that range from basic calibration procedures to answers to basic and advanced configuration challenges that many of us have experienced from the beginning. Bob Pariseau has authored many of them and they remain Nobel Prize winning candidates not just for their proprietary relevance to the Anthems but to the home theater general domain. Even experienced members of this thread have revisited them from time to time with consistent echoes of their continuing value. So take a quick peek at the first page of this thread and see if it makes sense...........alot of work and experience are located in those first update articles and have immeasurable value for all of us.

Peter
post #14025 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by bballer View Post

I have my D2 set to extended RGB for the PS3, with PS3 hdmi set to full RGB, is this correct?

HDMI always requires the YPB or something like that setting.
For sure it has a "Y" in the name.

RGB is for DVI - NOT HDMI.
post #14026 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post
Give Anthem tech support a call. They will likely ask you to install the D2 V1.32 software as a first step, since it has some improvements both in the power up sequence and in the HDMI driver over the V1.31 version you are currently using.

Were you using V1.31 with your prior AVM-50? It could be all of your issues are software related.

The image of the Setup menu looks like it has some pretty serious ringing. The image is named "component" so I'm not sure what you are trying there, as I thought you were using HDMI.
--Bob
Thanks Bob, I'll give them a call tomorrow.

No, on my AVM-50 it was ver 1.06.

Yes the image is from the D2 component out, I was checking to see if the issues on the HDMI out were also on the component side. I found I have different issues on the comoponent out.

On a different note here are my first run ARC graphs.

 

Anthem Correction Charts.pdf 88.443359375k . file
post #14027 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by bballer View Post

When calibrating your video display, do you first calibrate the television then the D2. Or, do you calibrate the television(using the televisions's controls) through the D2?

I have my D2 set to extended RGB for the PS3, with PS3 hdmi set to full RGB, is this correct?

See the "Video Calibration for non-ISF Techs" post found in the collection of links in the first post in this thread.

First of all, Extended RGB is almost always the wrong choice if you have the option of Studio RGB, or even better YCbCr. See the posts in the "Data Format" section of the collected links for details, but the simple reason is that use of Extended RGB means you discard Blacker than Black and Peak White data and "stretch" the number of steps from Black to Reference White (which likely introduces some banding).

For connection to the D2, the PS3 should be set to send 1080p/24 (for normal Blu-Ray movie playback -- also enable 1080i for "live video" Blu-Ray discs, 720p for some games, and 480p -- no upscaling -- if you intend to play standard DVDs as well), using YCbCr output and with SuperWhite turned on. The Extended/Limited RGB setting should be left at its default, Limited setting, but it doesn't really make any difference so long as you are using YCbCr output from the PS3. The Extended/Limited setting only affects RGB output. I believe some games may force the PS3 to send RGB so that's why you should confirm the Limited setting. Meanwhile, in the Video Source Adjust / Picture / Input Color space menu for that input in the D2 (under the "7" key), confirm that Auto YCbCr and Studio RGB are both checked.

-----------------------------------

Calibrating a modern TV -- as done by a professional calibration specialist (i.e., an ISF technician) -- involves several things a user would not normally be able to do, or do well, beyond the setting of the basic video levels (e.g., Brightness, Contrast, Color, Tint, and Sharpness). In particular, the ISF tech will attempt to go into hidden service menus in the TV to fine tune the gray scale ramps and color temperature of the display -- Gamma correction and such. To do that, he will use a signal generator that sends a known signal to the display, and he will have to adjust the basic levels as well as a preliminary step of this. But the MAIN thing you are gaining from this effort is the adjustments he makes in the service menus to refine the internal factory settings of the display. And when done correctly this is a big win.

The video the D2 outputs, as exemplified by its internally generated test patterns, is close enough to a reference video signal (if not identical) that the calibration the ISF tech comes up with should be just right for use with the D2 as well. BUT, if the tech was forced to make some compromises in his setup of the display -- as is far too common given the limited adjustment controls in many displays -- the basic level settings he leaves in the display may not be quite perfect for use with the D2.

Ideally, having adjusted the display using his signal generator, he should then REFINE those adjustments (again in the service menus as necessary) to precisely match the video the D2 puts out using the D2's internally generated test patterns. It may turn out that only modest tweaks to the display's basic video levels will suffice or he may need to revise his entire "compromise" combo of settings between the basic levels and the service menu.

The D2 also provides additional control over the Gamma correction built into its video output. The tech may be able to make good use of that to get around limited controls in the display itself, and to come up with a video solution which is more perfect and less of a compromise. Again, this sort of thing is BEST done inside the display, so that's where he should start. But the output adjustments in the D2 (Video Source Adjust / Output / Gamma for EACH input -- as extended by the Live Video Settings Editor application) may provide just the extra control he needs to get around some thorny problems in the display.

If the tech doesn't want to do that, for whatever reason, then *YOU* need to adjust the basic levels of the display to match the output of the D2. And with a well calibrated display the necessary tweaks should be minor. It is unlikely you will go into the service menus yourself, but you will likely be able to refine the display's settings all you need simply by doing user level adjustments of its basic video levels.

So whether or not you do this sort of full scale adjustment of the factory settings of the display -- including service menu adjustments -- it is still fundamental that the initial step in setting up the D2 is to refine the basic video level settings of the display to best reproduce the test patterns internally generated in the D2.

And all of that is independent of any video input sources connected to your D2.

Once that is done, you adjust independently for your video input sources using the input adjustments on the D2. The display's setup remains unchanged during this as it is the D2's job to convert any input video to the same video output (as shown by the D2's internal video test patterns) that you've already used to set up your display.
--Bob
post #14028 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbwright View Post

Thanks Bob, I'll give them a call tomorrow.

No, on my AVM-50 it was ver 1.06.

Yes the image is from the D2 component out, I was checking to see if the issues on the HDMI out were also on the component side. I found I have different issues on the comoponent out.

On a different note here are my first run ARC graphs.

The Component video issue may simply be that you have Sharpness cranked all the way up on that input in your display. But the ringing (ghost imaging) is so severe it looks more like an improperly terminated Component video connection or that you are pushing a video resolution into the display over those Component cables that the display is not really able to handle via Component.
--Bob
post #14029 of 42717
I believe the ARC re-measurement I did using the new Anthem instructions (at least 24" between mic positions and successive mic positions alternating left and right of center) has made for significant improvement in my center speaker results.

For whatever reason, the prior measurements I did, even as re-analyzed by ARC V1.2.1, apparently decided my center speaker was a poorer performing speaker than it really is. This was evidenced by a rather high cross over and by the particular "target" curve selected for that speaker (virtually no room gain and sharper roll off at either end). I suspect this is due to ARC having trouble detecting the true room response to that speaker (given the way I did the older measurements) and thus ARC was interpreting what it was hearing as inherently poor speaker performance.

The curious thing was that it was ONLY my center speaker that had these results. This is why it didn't occur to me that the measurement mic positioning might be at fault. For a while, I even thought I might have Richard Syndrome in that speaker.

Mind you, ARC did a fine job "correcting" the center speaker EVEN GIVEN ALL THAT, but the latest set of measurements allows ARC to make better use of what that speaker can actually handle.

And the result is audibly superior.

The new mic positioning recommendations seem to be a big improvement.
--Bob
post #14030 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post


ETA: I see we've passed 14,000 posts in this thread! Pretty good for a 2 year old product. Maybe we should have a party for 15,000.
--Bob


Bob,
I couldn't agree more. We could meet at Hank's but we'd have to sit in the dark.

Seriously it is a testament to this technology that it has sustained this incredible level of continuing interest and involvement from such a worldwide diverse group. Although, there have been significant improvements in other 'competing technologies' in the last year.....they are still playing catch-up to the anthems and NONE of them have demonstrated the ongoing suite of improvements to the existing box (D2) nor are they even capable. I offer ARC as the prime example. There have been more improvements to ARC since its release to better the product than any other integrated or stand alone device on the market. What a phenomenal accomplishment!

So yes Bob, I'm up for some sort of celebration at 15,000. Perhaps the fall conference in Denver???

Peter
post #14031 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

Bob,
I couldn't agree more. We could meet at Hank's but we'd have to sit in the dark.

ONLY Theater #3 is DARK.

The rest of the place is well lit.

Speaking of Well Lit - I bought a BRIGHT PJ
for the Game Room - where there is lots of
LIGHT to deal with.

It should arrive Thursday.
post #14032 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

ONLY Theater #3 is DARK.

The rest of the place is well lit.

Speaking of Well Lit - I bought a BRIGHT PJ
for the Game Room - where there is lots of
LIGHT to deal with.

It should arrive Thursday.

OK, I'll bite, which one?

Will you run it through the D2?

Peter
post #14033 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

OK, I'll bite, which one?

Will you run it through the D2?

Peter

NO D2 - it is for GAMING - See Below.

PT-AX200U
LL
post #14034 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

NO D2 - it is for GAMING - See Below.

PT-AX200U

Oh my God..........Hank will you marry me?????????


Where did you get that rig?????
post #14035 of 42717
I just did both updates to the D2.
1.32 installed without incident and other than what has been mentioned have noticed a few small differences so far. Notice the onscreen says PCM now when listening to CD's.
Also...when running through status the Audio Output now has a "DMut" on the lower right corner.
Bob - any idea what this is?

As for the new ARC, I reran the entire procedure including test signals.
The tones now run approximately 8 times as opposed to the previous 4 or 5.
My readings came out relatively the same. The upload process went without incident and I did not experience the Sub pops (not the label :-)) mentioned by Bob earlier.
I am now convincing myself that my system sounds better than it did before!
I LOVE THIS MACHINE!
/\\/\\
post #14036 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine ball View Post

Oh my God..........Hank will you marry me?????????


Where did you get that rig?????

Where all good gammers go - the TOY STORE
post #14037 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by drmabuse View Post

Also...when running through status the Audio Output now has a "DMut" on the lower right corner.
Bob - any idea what this is?

I don't recall seeing this. And I haven't spotted any write up on it. At a guess it stands for Digital Mute -- perhaps meaning the D2's digital audio output (for use with a digital audio recorder) is muted due to the digital audio input being copy protected.

Also, I wonder what might be different that you didn't hear the sub pops during the ARC upload? You are brave to even try it after the dire warnings posted here.
--Bob
post #14038 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I don't recall seeing this. And I haven't spotted any write up on it. At a guess it stands for Digital Mute -- perhaps meaning the D2's digital audio output (for use with a digital audio recorder) is muted due to the digital audio input being copy protected.

Also, I wonder what might be different that you didn't hear the sub pops during the ARC upload? You are brave to even try it after the dire warnings posted here.
--Bob

Have 1.32 and ARC 1.2.1 also. Did the re-measurements before the warning, did not notice any loud pop with the subwoofer.

Even with the new way of placing the mics, I still get relatively the same response curve as before, i.e, no ROOM GAIN. I emailed Nick about this and I will send him my ARC file later.
post #14039 of 42717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Also, I wonder what might be different that you didn't hear the sub pops during the ARC upload? You are brave to even try it after the dire warnings posted here.
--Bob

Perhaps more stupid than brave but was curious.
post #14040 of 42717
One of the things I keep meaning to mention to Nick is this...
Whenever I upload my settings to my computer for file save or download back into the D2 the Subs setting in both Movie and Music goes back to 1 Sub as opposed to my saved setting as 2 Subs.
Has anyone else ever noticed this? Not a big deal just one of those odd things that never seems to get fixed in any of the updates...
/\\/\\
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Receivers, Amps, and Processors
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Receivers, Amps, and Processors › Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide