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Don't dump your CRT RPTV! - Page 358

post #10711 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob View Post

This is what happens when your set cannot sync up to the signal properly. It is usually caused by the signal being sent out in 1080p to a 1080i-max set.

Most bluray players these days are designed for the newest of the new displays, meaning they default their Auto output settings to send out 1080p. 1080p was not prevalent when our sets were designed and will not work with our CRT sets, which need 1080i to look their best. The difference between 1080i and 1080p is nominal at best and takes the likes of an overhead projector to see the difference, and would make no relevant difference in our viewing of today's HD, whether from HD discs or broadcast. Be that as it may, 1080i is the max our sets can take in and properly display.

The cure is to set your bluray or HD-DVD player to go up to, but no higher than, 1080i. You may need to send out an S video or composite signal to do this - to one of the analog inputs on your display, to be able to see the menu for this setup on your disc player and alter it.


BTW, the bleariness in this pic - the grayness in what should be crystal clear blacks and the huge glow around the bright spot in the middle - shows that your set is in dire need of optics cleaning. Contact me directly if you want to get it done right.

Don't be a cowboy out there, guys, on this optics cleaning operation especially. Damage to your optics from the wrong methods and/or materials is instant and permanent. And irreversible.


Splatee -

My suggestion is to honor the fact that you got this $10,000 set for virtually nothing and use that spared cash to get it taken care of properly, maybe by a highly experienced fellow owner who would be glad to come on location for it?



b

Thanks for the input

I took the pic with my cell phone and the bright spot was from the flash. I went ahead and did the 64 point fine convergance in the service menu and adjusted with Avia. I still need to do the focus with the trim pots and a manual focus with the crts and run through the convergance again. Im taking a break at the moment, my eyes were starting to bug out from doing the convergance

Thank you
post #10712 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Granted that you used a flash, there should still not be a glow spreading out from center all the way out to the edges, as it is currently doing. That is being caused by the dirty optics all along the optical path. If it were actually clean in there, the flash would be much more pronounced and dynamic and brilliant, and the blacks around the outside would be much more inky and transparent, and would have been left clear black. This would be giving you a contrast ratio to be able to brag about. I can't see any level of impressive CR there in your pic to get excited about.

What you're seeing is the homogenization of your dynamic range caused by the dirty optics in there. There's 28 surfaces in there that need to be kept crystal clear, and on Pioneer Elite CRT HDready sets 10 of those get incredibly compromised over the years, on Mit's 4. That's why I always do my optics cleaning in my cals BEFORE I do the grayscale. You can't expect to get a decent grayscale with all that homogenization going on, skewing different colors of gray to different parts of your screen.

I see this phenom over and over and over again, and that's just in a normal month's time. Try multiplying that by the number of years these sets have been faithfully cranking away, steadfastly delivering a potentially gangbusters picture year by year, but also getting dirtier and dirtier year by year, and you'll start to see what I am seeing here.


Here's a 7 year old Pioneer, normal daily usage before and after my optics cleaning operation. Mit's don't get as many surfaces dirty as Pioneers do - but still, how many more years than that has yours been faithfully cranking away?

Before:




After (same day and from then on for the next year or 2, till they need it again):




b
post #10713 of 12297
Help!!!!

I turned on my Hitachi 65swx20b and this is what I had...
I went to the DCAM and only have the green displaying so it was easier to show you guys. The red and blue are fine, its only the green. Is this fixable, err i mean is it Worth fixing? I love this TV but if this is expensive to fix I'm afraid I'm gonna have to give it a grand funeral.
post #10714 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Happens all the time on CRT tech. Bump in the road, replace ICs and you're usually home free.

Many viewers of this thread have already done it. Help him, guys -

b
post #10715 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown Fan View Post

Help!!!!

I turned on my Hitachi 65swx20b and this is what I had...
I went to the DCAM and only have the green displaying so it was easier to show you guys. The red and blue are fine, its only the green. Is this fixable, err i mean is it Worth fixing? I love this TV but if this is expensive to fix I'm afraid I'm gonna have to give it a grand funeral.

I agree with Mr. Bob, it looks like convergance IC's. Not familiar with the Hitachi but have worked on a few Mitsubishi's. I just replaced the convergance IC on my mitsubishi and it went pretty smooth, took about a hour or so. You would need the following.

Service repair manual
Desloder Gun, i picked up one from radio shack and it made the whole desoldering the chip off the board a breeze.
Soldering Iron
Solder and Flux
Convergance IC's not sure how many for a Hitachi

There are alot of "how to videos" on youtube that can give you an idea of how the process goes, it is pretty straight forward.

Hope this helps, good luck
post #10716 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown Fan View Post

Help!!!!

I turned on my Hitachi 65swx20b and this is what I had...
I went to the DCAM and only have the green displaying so it was easier to show you guys. The red and blue are fine, its only the green. Is this fixable, err i mean is it Worth fixing? I love this TV but if this is expensive to fix I'm afraid I'm gonna have to give it a grand funeral.

If you went digital, that pic would always be perfect in dot by dot mode. I'm just sayin'.

BTW, has anyone here ever gone digital, and then said to themselves, "Why did I get rid of my CRT?". I'm just curious...
post #10717 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by lionorion View Post

If you went digital, that pic would always be perfect in dot by dot mode. I'm just sayin'.

BTW, has anyone here ever gone digital, and then said to themselves, "Why did I get rid of my CRT?". I'm just curious...

I own a 50 Samsung 3D plasma and an Epson 3010 3D projector with a 120 inch tab tension electric screen. Everyone here still prefers and uses this Hitachi RPTV more then the others. It has the best colors, the best blacks and ZERO gaming lag! If this was a 1000 dollar fix I wouldn't have done it but if it was a 999 dollar fix, I'd order the parts right now. Actually I did order them from tvrepairworld.com. 52.99 for the entire IC Repair kit... Sweet!
post #10718 of 12297
ok, I've attached a couple pictures of the inside on my set. I'm hoping that all of the wisdom in this thread keeps me from getting killed lol. I know TV's retain energy even after being unplugged, can someone point out the "Do Not Touch parts". I think I know all the areas but in case I've over looked something, I'd rather be safe and have someone else with experience take a look also.





I'm sure you guys know but I'll just point out in case, the IC's are on the far right side with those two big heat sinks attached and white paste between the chips and heat sinks.
Somthing is kinda on my mind about this though, could this be a domino effect going on? After replacing the IC's, could there be other resisters blown that caused this IC to go out? I mean anything is possible and I know its hard to speculate over the internet with just a bunch of pictures but any of your wisdom on this would be Huge!
my family LOVES this set, My kids grew up with it since they were toddlers and through all the advice I've received here, this set still Looks Amazing!
post #10719 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown Fan View Post

ok, I've attached a couple pictures of the inside on my set. I'm hoping that all of the wisdom in this thread keeps me from getting killed lol. I know TV's retain energy even after being unplugged, can someone point out the "Do Not Touch parts". I think I know all the areas but in case I've over looked something, I'd rather be safe and have someone else with experience take a look also.

I'm sure you guys know but I'll just point out in case, the IC's are on the far right side with those two big heat sinks attached and white paste between the chips and heat sinks.
Somthing is kinda on my mind about this though, could this be a domino effect going on? After replacing the IC's, could there be other resisters blown that caused this IC to go out? I mean anything is possible and I know its hard to speculate over the internet with just a bunch of pictures but any of your wisdom on this would be Huge!
my family LOVES this set, My kids grew up with it since they were toddlers and through all the advice I've received here, this set still Looks Amazing!

From what I understand, sometimes you can just re solder the existing ICs and fix the problem if it hasn't been run in the broken state too long, although upgraded ICs are supposed to help Picture quality.

- 2B
post #10720 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2 Bunny View Post

From what I understand, sometimes you can just re solder the existing ICs and fix the problem if it hasn't been run in the broken state too long, although upgraded ICs are supposed to help Picture quality.

- 2B

it only ran for a few moments after it happened. to be honest though, if I'm going to tear it a part, I might as well replace the parts. it'll cost less then 60 bucks when its all done.
post #10721 of 12297
Say, Bob. As you contemplate vacationing in the semi tropical paradise of Los Angeles, I wonder if you would have a look at this from an astute poster, Chronoptimist. It is in a thread regarding CRT-like displays. The chart for high and low gain is very interesting regarding the behavior of different types of displays, and it and the excerpted quote may go some way in explaining why some of us like CRT based technology.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post22011119
"...though CRT actually reduced both light output and length of exposure, which is something no other display seems to have today."

Aloha
post #10722 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown Fan View Post


I own a 50 Samsung 3D plasma and an Epson 3010 3D projector with a 120 inch tab tension electric screen. Everyone here still prefers and uses this Hitachi RPTV more then the others. It has the best colors, the best blacks and ZERO gaming lag! If this was a 1000 dollar fix I wouldn't have done it but if it was a 999 dollar fix, I'd order the parts right now. Actually I did order them from tvrepairworld.com. 52.99 for the entire IC Repair kit... Sweet!

Thanks for setting me straight H-town Fan!
post #10723 of 12297
Is there a thread/link/how-to somewhere in hear on the Mitsubishi Capacitor Replacement to solve the Blinking Power Light problem? And yes, I've searched and can't find anything definitive. Guidance would be appreciated!
post #10724 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by lionorion View Post

Thanks for setting me straight H-town Fan!

By the level of thickness that was laid I can tell you miss understood me, If I came off that way I apologize. I'm like most, if not all the people in this thread. Our CRT RPTV are not the only set we own, but our CRT RPTV's are our Favorite amongst all our sets. The only thing my Hitachi is missing that my newer sets have is a "p" after 1080 and my set was never put on a diet so its fat... Errr really fat lol.

Again, I sincerely apologize if I came off as a smart a$$, thats not how I meant it be.
post #10725 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullitt5094 View Post

Is there a thread/link/how-to somewhere in hear on the Mitsubishi Capacitor Replacement to solve the Blinking Power Light problem? And yes, I've searched and can't find anything definitive. Guidance would be appreciated!

You can try this guide....

http://www.techlore.com/article/2471...air-Procedure/

or this...

http://www.techlore.com/forum/thread...t-death-flash/

Not sure what your model # is but should be similar.

Hope this helps.
post #10726 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown Fan View Post


Again, I sincerely apologize if I came off as a smart a$$, thats not how I meant it be.

I don't think you came off that way at all. I think you came off as someone who was sharing your honest opinion of the different technologies which you own. It's a useful comparison, as it makes the point that it's how something looks, rather than a matter of abstract, technological advances.

I hope you get your fine set up and working soon.
post #10727 of 12297
Anyone know of a good place to get calibration training in Canada?
post #10728 of 12297
So I've removed the IC's from my beastly Hitachi. But now that they are out, I noticed something about them. they have different part numbers x.x


one is STK394-150 and one is STK394-110?!?!

I cancelled the order i had for new IC's because they both were -110's.
can someone recommed me what part (if theres and upgrade) I should order and a reputable place on the internet to order from? it seems every place i've seen, sells them in a matching pair....
post #10729 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by splatee View Post

You can try this guide....

http://www.techlore.com/article/2471...air-Procedure/

or this...

http://www.techlore.com/forum/thread...t-death-flash/

Not sure what your model # is but should be similar.

Hope this helps.

Thanks!!
post #10730 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeytown Fan View Post

So I've removed the IC's from my beastly Hitachi. But now that they are out, I noticed something about them. they have different part numbers x.x


one is STK394-150 and one is STK394-110?!?!

I cancelled the order i had for new IC's because they both were -110's.
can someone recommed me what part (if theres and upgrade) I should order and a reputable place on the internet to order from? it seems every place i've seen, sells them in a matching pair....

If you dont have a service manual try here, it comes in multiple parts for download...

http://www.eserviceinfo.com/index.php?what=search2

I would just order one of each to be safe . It shows both those convergance IC's. Now im not sure if there has been a revision to the IC's but doing a quick search i found both are used.

Hope that helps.
post #10731 of 12297
so I went a head and ordered those IC's i needed. Ordered from MCM electronics. Total cost plus shipping, 33.56. I ordered one -150 and one -110 just to be safe. I hope I get them fast cuz I'm Dying to solder these in and get it running. thanks for all the help guys!
post #10732 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post

Say, Bob. As you contemplate vacationing in the semi tropical paradise of Los Angeles, I wonder if you would have a look at this from an astute poster, Chronoptimist. It is in a thread regarding CRT-like displays. The chart for high and low gain is very interesting regarding the behavior of different types of displays, and it and the excerpted quote may go some way in explaining why some of us like CRT based technology.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post22011119
"...though CRT actually reduced both light output and length of exposure, which is something no other display seems to have today."

Aloha

I'd have to have proof that plasma uses a time co-efficient like DLP does. Yes there's image retention, but that's part of the screenburn issue and is not part of the coloration process, like it is in DLP.

b
post #10733 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullitt5094 View Post

Is there a thread/link/how-to somewhere in hear on the Mitsubishi Capacitor Replacement to solve the Blinking Power Light problem? And yes, I've searched and can't find anything definitive. Guidance would be appreciated!

Whenever you have the blinking green light of death and your DM Module contains 7 capacitors, you should replace all 7 of the 1000uf caps with 680uF each, all other specs remaining the same. Sometimes they will be bulged but most times they will not. You can check them, but if even 1 is bad you need to replace them all. This is straight from Mit. Rather than even checking them, simply replacing them is easiest. If your has only 4 caps in there it would be from a different model year, but probably the same issue. I would replace all those exactly the same way, same specs.

This should remedy your issue. I have direct from a tech who has done a lot more of these than I have, that this always fixes it for him. Has fixed it for me as well. Yes it could also be other things like the 9v regulator possibly going out, but we always go with the most likely suspects first.

You do have to be careful of the polarity and have a hot enough soldering iron, as you are dealing with a dual layer board, with lots of plating on it.

b
post #10734 of 12297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob View Post

Whenever you have the blinking green light of death and your DM Module contains 7 capacitors, you should replace all 7 of the 1000uf caps with 680uF each, all other specs remaining the same. Sometimes they will be bulged but most times they will not. You can check them, but if even 1 is bad you need to replace them all. This is straight from Mit. Rather than even checking them, simply replacing them is easiest.

This should remedy your issue. I have direct from a tech who has done a lot more of these than I have, that this always fixes it.

You do have to be careful of the polarity and have a hot enough soldering iron, as you are dealing with a dual layer board, with lots of plating on it.

b

Is the procedure described in this link accurate? It's saying to go with a higher voltage radial cap. Should I just use exactly what's in the set except for the use of 680uF caps instead of 1000? Link to Fix Also, is the addition of a fan necessary to prevent a reoccurrence? Finally, any good sources for the Radial Caps? Mouser can't ship until mid June. I'm new to the Houston area and don't have my old reliable sources I developed in Jacksonville.
post #10735 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Good write up, yes looks accurate and should apply also to sets with 7 caps rather than that write up's 4. All except that they don't pass on the directives of the manufacturer on changing the value of the caps from 1000 to 680 instead. Factory mod. They may not have direct access to Mit technical assistance like I do.

I always try to upgrade the voltage capacity on caps like this, yes, if possible. Fit is an issue tho, your caps can only be so tall and so wide before they will not fit. If you go to 1000uF caps and 35v, chances are they won't fit. Not only might they be too tall, they are almost pressed up against each other in there, so fatness is an issue as well.

If you go to 680uF caps like Mit directs they will be shorter and thinner, so going over the 16v prescribed voltage may not be an issue. If you can get 25v versions of the 680uF caps, that should pretty much solve any size problems. At 680uF, 35v caps may work as well.

MCM, Union Electronics, Andrews and East Coast will have such caps. Remember, don't order 1000uF caps! Get 680's. And make them board mountable, with both legs coming out the same side, beside each other.

b
post #10736 of 12297
In the replies to that thread on Techlore someone posted they were using105c 50v caps and installing them sideways like this...



Is that a good idea? If so, think you could put 7 in that way?
I'm assuming my WS-65813 uses 7 caps, correct?
Do you recommend installing a fan? Looks like a pain I would rather not deal with unless it's really necessary.
post #10737 of 12297
No you do not need to install a fan, that was just for added cooling but is not necessary.

Shouldn't be an issue with the caps sideways as long as the leads don't touch anything. You can pick caps up at radio shack or a frys store. The radio shack caps are just a bit fatter but should fit. And as also stated earlier make sure you have the polarity going correct direction.
post #10738 of 12297
Now that I'm waiting for these parts to be delivered I have time on my hands to think about all this. One thing that has popped up in my head was because this was the green gun, once I put in the new IC's will I have to do a total reconvergence on my green or will it just go back to where it was before all this happened? What should I expect once I put it all back together and turn it on the very first time?
post #10739 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Mit is the only brand where the red and blue follow the green on every Coarse register click, which the overhead CRT sets have always done, they call it geometry. This places Mit head and shoulders easier to calibrate on image structure than any other brand.

So yes if the green gets forced out of kilter because of an IC replacement, some heavy lifting will have to be done to the geometry/convergence. Or you could just get lucky and not have to do much but trimming.

If it had been the red or blue, it would be a lot less work. You chose the short straw when the green was the one that got affected. On any other brand this would not be true, it would be an equal opportunity gliche.

b
post #10740 of 12297
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullitt5094 View Post

In the replies to that thread on Techlore someone posted they were using105c 50v caps and installing them sideways like this...



Is that a good idea? If so, think you could put 7 in that way?
I'm assuming my WS-65813 uses 7 caps, correct?
Do you recommend installing a fan? Looks like a pain I would rather not deal with unless it's really necessary.

Good idea but overkill, you don't need 50v caps, which are a LOT bigger than 16v caps. Nobody is really sure why they go out, but since 680uF does not involve as much filtering work as 1000, the voltage was probably not it. As such chances are they can probably stay the same at 16v with no deleterious effects and no repeats of the going out phenom, as long as they are changed to 680uF.

b
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