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Don't dump your CRT RPTV! - Page 382

post #11431 of 11733
12/11/12 at 12:17pm
Thread Starter 
A much better price can be had. Usually no resistors are needed in this kind of repair, just the ICs, which can be purchased from reputable suppliers like Union Electronics, Andrews, MCM and East Coast Distributors. Be sure and be generous in using the heat sink compound for maximum heat transfer from the ICs to the heat sinks, and clean off any dried out compound from the past with a putty knife before installing the new ICs.

This repair is done all the time by DIYers, so as long as you're handy you should be able to handle it. If not have a friend do it who is.

Definitely not a reason to part with such a fine piece of equipment! You should see how I make such displays look. Lots of screenshots in this thread if you can find them -

wink.gif

b
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post #11432 of 11733
12/11/12 at 6:58pm
LastbutNotLeast.....exactly what I was thinking too, ha.

Mr. Bob, thanks for the reply. That thought did cross my mind but for some reason (too expensive?) I had forgotten about going the old bluray route. I will take a look at that once again. It is good to hear, however, the HD Fury does work with the set. And if I didn't need a new damn roof, I'd have you out this way. Please let me know next time you get to STL area and maybe timing will be right.
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post #11433 of 11733
12/11/12 at 7:25pm
Thread Starter 
Send me your contact information so we can be in touch in case I am going to be close by,
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post #11434 of 11733
12/12/12 at 3:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

I used to work for them when I was a kid when they first opened up (US Precision Lens)... cool.gif

I read somewhere once that they started out make watch crystals. Was this the case when you were working there?
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post #11435 of 11733
12/12/12 at 3:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post

The possibility that some Mitsubishi Diamonds used a Nikkor primary focus lens gains some weight if you consider that, according to the following linked page, Nikon belongs to the Mitsubishi Group.
http://www.shotaddict.com/brand/Nikon-Nikkor-Lenses/

This could very well be the case. Mitsubishi supplied this lens with new replacements and it is liquid coupled to the CRT. In the service manual it is only refered to as the "inner lens" and it is non removable without leaking the glycol. This lens is definitely glass. The removable/adjustable lens on my 73711 & 73411 are the same. They are a Delta 107 lens and were made by US Precision Lens Corp.With regard to a supplier for a front surface miiror, you might try http://www.pancro.com/. I had a front surface mirror made several years ago from Highly Reflective Mirrors and have been very pleased with the result.
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post #11436 of 11733
12/12/12 at 8:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob View Post

A much better price can be had. Usually no resistors are needed in this kind of repair, just the ICs, which can be purchased from reputable suppliers like Union Electronics, Andrews, MCM and East Coast Distributors. Be sure and be generous in using the heat sink compound for maximum heat transfer from the ICs to the heat sinks, and clean off any dried out compound from the past with a putty knife before installing the new ICs.
This repair is done all the time by DIYers, so as long as you're handy you should be able to handle it. If not have a friend do it who is.
Definitely not a reason to part with such a fine piece of equipment! You should see how I make such displays look. Lots of screenshots in this thread if you can find them -
wink.gif
b

Thanks for the reply...... I've successfully replaced the red LED that failed in my Samsung LED-DLP, so I think I can say I have a small amount of tech skills. ;-)

Do I need to disassemble the set first to get the part numbers off of the IC's, or can this be determined beforehand so that I can perform the repair and disassembly all at the same time. I really dont want to leave the set in pieces for any significant amount of time since I dont have the space to do so.

If not, do you know the part numbers that I need to order? I scoured up a little bit of info and came across this as a possible option but I dont have any clue if I'm on the right track yet - http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product/SANYO-STK392-150-/STK392-150

Again, thanks for your help. I'd hate to throw away the set if there's any chance of reviving it. While my brother's already ordered a replacement 60" LCD, he could wheel this bad-boy into the den and let the kids use it for DVD watching and Xbox gaming.
Edited by Ramsrule - 12/12/12 at 8:28am
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post #11437 of 11733
12/12/12 at 8:38am
Thanks, Trey 153, for the detailed answer. Very interesting stuff. cool.gif
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post #11438 of 11733
12/12/12 at 1:17pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramsrule View Post

Thanks for the reply...... I've successfully replaced the red LED that failed in my Samsung LED-DLP, so I think I can say I have a small amount of tech skills. ;-)
Do I need to disassemble the set first to get the part numbers off of the IC's, or can this be determined beforehand so that I can perform the repair and disassembly all at the same time. I really dont want to leave the set in pieces for any significant amount of time since I dont have the space to do so.
If not, do you know the part numbers that I need to order? I scoured up a little bit of info and came across this as a possible option but I dont have any clue if I'm on the right track yet - http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product/SANYO-STK392-150-/STK392-150
Again, thanks for your help. I'd hate to throw away the set if there's any chance of reviving it. While my brother's already ordered a replacement 60" LCD, he could wheel this bad-boy into the den and let the kids use it for DVD watching and Xbox gaming.

You will need to know that chip number. If it's STK 392-110, or 120, or 180, the 150 would sub in yes. However if that were the case I'd go with the more recent upgrade of the 392-180. It's at least 1 gen improved over the 150.

If you need a service manual to know for sure, go to www.servicemanuals.net. That will tell you. They are very cost effective downloads of the manual itself.

b
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post #11439 of 11733
12/12/12 at 1:20pm
any idea who made zenith crt rptv's?

have on out side i can get the model # if needed

thanks

john
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post #11440 of 11733
12/12/12 at 1:30pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trey 153 View Post

This could very well be the case. Mitsubishi supplied this lens with new replacements and it is liquid coupled to the CRT. In the service manual it is only refered to as the "inner lens" and it is non removable without leaking the glycol. This lens is definitely glass. The removable/adjustable lens on my 73711 & 73411 are the same. They are a Delta 107 lens and were made by US Precision Lens Corp.With regard to a supplier for a front surface miiror, you might try http://www.pancro.com/. I had a front surface mirror made several years ago from Highly Reflective Mirrors and have been very pleased with the result.

The 73711 and the 73411 were the same model year, so I imagine they would be using the same lenses.

I just talked with Brian at Pancro, am going to send him dimensions as soon as I have them measured out.

My former mirror came from High Reflective Mirrors.com, I see you mentioned them. Are the 2 companies associated at all?

Also are you the one who sent me info/drawings on how to mount the much heavier glass mirror in a 73" Mit once I had one, to replace the lightweight mylar one? And mentioned that it increased the light output by 25% over the mylar? If so Hi! Long time no see -

b
Edited by Mr Bob - 12/12/12 at 1:38pm
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post #11441 of 11733
12/12/12 at 3:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob View Post

The 73711 and the 73411 were the same model year, so I imagine they would be using the same lenses.
I just talked with Brian at Pancro, am going to send him dimensions as soon as I have them measured out.
My former mirror came from High Reflective Mirrors.com, I see you mentioned them. Are the 2 companies associated at all?
Also are you the one who sent me info/drawings on how to mount the much heavier glass mirror in a 73" Mit once I had one, to replace the lightweight mylar one? And mentioned that it increased the light output by 25% over the mylar? If so Hi! Long time no see -
b

Hello Bob, yes this is me. The 73711 and the 73411 are/were the same model year, however the 711 was the Diamond and the 411 was the Gold version yet they both used the same lenses and CRT's. The main differences were basically in the cabinet and the protective shield. I don't know if the 2 mirror companies are associated with each other or not. My guess would be that they are not and that each sourced their miirors thru the same manufactuer; possibly JDSU. With regard to the increased brightness of the FS mirror compared to mylar, it would be unfair to say that the light output increased by 25% but rather some of my settings decreased by about that number. For example, my subcontrast in the service menu went from 7 to 5 and the SCT (picure gain) was lowered from 39 to 32. The user settings for both contrast and brightness were also lowered to well below the midpoint of the scale.
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post #11442 of 11733
12/12/12 at 3:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post

Thanks, Trey 153, for the detailed answer. Very interesting stuff. cool.gif


You are most welcome. The 65813 you have is an outstanding TV.
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post #11443 of 11733
12/12/12 at 3:40pm
I have a Mitsubishi 73615 and recently got the Darbee Darblet video processor. I can recommend this product, it definitely gives the picture more "pop". Some users have mentioned it is like lifting a veil or like cleaning a window. I have used the hdmi input on this model of tv with no problems and recently tried the hd component inputs, I could see no difference. The Darblett ( I hate the name, it sounds like something Ronco would sell on late night tv) performs very well and I think it was worth the price to me. It gave this tv a new lease on life, animation, cgi and regular movies all look great. I have actually been watching older movies to see what kind of improvement I can make. The next upgrade I am going to make is new eyeglasses, 1 pair for work and 1 pair for watching movies only, that way I don't get the little micro scratches that regular wear and tear gives them. Like Mr Bob says be carefully cleaning your lenses!
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post #11444 of 11733
12/12/12 at 8:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob 

Why would you want to use HDMI for bluray?

If you want to listen to high-res audio, it has to be via HDMI unless your BDP has multichannel analog audio outs and your pre/pro has corresponding audio ins. If you watch component while listening to HDMI, you are likely to notice the audio & video are out of sync. Component video is real-time, but HDMI audio's processing may be audibly delayed. So watching through HDMI is the best way to keep A & V in sync if you listen to high-res audio via HDMI.
Edited by bweissman - 12/12/12 at 9:06pm
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post #11445 of 11733
12/12/12 at 8:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpizzull View Post

I have a Pro-610HD (yep, I fixed it with soldering and got a new board too) and am finally itching to watch bluray, etc. So you know where I'm going with this, ha..........who has a bluray player, with hdmi, hooked up to this TV with component? From the bits and pieces I read, I think I need to get a cross converter like the HD Fury products?? But I get confused when I start reading about HDCP problems (yes, it's been a long time since I kept up with forums, harr). I'd really just like to hear of an exact scenario with the Pro-610HD, with model numbers of parts needed, so I can start to plan out this purchase, ha. And if it is HD Fury, where are you all buying them?

I used an HD Fury 2 with my 610 until I replaced the 610. It works great, especially if you want to listen to the high-res digital audio formats and keep video in sync with the audio. If you're playing analog audio, it doesn't matter because that will be in sync with your analog component video. There are no HCDP issues with the Fury.

My Fury is In a drawer somewhere, but I'm done with it. PM me if you want it.
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post #11446 of 11733
12/13/12 at 5:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob View Post

You will need to know that chip number. If it's STK 392-110, or 120, or 180, the 150 would sub in yes. However if that were the case I'd go with the more recent upgrade of the 392-180. It's at least 1 gen improved over the 150.
If you need a service manual to know for sure, go to www.servicemanuals.net. That will tell you. They are very cost effective downloads of the manual itself.
b

Bob,

I grabbed the service manual, and it has the following part number for the IC's- STK392-560

http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product/STK392-560-NO

The parts from MCM look to be reproductions.... are these still ok to get or do I need to scour the interweb for originals?

Again, I really do appreciate the help.
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post #11447 of 11733
12/13/12 at 10:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bweissman View Post

If you want to listen to high-res audio, it has to be via HDMI unless your BDP has multichannel analog audio outs and your pre/pro has corresponding audio ins. If you watch component while listening to HDMI, you are likely to notice the audio & video are out of sync. Component video is real-time, but HDMI audio's processing may be audibly delayed. So watching through HDMI is the best way to keep A & V in sync if you listen to high-res audio via HDMI.

Since my 65813 is DVI, looks like I need to run everything through a receiver in order to get high res video and good audio in sync.

All this is an argument, as well, for the new Oppo 103, which has every port and option available.

By the way, Skyfall, for those who haven't seen it yet, is unbelievably good. Saw it last night on IMAX before the 48 frame per second Hobbit crowds it out.
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post #11448 of 11733
12/13/12 at 11:12am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramsrule View Post

Bob,
I grabbed the service manual, and it has the following part number for the IC's- STK392-560
http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product/STK392-560-NO
The parts from MCM look to be reproductions.... are these still ok to get or do I need to scour the interweb for originals?
Again, I really do appreciate the help.

The upgrade for that IC is the 392-570. Didn't know Sanyo had stopped producing the 560s, but maybe you can find some original 570s produced by Sanyo out there. If Sanyo no longer does this, then what you are linking to here may be the best available now, as MCM has a long and illustrious rep in my repair service person community.

b
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post #11449 of 11733
12/14/12 at 5:55pm
Sony 51ws500. Picked it up for free but needing a power cord, with a description of "has red squiggly lines." Figured at the worst I'm out $20, and, "Hey, with Mr. Bob's help, I'm sure I can make it look pretty." biggrin.gif

I had a hunch for the squiggly lines problem.
Unfortunately, it wasn't that and is apparently full-blown bad ICs.
Fortunately, it looks like the colors and text are pretty sharp, despite being out of convergence. (Only has an SD tuner hooked to it right now.)
I previously had a 46" version of this and the green especially was simply out of focus even when manually moving the guns, so that one probably had more problems than possibly ICs and got rid of it.

Anyway, I'm kind of thinking I have a convergence problem....smile.gif Check out the bowtie effect. It looks pretty cool on scrolling text since two of the colors bow down on the left side while the other color bows up.

Btw, I thought I was told it had a remote beforehand, but after getting it loaded up the guy said he wasn't sure where it was. So if anyone has a Y909 remote around for cheap, let me know. Currently using a universal I had that basically only has a tv/video button on it.

What's crazy about this is it doesn't have an ATSC tuner, and I think ICs would fix it but it's not guaranteed, and it doesn't have a remote, and it's "only" a 51", so part of me is wondering if it's even worth fixing vs. just keeping an eye out for an already-working one for like $75 possibly less.




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post #11450 of 11733
12/14/12 at 6:51pm
Thread Starter 
It's definitely a convergence issue. IC replacement is your next step.

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post #11451 of 11733
12/14/12 at 8:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnH Sunnyvale View Post

I completed the cleaning of my 55" Sony that I am selling. WoW!! It looks like NEW!! 1000% improvement!! Now I am having second thoughts about selling it.
I would certainly reconsider. It's big, it's pretty, it's paid for, you know where it's been, and it wouldn't surprise me if it still outlasts half the new TVs. And, honestly, various of the new TVs aren't all that impressive picture quality in comparison. Did I mention it's already paid for?
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post #11452 of 11733
12/15/12 at 11:27am
Uh oh. I turned the TV off then turned it back on and was greeted with this. I think that's worse than a convergence chip problem (or not?). Turning down the red voltage didn't help.

And half the red lines flicker/shimmer too. I've looked around for pics or video of the dreaded "Sony flicker problem," but couldn't find any visual examples. This was built in March 2003 with a serial number starting with 94 or 97 (I'd have to look again), so it shouldn't be inherently flawed for the Sony flicker.


Edited by TheFranchise - 12/15/12 at 11:46am
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post #11453 of 11733
12/15/12 at 11:50am
Thread Starter 
Your red is markedly diminished vs. green and blue on the vertical height and positioning, and all 3 images are noticeably shrunken in height. I would still start with the ICs, as vertical height and positioning of each color is part of the geometry/convergence paradigm. However your vertical sweep and its amplitude may also be affected.

And you should not be playing with the Screen controls for an issue like this. There's image structure and the colorations. The "voltage", if you mean the Screen controls, affects the colorations, not the structure. And affects whether the picture is even visible. Do it again and your picture may mute on you and stay muted. If it does that you may have painted yourself into a very expensive corner.

I am available for phone consultation if you wish. Not nearly as expensive as calling a service tech in to take over.

Never play with something you only know part of the info on. Sony's have special rules on the Screen controls, different from all other brands.

b
Edited by Mr Bob - 12/15/12 at 11:58am
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post #11454 of 11733
12/15/12 at 12:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bob View Post

And you should not be playing with the Screen controls for an issue like this.
Well, I also did it because the first time I turned it on yesterday after getting it, it had a couple lines towards the top, the common over-voltage wavy lines thing on an otherwise blank screen, for red. My 46" set had that too but for green or blue, and a small knob turn made it go away.

On this set, a small turn made the wavy red lines on black background go away yesterday, and then I took the pics I posted in my first post yesterday, but then turning the power off then back on it was back, along with this crazy amount of red that also flickers in the thin-line areas.

I had decided that since the set is already here and looked pretty good otherwise, yeah, may as well replace the ICs and go from there. But then this happened. Hmm. For the rest of the day, I'll have to repeat to myself, "Soldering is fun," and see what happens.
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post #11455 of 11733
12/15/12 at 12:36pm
Thread Starter 
For retrace lines, yes the Screen controls can be worked with. Just not for the geometry/convergence issues you originally stated. Again, keep in mind that the Sonys have special rules around handling the screen controls. If too far out of balance with each other, the pic will disappear. I recommend not touching any brand's Screen controls unless you are fully informed about how they work and what to expect. Some have auto-compensation circuits. In the old Runco CRT projectors you had to mechanically pull a 4 prong plug to effect realignment of their energies with each other, then put that plug back in again afterwards. And get it back in, in the proper direction!

Let us know how it turns out -

b
Edited by Mr Bob - 12/15/12 at 12:53pm
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post #11456 of 11733
12/15/12 at 12:37pm
Thread Starter 
BTW, I just learned that this thread has currently had more than a million views! 1,014,960 to be exact, as of 2 minutes ago.

cool.gif

b
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post #11457 of 11733
12/15/12 at 1:25pm
And counting... great stuff all-around Bob.

BTW, are you going to post some VSFS 2012? I'll get the camera out and post some screen shots. It wasn't me... my daughters are the ones that recorded it... rolleyes.gif

Congrats on your very informative and educational thread, and thanks for sharing your knowledge with us mortals. smile.gif
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post #11458 of 11733
12/15/12 at 1:54pm
Thread Starter 
No plans just yet, have only surveyed it a bit so far. Hope to soon.

Happy holidays and Hi to the women in your life - Irene and your girls. You are indeed blessed, Leo!

smile.gif

b
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post #11459 of 11733
12/16/12 at 5:07pm
Happy Holidays to you too Bob!!!

Prayers and Blessings to you and all the people you love...
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post #11460 of 11733
12/22/12 at 2:51am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bweissman View Post

If you want to listen to high-res audio, it has to be via HDMI unless your BDP has multichannel analog audio outs and your pre/pro has corresponding audio ins. If you watch component while listening to HDMI, you are likely to notice the audio & video are out of sync. Component video is real-time, but HDMI audio's processing may be audibly delayed. So watching through HDMI is the best way to keep A & V in sync if you listen to high-res audio via HDMI.

Excellent observation, Bob. I hadn't thought of the delay that would come with trying to mix digital audio with analog video. Analog should stay with analog and digital with digital, definitely.

wink.gif

b
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