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OLED TVs: Technology Advancements Thread - Page 240

post #7171 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by navychop View Post

FIFY.

 

I understand your point, but no, it's the case that there is a lot going on.  Whether or not it's actually shipping doesn't mean that it isn't being manufactured and that it isn't a flurry of technology happening for real.  And a lot of it is shipping, even if much of it isn't ending up covering the wall of best buy.

 

From my perspective, I think this is right, but please feel free to correct:

  1. 4K - Shipping
  2. w/ HDMI 2.0 - Shipping (finally)
  3. IGZO - unclear to me
  4. OLED - Shipping (kinda)
  5. Curved - Shipping (unfortunately)
  6. Passive 3D adoptions (from active) - Shipping
  7. Quantum Dots as emissive pixel technology - Not Shipping
  8. Quantum Dots - Shipping (as RGB light source only, for Triluminus LCD)
  9. Truly non-reflective surfaces - Not shipping

 

A lot of stuff IMO.

post #7172 of 9447
Quote:
3. IGZO - unclear to me

4K IGZO displays are shipping, the Sharp PN-K321 and the ASUS PQ321Q are both examples of such displays.
post #7173 of 9447
Samsung says their OLED TV will receive the Best New Product Award at the upcoming Korea Electronics Show in October.

http://www.koreaittimes.com/story/31966/samsung-uhd-curved-oled-tvs-win-innovation-awards-kes
post #7174 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubetwister View Post

[QUOTE]http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1346797220

TWO SAMSUNG OLED-TVS STOLEN AT IFA
By Rasmus Larsen (@flatpanels)
05 Sep 2012 More Sharing Services Share on facebook Share on twitter Share on email Share on print



"Samsung believes that someone will try to copy the technology."


I think Samsung has some experience in these matters. biggrin.gif
post #7175 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

I understand your point, but no, it's the case that there is a lot going on.  Whether or not it's actually shipping doesn't mean that it isn't being manufactured and that it isn't a flurry of technology happening for real.  And a lot of it is shipping, even if much of it isn't ending up covering the wall of best buy.

From my perspective, I think this is right, but please feel free to correct:
  1. 4K - Shipping
  2. w/ HDMI 2.0 - Shipping (finally)
  3. IGZO - unclear to me
  4. OLED - Shipping (kinda)
  5. Curved - Shipping (unfortunately)
  6. Passive 3D adoptions (from active) - Shipping
  7. Quantum Dots as emissive pixel technology - Not Shipping
  8. Quantum Dots - Shipping (as RGB light source only, for Triluminus LCD)
  9. Truly non-reflective surfaces - Not shipping

A lot of stuff IMO.

Yes. Just not a lot of OLED stuff, IMHO.
post #7176 of 9447
post #7177 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

Not yet posted? http://www.fujifilm.com/news/n130926_01.html
:

15μm diameter OLED dots were arrayed with 20μm pitch... - You beast, you are dreaming about gigapixel displays biggrin.gif
post #7178 of 9447
what we need is someone who can find a blue that lasts 30,000 half life
post #7179 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by filmoreXXX View Post

what we need is someone who can find a blue that lasts 30,000 half life

 

Or just stack 5 of them so that it no longer matters.

post #7180 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Or just stack 5 of them so that it no longer matters.

As one fails, it switches down to the next one. By the time you get to #3, you'll probably be back into the market to make your next purchase.
post #7181 of 9447
I finally had the opportunity to check out the new Sammy OLED for 2 1/2 hours today at VE. Thanks Robert! The set was in a darkened space with only a tiny bit of light entering the room. The room was quite dark. The set was not calibrated and was basically in out of the box mode with the exception that it was placed into movie mode with the blur settings disabled. As expected, the blacks on this set are superb, a shade or 2 lower than on my D-Nice adjusted 141 which has great blacks. The blacks here are better and are great. However, there is blooming to report which is noticeable around white objects against a black background. For example, when I popped in the Oblivion disc, a black screen comes up with a white Universal logo. A few inches around the logo are grey not black, a bit irregular in shape but a similar shape as the Universal logo.I have this a bit on the 141 too. The tv is really bright, even with the cell light dialed down to 0. With the black blacks and brightness of the picture, you are left with a very dynamic image, unlike anything I have ever seen. However, there were a few things I witnessed that I didn't like. The first is the curve. It really distorts the picture. Black bars at the top and bottom curve with the screen. It is slight but IMHO, a step backwards. The picture itself looks slightly bowed in. I do not like that at all. The screen also leans back and can't be adjusted unless you shim up the base, which make the set unstable. Because of the screen leaning back, it really needs to be at eye level, with one's eyes right in the middle of the screen. If you look up at the screen or down, you get a color shift. An example would be a black and white image. Standing up, the top part of the screen was fine. However, the bottom half would be awash in green and red blotches, with the reverse if you are looking up at the screen. I noticed the same issue when seated at either side of the set outside the frame. This OLED does not retain its image like a plasma does during off axis viewing. I also detected another slight abnormality due to the screen's curve. On 4x3 material, the black bars on the side tended to flare out ever so slightly as they reached the bottom on the screen. Out of the box, the set was a bit red. This was really noticeable on From Here to Eternity which was really red. I am sure a calibration will fix that. Curiously, a black and white image from Paul McCartney's KIsses LIve did not look as red except when an image came up from a black screen. When the image switched, faces had a red tint coming out of a full black screen. I am really not sure why that would be the case. With the motion circuitry disabled, some motion blur was evident. Turned on and kicked up 2 notches, this improved totally without any artifacts. As dynamic as the image was, I found the detail not to be fantastic, with the image looking a bit soft. I am sure that a proper calibration would fix that. Looking at the pixels, the blue pixels are twice the size as the red and green. I was also told that the voltage used on the blue pixels is about half as that on the others. As a result, the set is said the reach half brightness in only 30,000 hours, which is quite short IMHO. How well the blue pixel will wear is another matter. However, a real effort has been made to minimize the chance that that would happen. Pixel orbiter was enabled. I saw no evidence at all of any image retention, let alone burn in. On a black screen, I noticed no stuck pixels at all. Other than the issues noted above, this set does deliver a great image and is a hint of the future of TV. Personally, I want a flat wall mountable one that must be at a minimum 65". 70" would be about perfect for me along with a much lower price. Maybe in 3 years?
post #7182 of 9447
"Personally, I want a flat wall mountable one that must be at a minimum 65". 70" would be about perfect for me along with a much lower price. Maybe in 3 years?"

Yeah, that's pretty much the set all of us want.

2016 the soonest, 2018 on the outside?

Mine has to have 4K; I'm going to expect it to deliver 5+ years of lack of purchase regret. I got 6 from my previous plasma. The current one is in year 2.... It's just too much of a pain to re-integrate a new TV and basically it's not a device that delivers enough change to justify being replaced more often. I used to, for example, replace computers annually. Now, I go 3ish years between purchases. I expect my current Windows machine will go 5+...

Back to the topic at hand, it would be interesting to see if OLED can hit some interesting milestones in 2014.

* Shipping 100K units
* Falling another 30% in price
* Delivering flat panels (because that will signal the technology is selling on its own merits, not gimmickry)
post #7183 of 9447
I still have my 2002 Panny 42" EDTV plasma in the bedroom. The family room has my 50" 7UY both of which are going quite strong and still look great. My 141 is 4 years old and I want to get another few years on that one too. About than, I will be ready for another set. I keep my stuff for a long time. You should see how old some of my 2 channel stuff is.
post #7184 of 9447
JWhip, excellent review. Look for non curved 4K OLED at CES, only 13 more weeks.
post #7185 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

Not yet posted? http://www.fujifilm.com/news/n130926_01.html

Photolithography on a 55" scale?
post #7186 of 9447
JWhip, did Robert let you play with the settings? I'm concerned about the blooming you reported. Isn't blooming something you can control in the basic setup menu?

Also, how far back did you have to move for the OLED pixels to disappear? I think at 7 feet, I was still able to see them.
post #7187 of 9447
I didn't see the pixels at our seats which were 7 feet from the screen, which was too close for me. I can't imagine ever sitting that close to any display. As for the settings, we reduced the cell light to 0 and noticed no change in the blooming. Perhaps when the set is calibrated, it will be eliminated. We will see as I will be going back up to check once it is calibrated. It is my understanding that Robert is keeping this set for display. I will report back once it is. We will be comparing it to a fully calibrated 500M.
post #7188 of 9447
Here is the flat OLED-TV by LG. Without speakers it costs 7999 EUR. With canvas speakers 8999 EUR. Same as the curved one.

http://www.lg.com/nl/televisies/lg-55EA8809-gallery-oled-tv
post #7189 of 9447
I am curious to know how many on the forum actually purchased an OLED and if so which did you choose LG or Samsung
post #7190 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhip View Post

I didn't see the pixels at our seats which were 7 feet from the screen, which was too close for me. I can't imagine ever sitting that close to any display. As for the settings, we reduced the cell light to 0 and noticed no change in the blooming. Perhaps when the set is calibrated, it will be eliminated. We will see as I will be going back up to check once it is calibrated. It is my understanding that Robert is keeping this set for display. I will report back once it is. We will be comparing it to a fully calibrated 500M.

I went by VE this morning and watched Adele and Batman Begins for a few minutes. You're right, I can't see the pixels either at 7 feet.

On the Adele disc I could see a light-gray around the microphone she was holding, but the mic itself was not hazy. I saw this glow around other objects, too. It might be the way the video was shot; I didn't see this on Batman. This might be different from the blooming that you mentioned, where the white area of an image is spilling out into the black areas.

Shadow detail on Batman always bothers me. Seems it's overly dark on all sets, this one included.

The curve of the screen is interesting. With the TV at the right level, I'm wasn't as aware, or should I say distracted, by any picture distortion caused by the curve. The picture looks awesome, not Ultra HD awesome, just 1080p awesome, and that's good enough for me, until the industry can come up with real 4K stuff. After watching the Samsung a little longer, I went into a BestBuy to buy Avatar in 3D and sat in the magnolia section, in front of the Sony 65" ultra-HD LCD with the side mounted speakers. I sat in one of the two seats, which put me slightly off axis. After just having been with the OLED, I discovered that I was gazing more at the center of the screen and the edge closest to me. The far edge seemed to extend beyond my comfort zone and I realized I wasn't paying as much attention to that part of the screen. With the curved sceen, I felt...yes...more immersed in the picture, and Robert has the same two-seat arrange in his store. I think I'm liking the curved screen more, but that's just me.
post #7191 of 9447
Did you notice the color issues off axis as I described in my mini review? I have the Adele disc and have not noticed what you described on my 141. I guess the curve is a matter of taste, just like blondes vs, brunettes. I hate it. I also don't like the size of the screen. Just too small, especially at that price. My philosophy on sets is when I replace them, I go bigger and move the older ones to another room. I would consider a 55" for my family room, at maybe 2 grand. I also think I will hold out for 4k. I can wait 3 more years!
post #7192 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

After just having been with the OLED, I discovered that I was gazing more at the center of the screen and the edge closest to me. The far edge seemed to extend beyond my comfort zone and I realized I wasn't paying as much attention to that part of the screen. With the curved sceen, I felt...yes...more immersed in the picture, and Robert has the same two-seat arrange in his store. I think I'm liking the curved screen more, but that's just me.

Even if I buy this (and I personally don't), it's still a dumb way to sell TVs. Most people don't just sit with 1-2 people directly centered in front of the television. It's just not the way things work out more often than not. The idea that we are benefiting as consumers from narrowing the viewing area on a TV that finally solves the single worst problem of LCDs is pretty ridiculous.

I look forward to the death of curved.

(Also, I can't imagine finding a TV as small as 55 inches immersive in any way.)
post #7193 of 9447
I agree, 55" is NOT immersive. Viewing this set at 7 feet was not immersive in the least.
post #7194 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhip View Post

I agree, 55" is NOT immersive. Viewing this set at 7 feet was not immersive in the least.
Well that's not surprising, it only gives you a 32 degree FoV. You need to be about 4.5ft from a 55" display for an immersive view. 65" is more appropriate for 7ft.
post #7195 of 9447
I would never sit 4.5 feet from any TV at any size. Frankly, 7 feet from a 65" is too close for me as well. Just not my thing.
post #7196 of 9447
Like JWip said, it's a matter of taste, which you prefer. I think the real issue is price. If this Sammy were under two thousand, everyone would be all over it. The curved screen is simply an excuse to say away.

Regarding size, every time I look at my 50" plasma, I am so happy I got it, the 65" would look ridiculous in my apartment. The 55" OLED will fit perfectly on my stand, and the Connect One box is so terrific. I hate reaching behind the set so much that I never connect anything. Finally, I get to reconnect my Toshiba HD DVDplayer, without having to route it through my AVR.

I will comment on one thing, I think the real joke here is 4k. I have sat in the store many times looking at Spiderman on the 4k LCD displays, and nothing about this television appeals to me. The picture looks sharp but absolutely flat (no pun) and lifeless. I never, never considered buying this thing. In contrast, the minute I saw the OLED I knew it was something special. I just hope the set can last a few years. Anyway, I paid for the pretection plan, which helps me sleep.
post #7197 of 9447
Once you receive it from Robert, start an owners thread. The set does have a lot going for it, with the blacks and brightness. It is an eye catcher to be sure. The price, not so much and I would never buy a 1st gen product. Too many issues I would like sorted out. I figure maybe in 2 years, most likely 3 for me. Enjoy the set and keep posting your impressions over time. And by all means, have it calibrated.
post #7198 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhip View Post

I would never sit 4.5 feet from any TV at any size.
Which is why larger sizes exist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhip View Post

Frankly, 7 feet from a 65" is too close for me as well. Just not my thing.
Well different people probably find different viewing angles to be immersive or not. For me it starts about 50 degree FoV.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

Regarding size, every time I look at my 50" plasma, I am so happy I got it, the 65" would look ridiculous in my apartment. The 55" OLED will fit perfectly on my stand, and the Connect One box is so terrific.
This is why, as much as I want the improvements OLED brings, I think my next upgrade will be a projector. While I would like a bigger image, I don't want a bigger display in my home.
My current display is good enough that there's little reason to upgrade it other than resolution. A 1080p OLED would be better, but not so much that it justifies the additional cost - at least not in the near future while they are still sold at premium prices.
And I don't see 55" or smaller OLED displays with 4K resolutions, using a standard RGB subpixel layout (none of the large displays are yet) with enough lifespan or resistance to burn-in that makes them suitable as a monitor and not just a television, at an affordable price any time soon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

I will comment on one thing, I think the real joke here is 4k. I have sat in the store many times looking at Spiderman on the 4k LCD displays, and nothing about this television appeals to me. The picture looks sharp but absolutely flat (no pun) and lifeless. I never, never considered buying this thing. In contrast, the minute I saw the OLED I knew it was something special. I just hope the set can last a few years. Anyway, I paid for the pretection plan, which helps me sleep.
That's not really due to 4K, but the fact that it's an Edge-lit LED display.
post #7199 of 9447
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhip View Post

Once you receive it from Robert, start an owners thread. The set does have a lot going for it, with the blacks and brightness. It is an eye catcher to be sure. The price, not so much and I would never buy a 1st gen product. Too many issues I would like sorted out. I figure maybe in 2 years, most likely 3 for me. Enjoy the set and keep posting your impressions over time. And by all means, have it calibrated.

What, and face an onslaught of ridicule and rage. The guy who starts the Samsung Curved OLED thread will be the most hated member in AVS history.

Oh, what the f..k.--OK.
post #7200 of 9447
No doubt. All the haters and trolls who can't afford it will come out of the woodwork and start criticizing it. There's no way to avoid that I'm afraid.
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