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OLED TVs: Technology Advancements Thread - Page 173

post #5161 of 5877
2/5/13 at 3:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

They'll pay off the grand master posters here and we'll be "EDUCATED" into why 4K LCD is great!

Art, I know (no, I hope) that your repetitive posts in thread after thread are at least somewhat tongue in cheek. With that said, have you ever seen the Sony 4K LED/LCD? Have you ever seen the Samsung 4K display? Ever??

I sincerely doubt that anyone that's seen those amazing displays would come to the conclusion that we have anything to fear from these gorgeous displays, let alone need to be 'paid off' to say so.

Really Art, get a grip.
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post #5162 of 5877
2/5/13 at 8:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post


(something ridiculous)

[....] and we do note your dislike of LCD

Try not to jump to conclusions.
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post #5163 of 5877
2/5/13 at 8:25am
we should move on now...
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post #5164 of 5877
2/5/13 at 12:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ynotgoal View Post

The official press release from LG

SEOUL, Jan. 2, 2013 -– LG Electronics (LG) announced today that it will begin accepting pre-orders for its eagerly-awaited 55-inch class (54.6-inch diagonal) WRGB OLED TV (Model 55EM9700) in South Korea this month with deliveries scheduled to begin next month.

Other markets where the revolutionary LG OLED (Organic Light Emitting Diode) TV will be available will be announced over the next several weeks along with their respective prices. The announcement comes just days before the 2013 Consumer Electronics Show (CES), where an early version of the TV last year was awarded “Best of Show.”

More than 1,400 LG retail stores in South Korea will begin accepting orders from consumers for KRW 11 million (approximately US $10,000) TVs starting with delivery to commence the first week of February. As the first and only company to announce availability of the next-generation TV technology, LG is prepared to ramp up quickly to take the lead in the OLED segment that is expected to grow to 7.2 million units by 2016, according to Display Search.

“We are extremely pleased to be able to make this announcement at the start of the new year because we believe that OLED will usher in a whole new era of home entertainment,” said Havis Kwon, President and CEO of LG’s Home Entertainment Company. “Not since color TV was first introduced 60 years ago has there been a more transformational moment. When high definition TV was first introduced 15 years ago, the public’s reaction was ‘wow!’ but when customers see our razor-thin OLED TV for the first time, they’re left speechless. That’s a clear indicator as any that OLED TV is much more than just an incremental improvement to current television technology.”

Only 4 millimeters (0.16 inches) thin and weighing less than 10 kilograms (22 pounds), LG’s OLED TVs produce astoundingly vivid and realistic pictures thanks to its superior WRGB technology. LG’s unique Four-Color Pixel system features a white sub-pixel, which works in conjunction with the conventional red, blue, green setup to create the perfect color output. LG’s exclusive Color Refiner delivers even greater tonal enhancement, resulting in images that are more vibrant and natural than anything seen before. The 55-inch OLED TV also offers an infinite contrast ratio, which maintains optimal contrast levels regardless of ambient brightness or viewing angle.

Even before its launch, LG’s OLED TV was turning heads all over the world. In addition to being named Best of Show at CES 2012, the influential Industrial Designers Society of America recognized the TV with a coveted IDEA Award. Meanwhile, LGreceivedthe European Display Achievement 2012-2013 Award from the European Imaging and Sound Association (EISA). And to cap it off, LG’s OLED received Korea’s Good Design President Award in October.

Reviving this old post because it says delivery of the 55EM9700 OLED display is supposed to start the first week of Feb in Korea. Well, it's the first week of Feb. Have we heard from anyone who has received one yet?
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post #5165 of 5877
2/5/13 at 1:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Peterson View Post

Reviving this old post because it says delivery of the 55EM9700 OLED display is supposed to start the first week of Feb in Korea. Well, it's the first week of Feb. Have we heard from anyone who has received one yet?

I haven't heard anything after checking a plethora of sites. I'd love to see if they've shipped yet or not as well.
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post #5166 of 5877
2/5/13 at 4:02pm
Despite some of my outlandishness I believe one thing is clear--

There's talk of many technologies here but none of them are happening. When OLED is at Wal-mart then I'll believe it--I don't think that day will ever happen.

When in fact that day never does happen--OLED dies--and plasma is gone--what will we be left with?

An LCD only world!

I have yet to hear from any of the people around here who are supposedly knowledgeable how this is not going to take place.

It may be a 4K LCD world but it will be an LCD only world.

I challenge ANYONE to predict the year that OLED will be available at Wal-mart and I'll shut up about it!

I know there are many OLED proponents here at this thread and I would love more than anything for an LCD only world not to happen.

So all you OLED lovers and believers and wishers and dreamers please tell me--when will OLED be sold at Wal-mart? If it really is a great product that will be the ultimate PROOF of its greatness as a technology.

TVs are kind of like rocket propulsions systems. Dozens have been proposed and we're still sending 99% of them into space with solid and liquid chemical propulsion systems.

Just because a technology is feasible on paper does not mean that it is feasible in practice.

When OLED can be bought at Wal-mart then that will prove its true feasibility--until then it is like Warp drive is to rockets!
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post #5167 of 5877
2/5/13 at 4:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoozthatat View Post

I haven't heard anything after checking a plethora of sites. I'd love to see if they've shipped yet or not as well.

I would be shocked to learn of another delay.

Oh wait, perhaps not.
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post #5168 of 5877
2/5/13 at 4:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

I would be shocked to learn of another delay.

Oh wait, perhaps not.

Is it wrong to dream? Maybe I am a fool.
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post #5169 of 5877
2/5/13 at 6:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

I challenge ANYONE to predict the year that OLED will be available at Wal-mart and I'll shut up about it!

You promised! OLED will be available at Wal-mart July 17, 2018. Doors open early, hurry.

Now Art, keep your promise. biggrin.gif
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post #5170 of 5877
2/5/13 at 9:58pm
Oh, LG, the Little enGine that couldn't. ;(
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post #5171 of 5877
2/6/13 at 12:46am
Ken Ross: I will keep that promise--I'd like to get one last plasma but I'm beginning to think that the ZT60 MIGHT be plasma's last great effort.

I don't know if they'll improve one last time in 2014 or if they be shutting things down then and that the 2013 ZT60 will be their last great effort before OLED,

If Chinese 4K LCD is good enough it might not make any difference what anyone else makes--the tidal wave may be unstoppable.

I'm scared to death of the world wide cataclysm.

For many the Kuros are only past memories in our dreams.

Only Godzilla can save us now! That's what Gomer Pyle says anyway.
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post #5172 of 5877
2/6/13 at 1:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Inkjet OLED printing has been "just around the corner" since 2001. That's just reality.

As for blues, I don't really know how severe the problem is for Samsung, but (a) I don't think it's a problem for LG's RGBW displays (b) no, you can't stack multiple blues and balance them, it's unrealistically complex and expensive (c) obviously, a straight up breakthrough in blue OLED life is not at all easy, since, that too, has been a problem getting attention for more than a decade (d) don't you wonder if in this patent deal, LG isn't going to get $1 billion or so from Samsung for the RGBW tech? I sure do.

I'm not sure how relevant their mobile OLED's are to larger televisions, but Samsung don't appear to have made any progress to extending the blue lifetime at all. If you search around youtube, you will find screen burn-in examples dating from many years ago, to very recent models. The burn-in is always in the blue color channel only. Not very encouraging. frown.gif

The few reviews of LG's older 15" OLED TV that they shipped around 2010 don't mention anything about image retention or burn-in. Did the older 15" also use WOLED?
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post #5173 of 5877
2/6/13 at 2:47am
LG supposedly shipping in Korea on February 20th and Samsung "launching" on 19th.

http://www.oled-info.com/samsung-set-launch-their-oled-tvs-february-19
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post #5174 of 5877
2/6/13 at 5:47am
Samsung will start its 5" Full-HD AMOLED mass production this month
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post #5175 of 5877
2/6/13 at 9:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ferro View Post

Samsung will start its 5" Full-HD AMOLED mass production this month

They had to do this for any price, otherwise OLED would be going down the drain. Question is what is t h e price, and will this display be used in Samsung high volume products. If this display is made be the (many) millions OLED still have future. BTW, it will be interesting to see if this genuine RGB or pentile design.
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post #5176 of 5877
2/6/13 at 11:29am
Is Galaxy S4 going to have this display? Somehow I thought so, but I'm less sure now.

(This read differently originally.... I meant to say I expected this originally, but then the relatively late production of the display gave me pause... Slacker's post below confirms that it's expected on the S4, which confirms what I'd seen as well.)
Edited by rogo - 2/7/13 at 12:09am
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post #5177 of 5877
2/6/13 at 12:00pm
It will be a huge upset if the S4 doesnt have this display. Every rumor and analyst report has unequivocally said that this is going to be the display for the S4. Samsung is finally changing out the green material so there should a be a ~20% power consumption savings. I havent heard anything about whether they have a new blue.
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post #5178 of 5877
2/6/13 at 12:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

I would be shocked to learn of another delay.

Oh wait, perhaps not.

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post #5179 of 5877
2/6/13 at 3:16pm
Ah, so that's how the rolled up displays will come packaged! smile.gif
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post #5180 of 5877
2/6/13 at 5:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

Despite some of my outlandishness I believe one thing is clear--

There's talk of many technologies here but none of them are happening. When OLED is at Wal-mart then I'll believe it--I don't think that day will ever happen.

When in fact that day never does happen--OLED dies--and plasma is gone--what will we be left with?

An LCD only world!

I have yet to hear from any of the people around here who are supposedly knowledgeable how this is not going to take place.

It may be a 4K LCD world but it will be an LCD only world.

I challenge ANYONE to predict the year that OLED will be available at Wal-mart and I'll shut up about it!

I know there are many OLED proponents here at this thread and I would love more than anything for an LCD only world not to happen.

So all you OLED lovers and believers and wishers and dreamers please tell me--when will OLED be sold at Wal-mart? If it really is a great product that will be the ultimate PROOF of its greatness as a technology.

TVs are kind of like rocket propulsions systems. Dozens have been proposed and we're still sending 99% of them into space with solid and liquid chemical propulsion systems.

Just because a technology is feasible on paper does not mean that it is feasible in practice.

When OLED can be bought at Wal-mart then that will prove its true feasibility--until then it is like Warp drive is to rockets!

do you seriously have to remind us each and every week about your cold sweat lcd world armageddon dreams?!? i swear everytime i see artwood its followed by the same paranoid post. you obviously cant see oled at walmart because walmart doesent sell 12 thousand dollar tvs. i also find it hard to believe someone who buys their tv's from walmart is worried about a supposed "lcd world". im just kidding dude, i know you dont buy your tv's from walmart, but seriously, we can do without all the anti plasma haikus every week.
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post #5181 of 5877
2/6/13 at 7:46pm
^OLEDs aren't going to drop below $12k ever? wink.gif
Edited by vinnie97 - 2/6/13 at 7:52pm
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post #5182 of 5877
2/7/13 at 6:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

^OLEDs aren't going to drop below $12k ever? wink.gif

Now if that were true say goodby to OLED.Economy could never support it.
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post #5183 of 5877
2/7/13 at 12:48pm
To add more fuel to the fire, we eventually need OLED's capable of 1 millisecond impulse lengths for CRT-quality motion without motion interpolation, for playing console video games and computer games without motion blur at all, AND without input lag of interpolation. That requires OLED that's 16x brighter than a sample-and-hold. (1ms impulses versus 16.7ms sample-and-hold).

Ideally, native 120 Hz refresh is better, and that will only require 8x brighter (1ms impulses versus 8.33ms sample-and-hold) to have the same motion clarity as CRT without motion interpolation, and without input lag.

FWIW, PS Vita is a sample-and-hold OLED.
Edited by Mark Rejhon - 2/7/13 at 12:55pm
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post #5184 of 5877
2/7/13 at 1:59pm
I don't think it's paranoid to fear an all LCD world.

Ask any of the supposed expert reviewers and they're not for LCD.

Ask anyone if Plasma is on the way out and most will say yes.

Ask anyone if OLED is just around the corner at comparatively reasonable prices and large sizes and most everyone will say no.

What I point out here repeatedly is the dirty little secret that the industry doesn't want you to know and that is that we're heading towards an all LCD substandard world.

Wishing that wasn't the case isn't going to make it true.

What surprises me is all the plasma posters here at AVS who said for year after year how plasma was superior to LCD now you don't hear from anymore or they spout the new gospel that substandard LCD is now acceptable.

Now some people might believe that all of those people changed--I think most just joined the video display manufacturing sales force.

Ask the people at the plasma forum how many of them are looking forward to an all LCD world.

Ask the people at the LCD forum if they are looking forward to ANYTHING quality wise.

The best thing about OLED is that it keeps video picture quality fans' minds from where the state of the art is heading.
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post #5185 of 5877
2/7/13 at 2:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

What I point out here repeatedly is

Ok, you're on record.
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post #5186 of 5877
2/7/13 at 2:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

What surprises me is all the plasma posters here at AVS who said for year after year how plasma was superior to LCD now you don't hear from anymore or they spout the new gospel that substandard LCD is now acceptable.

Not me. I've only owned two flat screens, both plasmas, the second purchased last year (or end of year before, I can't remember) and I plan on keeping it until something better comes along. I have no idea what that may be, which is why I'm following these threads - to much tech to catch up on in a short time if I needed to do that.
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post #5187 of 5877
2/7/13 at 2:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

^OLEDs aren't going to drop below $12k ever? wink.gif

Of course it will. But the perspective of what were looking at is that oled needs to be a doorbuster on black friday to coexist on the shelf next to other tv techs. thats not the case. you didnt see kuros sold at walmart but they were atleast within someones price range who worked for a company as opposed to owning it. lets let the early stages be the early stages and stop trying to visualize what the end is going to look like. early plasmas were also ridiculously overpriced when they entered the market and they had and are still having a good run.

and artwood. its not that i dont agree with you, just not completely. its that you basically say the same thing with different words in alot of your posts. we get the point. thanks.
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post #5188 of 5877
2/7/13 at 2:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

I don't think it's paranoid to fear an all LCD world.

Ask any of the supposed expert reviewers and they're not for LCD.

Ask anyone if Plasma is on the way out and most will say yes.

Ask anyone if OLED is just around the corner at comparatively reasonable prices and large sizes and most everyone will say no.

What I point out here repeatedly is the dirty little secret that the industry doesn't want you to know and that is that we're heading towards an all LCD substandard world.

Wishing that wasn't the case isn't going to make it true.

What surprises me is all the plasma posters here at AVS who said for year after year how plasma was superior to LCD now you don't hear from anymore or they spout the new gospel that substandard LCD is now acceptable.

Now some people might believe that all of those people changed--I think most just joined the video display manufacturing sales force.

Ask the people at the plasma forum how many of them are looking forward to an all LCD world.

Ask the people at the LCD forum if they are looking forward to ANYTHING quality wise.

The best thing about OLED is that it keeps video picture quality fans' minds from where the state of the art is heading.

well if you do have to end up buying an led or lcd because thats all there is, just make sure your front and center and your significant other sits off center. im sure she could give a rats behind about off angle axis viewing. lol
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post #5189 of 5877
2/7/13 at 7:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post


What surprises me is all the plasma posters here at AVS who said for year after year how plasma was superior to LCD now you don't hear from anymore or they spout the new gospel that substandard LCD is now acceptable.

Art, I'm not sure why you continue to be surprised. You apparently can't grasp the concept that some plasma owners changed because the nature of the PQ of the best LED/LCDs changed. It's as simple as that. This is not rocket science. I am not talking about substandard LCDs, there are still plenty of those. Believe it or not Art, there are also still plenty of substandard plasmas. Would you be happier if the world was taken over by substandard plasmas with lousy black levels and serious IR?

Did you ever read the many reviews on the Sharp Elites? Some reviewers declared them to be the best consumer displays ever. So why wouldn't a former plasma owner who agrees, change allegiance? This doesn't lessen the PQ of plasmas, but rather gives a clear alternative to plasma with little in the way of sacrifice, save viewing angles.

When I can achieve better black levels than the Kuro I owned, far brighter whites and overall full-screen brightness, zero IR, zero fear of burn-in (admittedly less of an issue than it had been with plasmas) among other benefits and only give back (IMO) viewing angles, why would I not be happier? There are many former Kuro owners who now own the Elites and feel the same. There are other LED/LCDs from Samsung & Sony that have attained excellent PQ and have also gotten great reviews from professional reviewers.

Once you finally realize that the LED/LCD technology is not static and great strides have been made in PQ, you'll stop feeling paranoid and possibly far less convinced we have all been 'paid off' by some shadowy underworld LCD Godfather.

Oh, BTW, you've broken your promise to stop your endless LCD bashing...but I think we all expected that. rolleyes.gif
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post #5190 of 5877
2/7/13 at 10:58pm
^But there are also many current Kuro owners who weren't wowed enough by the Sharp panels to switch. wink.gif Aside from the poor viewing angles (and the inaccurate color reproduction), I don't like the voodoo being employed to create those deeper blacks, which adds a new distracting artifact, that being blooming. Maybe it's minor enough to keep you satisfied, but it's not a tradeoff I'd like to make.
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