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Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 494

post #14791 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Is Comcast screwing up my HDTV de-interlacing?

I've been noticing more cases where my D2 incorrectly drops out of film-mode when watching 1080i HDTV movies. The symptom is that there is a second or two of de-interlacing problems and then it corrects. Watching the Film Mode indicator in the Video Source Adjust / Info panel while replaying the scene on my HD-DVR I can actually see the D2 dropping out of film mode when the artifacts appear.

The question is whether something has gotten screwed up in the D2 V1.33 software or whether this is just another consequence of the heavy-handed "re-compression" that Comcast is doing to its channels in my market?

SO: Are others seeing 1080i HDTV de-interlacing issues with the V1.33 software? And if so, is your HDTV feed giving you video that otherwise appears to be undamaged, or is your HDTV provider also screwing up its retransmissions?

How 'bout folks who might be feeding other types of film-based content to the D2 at 1080i such as folks who have decided to use scaling in their SD DVD player instead of sending 480i to the D2? Have you noticed any degradation in 1080i de-interlacing performance with the D2 V1.33 software?

480i de-interlacing performance remains perfect as best I can tell. So if there's an issue here it will be just with 1080i/60 feeds of film-based content into the D2. I'm more than willing to believe it is just Comcast screwing up my HDTV feed, but I thought I'd check with some of the old hands here.
--Bob

I have noticed 480i SD DVD that isn't anamorphic, looks really bad even with the scaling in my AVM 50. There is a lot of artifacts the worst being stair stepping around edges an people's mouths. Is this normal?
John
post #14792 of 40764
Is anybody using the function that allows you to switch the rears and surrounds for the 6-CH analog input?

I do not seem to be able to get this function to work properly.

I want to be able to apply the analog-dsp and no other processing to my multi-channel (and 2-channel) SACD and DVD-A recordings from my DVD player.

I have switched the pre-outs to my amplifier per the instructions and have set the processing to analog-dsp. The sound still comes out of my surround speakers. (I have the copy surrounds to rears turned "off" as turning this on causes the sound to come out of both the surrounds and rears).

A similar question: is there a three button macro available for the analog-dsp setting alone, or would that be the "none" option? Is there a three button macro available to switch to analog-dir(ect) for a "DSP" setting?

Another questions: is there a three button macro to available to turn on and off the "copy surround to rears" as I would like to use this in all cases, but when listening to the 6-CH analog input - it would be nice to be able to select this on-the-fly.

Per communications with Anthem nearly two years ago I knew there was a glitch in the D1 software in regards to this function, but I was really hoping it had been addressed with the new software in the upgrade to a D1-HD.

Thank you,

Mike
post #14793 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayray View Post

ps. did you say ARC would not affect this input due to lack of bass management for Aanalog/dir?

Correct. ARC processing happens in the digital audio section of the D2. If you use ANALOG-DIRECT for an analog source, the input analog signal is never digitized and thus you lose ALL of the D2's processing features. Basically what you are left with is only the main volume control, just as would be the case with a traditional, non-processing pre-amp.

For a multi-channel player, this means you are entirely dependent on bass management and speaker time alignment (speaker distances) IN THE PLAYER. For a player sending out pure stereo (such as a traditional CD player when using its RCA analog audio stereo output jacks), you would have no bass management at all, which means no audio would be sent to your subwoofer.

If you use ANALOG-DSP in the D2, then the D2 digitizes its various analog audio inputs (both simple stereo inputs and also the multi-channel analog input) and then offers the full set of D2 audio processing -- including ARC. The processed digital audio that results is then converted to analog for output to your your amps.
--Bob
post #14794 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbMagFab View Post

Could this have something to do with the increased use of non-standard cadence by video distributors to squeeze in more commercials?

The impact on things like the HQV Reon/Realta are weird judder, as they get confused about the odd cadence coming across.

It could be, I suppose, although the D2 seems to be pretty snappy at picking up on even the odd-ball cadences.

I'm thinking that they might be screwing up the cadences when putting their "bug" logos and banner adds on the channels, but I'm seeing some cases that don't seem to be associated with that. It may also be that they are editing the content (badly) and screwing up the cadences, but the D2 is pretty good at recovering from that, so that would mean they must be "forcing" video mode for a second or so after such an edit.

[Remember folks: Friends don't let friends install Comcast.]
--Bob
post #14795 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayray View Post

I have noticed 480i SD DVD that isn't anamorphic, looks really bad even with the scaling in my AVM 50. There is a lot of artifacts the worst being stair stepping around edges an people's mouths. Is this normal?
John

Keep in mind that some SD DVD transfers are just godawful to begin with. The older, non-anamorphic titles are more likely to fall into this category.

Make sure you have the D2's Video Source Adjust / Picture / Film Mode set to Auto for that input, and then you can check the Video Source Adjust / Info panel to see when the D2 is detecting film cadences. (NOTE: This will only be applicable if the input video is interlaced. Film Mode will always show as OFF in the Info panel if you are sending progressive video to the D2.)

Also, make sure your player really is sending 480i to the D2 and not 480p. If it is sending 480p then the de-interlacing is actually happening inside your player and not in the D2.

(And of course make sure the D2 is set to output the video resolution that most closely matches the "native" resolution of your display so that the display doesn't have to scale things a second time.)

But sometimes the producers used video rate tools to do editing and did it so badly that they screwed up the interlaced data before it ever got put onto the disc.
--Bob
post #14796 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Correct. ARC processing happens in the digital audio section of the D2. If you use ANALOG-DIRECT for an analog source, the input analog signal is never digitized and thus you lose ALL of the D2's processing features. Basically what you are left with is only the main volume control, just as would be the case with a traditional, non-processing pre-amp.

For a multi-channel player, this means you are entirely dependent on bass management and speaker time alignment (speaker distances) IN THE PLAYER. For a player sending out pure stereo (such as a traditional CD player when using its RCA analog audio stereo output jacks), you would have no bass management at all, which means no audio would be sent to your subwoofer.

If you use ANALOG-DSP in the D2, then the D2 digitizes its various analog audio inputs (both simple stereo inputs and also the multi-channel analog input) and then offers the full set of D2 audio processing -- including ARC. The processed digital audio that results is then converted to analog for output to your your amps.
--Bob

And it makes a tremendous difference in sound. I now use Analog dsp for all of my Sacd's. I have my Sony 777 connected with analog outputs for SACD

Dick
post #14797 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by CycloneMike View Post

Is anybody using the function that allows you to switch the rears and surrounds for the 6-CH analog input?

I do not seem to be able to get this function to work properly.

I want to be able to apply the analog-dsp and no other processing to my multi-channel (and 2-channel) SACD and DVD-A recordings from my DVD player.

I have switched the pre-outs to my amplifier per the instructions and have set the processing to analog-dsp. The sound still comes out of my surround speakers. (I have the copy surrounds to rears turned "off" as turning this on causes the sound to come out of both the surrounds and rears).

A similar question: is there a three button macro available for the analog-dsp setting alone, or would that be the "none" option? Is there a three button macro available to switch to analog-dir(ect) for a "DSP" setting?

Another questions: is there a three button macro to available to turn on and off the "copy surround to rears" as I would like to use this in all cases, but when listening to the 6-CH analog input - it would be nice to be able to select this on-the-fly.

Per communications with Anthem nearly two years ago I knew there was a glitch in the D1 software in regards to this function, but I was really hoping it had been addressed with the new software in the upgrade to a D1-HD.

Thank you,

Mike

The only 3-button remote combos that I know of are the ones listed in Appendix A of the manual.

Do not confuse the surround mode selections in that list with the ANALOG-Direct vs. ANALOG-DSP setting. ANALOG-DSP causes the input analog audio to be digitized and ENABLES whatever surround mode processing you select. There is no surround mode processing available if you have set the source to use ANALOG-Direct.

The "NONE" surround mode selection does no surround mode processing on the input. E.g. a 5.1 source will not be expanded to 7.1 speaker output.

----------------------------------------

I can't answer your questions on the Reverse and Copy settings you asked about as I haven't played with those. You may need to send an email to Anthem tech support.

From the manual, the Reverse function is only for the 6-ch analog input, and to make it work you must use an audio mode which DOES NOT act to raise the 5.1 channel input to 7.1 speaker output. The "None" mode would be appropriate for your case. You can set this as the default in the Setup / Mode Presets menu.

If it is still not working when you do that, then you will need to give Anthem tech support a call. Last I heard the Reverse function WAS working correctly in the V1.1x and V1.2x software versions.

==============================

ETA: At one point there was a "bug" -- or possibly this was intended behavior -- where setting the Reverse option ALSO changed which speakers got sent the Setup / Speaker Calibration test tones. I don't know if this has changed in the V1.3x software. The point is, verify correct operation by playing a disc, not by using the Setup / Speaker Calibration test tones.
--Bob
post #14798 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmorse4765 View Post

And it makes a tremendous difference in sound. I now use Analog dsp for all of my Sacd's. I have my Sony 777 connected with analog outputs for SACD

Dick

Dick,
can you still output in stereo using the Analog/DSP?

John
post #14799 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayray View Post

Dick,
can you still output in stereo using the Analog/DSP?

John

Yes. Presuming you have stereo analog audio as input, simply select "Stereo" audio mode if you don't want any audio to be steered to the surrounds or center speaker. If you are using the 6 channel analog audio input -- playing content such as from a CD that only sends sound on the LF and RF channels of that -- select "None" as the audio mode. Make sure THX audio post processing is turned off for that input as well. And make sure you have disabled any speaker management (cross overs, speaker distances, and the like) in your player.

If you don't want your subwoofer to be included when you play Stereo audio, then set up a Music speaker configuration that doesn't include the subwoofer and which specifies Large front speakers. You can leave your surround and/or center speakers included in that configuration for other uses if you want since Stereo audio mode won't use them anyway. When you measure with ARC it will come up with a separate solution for your Movie and Music speaker configurations -- automatically adjusting for when the subwoofer is included. Then set up a Source from that player which uses the Music configuration.

If you leave your subwoofer in the configuration, and if your front speakers are set as Small, then even in Stereo audio mode, the cross overs will be active and some bass frequencies from the LF and RF input channels will be steered to your subwoofer. I like the musicality of my subwoofer so I leave it included in my Music speaker configuration (but I don't include the Center speaker).
--Bob
post #14800 of 40764
The latest word I have is that AVM-50 ARC Upgrade kits (including the required, dealer installable, hardware change) will start shipping before the end of July. No surprises on the Upgrade kit pricing -- roughly US$800 installed for both the hardware change and the ARC kit itself.

Obviously none of this is cast in stone until the official word comes from Anthem. I've got some indication of closer to US$900 pricing, but I suspect that is just people being cautious -- much as when ARC upgrades for the D2 were being quoted (by dealers!) between US$400 and US$500 immediately prior to its release only to finally end up at US$399.

----------------------------

If this ship date holds true, that should also mean that new, AVM-50 plus ARC "bundles" ought to be orderable "real soon now", too! I still have no details on what the "bundle" pricing will be. As best I can tell, Anthem has not yet put out a new dealer price sheet detailing this stuff.

Nor do I have any confirmation yet that the AVM-40 ARC stuff is also happening at the same time, although it is pretty clear that ARC for the AVM-40 will definitely happen, and soon. In the past, Anthem has staggered builds for different models, so it may be that the AVM-40 related production will crank up after a few weeks of AVM-50 related production.

---------------------------

As for next generation D2 (D3?) related stuff, there is very little useful information floating around right now. I suspect that CEDIA is too soon for an Anthem announcement although CES might work depending on how much change is involved in such a product.

I also think it unlikely that such a change could be implemented as an "upgrade". That is, I think getting the new product would more likely require a trade-in.

If anyone would care to pass on any new rumors to me about expected Anthem announcements at CEDIA this fall or CES in January, I'll be happy to "monger" them as appropriate (according to how much they seem to make sense).
--Bob
post #14801 of 40764
Wow, this is really cool. Kudos to Anthem.

Can't wait to hear reports from AVM50 "early upgraders" out there.
post #14802 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayray View Post

Dick,
can you still output in stereo using the Analog/DSP?

John

Like Bob said. you can toggle the DSp in the setup menu and hear the difference immediately.

Dick
post #14803 of 40764
Bob I have D-tv and I also notice film mode going on and off with 1080i sources. I think it also did it on prior versions also.can'nt remember for certain though. also when I go from a hd channel to sd most of the time I have to put the d2 to an unused input then back to sat to get picture and sound back.
post #14804 of 40764
Switching in and out of film mode is normal. It's only a problem if the Anthem gets incorrectly stuck in video mode too long when it should be in film mode.

Anthem is testing a new version of the HDMI software that ought to help with your DirecTV problem.
--Bob
post #14805 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

Working on it.

Really anxious to read that review
post #14806 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

The latest word I have is that AVM-50 ARC Upgrade kits (including the required, dealer installable, hardware change) will start shipping before the end of July. No surprises on the Upgrade kit pricing -- roughly US$800 installed for both the hardware change and the ARC kit itself.

Obviously none of this is cast in stone until the official word comes from Anthem. I've got some indication of closer to US$900 pricing, but I suspect that is just people being cautious -- much as when ARC upgrades for the D2 were being quoted (by dealers!) between US$400 and US$500 immediately prior to its release only to finally end up at US$399.

----------------------------

If this ship date holds true, that should also mean that new, AVM-50 plus ARC "bundles" ought to be orderable "real soon now", too! I still have no details on what the "bundle" pricing will be. As best I can tell, Anthem has not yet put out a new dealer price sheet detailing this stuff.

Nor do I have any confirmation yet that the AVM-40 ARC stuff is also happening at the same time, although it is pretty clear that ARC for the AVM-40 will definitely happen, and soon. In the past, Anthem has staggered builds for different models, so it may be that the AVM-40 related production will crank up after a few weeks of AVM-50 related production.

---------------------------

As for next generation D2 (D3?) related stuff, there is very little useful information floating around right now. I suspect that CEDIA is too soon for an Anthem announcement although CES might work depending on how much change is involved in such a product.

I also think it unlikely that such a change could be implemented as an "upgrade". That is, I think getting the new product would more likely require a trade-in.

If anyone would care to pass on any new rumors to me about expected Anthem announcements at CEDIA this fall or CES in January, I'll be happy to "monger" them as appropriate (according to how much they seem to make sense).
--Bob


I was hoping for Cedia.
post #14807 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

As for next generation D2 (D3?) related stuff, there is very little useful information floating around right now. I suspect that CEDIA is too soon for an Anthem announcement although CES might work depending on how much change is involved in such a product.
--Bob

Anthem should really put a muzzle on their regional reps and dealers then. I wasn't given a release date or anything, but a dealer told me that the next generation (or D2v.2) was imminent... if I remember correctly, one of them even said late summer or fall.

Of course, they have every interest in stringing everyone along so that they don't buy something else...
post #14808 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tolstoi View Post

Really anxious to read that review

Well, don't hold your breath. The first part of the D2 story is in the machine for the Sept. column. The next part will deal with the ARC vs. Audyssey measurements and audible comparisons.
post #14809 of 40764
I had this exact same issue (failed to switch to 115200 kbs) - you need to run the flash eraser, at least that's what worked for me.
post #14810 of 40764
walt here: finally installed the arc, and like most others, the crossovers are counterintuitive(at least to me)
Front @ 40HX: ctr @ 100hz: surrounds @ 105 and sub @ 120(for an active servo 15"-er)
boost on fronts is +1.5; even for ctr; minus 1.5 for surrounds, and minus 1.5 for sub.
room eq is "on". Bass mgmt is auto-lfe.
Question: is reference volume level at "0.0? that level plays too loud for my old ears. watched mahlers sixth at (-5.5 db) and the sound was very clear, quiet and detailed when it should be, lots of pressure when so scored . i recognize the 'personal preference' issues inherent in my question, but this (?) is related to what arc adds (changes) in my system.
- - - and referring to and earlier post by Dmorse4765, i am running cd's analog thru an arcam player, and there is a notable increase in soundstage this way.
post #14811 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by yacht422 View Post

walt here: finally installed the arc, and like most others, the crossovers are counterintuitive(at least to me)
Front @ 40HX: ctr @ 100hz: surrounds @ 105 and sub @ 120(for an active servo 15"-er)
boost on fronts is +1.5; even for ctr; minus 1.5 for surrounds, and minus 1.5 for sub.
room eq is "on". Bass mgmt is auto-lfe.
Question: is reference volume level at "0.0? that level plays too loud for my old ears. watched mahlers sixth at (-5.5 db) and the sound was very clear, quiet and detailed when it should be, lots of pressure when so scored . i recognize the 'personal preference' issues inherent in my question, but this (?) is related to what arc adds (changes) in my system.
- - - and referring to and earlier post by Dmorse4765, i am running cd's analog thru an arcam player, and there is a notable increase in soundstage this way.

After calibration, with speaker levels targeted to produce an SPL reading of 75dB using the Anthem's internal test tones (or as automatically set up by ARC), a main volume setting of -10dB will produce a "home theater style" reference volume output of 75dB.

A main volume setting of 0dB will produce a "movie theater style" reference volume output of 85dB. Most people find 85dB too loud for home theater use.

Keep in mind that peak volume levels (particularly from the LFE channel) can exceed the reference volume level by 15dB or so.
--Bob
post #14812 of 40764
Does anyone know the rationale for limiting ARC to 5Khz and below? I have a sharp 10db drop between 5K and 10K on my plots. Part of this is my room but I believe some of it is due to where ARC is choosing its reference level. If I recalculate out to 10Khz I get a pretty even curve throughout the spectrum. I haven't done a lot of critical listening so far but it sounds OK thus far. Just wondering if anybody else is seeing a large drop off after 5K and or correcting out to 10Khz?
post #14813 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by obie_fl View Post

Does anyone know the rationale for limiting ARC to 5Khz and below? I have a sharp 10db drop between 5K and 10K on my plots. Part of this is my room but I believe some of it is due to where ARC is choosing its reference level. If I recalculate out to 10Khz I get a pretty even curve throughout the spectrum. I haven't done a lot of critical listening so far but it sounds OK thus far. Just wondering if anybody else is seeing a large drop off after 5K and or correcting out to 10Khz?

Raising the Max EQ Frequency *WILL* make the Calculated curves look better out there, but that result is misleading.

The audio is too directional up that high, which means the ARC mic is picking up variations in the different listening positions that have nothing to do with real room response.

I.e., there's no good data for ARC to use up there.

It's amazing that ARC works as well as it does all the way up to 5KHz. Don't push it beyond that.

As to the dip showing in your curves, consider your speaker positioning -- particularly the vertical spread capability of your tweeters given the tweeter height compared to your seated ear height. You may be able to get a better result with some minor speaker repositioning. Also make sure you are doing your ARC mic positioning at the proper (seated ear) height but with due regard to whether it will be blocked from some speakers or get nearby reflections.

The bottom line: Don't raise the Max EQ Frequency target setting. And trust what you hear more than what you see in the ARC curve charts.
--Bob
post #14814 of 40764
I have a dedicated and treated room so alternate placement isn't an option. The only difference in height during measurement is the rear seating on a riser of approximately 10". I still wish ARC had some way of looking at individual position data, instead of only looking at the averages. It seems strange to me that my high end would be rolled off by 10db on pretty much all seven speakers. I have to do more listening comparisons between the 5Khz calcs and 10Khz calcs.
post #14815 of 40764
Hello,

How do I pull up the Gennum scaler page (showed in the screenshot of post 1 of this thread) ???

Thanks!
post #14816 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by obie_fl View Post

Does anyone know the rationale for limiting ARC to 5Khz and below? I have a sharp 10db drop between 5K and 10K on my plots. Part of this is my room but I believe some of it is due to where ARC is choosing its reference level. If I recalculate out to 10Khz I get a pretty even curve throughout the spectrum. I haven't done a lot of critical listening so far but it sounds OK thus far. Just wondering if anybody else is seeing a large drop off after 5K and or correcting out to 10Khz?


For my room I was using the 5k setting, but decided to try 20k.. (as my room is very dead, and the treble was suffering).

After I did this, WOW, big improvement.. Even if the ARC is said to have problems with Directional cues at frequencies above 5k, in reality, so does your ears... Every listening spot will effect the treble different to your ears anyway, so to me, having the arc deal with this upto 20k is the same.. Hears what my ears would hear at that exact listening spot..


Anway, in my situation, the 20k calibration worked the best.. More smooth, and very awesome detail in music and movie now..
post #14817 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by muad'dib View Post

For my room I was using the 5k setting, but decided to try 20k.. (as my room is very dead, and the treble was suffering).

After I did this, WOW, big improvement.. Even if the ARC is said to have problems with Directional cues at frequencies above 5k, in reality, so does your ears... Every listening spot will effect the treble different to your ears anyway, so to me, having the arc deal with this upto 20k is the same.. Hears what my ears would hear at that exact listening spot..


Anway, in my situation, the 20k calibration worked the best.. More smooth, and very awesome detail in music and movie now..

Correct me if I am wrong but aren't you supposed to point the mic vertically?

And if so, when playing frequencies above 5k being that they are very directional, wouldn't the results be completely inaccurate as your ears are not pointed to the ceiling?

John
post #14818 of 40764
Not to change the flow of ARC questions, but I have been thinking of adding a Wadia 170i Transport to my system with my IPod. I went on the Wadia site and was surprised to find a Faq indicating that the 170i will not work with Anthem Processors at this time.

I emailed Wadia and received the following response (very swiftly I might add):

Quote:


Thank you for your interest in Wadia! We have found a signal compatibility issue with the Anthem products in relation to the SPDIF output of the 170iTransport. We are currently working on a solution, probably in the form of an inline adapter. We will hopefully have something soon and will more than likely provide the part at no charge to customers with Anthem processors. I will let you know what we come up with. This is the only DAC/Processor that we have encountered this incompatibility with. Talk to you soon!
post #14819 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by goatwuss View Post

Hello,

How do I pull up the Gennum scaler page (showed in the screenshot of post 1 of this thread) ???

Thanks!

This is what Anthem calls the "Video Source Adjust" menu.

To bring it up, select viewing from any input Source and then press and hold the "7" key on the remote until the menu appears on screen. The menu is made up of several different panels that you reach by scrolling across the top of it. The one pictured in the first post of this thread is the Info panel.

Note that the settings in the Video Source Adjust menu are remembered separately for each input Source. So select the Source you want to modify and then view and change settings in the Video Source Adjust menu. You will see the changes in the video as you make them. There are also some remote control shortcuts for getting to specific parts of that menu more rapidly.

The Video Source Adjust / Patterns panel is also very useful. That's how you bring up the internally generated test patterns in the D2 when doing your video calibration.

The other main settings menu in the D2 is the "Setup" menu. That's where you do things like configuring your video output, your speakers, and your set of Sources.
--Bob
post #14820 of 40764
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_fitz View Post

Correct me if I am wrong but aren't you supposed to point the mic vertically?

And if so, when playing frequencies above 5k being that they are very directional, wouldn't the results be completely inaccurate as your ears are not pointed to the ceiling?

John

The issue is not the pointing of the mic, but rather that what the mic hears at the various listening positions is colored by directionality more than room response. Thus ARC doesn't have good data to correct room response up there. [ARC uses the variation in measurement at the different mic positions to distinguish room response from inherent speaker performance.]

Nick tells me that the ARC designers were even worried that the 5KHz setting might be too high, but they got enough good responses in testing that they left it that way.
--Bob
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