Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 495

Not to challenge YOU Bob, but isn't reference level (set at 0 on the Anthem) supposed to be at 75db? My understanding was that you then get 105db peak (at the listening position). The peak for lfe at that reference level is 115db (again at the listening position). Only the Avia disc should be calibrated with reference at 85db, right? If you have info that says otherwise, please share it!

The built-in Setup / Level Calibration tones in the D2 correspond to what "reference level" audio input sources would produce during normal playback when the D2's main volume control is set at -10dB.

This is actually pretty normal for AVR and pre-pro setups. The idea is that you adjust the built-in calibration levels to measure 75dB on your SPL meter and then use -10dB main volume to get that during normal playback.

Or, if you prefer, you crank main volume up to 0dB during normal playback and get 85dB reference levels (as are commonly used in movie theaters) but WITHOUT having to subject yourself to that during the Setup / Level Calibration process.

There is no hard and fast rule as to what reference level volume people should use. Use what is comfortable to you. 75dB is just a Rule of Thumb that works in many home theater setups. 85dB in movie theaters partly accounts for the audience noise level in movie theaters. Most people find 85dB too loud for home theater use.

The thing to keep in mind is that when using the internal Setup / Level Calibration tones as your guide, whatever level you set measuring those with your SPL meter will correspond to what "reference level" audio input sources will produce out of your speakers when you set the D2's main volume control to -10dB.

If you set the main volume to 0dB then "reference level" audio inputs will generate 10dB higher volume out of your speakers than whatever SPL level you targeted when setting things up with your SPL meter to begin with.

If you set the main volume to -20dB, then, similarly, "reference level" audio inputs will produce speaker volume 10dB quieter than what you targeted.

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ARC uses a wider frequency range for setting levels than is used with the built-in calibration tones, so the results may vary slightly from what you would set up manually with your SPL meter. But it looks to me like ARC is targeting the same standard: I.e., a main volume setting of -10dB is designed for home theater use (near 75dB for "reference level) and a main volume setting of 0dB is designed to replicate movie theater setups (near 85dB for "reference level").
--Bob

Wondered if anyone has this problem. I have 1.33 firmware installed on my AVM 50 but was getting this sysmptom with other firmware. When I stop a movie with my ps3 or change menus, pause and start with my HD dvd, I get a loud hissing/buzzing from my left rear speaker. Is this an hdmi loss of handshake with these devices because I can't think of anything else, and why just the rear left and not all the speakers?
John

I can't recall any other reports like that in here.

Are you saying this happens only when you switch between the PS3 and your HD-DVD player? Or when doing those specific operations in the PS3 or the separate specific operations in your HD-DVD player?

The first step is to make sure the noise is coming from the Anthem (or player) and not from your power amps. To do that, simply swap the LR output from the Anthem with some other output and see if the noise moves to the new speaker. If it stays in the LR speaker then the problem is in either your power amp or the speaker itself.
--Bob

Updated D1 to 1.33 last night. Today put on ARC 1.2.2, everything seemed fine until I attempted to upload. Would fail uploading the Movie and Music SUB settings. Called Anthem, was given 1.2.4, had to redo the calculation but the upload worked.

I have been very impressed with how much of a positive difference the ARC has made. Interesting thing when my brother saw my setup the audio is what he commented on.

That doesn't make sense to me. The output of the Wadia 170i Transport is standard digital coax.


I alsomost bought one but changed my mind. Instead I will go with a SqueezeBox 3 duet for my Digital music server instead of using a ipod/Wadia combo.

The key thing here is reference level inputs. DVDs tend to be more uniform I think, however the input level on CDs (the level at which the information is recorded) varies tremendously from CD to CD and so the output is going to vary. So even when you calibrate your system to either a 75dB or 85dB level, some media is going to sound loud and some quiet.

I wonder if anybody has experienced my THX issue after ARC. Before ARC, I seem to remember that I had acces to all of the THX modes. I know for sure that I had THX games mode.
My Setup menu reads:
a. 6.0: None
b. 2.0: Anthem Logic-Music
c. 2Sur: Same as 2.0
d. DD5: None
e. EX: None
f. DTS: None
g. ES: None
Now when I press the THX button on the remote, the on screen display reads 6 CHANNEL INPUT THX. My only choices when I press up or down are THX Cinema or THX Off. I do not have acces to any other mode.
The same thing happens when I press the mode button on the remote. I only get the same two choices. Maybe I have something set up wrong but I can't find it! By the way, my system is 5.1

Given that you are listening to a 5.1 source, the other THX modes (e.g., THX -Games) are only available if you have a 7.1 speaker setup. That is, they only differ from the "normal" THX-Cinema processing with respect to what they would send to your rear speakers. Since you have no rear speakers, those THX options aren't offered to you. See Section 4.8.6 of the Manual, and note specifically the number of output channels each such mode is designed to generate.

By the way, my experience with ARC is that THX post processing is far less valuable after setting up ARC. Listen to some decent source content with THX turned off and ARC turned on and see if you don't agree.
--Bob

This happens when doing specific operations with both players. Will try your suggestion.
thanks,
John

If you find the problem moves to the new speaker (indicating the problem is in the Anthem or the player), check out the following:

1) Does the noise vanish if you "Mute" the Anthem?

2) Does the noise vanish if you turn off ARC (Setup / Source Select / Room EQ = OFF for that source device)?

3) Does the noise vanish if you power off the source device but leave the Anthem powered on?

The idea is to try to isolate what parts of the setup need to be active to cause the noise to happen.

It is unlikely, but possible, that you have a type of "ground loop" problem as well. The single most common cause of ground loop problems is 60Hz power line interference coming in over the cable shields of cable or satellite system. "Ground loop" interference of this nature can hop from box to box via the cable shields of the cables connecting them. If you have cable or satellite TV, try temporarily disconnecting the feed from the wall to your cable or satellite TV box and see if that makes the noise vanish. (For this to be the cause, but only in that one speaker, you would likely also have to have a problem in your power amp.)
--Bob

I wonder if it is the same problem with the Mits. TV's (see below from Anthem's troubleshooting section). I had to make an in-line adapter with a capacitor for my old Mits. TV for my D2:

Problem: The AVM 20 doesn't recognize a coax RCA digital audio signal from a TV with a built-in digital tuner (known problem with some Mitsubishi rear-projection TVs).

Cause: The S/PDIF output of the TV has excessive DC offset (1200 mV vs. the specified tolerance of 50 mV or less). (DC stands for Direct Current).

Solution: Block the DC offset -- This can be done in one of two ways, and either method works equally well. The first is to use the AES/EBU input instead of the RCA input, through an RCA to XLR adapter. AES/EBU inputs are transformer-coupled, and transformers block DC. Another way to block DC is through a capacitor in series. If the AES/EBU connection is already in use, a small value capacitor (e.g. .22 uF) can be put in series with the RCA connection with the same result (have your Anthem dealer perform this).

Bob,

Done some more testing.
1. sound comes on when switching inputs, ie. ps3 to HD DVD to DVD.
2. also comes from rear left sometimes.
3.unplugged cable no change.
4.wiggled connections to A5 amp. No change.
5.Buzzing stops when mute is on, if I unmute it quickly sound doesn't come on until I cycle through inputs again.
6.sound stops if input is turned off
7. I don't have ARC yet. (AVM 50 owner)

I don't get any of this buzzing while playing movies or music, ONLY when switching inputs or navigating some menus.
John

For the sources involved, try this experiment:

In Setup / Source Setup for each such source, temporarily set Muting = MAX. This will mute the source input for a while each time the type of audio input changes (whether due to some change in content or due to switching to that source).

This may delay when the noise starts, but the main question is, even after waiting a few seconds, do you still get the noise?

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I presume you are using HDMI LPCM audio from the PS3. Try temporarily setting the PS3's HDMI audio output to "bitstream" and see if you still get the noise.

Also, verify that the audio settings in the PS3 for HDMI LPCM output do *NOT* have any of the 7.1 options checked, nor any options for 5.1 or below but with output sampling rates higher than 96KHz. The automatic HDMI setup in the PS3 should have removed all of those for you (i.e., the 7.1 choices or the other choices but with higher than 96KHz), but let's double check to be sure.

Odds are you are going to have to work this with Anthem tech support. So we're just collecting info here and going through the basics steps to try to isolate what works and what doesn't work.

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ETA: Do you have any HDMI input sources that are NOT generating noise like this?
--Bob

Bob,
my digital box doesn't do this and it is hdmi.
John

will check the other things when I put on the pj later this evening.
thanks

I have to add another vote to setting ARC higher than 5 KHz.

My front speakers are behind a 10 ft. wide "acoustically transparent" projection screen, and my four 7.1 surrounds are all dipoles located up high on the walls so the tweeters are aimed considerably above the listener's heads. The dedicated home theater room has acoustic treatments.

The result is that all high frequencies are rolled off somewhat. When measured by ARC, I've got about a 7 decibel dip around 12 KHz from each my speakers. I took ARC measurements at 6 locations, since I have two rows of 3 seats each, with the back row on a raised floor about 2 feet higher than the front.

The sound with ARC set to a 12 KHz limit is awesome. The highs, clarity, and sense of "presence" are all greatly enhanced relative to a 5 KHz limit ARC setting.

I'd suggest people try a higher limit and let their ears be their guide. If they don't like it, they can always revert to a 5 KHz limit.

- Dave

I asked a similar question a few pages back on my D2 not detecting a digital signal from a matrix switch. The signal is picked up fine by other pre-amps...but for some reason not my D2. I will see if perhaps the RCA to XLR adaptor will work.....

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It Works!!


Wow that was fast! I spent about 2 weeks trying to trouble shoot this...and thanks to the wealth of info on here, have my answer!

Now we can access all of the whole house audio/video in the theater too!

Off to buy a 2nd RCA/XLR cable (stole the one from the sub to try)

Cool! Info from the AVM-20 days helps current product owners too!
--Bob

If your EARS say it's better, then it's hard to argue! However, don't use the higher limit JUST because it makes the "Calculated" curve look better out there. Again, the word I have from Nick at Anthem is that ARC doesn't have much useful to work with up there.

[I tried a higher setting once with ARC V1.1 and didn't like the results at all, but that was back before we discovered the potential for corrupted ARC Uploads to the D2, so that may have been the cause.]
--Bob

I have a very similar setup, dedicated treated room etc but not the AT screen. My results sound very similar to yours. My room appears to roll off significantly (10db) starting at 5Khz, although I think it may actually be the large low frequency gain of the room which is making ARC choose a high reference line.

I'm currently running my 10Khz calc and don't hear any degradation, I may have to bump it up to 12K as I still have a bit of a dip there. I'm also going to do some 5khz vs 10khz comparisons but so far I'm leaning towards the 10khz correction.

I emailed Nick and he basically repeated the caveats Bob and others have mentioned but also said if it sounds better use it. I've sent him my calc files so it will be interesting to see what he comes back with.

I would have to assume that ARC has only so much "correction resource" to spread around. I would guess that such resources are assigned per speaker, but maybe not. And I suspect that for most rooms, ARC has to make some choices as to which problems it focusses on correcting.

In any event, one thing that may effect whether raising the Max Frequency helps or hurts is what other room response problems below 5KHz ARC decides it has to fix. A well treated room may free up ARC resources to some degree.

One thing's for sure, I would STRONGLY recommend folks not raise that Max EQ Frequency target above 5KHz until they've had plenty of time listening to the default ARC results. Get your ears familiar with what ARC does by default and THEN fiddle with it if you want.

Again, do not be fooled by the fact that the Calculated curves look better up there if you raise that target setting. If the ARC mic is picking up meaningless data, the Calculated curves may look good, but that doesn't translate into real improvement. Your ears will have to be the judge.
--Bob

Here are my graphs showing the drop off at 5Khz..i.e. where ARC no longer corrects.

Hi again,

I have a question regarding "dual outputs" i know the AVM50 does not have 2 main outputs via HDMI.
My situation is this. I am installing a projector and would like ot hook up the ps3 to it via HDMI for bluray ofcourse. Then for HDTV/cable viewing I will be adding a 42" plasma or keeping my sxrd60xbr2 not sure but anywho. I know I can add a component output for the cable box onto the plasma but what if I wanted to say watch a hockey game on the projector. Is there a way to route the output back through the HDMI to the PJ?
I hope I am explaining myself correctly.

Hook up the PS3 via HDMI to the AVM-50. Both audio and video will come in on that HDMI cable.

Hook up the cable box via Component to the AVM-50. You can use Optical digital audio cable for audio if you select method (1) or (2) below and "COPY" Main audio to Zone 2, otherwise you must hook up BOTH an Optical digital audio cable for Main path audio input of DD5.1 cable TV programs AND a stereo analog RCA cable pair for Zone 2 path audio input.

Hook up the projector to the Main AVM-50 HDMI output.

The AVM-50 will convert the cable Component input to HDMI for your projector meaning you can watch either the PS3 or your cable box on the projector, with both converted to the Video Output you specify for your projector.

Meanwhile, hook up your second TV to the "Main or Zone 2" Component output of the AVM-50.

In Setup / Video Output you can specify one of three things to go out that AVM-50 output to your second TV:

1) The source you select on the Main path, PROCESSED: Use this if your second TV can accept the same Video Output configuration you have specified for the projector. You can just use the audio on the Main path (the audio going to your normal surround speakers) if your second TV is in the same room as the projector, or you can "Copy" that to Zone 2, which means it is down-mixed to stereo and sent out the Zone 2 stereo outputs of the AVM-50 for your second TV in a different room. In the latter case, the Main and Zone 2 volumes can be separately controlled and separately muted, meaning you can select the Main source but leave the projector off and the Main volume muted and just get audio and video on your second TV.

2) The source you select on the Main path, UNprocessed: Use this if your second TV would work better getting the unprocessed video passed through from the cable box. The second TV would do its own scaling of that video input just as if you had the cable box connected to it directly. Audio is as in (1) above.

3) The source you SEPARATELY select on the Zone 2 path, UNprocessed: Use this if you want to simultaneously have different sources playing on the projector and on your second TV. The video going to the second TV will be unprocessed pass through from the source you select for it. Main path audio will go out the normal, surround sound audio outputs of the AVM-50. Use the AVM-50's stereo audio output jacks for Zone 2 to pass the selected Zone 2 source's audio to your second TV. Note that you must use stereo analog RCA jack audio input for your Zone 2 sources for this to work.

Note that you can define up to 4 distinct Video Output configurations, so you could even switch between, say methods (2) and (3) on the fly by having them in separate Video Output configurations.

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NOTE: Copy protected HDMI input (as from the PS3 and just about every other interesting HDMI source device) can not be converted to Component output. When you select an HDMI input on the Main path, the Component output of the AVM-50 will be muted unless you have used method (3) above and selected a different (non-HDMI) input source for Zone 2. Which basically means you can't watch the PS3 on your second, Component video TV.

But as long as you are OK not seeing the PS3 on the second TV, this hookup will get you what you want for the cable box (and other video sources like it) and both TVs.
--Bob

I have updated my ARC to version 1.2.2. When running new measurements i have lost a measurement signal for the right rear surround. It jumps from right side to left rear. I reloaded v1.2.2 and tried again with same result. My system is 7.1 direct and is designated as such in the speaker config section. Do I have some setting somewhere that is causing my D2 and ARC not to recognize the right rear speaker? BTW, ARC sounds great even without the RR speaker. Thanks for replys. Chuck

In addition to the Setup / Speaker Configuration stuff, you ALSO have to tell the ARC application itself that you have 2 rear speakers.

Look closely at the screen ARC puts up for you when you go to do Measurement -- the screen with the check boxes for which speakers you have. Make sure you specify in there that you have 2 rears. If you are doing both Movie and Music configurations, specify that for both of them.
--Bob

Alright here is my Klipsch THX Ultra 2 setup. My equipment rack and speakers all in one cabinet that I just made. Took about 3 days to make this cabinet, it doesnt vibrate or anything, that I could tell and I have turned the volume up a ton. So here is a list of my equipment:

Anthem Statement D2 with ARC-1
Anthem PVA 7
Panamax 5500EX
Toshiba HD DVD A30
Sony PS3
Dish Network HD DVR
Sony KDL52XBR2

AND...Klipsch THX Ultra II system!!

Attachment 115005

Attachment 115006

Boy, do you need ARC!!

Hello!

Thanks Bob and others for your help regarding pulling up the video options menu. Pretty cool!

I just changed speakers to av123 LS6 line sources, and they are not as efficient as my prior speakers... is there any way to change the reference level of the D2? So that I can adjust the volume that 0db on the Anthem actually is. I'd like to make 0db louder with my setup.

Thanks