Dynaudio Owner's Thread - Page 596

Hi Guys, To gn77b, Was your listening experience of Dyns only at a Consumer or industry show? Also Sonus Faber Cremonas use a Ring radiating tweeter. As of a year and half ago, the Cremonas sold for $12,800.00 USD retail. Since then, I've seen them at the retailer where I once worked for $11,500 to $12,000 retail USD. A nice sounding speaker if that's your thing. I would have to describe them at system dependent. Some have even described them as a little too polite. Again, if that's your thing, great! However, I own C2s (Dynaudio Confidence Series) and I love them! After aproximately four years of listening to Cremonas, I still chose Dynaudio C2s because I found my sound. They do all of the things that are important to me correctly and with refinement. For me, they really sitr the emotions. Which speakers do you use?

Sparks81

Has anyone tried pairing a sub from Rhythmic Audio with their Dyn's. They use 'direct servo' drivers, something I have no experience with. The amp on my Dub 500 has given me nothing but problems so I feel like it's time for a change.

What is the amp on your Sub500 doing. I had mine repaired under warranty three times before it ended up right (it had a 5 yr warranty). The amp/electronics kept dying. It puzzled my dealer to no end. Since then (i.e. that last 4 years or so) it's been fine.

I believe that Intamin has dual Rhythmik D15-SE subs, maybe he'll check in here soon.
Edited by callas01 - 11/18/12 at 8:05am

Thanks for the information.

I'm in the LA area. My local Dynaudio dealer closed its doors several years ago so I'll have to find a new dealer. I hope to audition the Sierra-1s in San Clemente.

if you want to call my living room a consumer or industry show then yes, my experience with Dyns is limited to those.
I use the Dynaudio Confidence 3 but that's an out production model and not so common. in fact I doubt anyone else here ever listened to them. anyway, this (pointless, IMO) SF vs Dyn thing started because I wrote that I disagree with Dynaudio's pricing for replacement drivers. but like someone else already said, maybe we should just drop it.

anyway, since we discussed about profit margins, I accidentally found an interview with Spectral owners and here's a quote:
"We have a multiplier of three-to-one, and five-to-one is typical in the high-end industry. And rightly so."

here's the whole interview: http://www.spectralaudio.com/TAS_%20Interview.pdf

and since the subject was opened, I happen to know a quy who owns a small local audio company and I know he applies smaller profit margins. II think you'll find smaller (1-2, 1-3) profit margins only with small companies that don't resort to distributors and don't advertise (which costs). unfortunately he also told me that it's impossible to make a living out of audio.
Edited by gn77b - 11/19/12 at 12:41am

OK. You C1/C2 owners, tell me what you think.

I'm at around 65-80 hours on my Esotar2 tweeter break in. They have been getting ever better, but for about the last few hours that seem to have taken a step backward. They are sounding a bit thinner and harsher than they did earlier this weekend. Maybe a little like they did in the first few hours. It seems to have happened suddenly, not gradually. Is that normal?

Dean you are just under what I noticed with my original C1's (both pairs). I mean going from getting a little better to horrible. The other thing I noticed was that around 150 - 200 hrs they almost snapped back. For my C1's they took 350 - 400 hrs to stop getting better after the 200 mark. For the C1's was it just the tweeter ????? I don't know.

So it sounds like my experience so far matches yours?

I am playing Brahm's Symphony No. 4 now and it is starting to go back to getting better, and that's just from the first movement to the third. Now the fourth is playing is it sound fantastic. The strings are sounding smoother and sweeter once again, and I am hearing fuller midrange. These tweeters are bi-polar.
Edited by RaceTripper - 11/19/12 at 6:10pm

Again it was horrible with the C1's during that 150 hr mark. There may be a crossover burn in along with woofer which may explain the hrs I've heard.

There are excellent deals on the new focus series listed on Audiogon: a new pair of focus 160 at nearly 50% off; just a heads up for those that are looking.
Edited by alconzo - 11/20/12 at 5:28pm

I use Sunny Components in Covina, hes a very good guy.

Your probably right about not keeping the Studio's if I had brought them home to replace the Ascends. The Ascends with the Nrt tweeter fall somewhere in between the Focus 110's and the Studio 20 v5, the Digms being the brightest and the 110's being the warmest out of the trio. Each one has their own strengths and weaknesses with the Dyn's slightly edging out the others as the ones I would want to live with long term.

 

CD is also right about the Sierra 1's being over hyped, while they're good speakers in their own right the performance just isn't world beating as others may claim. Maybe if I lived in the US and didn't have to pay extra fees to import them to Canada I might feel differently but at the price I paid for them with the Nrt tweeter upgrade they fall into a much more competitive price category. The competition isn't head and shoulders above them but still comes out slightly ahead IMO.

quote name="RaceTripper" url="/t/686371/dynaudio-owners-thread/17850#post_22605283"]OK. You C1/C2 owners, tell me what you think.
I'm at around 65-80 hours on my Esotar2 tweeter break in. They have been getting ever better, but for about the last few hours that seem to have taken a step backward. They are sounding a bit thinner and harsher than they did earlier thi

s weekend. Maybe a little like they did in the first few hours. It seems to have happened suddenly, not gradually. Is that normal?[/quote]

Race Tripper, When I set up my C2s for the first time, things sounded somewhat constricted...which I'm told is normal for a speaker that has never been played before. At the end of the first 100 hrs, it seemed as though the sound was opening up, becoming more fluid, smoother, with wider soundstage. As I listened over the following days, it then seemed like the sound characteristics reverted back to the quality when the C2s were first connected for the first time...almost cold and without emotion...almost! Keep in mind, to me, a Dynaudio still sounds good regardless of how broken-in it is. It just may not sound it's best when not run-in totally.

So, I would have to say that what you are experiiencing is normal...IMO. You know, for what it's worth, I kind of like your idea of utilizing the Esotar2s in your S3.4s. I've often wondered, what it would be like to have Confidence sound in a smaller floor standing model. I'm curious to hear your results.

sparks81

I have no doubt this is a huge upgrade to the S3.4s. I am already hearing the benefit, especially with classical music. With the stock S3.4 jazz sounded great, but I still thought there was something missing when I play classical. I don't feel that way now. That is particularly evident when I play symphonies. It's just so open and full bodied. I feel like I'm in a concert hall. Right now I am playing Alfred Brendel performing Beethoven piano sonatas and I really get a sense the piano is right here in the room with me. And yet, the speakers don't overwhelm my smallish 11x17 room.

I guess today is a good day with the Esotar2. I've been playing through my old set of Alfred Brendel playing Beethoven sonatas. This is a box set of analog LPs (13) on Philips that I bought 25-30 yrs ago, and have not played in a long time.

OMG!!! I've never heard piano sound so good on a stereo system. It is so realistic and dynamic. I swear I can just about sense the vibrations of the piano frame and see Brendel's fingers flying across the keyboard. This is a recording in particular that I think really benefits from the low end grunt and finesse of the Naim NAP 250-2.

Dean If like my original C1's they will get just a hair better every day for the next few days. That's assuming they have already hit the bottom of the good to bad to good/great sound Keep us informed because I'm still trying to figure out the min of 200 hrs before the C1's got to the the rise of great sound Although I'm starting to think it was the combination of the tweeter - woofer and the crossover breaking in. After all your other drivers and crossover were already broken in.
George

I totally agree that you were dealing with break-in of more components. I"m dealing with just the tweeters. It's funny as sometimes the high end of the range seems to get worse independently of the lower range (mids) of the tweeter. I think when the mids are off is when I think the speakers sound unbalanced and thin, and when the high range is off when I think they sound a bit screechy. Right now it all seems to be together and sounding great. I'm now listening to an old Decca recording of Schubert's Octet (for string quartet plus double bass, horn, clarinet, bassoon). I really like what I am hearing. This sounds nothing like my old Contours anymore. I no longer have this feeling of a veil over the sound with some classical music. That is now gone.

I briefly auditioned the Focal Chorus 706Vs, 807Ws, and Dynaudio DM 2/6s (the only Dynaudio monitors they carried) at a local dealer today. The placement (very close to the wall and not toed-in) and the room (all centerblock walls) were horrible and the equipment (Cambridge Audio integrated amp and a Denon DVD player) wasn't great. The noise floor was quite high too. I know these speakers could all sound much better, but at least I got a sampling of their sound.

The Focal 807W definitely sounded more refined and detailed than the 706V, but the two speakers shared very similar characteristics. Build quality of the Focals was very impressive as was the bass and smooth midrange. The Focals gave off a wider and taller soundstage than the Dynaudios, but a lot of this could have to do with them being significantly larger speakers than the DM 2/6s. Soundstage depth was poor for all speakers, but I think this had more to do with them being about a foot from the back wall than anything. The Focals were significantly more efficient and there was an excitement about them that was appealing, but the highs were way too prominent for my tastes. The recordings I brought were very high quality and I was beginning to get listening fatigue after a very short while, so I'd hate to think what the Focals would sound like with average recorded music and movies, which are usually too bright. Also, from my experience, Cambridge Audio and Denon are fairly warm electronics. The Dynaudios seemed very neutral and natural throughout the spectrum. They lacked some of the Focal's excitement, but seemed more detailed with better imaging. Overall they were a pleasure to listen to.

I'll go to Sunny's and audition the DM 2/6s, 2/7s, the Excite X12s, and maybe the Focus series if they have them there. I want to like the Focals, but I just don't think they are going to work for me, given their, to my ears, exaggerated highs.

I know that he has the some of the DMs and most of the Excites and the Focus. Last time I was there he had the DM3/7s, X16s, X32s and X36s along with the Focus 160s, 260s and 380s. He's told me he has the 2/6s in the past but its been a while since Ive asked, was looking at those for surrounds, but skipped that idea for the 160s as mains, will have to revisit the 2/6s later. Like I said earlier, I heard the Focals for a song or two, so it wasnt the full time you were able too. The X12s and 2/6s are both mini monitors, so the much larger Focals should sound bigger. I think tho you might be surprised by the Excites overall performance, check out the X16s, they should sound larger like the Focals did and with the imaging and detail(better detail) then what you got from the DMs. The 160s are incredible, but they are twice the price, however I felt they were worth the upgrade.

Sunil is a good guy. A bit dry, but very knowledgable and helpful. Tell him Steve Callahan sent you and to take care of you.
Edited by callas01 - 11/21/12 at 10:43pm

Hi RaceTripper, I'm glad u are enjoying the new tweeters. Have you ever listened to classical music on the "Reference Recording" lable? I purchased 2 CDs from them. The quality of the recordings were stunning! If ever you get a chance, if you haven't already, try one. I think you'll enjoy it.

Sparks81

Happy Thanksgiving Dyn guys. Well, most of you anyway.

I am aware of the Reference Recordings label, but don't have any titles. While I have about 3000 classical and jazz LPs, they are mostly regular releases from decades ago. It's only in the last two years that I have been buying high end remasters/reissues (i.e. audiophile pressings), when I started back into two-channel.

I looked at Acoustic Sounds and I didn't see any music on Reference Recordings I want to get, except for a pricey used record.

Happy Thanksgiving to all!

Don't tempt me with the Focus series! I haven't heard any speakers in the Focus line, but the 380s look very tempting and my Classe stereo amp would be a good match with them. I've thought about combining my separate stereo and home theater systems into one. It would take up less real estate and my Classe stereo preamp has a pass through so I could integrate the two systems while maintaining the purity of the stereo system. My stereo speakers are over a decade old, too.

How is the Focus center? The one thing that's always bothered me about Dynaudio centers is that, the massive Evidence excepted, they are all two-way and the drivers are on the small side compared to the main speakers. This is why I was thinking of going with five identical DM or Excite mini monitors. If I were to go all out on the Focus series, I would probably go for 380s up front and either the Focus center or a single 160. I know the DM series speakers are available individually but what about the Excite and the Focus series?

I heard the 380s and they were great, but they'll want some room to play. Honestly I was nervous that the focus was gonna be more then the performance was worth, but boy was I wrong. I had the focus 200C for a short time in my room, right now I still have the X22 from the excite line. I'm in no hurry to change the center channel, it performs very well even tho its small. Now the focus center I borrowed from a friend was bigger sounding and better detail. However in my room at my seated distance the X22 is great. Eventually I'll upgrade to the focus center.

OK guys; the time has come. Not that people follow my every movement, like it's somehow important; but I think at least some of you are aware that I have been contemplating selling my C1 Sigs.

To this point, I've tried to take a very low-key and non-aggressive stance; I floated an "interest check", and then turned it into a full-fledged for-sale ad on another forum (that I've since been told, only mostly cares about Salk and Selah speakers, lol). The idea was...I didn't really want to sell, until I had time to wrap my mind around it. Well, as I lead with...that time has come.

Let's not do the whole "why" thing; or try to talk me out of it. At least not out in public like this; I might be an ego-maniac, but not megalomaniacal (meaning, you're welcome to PM me if you like...as you are always, with anything related to audio). And let's not misunderstand, that I think the C1s are anything but the world-class monitors, and best speakers I've ever owned...that I've previously touted them to be. This is a sea-change; this is about "down-sizing"...and to a certain extent, just having been with the fine Dynaudio sound for the last 6 years and wanting to spread out a bit. You'll see in the ad, I've decided to lower my previous asking price...and sell without the Stand4s; because if Dyn ever updates that S1.4, I might be right back in the club!

Which is not to say, that just because I'll cease to be a Dyn owner...in the present; that I'll stop posting to the thread. So please...don't not buy them, where you would have otherwise, just because you'll miss my posts (OTOH...they probably will become less-frequent, and shorter in length; so maybe...if for no other reason...there's all the incentive you need to buy )

Here's the ad http://www.avsforum.com/t/1441182/dynaudio-confidence-c1-signature-gloss-bordeaux-w-o-stands. As I said; floating the sale elsewhere, was the least-aggressive move I could make. This is more-so...and I'd like to see them go to a friend or Dyn enthusiast; so yes...there is a discount to be had, within the thread! The next move...which we'll call less about being aggressive, and more desperate; is to full-out list them on Audio-goner.

Please; don't let it come to that! lol

Good luck with the sale CD. That's a great price for them.

Thanks Dean; I think so too. Tell all your friends at AA

Sounds like you're getting on nicely with your upgrade?

Why not post it on AA?

Yeah, the upgrade is a winner. I am really enjoying the system and now feel like I got that last little bit I was missing. When playing classical I kept thinking the sound need to be a bit more open and expansive. This gave me that and then some. And I still have improvement to come as they get more hours on them. I'm very happy with this.

You gotta pay...to post (classifieds).

I have to tell ya; I feared the worst. I was just worried your cross-over wouldn't be exactly right; and that 100-200Hz difference, might have more impact than you thought. I'm happy to have been wrong, lol.

I agree, the Esotar(2) is a special tweeter; it's extended, airy, and delicate when you want it to be; it sizzles, without ever being fatiguing...when it has to (I was just telling someone, I think Dynaudio are the best hi-end Rock speakers I've ever heard).