Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 741

I would also like to know how to make something along these lines right in setup...

When I play a 2 channel CD from my Oppo BDP-83, it always shows up as stereo + PLXII or something like that, or Anthem Logic Music, How do I set it up so I always defaults at Stereo first, then I can change it with the Mode switching...

Same thing with other multichannel sources, I'm sure I don't have it setup proper, but I just didn't know how to set it right...

Thanks Bob. Yes the source is 5.1. Sometime the source is continuously playing while I switch to another source. When I come back to the 5.1 source d2v shows DD2.0. When I turn d2v off and on then d2v shows DD 5.1.

All you need to do is adjust your default choices in Setup > Mode Presets.

In the Mode Presets menu you can set the default audio mode for each type of input you might receive from each of your sources. This will apply when you change to that source as input. You can make manual changes from there of course and they will survive until you switch away from that input and back.

So for example I have a Source Setup for DVD playback which uses PLIIx-Movie as the default for 2.0 input from old stereo movies. "Movie" bass management mode is selected in the Source Setup menu and PLIIx-Movie is selected on the 2.0 input line of Mode Presets for that source.

Meanwhile I have a separate Source Setup for CD playback which uses Stereo as the default for 2.0 input. "Music" bass management mode (my alternate ARC configuration without the Center speaker) is selected in the Source Setup menu and Stereo is selected on the 2.0 input line of Mode Presets for that source.

Both of these happen to refer to the same, physical disc player.

There is also a "last used" Mode Presets option which retains whatever was last in effect for a given type of audio input for the previous device when you now switch to this new device as input -- i.e., that's how you set things if you DON'T want to use a Mode Preset for that type of audio from that source device.

For modes were it is relevant you can also set the default for whether or not THX audio post processing is also to be used.

See Section 3.7 of the Manual. The only confusing thing is that the Mode Presets menu will allow you to select default settings that don't actually apply to your speaker configuration (such as 7.1 surround processing choices when you only have a 5.1 speaker setup). That's OK because the D2v will use the correct subset of the surround mode when you actually select that device as input. So the confusion is that you will see choices in Mode Presets that won't actually show if you press the Mode button while listening to that source and cycle through the available choices with the Up/Down arrows. I.e., the Mode button choices at any point in time only show you what's actually available at the moment for (1) that type of audio input, and (2) your real speaker configuration, and (3) whether or not you also have THX turned on at that moment.
--Bob

Are you using HDMI audio input or something else from that source such as Optical digital cabling? What is the source device?

It is possible this is a firmware problem in the source device (losing track of what the D2v will accept as input, so defaulting to 2.0 when you switch back to it instead of 5.1).

In Setup > Source Setup for that source, confirm that Auto-Dig = OFF. That simplifies the process of establishing the audio when you switch inputs to that source.

When the D2v is incorrectly showing DD2.0, press Select repeatedly on the D2v remote and report each of the status messages it brings up for audio input *AND* output. Then press the Mode key once and report what it says for your current audio surround mode. Then press and hold the "7" key until the Video Source Adjust menu comes up. Scroll right to the Info panel and also report what it says for audio input. Let's see if there's some useful evidence in the D2v's status messages.
--Bob

Thanks Bob. I will try that.

Thanks Bob, I will have to revisit all this stuff in the Modes Presets area when I have a bit more time...

Thanks Montekay, indeed the speakers are large flat panels full bandwidth dipoles.

For now, I am taking what Bob called Door #3. I may play/tweak some later, but I am truly enjoying all this new sound!

Thanks again Bob!!

Hello Bob. Last night I tried 2 movies with DD TrueHD and DTS Master sound tracks on Panasonic BD55 BD Player. The pcm to d2v is much clear and louder with good base extension than the Bitstream to d2v. Shouldn't they both sound the same? Am I doing something wrong or there is something I can adjust perhaps maybe the HDMI cable? But if it is cable then why pcm works fine and not Bitstream? Thanks a lot as always Bob.

I'm not familiar enough with the BD55 to advise what settings to check, but evidently it is screwing up its Bitstream output in some fashion.

The usual culprit in such cases is that you have made some setting in the player or in the choices on the disc menu which is causing it to use the "core" or "associated" lossy track instead of the lossless track. Typically this is due to having "secondary audio" or "menu audio" enabled.

Press Select repeatedly on the D2v remote and report what it says it is receiving for audio input. In particular, does it say it is receiving TrueHD or DD -- and does it say it is receiving DTS-HD MA or DTS?

This won't be a cable problem.
--Bob

When I send Bitstream to d2v, the front panel shows the correct signal like DD TrueHD or DTS MA but sounds different than the pcm.

Check the owner's thread for the player to see if there are other reports of a difference like this. I don't know of any settings mistakes you can make in the D2v that would result in what you are reporting, and I know from my own testing with the Oppo player that when the player is sending out the right stuff the LPCM and Bitstream for TrueHD and DTS-HD MA tracks sound the same in my 5.1 speaker system.

If it's a player problem, there should be numerous other reports by now in the player thread. While you are in there, double check that you have the latest player firmware.

If you don't find any other BD55 owner reports along these lines, send an email to Anthem tech support and see if they know what's up with this player.

NOTE: What we are talking about here is playing the same TrueHD or DTS-HD MA track with the player set to output either HDMI LPCM or HDMI Bitstream. There should be no difference when you change the HDMI output setting. However if the disc happens to ALSO have a raw (uncompressed) LPCM track, there may very well be a difference when comparing that track (which will, of course, yield HDMI LPCM output) to the lossless TrueHD or DTS-HD MA track that happens to also be on the disc. That's just due to the two tracks being mixed differently by the studio.
--Bob

Bob When playing a BluRay Disc with low loss audio such as True HD, DTS-HD MA or DTS etc on a OPPO BDP-83 thru a D2 and performing the above. What should one see displayed on the D2 screen output ?

Thanks Bob. I talked to the Anthem's Tech support and he told me there is nothing on d2v that will do wrong. It is the player's issue. I am thinking there are 2 tracks one for LPCM and one for DD TruHD or DTS MA as you said. I will also search on the forum and manual of BD player and see if I can find something new. I appreciate it Bob.

The original D2 does not offer decoding of the new lossless formats, so when playing Blu-Ray with a D2 you need a player that does the decoding itself -- for example the PS3.

When set up that way the player will decode TrueHD or DTS-HD MA lossless tracks to HDMI LPCM and the input status display on the D2 will show 5.1 LPCM input -- usually at 48KHz but with some tracks that might be higher.

Now if you are playing a lossy DD5.1 or DTS track with the player still set to do the decoding you'll see THE SAME audio input status on the D2. So you have to check the playback status on the player itself to know that it is playing the DD5.1 or DTS lossy track.

If instead, you have the player set to output the Bitstream for traditional, lossy DD5.1 or DTS tracks, then the status display in the D2 will show Dolby Digital or DTS format as the input.

Since the original D2 can't decode the lossless TrueHD or DTS-HD MA tracks, if you have the player set to output HDMI Bitstream and select a track like that off the disc, most players will automatically switch to playing (as Bitstream output) the "associated" lossy DD5.1 or "core" lossy DTS track which is also on the disc for just such compatibility purposes.

Add to that that some players CAN'T do their own decoding and some players CAN'T output Bitstreams of the lossless tracks (the PS3 being the most notable example of the latter) and the combos can get pretty confusing.
--Bob

When I use the Bitstream on the player the d2v shows the correct format as DD TruHD or DTS MASTER on the front panel and when I check the player, it also shows the same output as DD TruHD or DTS MASTER. But the sound quality and volume of the Bitstream is lower than the PCM from the player. I talked to Panasonic a few minutes ago and they told me the d2v cannot decode the DD TruHD and DTS MASTER Bitstream as it supposed to and lowers the quality of the Bitsream.

The folks you talked to at Panasonic are incorrect.

Also the post you responded to was answering a question about the original D2, not your D2v.
--Bob

I know that this thread is generally a love fest about how great Anthem is about upgrades and their response to problems.

HOWEVER, it has now been a full year without an upgrade of V1.33 of the D2 firmware.

It's not as if one is isn't needed to address a few lingering problems, mostly with the HDMI hand shaking. And, Nick's replies that "it is in the works" are wearing a little thin.

They are certainly keeping up with the D2v, even though there are substantially more D2's out here.

Anthem! HELLO, is anybody there?

I can't really fault them for focussing on D2v releases right now since the initial firmware problems in the D2v were pretty nasty, and they also have a major promised feature to still get out the door (Dolby Volume).

But I agree it is time the promised V1.34 release for the D2 got finished up. My guess would be they were proving some of the HDMI changes in the D2v, and now have to port them to the older HDMI hardware in the D2 -- mainly testing time.
--Bob

I'm really hoping they look into the frequency response issues I sent them before they post a new version. My issues still might be hardware problems but if any of it is firmware related and they don't fix it now then they will end up just having to release yet another version shortly after. I'm still out of the country and thus can't send Nick the setup file he needs but at least some of the issues could not be set up related.

mk

Bob
You must have read over the question and missed the player I am using. So I assume the OPPO player will decode TrueHD or DTS-HD MA lossless tracks and output PCM and the input status display on the D2 will show 5.1 LPCM input -- at 48KHz.

Make sure all your other options are the same. You probably have different matrixing options for LPCM versus Bitstream, which could result in different output sounds. I've seen cases where people didn't know what LPCM was, and they set the output to Stereo/2-channel!

Yes, set the Oppo to HDMI LPCM output and both TrueHD and DTS-HD MA tracks will show up on your original D2 as LPCM. The channel count (2.0 vs. 5.1) and the sampling rate (48KHz or higher) will depend on how the TrueHD or DTS-HD MA track was constructed by the studio. 7.1 tracks will be down-mixed to 5.1 automatically by the Oppo (the original D2 is limited to 5.1 input). You can use a surround mode such as PLIIx in the original D2 to raise 5.1 input to 7.1 speaker output if you have a 7.1 speaker setup.

Also make sure you have Secondary Audio set to OFF in the Oppo unless you are actually trying to use a disc feature that needs Secondary Audio. This keeps the Oppo from having to use the lossy "associated" or "core" audio track instead of the lossless track.
--Bob

Thanks Bob and AbMagFab.
I resolved the issue of Bitstream & PCM last night. My BD55 player has an optio to enhance the dialog. That caused the front channel to receive higher volume. I turned that option off and got exact same sound from Bitstream & PCM.
Thanks again for all your help.

Great! There are so many options to check in cases like this, it can really be confusing.

----------------------------

During Beta testing for the Oppo Blu-Ray player I've done extensive comparison of the Oppo sending Bitstream to the D2v vs. the Oppo decoding to LPCM vs. the PS3 decoding to LPCM.

Whatever you might think of the PS3 as a player, one thing that's known is that it puts out proper levels and correctly decodes the vast majority of the lossless tracks.

I compared levels, and I also compared sound quality. All 3 ways are identical.

With three exceptions:

(1) The PS3 can be set to down-mix 7.1 tracks to 5.1. The D2v will do that as well of course. In my 5.1 speaker setup I found the sound quality was much improved for 7.1 tracks if I set the PS3 to output the full 7.1 LPCM to the D2v and let the D2v do the down-mix to 5.1 speakers for me. (For the original D2 you have no choice but to let the PS3 do the down-mix to 5.1 for such tracks.) NOTE: The Oppo always sends 7.1 to the D2v for such tracks, and 5.1 to the D2 -- so there's no setting you can get wrong here.

(2) The Oppo and the PS3 have DTS-HD MA "Essentials" decoders -- a limitation that only affects their decoding of traditional, lossy DTS tracks. This means they don't decode matrixed rear speaker audio for lossy DTS-ES tracks as found on some SD-DVDs. For either player, select Bitstream output of the DTS-ES track and the D2v will do this correctly. (Although the PS3 can't output Bitstream for lossless tracks, it CAN do so for lossy tracks.)

(3) The D2v does not decode the special embedded coding of HDCD audio discs. It plays them just as if they were regular CDs (HDCD coding is backward compatible with CD players). The Oppo DOES decode these discs, raising the 16-bit LPCM coming off the disc to 20-bit audio embedded in 24-bit audio to send to the D2v -- raising the dynamic range at the expense of increasing the noise floor. So when playing HDCD audio discs, use HDMI LPCM output from the Oppo to get the full dynamic range of these stereo recordings.

-------------------------------------

Also note that DTS is once again screwing up the Blu-Ray world with unnecessary complexity in DTS-HD MA. There are some new discs out there which have 5.1 DTS-HD MA tracks that are mistakenly getting decoded as 6.1 (or 7.1) because the CORE lossy DTS track embedded in there is DTS ES Matrix. Just as with the last case of this, where studios started using the "alternate speaker presentation" for surround speakers, there are DTS-HD MA decoders out there which are getting tripped up by this. And just as with that case, it is not patently obvious what the correct answer should be. So for discs screwing around with this, there will be some differences in decoding until the various decoders get their act together.

Honestly, when the AV revolution comes, DTS should be first up against the wall. /rant
--Bob

AND

Now another for you to stand against the rant wall

We have HDMI 1.4 coming from Silicon Image which will make all our equipment and cabling obsolete. It does provide quite a few upgrades etc but it requires a different chip, software and cables

Yes indeed. Ethernet on the HDMI Cable. I can't wait for the first questions about why does my in-house network go down every time I change channels on my cable TV box?
--Bob

Hi,

I am curious. Has anyone used the Oppo's DVD-AUDIO and SACD features yet? I was thinking of getting a BPD-83 if the HDMI sound output offers an improvement over my Integra DPS-9.1 which I have owned for several years now (the Integra is setup so that it sends 5.1 audio to my D2v via it's analog 5.1 outputs).

I already own a PS3 plus a Sony BDP-S5000ES which covers the Blu-Ray side of my system. Even though I still can't seem to get 7.1 DTS-MA audio bitsream to work properly from my S5000ES to the D2v (making me wish the S5000ES had an LPCM option) it has otherwise been an outstanding player.

So does the Oppo "play nice" with the Anthem D2v v2.07? Any problems with DVD-Audio or SACD playback? Will it be an improvement over what I get from my Integra or should I save my $$$ and just wait for the next Blu-Ray 3.0 spec before adding yet another player to my system.

Yup, your opinions do count here!

p.s. To the person worried about the D2 with v1.33 for over a year now. All I can say is that I also own a D2 that was just retired to spare use when I got my D2v, and I really do think that Anthem has their hands full getting all the remaining D2v glitches ironed out. I remember when I bought my D2 with the original 1.0 firmware; they worked hard to bring it up to v1.33 and there are a lot of decimal points between 1.00 and 1.33!!

Apple TV is a prime example - geeze it's HDMI didn't work with what seems like forever but Anthem support never gave up and have succeeded admirably with their firmware 2.04-2.07 on the D2v (which I understand will eventually arrive for the original D2 via a firmware 1.34 update sometime down the line).

So yea, I guess we never do get perfect "out of the box" Anthem products unless of course you purchase one well down the production line, but how much fun is that? We can always look forward to new features & improvements with no upgrade costs involved - sounds fair to me! {even if our patience wears a little thin at times }

... I must add that I feel sorry for the folks out there who don't follow Internet threads such as this and may never be aware of any of the available improvements to their Anthem purchases. Ouch!

Ray

I just thought of another Oppo vs. D2v decoding difference to add to the list.

DTS-HD MA on Blu-Ray supports up to 192KHz for 5.1 (but only up to 96KHz for 7.1). However the Oppo has a processor limit that only lets it decode up to 96KHz for 5.1 DTS-HD MA. If you set it to HDMI LPCM output for such a track you will get 96KHz.

Of course discs with 192KHz 5.1 DTS-HD MA on them are only slightly less rare than hen's teeth, but if you play one, set the Oppo to output HDMI Bitstream to the D2v and the D2v will decode the full 192KHz.

Note that this is just a decoding limit, so if you have a disc with a 192Khz raw LPCM track (which of course needs no decoding), the Oppo can output that just fine to the D2v.
--Bob

Ray,
SACD from the Oppo to the D2v works fine. The D2v doesn't accept DSD input so set the Oppo to SACD Output = PCM and it will send 88.2KHz to the D2v.

I've not actually tried DVD-Audio in my Oppo but I see no reason why it should have problems with the D2v. The underlying audio architecture of DVD-Audio is basically a subset of Dolby TrueHD which the Oppo decodes just fine for the D2v.

I can't really give you any useful comparison against your Integra.

---------------------------------

Have you talked to Anthem tech support about your DTS-HD MA problem with the Sony player?

What happens if you try to Bitstream that?
--Bob

I went into my speaker calibration screen today to make some adjustments and noticed I was not getting any sound from eith my music sub setting or movie sub setting. I thought at first that this was an issue with my DD15 sub but the light was on in the front so I tried some music and TV and sure enough, it is working. Why would the Anthem not be sending a signal out to the sub through the speaker calibration? It used to work, so I'm not sure when this occured. Any hints?