Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 711

I have been fooling around with some 96/24 tracks from HDTracks.com and I have a basic but important question:

For listening to the music I use Songbird on the Mac, which I believe to be a fine choice. I output the audio via a digital optical cable from the Mac directly to the D2. I adjust the output in OSX's "Audio Midi Setup' utility to 96/24. When I look at the D2 it shows that the audio input is coming in at 96/24.

So that all sounds fine - my question is what is the story on these expensive 'USB Links' I see? For example:

http://www.belcantodesign.com/news_usb_link.html

Does this do anything more than my Mac is already doing? It seems unnecessary to me, but maybe I'm missing something???

Thanks,

David

Hello all. I have been lurking here for while. Bought a D2v about a month ago as the centerpiece to my new system. Pioneer LCOS (JVC unit), 3 Bryston 4Bsst's, Paradigm Studio Reference speakers, Stewart screen, Pionner LD/DVD combo, Denon six disc changer, Pioneer 51 Blueray, direct tv HDDVR, Bryston CD player.

Well, I have been having serious issues with the Anthem. I updated the firmware of the Blueray player as well as the Anthem and I am still getting voice and picture drop out. The Anthem does not like switching iputs but it especailly does not like fast fowarding or chaning channels on the HDDVR (especially from HD to non HD and back) as well as skipping chapters on the Blueray. Regular DVD play back on the Blueray is horrific (not sure if it is the anthem or the Blue, suspect Anthem). I am adding a dedicated Denon DVD player through component. We are going to try and toubleshoot the issues tonight with some people in the know, but my impression (and I have not fooled around with the Anthem like others here have) is that it is not quite ready for prime time. They have some HDMI and processing issues to work out. My system is not complicated and I just want consistent video and audio before I start tweeking. Overall, I am very disappointed in the product out of the box. Had I known it was going to be such an investment in time and effort, I would have purchase another item. I like to tweak stuff, but not to have to make it run at some base peformance level.

BTW, if there are any "superusers" in the DFW area that can be coerced with a bottle of good scotch to help me tweak the Anthem let me know.

I think you're correct. It looks superfluous in your case.

I agree with Roger. I see no point in spending the money on this.
--Bob

The firmware you should be running in the D2v is V2.04. Even though you updated your firmware, if you are still using a version older than that you should definitely update again to V2.04.

I'll assume you are on V2.04 in what follows, but if not, updating to V2.04 really needs to be your first step as it has important bug fixes. When I see a situation like yours, multiple failures from multiple HDMI devices, my first thought is cable problems. The HDMI handshake goes from the source, through the D2v, to the display -- every time. So the HDMI cables on BOTH sides of the D2v could be suspect.

Keep in mind that if you are using 1080p, particularly if you are using the Deep Color feature of HDMI V1.3, the bandwidth of the signal on the cables is much higher. That means you need to get cables that have been designed and tested for that use. If you find cables labeled as HDMI V1.3 "for 1080p", or "high speed", or "category 2" (all of which mean the same thing) then those cables are supposed to have been made to the newest, strictest testing specs.

Also know that cable testing only applies to the cable as built -- at its manufactured length. So if you daisy chain cables or use wall plates, then that can be the source of problems.

Once you feel you have eliminated both firmware and cables as the cause, you should give Anthem tech support a call with the model numbers of your display and source devices. They may be able to tell you that the devices you have are known to work with the D2v (which would suggest you have a hardware problem -- either in your cables or in your D2v video board), or that they are known to have problems. That can help you focus on where the issue is.

I find it particularly interesting that you are having problems with the Pioneer 51 since that's a newer device and should certainly not trigger loss of signal when doing a Chapter Forward. The quality problem you are having when using it for SD-DVD playback could be simple setup error.

In the first post of this thread you will find a collection of links to other posts with tutorial content. In particular, look for the one labeled "Video Calibration for non-ISF Techs". Review the information in there to see if it suggests anything that needs changing in your setup. Standard DVD viewing quality is pretty sensitive to setting things up correctly. There's less margin for error.

But clearly the first thing to tackle is your HDMI problems. So confirm the firmware version, rethink your HDMI cables, and talk to Anthem tech support about the particular devices that are giving you grief.
--Bob

I have a 5900 that started to have problems recognizing discs. I took the cover off, removed the cover from the transport section, carefully cleaned the laser and all moving parts of the transport. It has not had a problem for over 16 months now.

(Make sure you unplug it before doing this!

Mike

AppleTV over HDMI

I got word from Nick at Anthem that they've had something of a breakthrough regarding HDMI support for AppleTV.

Apparently Apple's AppleTV product implements an unusual (but legal) optional method of handling the EDID information which is distinct from what they do on their computers. The trick was to find a way to support that which would not cause other HDMI devices (in particular cable TV boxes) to fail. As Nick said, "One of many such details arising from the 1000 page HDMI EDID spec...."

They now believe they've figured that out, and if the fix survives further testing it will be included in the next firmware for both the old and new processors. For the D2 and AVM 50, this would be the V1.34 bug fix release. For the AVM 50v and D2v this will likely be the upcoming major release that includes Dolby Volume support.
--Bob

Bob,

Thanks for the quick reply. I will check the cables but all are recent purchases and high quality. I had an installer do the behind the wall work. There is a long (40-50 feet, near the limit) HDMI run from the Anthem to the Pioneer projector. How else do you get a 1080P signal to a projector, right? I am sure that the issue has been beat down ad nauseum on the HDCP handshake and 1080p through component. It is a tremendous shame that this stuff isn't plug and play. Wind up costing the consumer and manufacturers a lot of time and wasted money.

Tackling this stuff, particularly with longer runs, is a real nuisance -- particularly since there are still plenty of source and display devices out there with their own problems that just complicate the process.

One thing to try is to set all sources to no more than 1080i and then set the D2v to send 1080i to the projector. If that works but 1080p doesn't work, then marginal cabling becomes a real possibility. If you are using wall plates at either end of the behind the wall run, be aware that MANY wall plates have had problems passing 1080p signals cleanly. Use the "through the wall" plates instead -- which are basically just ways to pretty up a hole in the wall that you pass one long run of cable through from the D2v all the way to the projector.

By the way, 480p (not 480i) is the "simplest" signal for HDMI to carry. So if you still have problems using 1080i, try 480p to see if that makes a difference. This is not a workaround of course -- just a way to try to focus in on the true source of the problem.

Another thing you can do to test is temporarily move the D2v under the projector with one source device and see if things work cleanly when using a 6 foot or so HDMI cable to the projector. No need to hook up amp wires and such -- just test the video portion.

If you find it really is a problem with the in the wall cable there's nothing for it but to replace it. There ARE solutions for longer HDMI runs. One solution involves a repeater. Another solution involves fiber optic cable with a translator box at each end. The fiber solution allows pretty much unlimited length (at a cost). Whatever you get, be sure to try it just laying things out in the open FIRST before you fish it through the wall.
--Bob

I just got my new AVM50v yesterday (HOORAY!) but am very disappointed to find it doesn't currently support AppleTV, which comprises about 75% of our viewing.

Any idea how long until Anthem releases the update that will correct this?

Thanks,
Mike

I don't have a date for the next firmware. In the interim, you should be able to hook up the AppleTV via Component, yes?
--Bob

Bob -

I have currently a Denon 3800 BDCI Blu-ray which about 14 months ago was considered a fairly nice unit.

I am interested however in purchasing a Oppo BDP-83 primarily as a SACD unit.

With your experience with the D2v / AVM50v and the Oppo, have you had an opportunity to do any SACD evaluations? How would you integrate the Oppo (or another SACD player) to a AVM50v?

I use my AppleTV like Bob says - COMPONENT.

The AppleTV native content is 720p - which is what I
have AppleTV set to output and then use the D2 to scale
to 1080p. It works great and HDMI is ONLY needed for
1080p and Lossless Audio - NEITHER of which the AppleTV
delivers.

Congrats! This is the second or third week in a row that I was told my D2v was coming. So I was getting a bit discouraged, but the dealer just called and said it was en route from Anthem. woohoo!

I have not tested the BDP-83 for SACD, but there are other Anthem owners in their Early Adopter Program who have reported it works just fine with the Anthem units -- with perhaps some glitches on a few discs (the typical, final bugs). You hook it up via HDMI and set the BDP-83 for PCM output of SACD discs. The Oppo decodes the DSD on the disc to 88KHz multi-channel LPCM for the Anthem.

Since the Oppo is new, I recommend you buy direct from them so that you can take advantage of their 30 day money back policy in case you find something you don't like.
--Bob

More Cool Kids!

It's a good thing we built that extra wing onto the club house!
--Bob

Add another to the list! Store just called and its there, just have to go pick it up!

I've played numerous SACDs on the BDP-83 using the method described by Bob (HDMI/PCM) through my D2 without issue. DVD-As on the other hand have been a bit more problematic but the last two FW updates have corrected a good number of those issues as well. I think a lot of the issues with SACD and HDCD are with those trying to do DSD or HDCD decoding in the receiver ala Denon and Marantz.

Hey that's great. When did you guys order?

Dealer just called and it has arrived. yay!

I ordered it the first week of Feb, but I think the dealer held off ordering from Anthem until mid-March because I requested it for April 1st... they couldn't have foreseen the parts issue, so I can't say I blame them for having waited to process the order.

Yes, I hooked it up using component video and optical audio. Set it to 720p and it works fine. Just thought it was weird HDMI didn't work with my new unit.

All is well now!

Here's another question:

My display is a Pioneer 5070HD, which has 1365 x 768 pixels. Closest resolution it will accept is 1280 x 720 (50), so I set it to that, and picture is very good, though somewhat softer than I'm used to (though I recalibrated using "movie" mode this time, compared to "user" previously, as one thread recommended).

In the days before the AVM50v, everyone recommended setting all incoming sources to 1080p24, which the Pioneer accepts, and for reasons I completely don't understand this always seemed to give the best picture!

Apart from placebo effect, can anyone explain why 1080p24 might look better on a 720p display. Is there any good reason to buck the official advice and set the Anthem to output 1080p24?

Thanks!

Sure. The makers of 720p and 768p panels know that they will most commonly be compared in stores using 1080i or 1080p content as opposed to 720p content. So if they have to make any tradeoffs in the design they will tend to do it in favor of making 1080i or 1080p input look better even though that has to be scaled down to the native resolution of the panel. I don't know that Pioneer had to make any such compromises, but look for things like overscan present at 720p but not present at 1080p input.

1080p/24 to the panel should ONLY be used when you are playing film based Blu-Ray content. Do not try to convert other content to 1080p/24 for output to the display -- you will get video that stutters. If the panel accepts 1080p/60 then that's a good choice to try (presuming you can't get the panel to accept its true, native resolution which is almost always the best choice).

Odds are this pioneer is simply converting 1080p/24 input to 768p/60 for display. If so, you'll get no advantage in "judder" reduction using 1080p/24 even from Blu-Ray movies.

But I suspect any difference you are seeing now in using 720p to the panel is simply a matter of not having your video calibration fully tuned in yet, or that you are still too used to your old video setup.
--Bob

How did you have your D2 setup for SACD. I'm still having issues with detached sound. When I set the Oppo for stereo, it sounds great. When I set the Oppo for SACD multi it sounds detached or distant. Moreover, my front speakers will not output sound except in stereo mode when using the Oppo in multi. Oppo is set for pcm and multi by default.

Bob,

You are fast!

I called Pioneer tech support and they confirmed that the native resolution is 1365x768/60. Is that an option on the Anthem? If so, I will try that when I get home tonight. If not, he thought that sending the Pioneer slightly more information than native (i.e. 1080) would give a better picture than slightly less information (i.e. 720). Does this sound right?


I have been calibrating my own displays for over 10 years now and think I did this one carefully. Probably could use some fine tuning, but it is still exceedingly pleasing, and may just be "different" from what I'm used to.

One weird artifact my daughter noticed is the studder you mentioned. She asked me why the people on TV are moving like robots now. I think this was with the output set to 1280 x 720 but will have to look again.

There is a little bit of a learning curve here, but it's still kind of fun!

Don't confuse the "native" resolution -- which is the physical matrix of pixels -- with the list of input resolutions the panel is willing to accept. There are quite a lot of displays out there that won't accept their native resolution as a valid input resolution.

On the other hand, if yours does, then that's almost certainly the best one to use.

The Anthem has built in video output definitions for 1360x768p and 1366x768p. Try those. There are additional pre-defined definitions available in Live Video Settings Editor (in Utilities in the ARC install kit). You can select one of those and upload it to the Anthem where it then becomes your Custom resolution selectable in Setup > Video Output. You can also use Live Video Settings Editor to define a COMPLETELY custom set of video timings. Basically if the display accepts it, you can define it in LVSE. [BUT NOTE: This is arcane in the extreme -- be prepared to do some learning.] However it is rare that anyone has to do that these days. There were some Panasonic 768p panels a couple years back that needed custom timings, but I haven't heard of anything recently.

My guess is, your Pioneer does *NOT* accept its native resolution as a valid input format.

-----------------------------------------

Purely from an information content point of view, it is better to send all of the resolution to the display and then have that scaled down by the display. But that assumes (1) you aren't also upscaling SD content to get to that point, and (2) the down-scaling in the display is good enough.

This becomes particularly tricky when sending 1080i to the display since then you are dependent BOTH on the display's de-interlacing of 1080i and its down-scaling.

If the display will accept 1080p/60, then that's a good resolution to try. If it will only accept 1080p/24 then you can use that when playing film-based Blu-Ray movies but you must *NOT* use that for other content or you will get stuttering. Blu-Ray movies aside, if the display will only accept 1080i/60, you are probably much better off *NOT* using that and sending 720p/60 instead -- again assuming the display won't actually accept 768p/60 from the Anthem. The reason, again, is to avoid de-interlacing in the display -- which the display must do before it can down-scale 1080i/60 input to its native 768p matrix.

Now some displays have their own problems with 720p input -- overscan that you can't eliminate being one of the most common. So play around with the different choices available to you to see which works best -- prioritizing things according to what I just described.
--Bob

I don't have anything special set on the D2 side. I use the same setting on the D2 for CD, SDVD, BD, HDCD, DVD-A and SACD, they just work. I am using Audio:HDMI and ARC is enabled. On the Oppo I use source direct and HDMI set to LPCM. Something is definitely amiss in your set up. Do you get 7.1 out of the analogs? I haven't bothered to even hook mine up but it would at least prove the Oppo is reading the Multi channel layer correctly.

And yes make sure SACD is PCM and not DSD as Bob says below.

ARC with *BAD* speakers/amps?

Since things are a little slow right now while waiting for the latest deliveries and the next batch of firmware, my mind wandered a bit and I started wondering just how good ARC might be when faced with bad speakers and amps.

It occurs to me that someone out there, perhaps waiting delivery on their GOOD speakers and amps, might have hooked up a really awful rig and turned ARC loose on it just to see what happened. Anybody care to 'fess up to having done that? How did it turn out?


--Bob

ok, so i'm unpacking my new d2v and i've already noticed some... strangeness. While the outside box was new, and factory sealed/stapled, some of the accessory boxes look re-taped. And in the box containing the remote control and antennae were two remotes: one new and one old with fingerprints and batteries installed. also, there were 3 new sets of batteries shoved into the bag through a hole torn in the plastic. i guess i'm not too concerned yet, but this sorta smells like my new d2v is actually someone else's refurb.

At least the serial numbers on the box/arc/unit seem to match so far.

Oh no not Bob Pariseau Inc too Hopefully they won't have to resort to layoffs. Have you checked your severance package lately Bob?