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Industry Insiders Q&A Thread: only Questions to insiders please - Page 93  

post #2761 of 4623
I ask of the insiders here the same question that I did in a post over in the HD DVD Software section. Will the DVD Forum defend "DVD" trademark?
That post describes BB using the term "Next Generation DVD" to display case label Blu-ray Discs.

Bob
post #2762 of 4623
There is a debate going on in another thread about extras causing a decrease in picture quality.

Can anyone comment on whether a better quality picture could be acheived if the extras were stripped and the entire disc size was given to the feature??
post #2763 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhafner
Take a first generation D5 tape and copy it on another. Then copy that one etc. After how many generations has the picture broken down and compression noise is very obvious? Assume an average 35mm feature film is on the tape.
What happens if you use HDCAM SR instead at 440 Mbit/s? 880 Mbit/s?
Great point!
post #2764 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland
Can not speak for D5, for HDCam the proper way to make a clone/dub using a studio deck is to use a special dubbing board. It takes the error corrected data from one machine and feeds it to the second machine (this may be included in recent machines). As long as there is no errors in the data then the number of generations should be many.

Every time you retrieve and save a computer file you are performing a similar process. Error correction is the key element to most digital storage processes. Take some of your CD,s and back light them. You have a good chance of seeing a pin hole(s). That will mean a chunk of data being lost but with error correction processes the data will be fully recovered in most cases.
I agree with one exception - whomever is in control of the overall production and post process must adhere to all of the rules of good video engineering. I find out all too often that someone "assumes" something is true only to find out after the fact that it wasn't true or someone else downstream "assumed" something else. It happens every day in Hollywood.

I'll give you a good example. There is a very good high-end professional video device which will go unmentioned. The SW I/O GUI has two settings, one named something like "Full" and the other named "Head" (or something like that, I can't ever remember what they were ever talking about). It has 10 bit HD-SDI I/O intended to patch into a mainstream router or D5 machines.

There is a difference in mapping from reference black to peak white. Is it 16-235, or 64 to whatever? Do you clip off the LSBs, do you round? What happens with video overshoot and undershoot. Note that throwing away the undershoots and overshoots is NOT the right thing to do with video if you've ever studied signal processing. I could go on.

If you patch thru this mess even once during a dub you will get potentially horrible picture quality. That has nothing to do with the movie or the compression or the source content.

You might thing that this is a trivial problem but when you only have 8-10 bits to deal with the lookup tables cause considerable quantization noise. Each piece of equipment may make a different assumption. And there will be be repeated noise accumulation and different noise if different equipment interprets the code values in different ways in rounding up or down.

HD-SDI is not deterministic, despite what anyone might tell you. Digital isn't perfect, it is quantized analog information that can be in interpreted any one of a different ways depending on the make and model.

Then add the inherent compression of a DA5 machine. I can see D5 compression on a good Sony CRT monitor. It isn't a transparent master transfer to begin with even if everything is calibrated off the telecine.

Then, if you're tweaking the bits coming in cause of all the things I mentioned above (let alone color correction, grading, grain), the compression on the way out to the high def DVD is going to do completely weird things.
post #2765 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by crashoveridema0
So Amirm 1080p through vga sounds great my only question is how will dolby digital trueHD be transported to a reciver and will the japanese price of the hd dvd drive be very close to the u.s. price?
1080-what-P? If you don't specify the framerate you're talking gibberish.
post #2766 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by amirm
No, there is no AACS hold up. Niveous (http://www.niveus.com/)
Nievus is well known for announcing things to gain hype far in advance of availability. They have been touting an HD-DVD MCE solution for about a year now.
post #2767 of 4623
For Tom McMahon or kjack. Any comment on these articles about IPTV rollout delays due to scarcity of H.264 decoder chips?

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=104247

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=102937

Ron
post #2768 of 4623
I was looking at the bottom of an HD-DVD and noticed several serial numbers and barcodes. Anyone care to explain what these are and what they are for?

Thanks.

Adam
post #2769 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobgpsr
Will the DVD Forum defend "DVD" trademark?[/url]
That post describes BB using the term "Next Generation DVD" to display case label Blu-ray Discs.
While you can't use the DVD logo without licensing or permission, "DVD" is probably too commonly used to defend against anything any longer. You have to defend it everywhere, not just one particular usage that you don't like, and be defending it as soon as possible, not 10 years later. Or perhaps the trademark symbol is too small to see without looking closely at it.
post #2770 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr1394
For Tom McMahon or kjack. Any comment on these articles about IPTV rollout delays due to scarcity of H.264 decoder chips?

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=104247

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=102937

Ron
Must still be diehard ST customers to be willing to wait so long? :)
post #2771 of 4623
Amir,
Is there anything that would prevent a vendor to say, release a software/hardware Blu-ray bundle (ie, PowerDVD BD or WinDVD BD for the 360 with an external Blu-Ray drive) that would play on the 360? Or they do the same for the PS3 with an external hd dvd drive (or even the 360 hd dvd drive)?
post #2772 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talkstr8t
My estimate is based on Sony's revised estimate of 2M PS3's out by the end of the year.

- Talk
Is that 2 million for North America and Japan since they said the rest of the world won't get any until spring of 2007?
post #2773 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by atagert
I was looking at the bottom of an HD-DVD and noticed several serial numbers and barcodes. Anyone care to explain what these are and what they are for?

Thanks.

Adam
That bar code can tell the drive what type of DVD it is, how to read, etc. There is registration process so that certain part of that ID can be used by a specific company/application.

BTW, if the above system worked all the time, one can ID and play a disc in a couple of seconds...
post #2774 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ja Phule
Amir,
Is there anything that would prevent a vendor to say, release a software/hardware Blu-ray bundle (ie, PowerDVD BD or WinDVD BD for the 360 with an external Blu-Ray drive) that would play on the 360? Or they do the same for the PS3 with an external hd dvd drive (or even the 360 hd dvd drive)?
The software to play such format has to exist on the console. And currently, the only entity that can enable such functionality is the company which built the console. As a result, third parties can not provide such functionality on their own.
post #2775 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr1394
For Tom McMahon or kjack. Any comment on these articles about IPTV rollout delays due to scarcity of H.264 decoder chips?

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=104247

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=102937

Ron
Gee they aren't in touch with the right sales guys at our end. We're Rock & Roll with H.264/AVC, VC-1 and MPEG-2 HD decoder SoC parts of al types right now.
post #2776 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandmaster
Putting on my Videogames Insider hat for a moment, three games in that thread were listed as internally rendering at 1080p - Oblivion, Call of Duty 2 and Dead or Alive 4. Framebuffer dumps of the CoD2 and DOA4 demos indicate a 720p resolution being used. Based on how graphically complex Oblivion is, I'm willing to wager that would be 720p too.

1080p frame buffers are definitely possible and the HD-DVD player obviously uses them, but I just don't think we've seen them in games yet.
According to Tallen94 (whose post sounds a bit insiderish :) ) your test result may have been due to "multi-res" rendering which would only render 1920x1080 if you specify that output resolution.

As long as you have your gaming industry insider hat on, perhaps a retest with output set to 1080i?
post #2777 of 4623
Is the window of opportunnity for 1G Blu-ray players fast disappearing? Am I right in stating that all new BD players post 1H 07 must support BD-Live?

We're already hearing rumours that Panasonic will have two new models to replace the about to launch DMP-BD10 in Mar/Apr 07, and confirmed launch dates for other players are conspicuous by their absence. If they don't launch really soon aren't we in serious danger of not seeing anything until Spring '07 when you would expect BD-Live players to turn up en masse?

I for one am losing patience with this whole 'war'. My preference for released ontent so far goes to BD (just my personal taste in films) but I'm not going to buy a player just to have HD if the format doesn't hold the content. However if I can't buy a player for the content I'd like, my only recourse is to forget the whole thing and come back again in 12 months.

Don't the companies involved realise this is unlikely to be a rare reaction and if so, what do they want to do about it? Shouldn't BD companies such as Pioneer who have ethernet connectivity be making a commitment for example to support BD-Live on their player via a firmware update? At least then some of the uncertainty is removed?
post #2778 of 4623
**************************************

AMIRM,,

Will we get to hear TRUE_HD from the 360 add on without getting it downconverted via optical?

I want True HD from my receiver. The only way i get get it is via 5.1ch analoge or hdmi without being downconverted. Am i better of buying a HD-A1/HD-EX2 or a xbox 360 addon?
post #2779 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneRoses
amirm,

XBOX 360 VGA Cable currently output RGB signal at so called "TV Scale" instead of "PC Scale" Most displays expect PC Scale from its VGA input, this will result in washed out picture (too bright picture) and loss in dynamic range if you try to compensate black level by turning brightness setting down.

Can this be fixed by software update? or it is hardware bug that cannot be fixed.

Thanks.
This is my question from page 85 and I really need and answer. This is very serious bug for XBOX 360 as HD-DVD player as it will ruin Hi-Def experiance for most of us who are certainly not an average Joe who can't tell the difference in image quality.

I tried to get respond from xbox support but no answer at all

Please response.
post #2780 of 4623
Cjplay, or any other Insider,
A Nine Inch Nails concert has been announced for release on HD-DVD and Blu-Ray in early 2007. The trailer for it is available here. Rob Sheridan, who is with the NIN camp, just posted the following

"we're still having a great deal of trouble perfecting the high-definition encode. Apparently the authoring facility has already put 200 man hours into encoding our feature, and it still has a long way to go before the quality is up to snuff. There is quite an art form to a good encode that I didn't really have an appreciation for prior to this experience."

Have you done work on encoding a concert such as this? Is more than 200 man hours a lot for one encode? Would one codec be better than another for the encoding challenges posed by a rock concert with a lot of strobes, smoke, and fast movement?
post #2781 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocX
Amir,

I have one question (I signed up especially for that ;) ):

I have an US console but I'm located in Europe at the moment (and I took my box along). Can I just go to a shop here, purchase an european HDDVD AddOn and hook it up to my US X360?

Or do I have to wait until I get back to the states (can take some time) due to some restrictions (HW or SW wise) that prevent operation of an european AddOn with my Xbox?

Thanks
DocX
I'm not Amir, rather I'm someone on the Xbox team. I hope that's okay :)

You should be fine to buy an HD-DVD drive in Europe an hook it up to your US Xbox 360.
post #2782 of 4623
Perhaps nyber you can answer the question of whether the add-on drive can be used on a PC???
post #2783 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by builty
Perhaps nyber you can answer the question of whether the add-on drive can be used on a PC???
PLEASE nyber!
post #2784 of 4623
Welcome to the site Nyber and thanks in advance for the abuse your about to take :)
post #2785 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarod M
Cjplay, or any other Insider,
A Nine Inch Nails concert has been announced for release on HD-DVD and Blu-Ray in early 2007.

"we're still having a great deal of trouble perfecting the high-definition encode. Apparently the authoring facility has already put 200 man hours into encoding our feature, and it still has a long way to go before the quality is up to snuff. There is quite an art form to a good encode that I didn't really have an appreciation for prior to this experience."

Have you done work on encoding a concert such as this? Is more than 200 man hours a lot for one encode? Would one codec be better than another for the encoding challenges posed by a rock concert with a lot of strobes, smoke, and fast movement?
While I've not done this concert, I've done some in the past and they all represent a VERY difficult encode. Add to that any level of interactivity and high-end audio and you'll crop the PBR to low 20's or even 19Mbps. 200 man hours is over 2 weeks of 2-shift work which is usually only necessary for us on IME/TrueHD combos, so I'd consider it a little excessive. I'd be worried that this title's extremem amount of flashing is preventing them from finishing, but I'd look to Rundown's club sequence for something close. However, I'd think they'd shoot this guy at 1080i59, but would hope they chose 1080p30... Good luck to the compression team working on that.

Cjplay.
post #2786 of 4623
Hi Nyber! Welcome aboard!

I second (or is that third) the questions above.

I've been seeing some posts that say the HD DVD add-on will work with Media Center PCs (not regular Windows).

Can you confirm this? I realize that you probably have to have certain hardware in place to decode/display VC1, etc, but I gotta know!

:D Thanks!
post #2787 of 4623
Hi Amir,

U mentioned that Toshiba-Samsung are manufacturing Blu-ray laser drive for BD CEs. Is this for real?

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.en..._dvd_1_jpg.jpg

Samsung HD DVD laptop ...

full article :
http://www.engadget.com/2006/09/28/s...op-yes-HD-DVD/
post #2788 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by builty
Perhaps nyber you can answer the question of whether the add-on drive can be used on a PC???
Amir kind of answered that it's TSST drive. I wonder what the exact model number is. Assuming it's got either the notebook or standard IDE/SATA connection and it's on the play list, I can't see why it wouldn't work. If it would work, I'd be happy to pay $200 and get king kong too. :)

(Just to make sure this qualifies as a question, can we get the model number or am I being too greedy now? :>)

Chris
post #2789 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cjplay
While I've not done this concert, I've done some in the past and they all represent a VERY difficult encode. Add to that any level of interactivity and high-end audio and you'll crop the PBR to low 20's or even 19Mbps. 200 man hours is over 2 weeks of 2-shift work which is usually only necessary for us on IME/TrueHD combos, so I'd consider it a little excessive. I'd be worried that this title's extremem amount of flashing is preventing them from finishing, but I'd look to Rundown's club sequence for something close. However, I'd think they'd shoot this guy at 1080i59, but would hope they chose 1080p30... Good luck to the compression team working on that.

Cjplay.
So this sort of example would be a very good one as to why a higher video PBR of 40Mbps would be useful then?
post #2790 of 4623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cjplay
While I've not done this concert, I've done some in the past and they all represent a VERY difficult encode. Add to that any level of interactivity and high-end audio and you'll crop the PBR to low 20's or even 19Mbps. 200 man hours is over 2 weeks of 2-shift work which is usually only necessary for us on IME/TrueHD combos, so I'd consider it a little excessive. I'd be worried that this title's extremem amount of flashing is preventing them from finishing, but I'd look to Rundown's club sequence for something close. However, I'd think they'd shoot this guy at 1080i59, but would hope they chose 1080p30... Good luck to the compression team working on that.

Cjplay.
Thanks, as always, you've been very insightful. I'm hoping they're using the right codec for the job, as this one looks like a real test. Rob said "it might cost the sanity of a few video technicians," so consider yourself lucky that you aren't working on it! :D

Oh, and he also said that "it will be presented in full 1080p resolution...shot on high quality professional video cameras...not upconverted and not HDV."
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