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Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 1272

post #38131 of 42682
Hi Bob:

I measured the internal temperature of my D2v in its rack and it measued anywhere from 100F (37.8C) to 110F(43.3C) depending on the time of day. Is this normal? If not, what is the typical or safe are of operation for this unit? I placed the temperature probe within the slots on the left side of the unit.


Thanks,

David
post #38132 of 42682
Can somone tell me the difference between the AVM-50 and the D2 is one better than the other ?
post #38133 of 42682
Just installed firmware 3.09 without an issue. My test disc is Thor on BD and my god the improvement in the whole soundstage is clearly noticeable. Rears are much improved as is the front stage and bass so basically everything. Now I was listening to it at -18 which is what I always listen to this movie at (just reloaded my previous ARC calibration) and to me it sounded louder. Not sure why (is it due to the 7.1 DTS-HD fix possibly) but now I'm interested in Macca's testing of the levels now.

All I can say is this firmware is what we have been waiting for, the locking onto the signal after changing chapters is almost instant (quicker now) as is the bringing up of the main D2v menu. Thanks to Anthem for looking after their clients and just in time for Avengers next week (Australian release is 29th Aug).
post #38134 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonNo10 View Post

Just installed firmware 3.09 without an issue. My test disc is Thor on BD and my god the improvement in the whole soundstage is clearly noticeable. Rears are much improved as is the front stage and bass so basically everything. Now I was listening to it at -18 which is what I always listen to this movie at (just reloaded my previous ARC calibration) and to me it sounded louder. Not sure why (is it due to the 7.1 DTS-HD fix possibly) but now I'm interested in Macca's testing of the levels now.
All I can say is this firmware is what we have been waiting for, the locking onto the signal after changing chapters is almost instant (quicker now) as is the bringing up of the main D2v menu. Thanks to Anthem for looking after their clients and just in time for Avengers next week (Australian release is 29th Aug).

before this fix, thor was 6db louder when my anthem was decoding vs my Oppo bdp 83 player. Don't know why, but it aint constanly. theise 6 db i also noticed on Ice age 3 , sin city , and more...can't remeber them all :-)
but on Captain America the levels are the same, bitstream from the player vs LPCM. So Maby there is som flag on theise Disc in DTS regards??
post #38135 of 42682
Is the D2v ( 3D) something that will be eventually upgradable to a 4k unit should that ever catch on?
post #38136 of 42682
^ Unlikely unless you are happy with just "pass through" as now with 3D.

The video processor is not designed for 4K, and replacing the video board would be a major cost. I.E., it would be a new unit (perhaps via trade-in), not an upgrade.
--Bob
post #38137 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by p.las View Post

before this fix, thor was 6db louder when my anthem was decoding vs my Oppo bdp 83 player. Don't know why, but it aint constanly. theise 6 db i also noticed on Ice age 3 , sin city , and more...can't remeber them all :-)
but on Captain America the levels are the same, bitstream from the player vs LPCM. So Maby there is som flag on theise Disc in DTS regards??

Hmm perhaps. I've always used Bitstream but this time Thor did seem louder at same level.
post #38138 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by a1usedcomp View Post

Can somone tell me the difference between the AVM-50 and the D2 is one better than the other ?

The difference is solely in audio.

Early in this thread, several people took the time to give both units a try, and there was close to 100% agreement the original D2 sounded enough better than the original AVM 50 that these folks could hear the difference. This was true even for folks who ended up deciding to save money and get the AVM 50. I.E., the D2 sounded better, but not enough better to them to want to spend the extra money because, really, the AVM 50 is no slouch for audio.

NOTE: Adding ARC is a hardware upgrade for the original AVM 50. DO NOT GET an AVM 50 that does not already HAVE the ARC upgrade, because I'm not sure you can still get the upgrade.
--Bob
post #38139 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmusoke View Post

Hi Bob:

I measured the internal temperature of my D2v in its rack and it measued anywhere from 100F (37.8C) to 110F(43.3C) depending on the time of day. Is this normal? If not, what is the typical or safe are of operation for this unit? I placed the temperature probe within the slots on the left side of the unit.


Thanks,

David

I've no idea what's normal for the internal temperature. Keep in mind those vents are SUPPOSED to be warm because that's where the heat comes out. If you have your unit in an enclosed, space a better measure is the temperature of the surfaces of the enclosure facing the unit, for example the under-side of whatever's above it. If those are not warming up too much then the heat leaving the Anthem is dissipating as designed. I.E., no problems.

My rule of thumb is that the surface above the Anthem should be not much more than 10 degrees warmer than ambient room temperature.

If those surfaces are heating up a lot then you have your Anthem in an oven, and that's not good. Double the space, or open it more to air, or add a fan.
--Bob
post #38140 of 42682
I have a fan on my D2V. On my amps too. Cool equipment is happy equipment. smile.gif
post #38141 of 42682
Hi Bob:

I measured the internal temperature of my D2v in its rack and it measued anywhere from 100F (37.8C) to 110F(43.3C) depending on the time of day. Is this normal? If not, what is the typical or safe are of operation for this unit? I placed the temperature probe within the slots on the left side of the unit.

Thanks,
David

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I've no idea what's normal for the internal temperature. Keep in mind those vents are SUPPOSED to be warm because that's where the heat comes out. If you have your unit in an enclosed, space a better measure is the temperature of the surfaces of the enclosure facing the unit, for example the under-side of whatever's above it. If those are not warming up too much then the heat leaving the Anthem is dissipating as designed. I.E., no problems.
My rule of thumb is that the surface above the Anthem should be not much more than 10 degrees warmer than ambient room temperature.
If those surfaces are heating up a lot then you have your Anthem in an oven, and that's not good. Double the space, or open it more to air, or add a fan.
--Bob

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingnut4772 View Post

I have a fan on my D2V. On my amps too. Cool equipment is happy equipment. smile.gif

Thanks all. This is what Anthem said to me below:

David,


Just asked engineering. They said it seems normal.

If you’re worried you can always have extra fans blowing air out of the rack.


Andrew Cirurgiao
Technical Support


I read a paper on thermo management from MiddleAtlantic and they said the maximum temp should be 85F. For every 10 degree change afterthat reduces the device reliability by 40%. This is what frightened me the most. I have a 35CFM (cubic feet per minute) fan on it now but plan to change to a new 128CFM fan once it arrives.

When i asked what the maximum safe operating tempearture of the D2v was, the response was:

The answer can't be summarized with one number. We test our designs by monitoring several points inside the unit simultaneously, no fans.

Thermal protection is built in, and a message is displayed just before the unit shuts down.

The last time anyone here got a report of this happening in the field was many years ago and not only was it from a country a lot closer to the equator than the US, but the unit was completely enclosed in a piece of furniture.

A fan was in there too but it did nothing because no air was being exchanged - the air it was blowing into the unit was the same temperature as the air being taken away from it, in other words it was the same air.



To summarize, the general answer is that if the D2v's thermal protection isn't engaging, the parts inside the unit are probably well within their safe operating range, however, the cooler you can keep your electronics, any electronics, the longer they'll last, regardless of whether it has thermal protection.

Edited by dmusoke - 8/23/12 at 12:49pm
post #38142 of 42682
ARC question. The subwoofer cut-off that ARC sets to roll. The LFE frequency that are high then the cut-off are rerouted to the front speakers? I'm thinking yes but just wanted to verify? Example I have it set to 100hz. Anything over 100Hz will go to the front speakers?
post #38143 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

^ Yeah the long press buttons are currently all in Harmony's definition for the Statement D2v. On the other hand the input selectors are broken and the arrow keys, although they work, are slower than they should be.
--Bob

Bob or anyone else using a Harmony... Is there a reason that the volume up/down control is set to 2db not 0.5db as the original Anthem remote?

I've finally moved into the D2 world and have been setting it up the past few days.
post #38144 of 42682
Hi Eric,

If we're talking about the same thing (I use a harmony with a 50v) if you press the volume and hold, then it does jump faster. However, if you press it once, then it moves in 0.5db increments with my implementation.

Theo
post #38145 of 42682
Uploaded new firmware and no problems.

Quick question:

I tinkered with my subs ( had to replace one ) and reran ARC. ARC set my subwoofer to 80 ( I know it's not a crossover ) where it was previously 105. What kind of changes would cause ARC to lower it ? Is that a good thing? Bad thing ?

I fiddled with them using the output on my SMS1 to get a very good Pre ARC room response. The only real change I made was setting my RR sub's crossover frequency control to about 43hz. Doing this made my in room response the best I've seen it ( on the SMS1 graph) but I'm really just fiddling to see what happens.
post #38146 of 42682
So has anyone else installed the new firmware and noticed any difference?
post #38147 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonNo10 View Post

So has anyone else installed the new firmware and noticed any difference?

I'm still toying with it. Haven't really noticed anything yet. I'll put in a movie later.
post #38148 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricE View Post

Bob or anyone else using a Harmony... Is there a reason that the volume up/down control is set to 2db not 0.5db as the original Anthem remote?

I've finally moved into the D2 world and have been setting it up the past few days.

In your Harmony configuration, go to the Devices section and Troubleshoot the Anthem. Select the item for commands happen too many times. It will bring up the key repeat count value which is how many times the command is sent for each button push. Change that to 0. Some devices won't respond to remote commands unless they are sent more than once. The Anthem does not need that.
--Bob
post #38149 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by steven2583 View Post

ARC question. The subwoofer cut-off that ARC sets to roll. The LFE frequency that are high then the cut-off are rerouted to the front speakers? I'm thinking yes but just wanted to verify? Example I have it set to 100hz. Anything over 100Hz will go to the front speakers?

No. LFE above 100Hz is attenuated and lost. Mind you there isn't much LFE up there.

None of the LFE content goes to the fronts when you have a subwoofer in the configuration.
--Bob
post #38150 of 42682
So ARC is telling me 120 for the subwoofer cut-off. If I don't want to lose anything I should have a higher setting for my Movie setting. Music setting I only have 2 channel music so having it at 100 shouldn't matter because it doesn't get anything unless it's redirected from the mains which I have set at 60. That seems like a design flaw to me that LFE would be thrown away. I would think there would be some option in keep it and rerouting it to the mains.


Has any one out there ever checked what frequency range most movies send to the sub?
post #38151 of 42682
The search function here is maddening. Can someone point me to the ARC instructions for setting up with 2 subwoofers. Just set up 2 new SVS PB12+ to replace a single PB Ultra.

Bob...if you're out there...help....

Thanks
Randy
post #38152 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by steven2583 View Post

So ARC is telling me 120 for the subwoofer cut-off. If I don't want to lose anything I should have a higher setting for my Movie setting. Music setting I only have 2 channel music so having it at 100 shouldn't matter because it doesn't get anything unless it's redirected from the mains which I have set at 60. That seems like a design flaw to me that LFE would be thrown away. I would think there would be some option in keep it and rerouting it to the mains.


Has any one out there ever checked what frequency range most movies send to the sub?

LFE in movie content is gone by 120Hz. The 120 cutoff you have for Movies is fine.
--Bob
post #38153 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiliman View Post

The search function here is maddening. Can someone point me to the ARC instructions for setting up with 2 subwoofers. Just set up 2 new SVS PB12+ to replace a single PB Ultra.

Bob...if you're out there...help....

Thanks
Randy

Measure the distance from ARC mic position #1 to each sub. Use the average of those two distances as your Subwoofer distance setting. Put in normal distance settings for your other speakers.

Set "1 Sub" in your Speaker configuration, even though you have two. When using ARC you must set "1 Sub" if you have Subwoofers.

Zero out all the lines in Setup > Level Calibration. Use the internal test tones to set the Test Level line to yield 75dB SPL (the noise will be coming from Left Front). Go to either of the Subwoofer lines but leave that line at 0.

With only one sub turned on, adjust the volume knob on that sub to 72 (not 75) dB SPL.. Switch and do the same with just the other sub powered. When combined they will yield roughly 75dB SPL which is close enough for ARC to work with.

(All the lines in Level Calibration stay at 0 except for Test Level, which ARC will use.)

With one sub powered at a time, adjust the Phase and Polarity controls on that sub for best match with the Left Front speaker. You can use the FM tuner set to produce the hiss between stations (set Stereo audio surround mode so audio only goes to Left Front/Right Front/Sub). Adjust Polarity/Phase (controls ON THE SUB) for maximum bass in that hiss. See the Setup section of tutorial post links in the first post of this thread for more hints on this.

Repeat with just the other sub powered. When each Sub is in proper phase with the fronts then they are also in phase with each other.

All the preliminaries are now done.

Power up both subs and do an ARC Measurement pass as normal. Look at the red Measured curve for Subwoofer to see how well your two subs are operating together without producing peaks and dips. If there are still substantial problems you may need to shift one or both subs and redo the above preliminaries. The Quick Measure tool in the ARC Tools menu can be used with one sub powered at a time to get a feel for how shifting the sub alters its uncorrected output.

If the red Measured curve doesn't look too bad, and the green Calculated curve shows that ARC has produced results close to the Target curve then you are in good shape. As a final check, the volume trim ARC Uploads into Level Calibration when you do the Upload should be within a few dB either side of 0.
--Bob
post #38154 of 42682
THANKS. You're awesome!

Randy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Measure the distance from ARC mic position #1 to each sub. Use the average of those two distances as your Subwoofer distance setting. Put in normal distance settings for your other speakers.
Set "1 Sub" in your Speaker configuration, even though you have two. When using ARC you must set "1 Sub" if you have Subwoofers.
Zero out all the lines in Setup > Level Calibration. Use the internal test tones to set the Test Level line to yield 75dB SPL (the noise will be coming from Left Front). Go to either of the Subwoofer lines but leave that line at 0.
With only one sub turned on, adjust the volume knob on that sub to 72 (not 75) dB SPL.. Switch and do the same with just the other sub powered. When combined they will yield roughly 75dB SPL which is close enough for ARC to work with.
(All the lines in Level Calibration stay at 0 except for Test Level, which ARC will use.)
With one sub powered at a time, adjust the Phase and Polarity controls on that sub for best match with the Left Front speaker. You can use the FM tuner set to produce the hiss between stations. Adjust for maximum bass in that hiss. See the Setup section of tutorial post links in the first post of this thread for more hints on this.
Repeat with just the other sub powered.
All the preliminaries are not done.
Power up both subs and do an ARC Measurement pass as normal. Look at the red Measured curve for Subwoofer to see how well your two subs are operating together without producing peaks and dips. If there are still substantial problems you may need to shift one or both subs and redo the above preliminaries. The Quick Measure tool in the ARC Tools menu can be used with one sub powered at a time to get a feel for how shifting the sub alters its uncorrected output.
If the red Measured curve doesn't look too bad, and the green Calculated curve shows that ARC has produced results close to the Target curve then you are in good shape. As a final check, the volume trim ARC Uploads into Level Calibration when you do the Upload should be within a few dB either side of 0.
--Bob
post #38155 of 42682
So Bob have you had a chance to test any 7.1 Blurays (I know you have a 5.1 setup like me), and noticed any level differences? I've only tried Thor and it sounded awesome but it did seem to be louder at the same volume I normally listen to it at.

Very keen to hear others impressions of this new firmware seeing it's gone public and has pretty much most fixes that we have all been waiting for.
post #38156 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonNo10 View Post

So Bob have you had a chance to test any 7.1 Blurays (I know you have a 5.1 setup like me), and noticed any level differences? I've only tried Thor and it sounded awesome but it did seem to be louder at the same volume I normally listen to it at.

Very keen to hear others impressions of this new firmware seeing it's gone public and has pretty much most fixes that we have all been waiting for.

All DTS-HD MA sounds a bit louder than the LPCM alternative, but the channels appear to be properly balanced against each other either way -- i.e., just adjust main volume as needed. I've not noticed any issue on specific discs.
--Bob
post #38157 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

All DTS-HD MA sounds a bit louder than the LPCM alternative, but the channels appear to be properly balanced against each other either way -- i.e., just adjust main volume as needed. I've not noticed any issue on specific discs.
--Bob

Yes I've always known that but after listening to Thor last night it was definatly louder with 3.09 at the same volume with the previous firmware I had installed which was 3.03. Anyway will be keen to read Macca's feedback on the level testing. Thanks Bob.
post #38158 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by steven2583 View Post

So ARC is telling me 120 for the subwoofer cut-off. If I don't want to lose anything I should have a higher setting for my Movie setting. Music setting I only have 2 channel music so having it at 100 shouldn't matter because it doesn't get anything unless it's redirected from the mains which I have set at 60. That seems like a design flaw to me that LFE would be thrown away. I would think there would be some option in keep it and rerouting it to the mains.
Has any one out there ever checked what frequency range most movies send to the sub?

ARC does treat bass differently compared to other processors.

Not only does it throw away any LFE above whatever it sets as the sub cut-off, but if it sets the mains to 60Hz and the sub to 120Hz (for example) it will roll off the mains at 60Hz and have the sub overlapping them up to 120hz.

As far as I've been able to work out, it doesn't treat the LFE as separate channel.

Most other prepros would attempt to do a crossover at 60Hz for your L/R main channel signal and run the LFE separately.

Anthem seem to see this as a feature rather than a bug. I've done a bunch of measurements and this overlapping bass does indeed measure smoother than forcing it (via Targets) to do a more traditional crossover. In fact, in my room I get better response truning ARC Off than I do when forcing it cross both sub and mains at a specified point (40Hz in my case).

I posted the measurements here a while back:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/678260/anthem-d2-d2v-avm50-avm50v-arc1-tweaking-guide/37650#post_22225485
post #38159 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonNo10 View Post

Yes I've always known that but after listening to Thor last night it was definatly louder with 3.09 at the same volume with the previous firmware I had installed which was 3.03. Anyway will be keen to read Macca's feedback on the level testing. Thanks Bob.

i will try to install the new software, and then messaure the difference , bitstream vs LPCM on Thor. last time the difference was 6 db - bitstream was the loudest one.

this is the first time i have to install new software - is there anything i shout bee aware off??? or is it allmost the same as upload ARC?
post #38160 of 42682
Quote:
Originally Posted by steven2583 View Post

So ARC is telling me 120 for the subwoofer cut-off. If I don't want to lose anything I should have a higher setting for my Movie setting. Music setting I only have 2 channel music so having it at 100 shouldn't matter because it doesn't get anything unless it's redirected from the mains which I have set at 60. That seems like a design flaw to me that LFE would be thrown away. I would think there would be some option in keep it and rerouting it to the mains.
Has any one out there ever checked what frequency range most movies send to the sub?

as i recall there is a brickwall at 120 hz on the LFE track

infact THX recomend a lowpass filter at 80hz24db.
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