Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 1028

2 failures in a row and another forum member who related identical issues with the HDMI output after 5 months of operation suggests to me it's a production issue with the HDMI boards. My Brothers electrical work was done after the first Anthem D2V failure then before the 2nd replacement unit.

I wouldn't rule out electrical issues which is why when the third unit arrives:

1. Use a different BD Player. I'll contribute the Marantz UD9004 I use.
2. Use a different projector. This will be hard to source but we'll work something out.
3. Replace the the THOR PS10 with a current version or get the current unit checked for faults.

Multiple defects and bad batches can occur and slip through the QA process. One does not need to look far for examples - Original XBOX 360 and RROD issue? Bad/poor solder of the graphics chip which when heated would disengage from the Motherboard causing an issue. I'm not impugning Anthem's QA practices but soldering robots can have bad days too...

Blade

How good is the videoprocessor in the d2v?
Is it as good as a Lumagen Radiance or Crystalio II?
And if you have a 16:9 image on a 2.35 screen, does it have built-in masking of the sides to make them as black as possible?

Thanks Bob, I haven't adjusted the phase properly yet. I have read how to do it but I haven't bothered too much with it as I'm still moving things around & I keep forgetting to have someone give me a hand when their free .



I have used the quick measure function in V3, its defently a great tool they added. When I play with sub positioning again, I'll defently be using it again.


After looking at some sealed subs online & their response graphs I noticed that some don't give a nice flat response like a ported sub, etc. They seem to give a gradual increase as the frequency goes up. & when you run the sub full range the -3db limit was say 39hz but when you put the crossover on its lowest setting, say 40hz, the -3db limit was under 20hz. So this got me thinking, maybe I should play with mine as well? My internal sub crossover has been disabled but was wondering if maybe I should turn it on & set it lower? Wasn't sure if using the sub crossover & then the setting ARC applies would cause any issues or if it would actually even make a difference because of what ARC does (but maybe worth a try?). I do have a bass test CD so I put on a 20hz tone & did notice output seems to increase slightly if I enable the crossover & put it on its lowest 40hz setting. I also noticed the sub test tone the Anthem produces is at a higher frequency as the output reduces playing the internal test tone with the internal sub crossover on. So I was going to try a quick measure with the internal sub x over on & see if the bottom end is any better.

You might try setting the phase on the sub to 180 and / or reversing the polarity on the mains. Your fronts have good low end response and could be working against the sub at the low frequency because they are out of phase or polarity or both. Your charts looked like mine until I discovered that problem in my setup. Making those adjustments corrected the problem. I also had an SVS unit and that sub should perform quite well in that room unless it is huge.

I see Bob beat me to the post

Actually I'm just visiting to repeat my occasional public service announcement: When in need of factory service, contact the factory.

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"Problem with our video board supplier" sounds like another rumour in the making. The boards are supplied by the surface-mount machine that's directly below my office and lately there's been one return. Little can be predicted from something that occurred once in a row whereas bad connection, be it external or internal, accounts for 90% of hardware problems. The distributor who has Simon's first unit will soon check connection between video board and HDMI 1 output - there's enough reason to suspect its involvement, not to imply there's enough reason to suspect how it possibly got that way. That would be the next step.

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Long time readers might remember the early D2 days when according to some posters half the problems were caused by heat and rest by handshakes, ours and not possibly theirs. In hindsight what did it amount to when there was no handshake analyzer in the hand that did the finger pointing? When a problem arises, it's the observations that count and the more detailed they are when communicated to us, the quicker the solution. This is why we're likely to ask questions before coming up with answers.

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If DSP mode sounds distorted whereas DIR does not, the first thing to check is analog input level - details are in manual section 3.8. Reduction is necessary when source voltage exceeds 2Vrms, to prevent digital converter overload.

Happy to bring over my unused up Epson TW1000

Cheers

You need to set the analog level to a negative number. You are clipping the Anthem DAC's. Using the balanced input, I need to set the level to -8 to avoid clipping.

I am using a PS Audio DLIII DAC with my Anthem D2.

I have had HDMI hanshake issues the entire time I've owned my D2v and have let it be known that I was not happy. Right now my room is being redone, for acoustic upgrade, and I have had to move into a smaller room with a 47" Plasma instead of my 142" screen and projector. I am now running a 3 foot HDMI from my D2v to the plasma and am having no issues at all. Tonight I will switch the 3' HDMI for my 50' that I was using and see if the issues come back. If they do not then I would have to blame my Epson 6500 projector for the handshake problems, I will keep you posted.

John

Another test would be to try 480p (not 480i) on the 50' cable to the projector, with 8 bit set in Setup > Video Output. That's the simplest HDMI signal for the cable to handle.

If that seems to be working, then try 1080i to the projector on that cable. If 1080i works but 1080p doesn't then it definitely looks like a cabling problem.

Now some "cabling" problems are in fact due to the device at one end or the other not fully implementing the dynamic signal EQ that allows such long HDMI cable runs for high bandwidth signals. This is an HDMI chip hardware design issue in the device, so not something easily fixed.

[For example, HDMI V1.3 allowed higher bandwidth signals -- e.g., "Deep Color" 1080p -- but the first generation of HDMI V1.3 chips did not implement the additional sophistication in their signal EQ to allow that to work well over longer or marginal cables.]

But switching to a "better" HDMI cable (or "shorter" if that's possible) may reduce the problem so the lack of full, dynamic, signal EQ in the HDMI chip may no longer cause a problem.
--Bob

Apparently identical effect does not mean identical cause.

If the plasma accepts deep colour whereas the projector does not, you might still get no picture... cable bandwidth issue. In such a case change D2v video outptu to 8-bit or 10-bit (v2.10 or later).

It doesn't end there either - even with 8-bit there's a difference: TV accepts sound whereas projector does not. That's more data to go through the cable.

And if audio doesn't push bandwidth over the fence *then* you can conclude it's the projector, but you'd have no way of knowing without cable tester and/or handshake analyzer.

So:

Connect entire system to test it before installing - jumping to conclusion can easily lead to trying to fix the wrong problem (which is futile).

Come to think of it if projector starts working when HDMI audio out is turned off in the source, it may be a handshake issue. I've heard of this happening (audio-out can't be disabled in D2v, maybe some day) but don't know the cause.

Wow thanks for the kind offers. I actually called Thor Technologies yesterday and had a long talk with a guy about the issues. In the years since the release of the PS 10 they have had 2 returns (from country people) and both units were perfect on their bench. The likely hood of it being the PS10 is remote but I've taken it out and put my Powerbox board in instead. He also said the only difference b/w my unit and the updated one is the dimmer switch and the 220v option that's it nothing else and not worth upgrading to. Also my 15m HDMI cable from Selby arrived so will use that instead of my current one just need to get an installer to put in it in. As for the projector well I'm 99.9% set on buying the Epson TW-3600 or the TW-3500 (comes with free globe at the moment for $2400), and the TW-3600 can be had for approx $2000 here in Australia (Harvey Norman). The projector is the only thing that hasn't been upgraded in my system plus after talking to the guy at Thor I'm getting one of these for my Krell TAS 5 channel amp:

http://thortechnologies.com.au/produ...m90-hardwired/

This now comes standard in 16amp and my Krell is running on a 15amp power point at the moment but isn't filtered as only the other 2 power points 20A (both with 2 insert points) are filtered via the Clipsal module on the main board. The contact at Thor also said that the filter module (ON MAIN POWER BOARD) doesn't protect agianst noise or spikes that may come from fridges and vacume cleaners etc, also it's best to still use power boards with any equipment that I'm using for my HT. He highly recommended that I continue to use the PS10 for my D2v and Oppo and finds it hard to believe that the PS10 is the cause of my issues I'm having. This exercise is going to cost me but I want to be 100% sure (if that's possible) that another D2v doesn't becomes unusable. I can only try and hope that the measures that I'm implementing will be worthwhile.

Thanks again for the offers guys appreciate it.

Hi,


Surge protection etc is a good idea on av gear,amps low powered will usually will be ok.On the krell when off and unplugged and then plugged in and put into standby it will trip most surge gear as it fills CAPS.In my case it sets off, ups and monster surge gear for video gear.Once in standby mode and off it should be ok.(I have the same amp krell too).

Cheers Victor.

Check out ProntoTunes for the TSU9400. It gives a nice interface for AppleTV for seeing and selecting iTunes or Apple TV from the Pronto.

Thanks for that. So when yours is in standby do you hear any kind of low hum? Also what do think of the Thor protection device just for the Krell?

Thanks mvppsu - Is it ironic that I'm also using a DLIII?

Well, here's what I found:

I lowered the analog level to a -8 and yes it did get rid of the fuzzieness but it sounded horrible - very hard, sharp, no bass impact or weight. I obviously had to turn the volume waaay up to get it back to normal listening level. I also lowered the noise level much lower and that seemed to help but it still isn't where it needs to be.

I have the D1 also connected RCA as well in the CD and when I switch to CD it is soooo good - powerful, clean, tight, sweet highs, etc. The clarity just isn't there like it is with XLR.

I am just stumped - it might be time to call the dealer which is such a pain - would rather have a finger amputated w/o anesthetic. They are horrible to deal with. It just doesn't make sense to me why I would need to lower the analog levels and my buddy who has the exact same setup (diff. DAC) has all of his set at 0 and his works perfectly. And why don't I have to lower the levels when I use RCA analog in (voltage differences)?

Note that I had already tried all suggestions, 8 bit and 1080i instead of 1080p output plus others and the problems persisted. I have put my 50' Monster HDMI cable back into the equation and my handshakes are at least twice as long, almost as bad with the projector in the set up. So without a cable tester or handshake analyzer it looks like the 50' cable is part at fault and the projector only adds to the problem. One more note that with my old Denon 3808 I had no problems with the same 50' cable and the same projector. Then again, my Denon didn't sound this good.

John

for jb5200 - In case "hidden" DSP settings such as nonzero Fronts Bass are at play, save user settings, load defaults, load user settings. This would clear them without affecting menu settings. Also use the on-screen meter in menu 8 to help find the right analog-in level setting.

If you need further assistance please contact tech support.

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for studlygoorite - In case it hasn't been considered or applied and it's not too late, you might want to use conduit for AV cabling - this will make future cable swaps a lot easier than fishing behind finished walls. 50 feet of straight copper for HDMI is tricky - at least make sure it's 23-gauge. For Category II (12-bit 1080p60 bandwidth required) the official limit is 25 feet.

As for unofficial limts:

At the factory's theater the D2v and LTX 500 have no hiccups with a 23-gauge 20 metre cable (over 60 feet). This was surprising and wouldn't you know it, when I tried to set up a second identical system it didn't work unless resolution was lowered. No sources were involved yet. The 20m cables were bought at the same time so I'm guessing they came from the same roll. Luckily the second system needed only 40 feet and when the shorter cable arrived everything worked like magic. You can never be sure about what'll happen till you try it.

I think I haven´t got any answers for my questions? Anyone?

D2v uses the latest VXP processor - that's one basis for comparing against others.

Output frame is always 16:9 unless output is set to 480/576 in which case it is 4:3.

Are you using a fixed lens or movable?

If movable, there light reflected by the non-16:9 part of the screen is ambient not direct from projector, so to minimize it the choices are physical masking or a special black screen such as SI Black Diamond.

If fixed, which means the projector will be in horizontal squeeze mode for non-2.4:1 movies, the light projected at the sides varies according to the projector's technology, for example LCD cannot turn light off completely while others can. There is still the ambient light issue to deal with, as with moving lens.

I have fixed lens so I use my Crystalio II vp to stretch 2.35 movies.
The Crystalio has some kind of built in masking for making the sides as dark as possible with 16:9 material.
If I would get an Anthem D2v I was wondering if this had the same functionality. Then I could sell my CII and use the money to invest in the D2v.

It sounds like you are referring to the pillar brightness adjustment which is there as part of VXP with 10 steps from black to light gray. Default is black.

It is not a mask - its purpose is to let the user select how much light to add at the sides when image is 4:3 to prevent "image retention", more commonly known as burn-in (severity depends on the display type).

For further info please contact tech support - I have to return to my regularly scheduled work day.

If you use a "normal" lens (no anamorphic widening), the 16:9 content will not use the sides of a 2.35 screen at all, and so any light leak you are seeing over there can't be fixed by anything the projector or a video processor can do. I.e., no pixels are being displayed over there. That portion of the screen is reflecting ambient light in the room, including light reflected back onto the screen from the walls, etc., due to the active portion of the image.

If you use an "anamorphic" lens which optically widens a 16:9 image left to right so that it fills a 2.35 screen, then every portion of the screen is illuminated directly by the projector. When playing 2.35 content, you can apply a uniform vertical stretch in the D2v so that the content fills the 16:9 output frame sent to the projector -- i.e., no wasted pixels just holding letter box bars. Now this distorts the image: Circles now look like tall ovals. But the anamorphic lens optically widens that 16:9 input frame to the 2.35 image it throws to the screen so things now look correct again (circles look like circles, and the image fills the 2.35 screen top to bottom and left to right). You do the vertical stretch in the D2v using a Custom Crop and Anamorphic Scaling. See the "Fun With Custom Cropping and Scaling" post links in the first post of this thread for details. When playing 2.35 content this way to your 2.35 screen there are no unused areas of the screen.

The problem comes if you play regular 16:9 content using that same "anamorphic" lens. If you leave the Custom Crop in place, the top and bottom of the image will be discarded -- i.e., the portions that used to be the letter box bars when you were watching 2.35 content. The image will fill your screen left to right and top to bottom, and it won't be distorted (circles look like circles), but you can't see the top and bottom portions of the original 16:9 content frame.

If you turn OFF the custom crop, but still leave your anamorphic lens in place, the image will fill your screen top to bottom and left to right, and you won't lose any portions of the image, but the anamorphic lens will stretch the image left to right (which is why it fills the 2.35 screen left to right) and so the image is distorted (circles now look like wide ovals).

The "correct" solution is to swap out your anamorphic lens with a normal lens. You'll now see the 16:9 content filling your screen top to bottom, and without distortion, but a portion of either side of your 2.35 screen will be unused. I.e., back to the first case above. Again, done this way the projector is not illuminating the sides of the screen so any light you see off of that is ambient light and there is nothing the projector or any video processor can do to alter that.

An alternative, "less correct" solution is to leave the anamorphic lens in place and apply a "squeeze" to the 16:9 content so that it doesn't use a portion on either side of the 16:9 output frame being sent to the projector. This distorts the image of course: Circles now look like tall ovals. But your anamorphic lens now optically widens that and so you again see an undistorted 16:9 image that fills your screen from top to bottom and leaves a portion of the 2.35 screen unused on either side.

However in this "squeeze" case, the left and right sides of the screen *ARE* being directly illuminated by the projector. I.e., there are actually pixels being thrown by the projector to those sides.

Now when the 16:9 content is squeezed this way, the unused portion of the 16:9 image frame on either side is filled with black pillar box bars. The pixel values being sent to the projector in those bars on either side are indistinguishable from "black". If the projector's black levels are not dark enough for your taste then you will see dark gray in the unused portions on either side of the screen but there is nothing that ANY video processor can do to alter that. It can't send "negative" pixels to the projector that will force the projector to magically throw less light for those pixels than its inherent black level output limit. Some projector technologies are worse than others in terms of how little light they throw for "black" pixels, but again if your projector, properly set up, still throws dark gray instead of black for a "black" pixel, there's nothing any video processor can do to correct that.

Folks use curtains that can be partially drawn on either side to help in such cases. Curtains are also used to cut down on ambient light reflection in unused portions of the screen.

But there's yet another problem with this "squeezed" approach to 16:9 content. When you squeeze the 16:9 content, each line across the image has to fit into fewer pixels! Why? Because you are using the pixels on the left and right of the output frame to hold your pillar box bars that result from the squeeze. The NUMBER of pixels on each output line doesn't change, it's just that you are now wasting a bunch of them to hold black pillar box bar pixels.

And that means you are discarding horizontal resolution. A lot. And once discarded there's no way to get it back. The anamorphic lens will optically widen the image back to a 16:9 shape, but the horizontal resolution within that shape can't be restored that way or any other way.

And so, Anthem has chosen to NOT OFFER a 16:9 "squeeze" option in their video processor.

It sounds like you are saying you are using just such a "squeeze" option in your CrystalIO. So the short answer to your question is that the Anthem will not do that. By design. But understand that every time you watch 16:9 content using such a "squeeze" option along with your anamorphic lens you are throwing away image quality. And also understand that despite how they might have written it up, there's nothing the CrystalIO can do in the black pillar box bars created as part of that "squeeze" which will make your display throw anything blacker than its own, inherent black level limit for those pillar box bar pixels.

My recommendation is that you should investigate one of the lens options that makes it easy for you to shift between an anamorphic and a normal lens when you want to view 16:9 content on your 2.35 screen and stop using the "squeeze" option. If even with that you have too much ambient light reflection from the unused sides of the screen, consider curtains that can be partially drawn to cover the unused portions on either side of the screen.
--Bob

Thank you for an excellent answer!

Vintage Bob
John

In standby and not on(no blue glow) no hum,when on with single ended cables some hum,i use balanced and no hum.(Every krell amp in my system has had hum from amp and speakers,better quality cables help,balanced cables help or fixed problem in my system and new 20amp 240v for this amp only helped too.)

Check with thor as I think the thor will cut power to the krell when amp is off and you switch rear breaker on.(too much current draw,for a few milli seconds,active tracking will cut power).The result is you may not be able to turn amp on.Even with HT and powering 5 low eff speakers it may activate?
For HT I use amp only for centre only,so it,s not really using much power.

Victor.

iRule question - what settings do I need on the D2 to be able to feed it commands from the GC-100 gateway via RS-232?

I have set up the iRule app with the 'Anthem Main' commands from the device database and set the gateway to transmit via the RS-232 port to the Anthem. I have connected a standard M/F serial cable from the GC-100 to the D2.

As far as I can tell the D2 is unresponsive to commands - what am I missing?

David

Got a chance to call Thor Tech and asked the question and the guy said it allows for a variance of 50% so it wont prevent the amp from receiving power and the active tracking wont interupt the supply and said it was perfect for this application. Needs to be installed by a certified electrician.

I have a question about room gain. I'm using arc 3.0. I added acoustic treatments to my room. I'm not totally done but it's going to take me a few weeks to build the rest so I decided to run ARC again. Watching movies and tend to sit in my sweet spot. I took most of my measurments around there. About 23 feet back from the front speakers and 15 feet from the surround speakers. I get a room gain of 3.945749 for movie mode. In music mode I use to get a gain of 0.258642. Front speakers only with sub. I make one measurement in my sweet spot. The other four measurements I make about 6 feet behind the sweet spot about standing ear height. Since I walk around about 50% of the time doing stuff. I use to get a room gain around the 3.94 number. Any reason why it would be so different from previous measurements? Should I measure again?

By the way as I add acoustic paneling and two bass panel traps I notice that the sound of on and off are much closer then before but still quite different. ARC brings out the midrange and mid bass and sounds smoother. But the graphs are really not that much different then before. I expected a change in the graphs.

David I posted the answer to your question in the Irule forum.


Don