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Picked up a VSX-84TXSi today - Page 4

post #91 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monty Williams View Post

Well that's what threw me off and caused me to make my initial statement that the HDMI inputs had to be assigned to something like DVD, DVR, etc. Like I mentioned, when I was using the 74 both of the HDMI inputs were assigned to a standard source like DVD and renamed to "DV-79AVi" etc so I never saw an input labled "HDMI 1" for example when using the 74's selector wheel. When I upgraded to the 84 this past week, I utilized 3 of the 4 HDMI inputs and assigned them to a standard input such as DVD, DVR, etc and renamed them for the component, i.e. "HD-A1", DV-79AVi", etc. However, I currently have 1 HDMI input unused and unassigned and when I use the selector dial on the receiver, one of the input options is "HDMI 4", the one I haven't used or assigned.

The secondary "sub" remote for multi-room use does have a button labled HDMI which allows you to toggle through the unassigned HDMI inputs. For testing purposes as aresult of this thread , I just went into the "Input Setup" menu and unassigned the HDMI 3 input. When I used the sub remote, by using the HDMI button I was able to toggle between the unassigned HDMI 3 and HDMI 4 inputs. The HDMI 1 and 2 inputs were able to be selected only if I chose the inputs that I have them assigned to, in my case 'DVD' for the 79AVi and 'Video 1' for the HD-A1.

So potentially the 84 can have 4 more usable, remote selectable inputs, right?
Do you know if you can rename the HDMI 1, HDMI 2, etc... inputs?
And, I wonder why those inputs can't be selected independently?

dc
post #92 of 3579
Sorry , this may have been asked but...
What kind of DAC`s does the `84TXSi have ?
Are they really important ?
I have a `79AVi dvd player , so using iLink , it would by-pass the dac`s anyway right ?
Many thanks,
Gary
post #93 of 3579
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monty Williams View Post

Yeah, why? Did I miss something in my haste to remove it and throw it away?


No, I just didn't want to screw up the finish on the front panel when I took it off.
post #94 of 3579
Thread Starter 
Speaking of speakers, now that I have a THX Select2 receiver (the 84TXSi), I have a question for everyone regarding speaker placement. Has anyone experimented yet with what the optimum position for the back channels is in a 7.1 THX layout?

Traditionally, the word has always been to separate the right and left back channel speakers, up to the same distance apart as the front speakers. However, THX is now recommending, under the Ultra2/Select2 specifications, that the back two speakers be placed together behind the listener so they can better image with the side channels. This is all part of there 'Advanced Speaker Array' (ASA) spec. (http://www.thx.com/mod/products/speakermodes.html)

Obviously, this would only come into play when listening in one of the THX modes, which I don't always do. What does everyone think? Any one play with it at all yet? I've been dinking around with it, but haven't come to any conclusions yet. I'm also trying to figure out what would be some good demo material to comare with (something with 6 channels presumably)
post #95 of 3579
Okay, say you have HD Cable from Time Warner and a Scientific Atlanta 8300HD DVR...

When outputting a video signal to your Pio VSX-84TXSi receiver, which output resolution should one be using? For instance, if you had a 1366x768 plasma (essentially 720p). Would you output 720p from your 8300HD DVR to the VSX-84TXSi and let it pass the signal to the plasma? Or...

I'm guessing the scaler/upconverter in the Pio VSX-84TXSi is superior to the one in the SA 8300HD DVR... so what about sending a 480i signal from the 8300HD DVR and letting the Pio upconvert the signal to the plasma's native 720p resolution?

Which route should I take for optimal image quality?
post #96 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rieper View Post

Okay, say you have HD Cable from Time Warner and a Scientific Atlanta 8300HD DVR...

When outputting a video signal to your Pio VSX-84TXSi receiver, which output resolution should one be using? For instance, if you had a 1366x768 plasma (essentially 720p). Would you output 720p from your 8300HD DVR to the VSX-84TXSi and let it pass the signal to the plasma? Or...

I'm guessing the scaler/upconverter in the Pio VSX-84TXSi is superior to the one in the SA 8300HD DVR... so what about sending a 480i signal from the 8300HD DVR and letting the Pio upconvert the signal to the plasma's native 720p resolution?

Which route should I take for optimal image quality?

I'm not familiar with your cablebox or provider, but if the PVR gives you access to true HD stations then down-converting the signal with the box then up-converting it with the 84 will look nowhere near as good as outputting a true 720p signal from the box and passing the signal to the display.

If it's up-converted SD material you're talking about, then I'd try both ways (also you can try outputting 480i from the box, passing it to the display and letting the plasma scale it)... but no matter which way you slice it, it's still gonna look like SD crapola.
post #97 of 3579
Well, got my 84 today and set it up in the rack (if anyone wants a Middle Atlantic 1015TX custom faceplate, LMK). Advanced MCACCd the thing, and now the volume is set to -9db...used to be -20db on the 1015.

Didn't do much except the normal setup routine. Went through all the inputs and set them up.

A couple of things...

HD DVD - The HDMI switcher does pass the BTB and WTW signal, so I assume the correct colorspace is being negotiated. I had a problem with the monoprice switcher in this regard, so this seems to work fine.

Also, PCM through HDMI...now, I don't know if it's set up correctly or not (I've triple checked), but I'm getting the soundfield selection with it on PCM. I didn't think this was possible. I made sure the front panel said PCM, etc...but I was able to overlay THX Surround EX. Much better than running the analog connectors where I was unable to overlay anything.

Other than that...that's about as far as I got tonight. Need to do some reading, but I am pleased with this new receiver.
post #98 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamCatcher View Post

So potentially the 84 can have 4 more usable, remote selectable inputs, right?
Do you know if you can rename the HDMI 1, HDMI 2, etc... inputs?
And, I wonder why those inputs can't be selected independently?

dc


The 84 has 4 HDMI inputs, all can be assigned to conventional sources such as DVD, DVR, SAT, etc and all can be renamed/assigned a custom name such as 'HD-A1', 'DV-79AVi', etc as the case may be. The HDMI inputs that are not assigned to a pre-labled input such as DVD, SAT, DVR, etc are listed as a selection("HDMI 3", "HDMI 4") when using the receivers dial. You can select them independently if they are assigned a conventional input such as DVD, SAT, DVR, Video 1, etc for which there is a discrete button on the main remote. If they are unassigned as a conventional source such as DVD, DVR, SAT, etc they remain listed as "HDMI 3" or "HDMI 4" for example, as you rotate the selector dial on the receiver.

If I understand your questions correctly, the receiver does what you want it to do.
post #99 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monty Williams View Post

The 84 has 4 HDMI inputs, all can be assigned to conventional sources such as DVD, DVR, SAT, etc and all can be renamed/assigned a custom name such as 'HD-A1', 'DV-79AVi', etc as the case may be. The HDMI inputs that are not assigned to a pre-labled input such as DVD, SAT, DVR, etc are listed as a selection("HDMI 3", "HDMI 4") when using the receivers dial. You can select them independently if they are assigned a conventional input such as DVD, SAT, DVR, Video 1, etc for which there is a discrete button on the main remote. If they are unassigned as a conventional source such as DVD, DVR, SAT, etc they remain listed as "HDMI 3" or "HDMI 4" for example, as you rotate the selector dial on the receiver.

If I understand your questions correctly, the receiver does what you want it to do.

Monty,
Well sort of.
I was wondering if you could rename say the HDMI 1 input, that has not been assigned an input, to HD-DVD or 79AVi?

dc
post #100 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by enchntr View Post

Well, got my 84 today and set it up in the rack (if anyone wants a Middle Atlantic 1015TX custom faceplate, LMK). Advanced MCACCd the thing, and now the volume is set to -9db...used to be -20db on the 1015.

Didn't do much except the normal setup routine. Went through all the inputs and set them up.

A couple of things...

HD DVD - The HDMI switcher does pass the BTB and WTW signal, so I assume the correct colorspace is being negotiated. I had a problem with the monoprice switcher in this regard, so this seems to work fine.

Also, PCM through HDMI...now, I don't know if it's set up correctly or not (I've triple checked), but I'm getting the soundfield selection with it on PCM. I didn't think this was possible. I made sure the front panel said PCM, etc...but I was able to overlay THX Surround EX. Much better than running the analog connectors where I was unable to overlay anything.

Other than that...that's about as far as I got tonight. Need to do some reading, but I am pleased with this new receiver.

Doesn't the multi-channel PCM output of HD DVD get decoded as one of the DTS formats, even if it started out as DD? Some sort of strange and temporary work-around?

This from the recent review of the Toshiba HD-XA1 in S&V:

All the new titles I looked at were encoded with Dolby Digital Plus a enhanced version of Dolby Digital that supports up to 7.1-channel sound and much higher bit rates which I listened to as uncompressed PCM or as PCM downconverted to a DTS bitstream for the player's optical output. (The format specs give manufacturers the option of downconverting to DTS or Dolby Digital for output on the coax and optical ports, and Toshiba chose DTS.)
post #101 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphish View Post

Doesn't the multi-channel PCM output of HD DVD get decoded as one of the DTS formats, even if it started out as DD? Some sort of strange and temporary work-around?

This from the recent review of the Toshiba HD-XA1 in S&V:

All the new titles I looked at were encoded with Dolby Digital Plus a enhanced version of Dolby Digital that supports up to 7.1-channel sound and much higher bit rates which I listened to as uncompressed PCM or as PCM downconverted to a DTS bitstream for the player's optical output. (The format specs give manufacturers the option of downconverting to DTS or Dolby Digital for output on the coax and optical ports, and Toshiba chose DTS.)

If you use the HDMI or analog multichannel outputs you get multichannel 96khz PCM of the decoded DD+ from the Toshiba. The DD to DTS conversion is only applicable if you use the optical or SPDIF digital connections.
post #102 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamCatcher View Post

Monty,
Well sort of.
I was wondering if you could rename say the HDMI 1 input, that has not been assigned an input, to HD-DVD or 79AVi?

dc

Sorry if I misunderstood your question initially. Yes, you can rename the HDMI inputs to whatever you want without having to assign them to a standard input such as DVD, DVR, etc.
post #103 of 3579
Back Speaker Placement
In respone to Foundation42 regarding the THX back speaker select2 recommendation. I have the 74 and I have experimented quite a bit and have found that in my room putting the rear speakers together and using THX Select2 is the best surround environment for me. I have two direct firing older Energy C-2 bookshelf speakers in the back.

One other thing, I have also like the THX Music for 5 channel DVD Audio and SACD recordings using the two rear speakers together. According to the THX folks, the 2 side and 2 rear speakers work together to put the rear channels mid-way between the two. Anyhow for my ears and room I like the back speakers together vs. spread apart.

Jim
post #104 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monty Williams View Post

Sorry if I misunderstood your question initially. Yes, you can rename the HDMI inputs to whatever you want without having to assign them to a standard input such as DVD, DVR, etc.

Thanks for the clarification.

So potentially with the 84 you can have 4 more remote selectable inputs, without having to use up inputs like DVD, DVR, etc....
This is excellent news as I always seem to be short on usable, remote selectable, inputs.
Do you know how the input labeled iLink on the remote functions?

dc
post #105 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamCatcher View Post

Thanks for the clarification.

So potentially with the 84 you can have 4 more remote selectable inputs, without having to use up inputs like DVD, DVR, etc....


yep, that seems to be the case.

This is excellent news as I always seem to be short on usable, remote selectable, inputs.
Do you know how the input labeled iLink on the remote functions?

That's a good question. In response to your post I tried pressing the 'i.Link' button on the sub remote and regardless of which input the receiver was set to, the receiver displayed "Cannot Select" and didn't do anything. A cursory review of the manual didn't result in any mention of it...now I'm really curious and I'll let you know if I figure it out.

dc

.
post #106 of 3579
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifigi53 View Post

Back Speaker Placement
In respone to Foundation42 regarding the THX back speaker select2 recommendation. I have the 74 and I have experimented quite a bit and have found that in my room putting the rear speakers together and using THX Select2 is the best surround environment for me. I have two direct firing older Energy C-2 bookshelf speakers in the back.

One other thing, I have also like the THX Music for 5 channel DVD Audio and SACD recordings using the two rear speakers together. According to the THX folks, the 2 side and 2 rear speakers work together to put the rear channels mid-way between the two. Anyhow for my ears and room I like the back speakers together vs. spread apart.

Jim

That's interesting, thanks. Do you use the THX modes for all of your movie/tv watching? I haven't tried the music modes for dvd-audio, but I'll give it a try.
post #107 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifigi53 View Post

Back Speaker Placement
In respone to Foundation42 regarding the THX back speaker select2 recommendation. I have the 74 and I have experimented quite a bit and have found that in my room putting the rear speakers together and using THX Select2 is the best surround environment for me. I have two direct firing older Energy C-2 bookshelf speakers in the back.

One other thing, I have also like the THX Music for 5 channel DVD Audio and SACD recordings using the two rear speakers together. According to the THX folks, the 2 side and 2 rear speakers work together to put the rear channels mid-way between the two. Anyhow for my ears and room I like the back speakers together vs. spread apart.

Jim

So does this mean the 84 can digitize and add bass management, dsp processing, etc. to the analog multi-channel signal?
post #108 of 3579
I use the THX modes for most everything. As far as audio inputs, no I don't use them, I use the i-link connection to my Pio Elite DVP-59. I like the I-link and even with regular CDs it sound good to me. This is a BIG surprise because before that time I have been a stickler for using Pure Direct and the analog inputs for all music - with the '74, I use i-link exclusively now. Not sure it is the lack of jitter or what, but it is very good and I here things on the recordings I didn't hear before with my pure direct music system. It very well could also be the room correction software in the receiver, the room really does make a difference and with the room correction software, it really helps the overall experience.

Jim
post #109 of 3579
Here is a question!

Can the 84txsi and 82txs upscale HDMI 480i or 480p input signals up to 1080i HDMI output?
I've heard that the yamaha rx-2600 cannot upscale digital signals. only HDMI switching and analog upscaling to HDMI.
post #110 of 3579
Has anyone determined whether in Auto Surround mode, if you are "watching" DirecTV and you tune to an XM channel that broadcasts in HD Neural surround, (I think only the classical channels do currently) whether the Neural Surround is actually activated.

My reading of the VSX80TXV manual leads me to believe that HD Neural Surround will only activate when XM is selected as the source (obviously XM would not be the selected source when listening to it through D*).

I read an article about XM surround in an AV magazine last month and the article claimed that D* users would be able to enjoy the benefits of the surround processing, which leads me to hope that receivers such as the newer Elites will automatically detect that its an XM signal coming through (even though its coming from D*).

Thanks for any replies.
post #111 of 3579
Could anyone explain what "AIR Studios" means and its significance?

Also i am looking into getting a pre/pro or avr to power a 5.1 ACI setup. would the 84 be recommended and if i were to go the pre/pro route ie outlaw 990/7125, will i hear a noticable difference?
post #112 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by enigma001 View Post

Could anyone explain what "AIR Studios" means and its significance?

Also i am looking into getting a pre/pro or avr to power a 5.1 ACI setup. would the 84 be recommended and if i were to go the pre/pro route ie outlaw 990/7125, will i hear a noticable difference?

Iirc Air Studios is a sound stage/recording house where alot of movies soundtracks are made. In theory the Air Studio dsp's in the 84 will replicate the sound/atmosphere of their unique sound stages.

I don't know the answer your second question...but yesterday I ordered a sherwood p965 pre-pro. My reasoning was mostly to do with how the 84 handles analog multi-channel more than sound quality which I'm sure is very good with either unit.

edit:
As far as studio soundfields...sony does the same thing in their receivers...they have several "studio" dsp's.
post #113 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphish View Post

Has anyone determined whether in Auto Surround mode, if you are "watching" DirecTV and you tune to an XM channel that broadcasts in HD Neural surround, (I think only the classical channels do currently) whether the Neural Surround is actually activated.

My reading of the VSX80TXV manual leads me to believe that HD Neural Surround will only activate when XM is selected as the source (obviously XM would not be the selected source when listening to it through D*).

I read an article about XM surround in an AV magazine last month and the article claimed that D* users would be able to enjoy the benefits of the surround processing, which leads me to hope that receivers such as the newer Elites will automatically detect that its an XM signal coming through (even though its coming from D*).

Thanks for any replies.

I would think it only works with the XM input and not the D* signal. Plus, technically it's not an XM signal through D*...it is standard D*.

At least you can overlay something like THX EX or PLIIx on it.
post #114 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by enchntr View Post

I would think it only works with the XM input and not the D* signal. Plus, technically it's not an XM signal through D*...it is standard D*.

At least you can overlay something like THX EX or PLIIx on it.


Thanks for your inference, but I'm really looking for a response from someone who's actually tried it.

Anyway, your assumption doesn't seem to hold water. D*'s signal is not ATSC, yet it still incorporates the same Dolby Digital or Dolby Surround signals encoded by the broadcasters. So, there's no reason to just expect that whatever flags are built into XM's signal to activate HD neural surround are lost just because they are retransmitted by D*.

The main reason I'm thinking that HD neural surround won't work for D* signals is becasue the manual says that HD neural surround is automatially activated when XM is selected as a source. This affirmative statment does not means that HD neural surround might not be activated when another source is selected (such as SAT/DBS), but it makes me question whether it will. Hence, why I'm asking for someone who's actually connected these receivers to D* to let me know their experience.
post #115 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphish View Post

Thanks for your inference, but I'm really looking for a response from someone who's actually tried it.

Anyway, your assumption doesn't seem to hold water. D*'s signal is not ATSC, yet it still incorporates the same Dolby Digital or Dolby Surround signals encoded by the broadcasters. So, there's no reason to just expect that whatever flags are built into XM's signal to activate HD neural surround are lost just because they are retransmitted by D*.

The main reason I'm thinking that HD neural surround won't work for D* signals is becasue the manual says that HD neural surround is automatially activated when XM is selected as a source. This affirmative statment does not means that HD neural surround might not be activated when another source is selected (such as SAT/DBS), but it makes me question whether it will. Hence, why I'm asking for someone who's actually connected these receivers to D* to let me know their experience.

I have DirecTV so I'll try it out tonight.
post #116 of 3579
Thanks Rojma. I look forward to reading your results.
post #117 of 3579
I have a set up with two front speakers and a sub. No surrounds. How does the 84 process Dolby Digital in this case. I assume the the surround info is redirected to the front speakers while the bass below the x-over setting and the LFE info is sent to the sub.

Is my assumption correct?

Thanks
post #118 of 3579
I will hook it up and let you know what I think as soon as I get it...

DVD-Audio, SACD, DVD through the OPPO DV-970HD HDMI.

Energy Audissey Speakers, Optoma HD-72 projector.

It is replacing a Denon AVR-4800, Rane EQ, and Belles 400a amplifier. I will use it's internal amps and signal proscessing - Hope it is good.
post #119 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphish View Post

Thanks for your inference, but I'm really looking for a response from someone who's actually tried it.

Anyway, your assumption doesn't seem to hold water. D*'s signal is not ATSC, yet it still incorporates the same Dolby Digital or Dolby Surround signals encoded by the broadcasters. So, there's no reason to just expect that whatever flags are built into XM's signal to activate HD neural surround are lost just because they are retransmitted by D*.

The main reason I'm thinking that HD neural surround won't work for D* signals is becasue the manual says that HD neural surround is automatially activated when XM is selected as a source. This affirmative statment does not means that HD neural surround might not be activated when another source is selected (such as SAT/DBS), but it makes me question whether it will. Hence, why I'm asking for someone who's actually connected these receivers to D* to let me know their experience.

Well, just tried my 84TXSi and my HR10-250 on channels 864, 865, and 866 (all classical channels) and they came over with no neural surround. This is through HDMI (sound is sent through as PCM...cycled through auto/hdmi, etc). I do not have an optical cable set up, but I am able to receive DD through the same connection.

LMK if this helps,
Ed
post #120 of 3579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphish View Post

Thanks for your inference, but I'm really looking for a response from someone who's actually tried it.

Anyway, your assumption doesn't seem to hold water. D*'s signal is not ATSC, yet it still incorporates the same Dolby Digital or Dolby Surround signals encoded by the broadcasters. So, there's no reason to just expect that whatever flags are built into XM's signal to activate HD neural surround are lost just because they are retransmitted by D*.

The main reason I'm thinking that HD neural surround won't work for D* signals is becasue the manual says that HD neural surround is automatially activated when XM is selected as a source. This affirmative statment does not means that HD neural surround might not be activated when another source is selected (such as SAT/DBS), but it makes me question whether it will. Hence, why I'm asking for someone who's actually connected these receivers to D* to let me know their experience.

I tried it out and it does not seem to be working. I tried out the Fine Tuning and Pops XM channels and neither worked. I set the receiver to Auto Surround and it just picked the 2 channels up as stereo. To ensure that the receiver and my HD Tivo were working correctly and communicating with each other, I switched to some of the DirecTV HD channels and some of the local HD channels (from an off air antenna) that have Dolby Digital and the receiver properly switched to Dolby Digital.

I did find the article that mentioned the XM HD surround being compatible on DirecTV:

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...1&print_page=y

Maybe the stream is not turned on yet? Anyway I do hope that they get this working because it would be very cool.
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