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Official Sony 40",46" XBR2, XBR3 - Owner's Thread - Page 107

post #3181 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin_K View Post

I agree, I've seen the 1000.00 standalone at BB hooked up to the 40xbr2 floor model and it didn't look any better than the PS3 output on mine. And if you grab the core you can get it for 499, much better deal IMHO. Went to BB yesterday to grab VF5 and Wii Play and saw they had stacks of PS3s (40+) so it seems availability isnt an issue anymore.

Sorry to be going back 20 posts... what does "grab the core" mean??
post #3182 of 3414
PS3 core system is $499, instead of the one with the larger HD which is $599.
post #3183 of 3414
I know I'm a little late in the thread but just thought I would chime in as a new 46XBR3 owner to go along with my 32xbr1 thats in the bedroom. I also just recieved the sony BDPS1 bluray player. Now I can't wait to get everything set up and let her rip
post #3184 of 3414
[EDIT]
post #3185 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wafe27 View Post

I hate to report another promblem, but I am having problems with sound over VGA. I cannot get sound over a digital audio cable on by 46' XBR3. I changed the settings and called xbox support without results,
Does anyone know how to get 5.1 audio through VGA on Xbox 360, on and XBR3? Is it some setting I have to change?
Thanks for the help

Thats because the toslink cable needs to be connected from the video harness of the 360 to the receiver. The TV will only send digital audio output when you are using the built-in tuner. You need an additional toslink cable.

Bob
post #3186 of 3414
OK, I've been reading page after page of this thread over Remote Desktop and it's such a chore I just had to go ahead and ask my questions...

First of all, I made a huge mess getting this unboxed, so I decided to test my new KD-46XBR3 with the easiest thing to connect and try: my HTPC over VGA (XP Media Center Edition 2005 + 7800GS). After it warmed up, it looked amazing! I had to take it from Vivid to Standard mode to keep from being blinded.

Then I tried DVI-to-HDMI using a Philips dongle-style converter that converts the end of a DVI cable to an HDMI connector. I have the other type (Philips also) which converts it to a HDMI port at the card's DVI port, but I had no HDMI cable so I felt glad that I had the forsight to get both types when I found them on clearance. I selected 1080p and, strangely, there is significant overscan chopping off my taskbar, Start button, left column of desktop icons, etc. Why is this present with the HDMI input and not the VGA input? Are difficulties with PC input on other inputs the reason why they call the VGA input "PC input" instead of VGA? I thought I was digitally addressing pixels so shouldn't there be zero overscan?

I connected my laptop's ATI X1400 DVI port to the same cable and set my drivers to use the TV exclusively (primary display with the Laptop's panel disabled) and had a MUCH worse problem! The overscan is still present, but the icons on my dektop that I can see shimmer as if interlaced and all the text and borders have interfering lines as if the contrast was cranked up way too high on a CRT TV. Even without all the artifacts, the text is not crisp and straight. How can DVI/HDMI be that much worse than VGA?! I swaer, my VGA output looked digital, and all it ever takes is a glance for be to determine when a LCD is scaling VGA or using native resolution DVI so this speaks volumes about the opposite difference I'm seeing now.

Could it be that the cable is not a dual-link DVI cable? I thought that resolutions requiring dual-link cables simply didn't work with standard cables.

Could it be that the DVI-HDMI adapter, which has no "length" at all (being a dongle that fits on the end of the DVI cable), is not an HDMI 1.3 adapter? I mean, the resolution works, but the image is crap. If VGA looks good, even non-v1.3 HDMI should look better than this blurry artifacted mess.

My horrible results with PC connections on my Sony KV-30XBR910 (PC connection is "unsupported") are part of the reason I bought this set. If I can't get decent digital HDMI output from a PC, I don't want it. In fact, I was going to get a Vista Premium media center with CableCARD support so I wasn't even worried about the TV lacking this feature. Vista will require that DVI/HDMI for content that requires HDCP.

Other than the desktop, I had nothing to view in 1080p on the PC so I left Half-Life 2 installing and decided to see what 1080p looks like on some other non-VGA input. I'm too poor to get everything right away... I like to shop around. This meant that I have no HDMI cable for my Playstation 3. No worries, the PS3 can do 1080p over component, right? I dug up my official Sony PS2 component cables and held power for 5-10 seconds to reset the video to 480i. I selected the supported resolutions and the XMB (PS3 Cross Menu Bar dashboard/interface) defaulted to 1080p for the test. SCRAMBLED IMAGE.

It timed out and I set it to 1080i instead, but why can't my PS3 do 1080p over component?
The cables are PS2 component cables. Before purchasing them, I verified through Sony that they would work. After all, they look kinda wimpy for a 1080p set. Even before checking with them, I saw nothing in the manuals even mentioning a part number for the proper cables. It acted like there would be only one kind of cable period and did nothing to explain any potential differences or problems. So I guess my question is, would component cables not intended for 1080p cause a scrambled image or just a low-quality image? I always assumed the latter. Not rolling white lines pitched diagonally on a blank screen.

Am I going to run into any issues with an XBOX360 using 1080p over component? I've started collecting deals on all the XBOX 360 accessories but I'm still torn between getting one now or when HDMI-equipped models hit the market (mark my words: they will, and they will soon).

Also, I heard that many high-end Sony LCD TVs have video "blanking issues" with the Nintendo Wii (or perhaps certain titles for it). My friends played a good bit of Wii Play on the set last night and didn't notice anything, but does anyone know if the KD-46XBR3 is one of the affected sets?

Thanks!
post #3187 of 3414
I forgot to ask about whether or not this set can deinterlace 1080i film sourced material to 1080p, but I see that it failed this test here. Is there a high-end receiver that can make up for this deficiency? I can make up for the lack of CableCARD with a Vista Premium HTPC IF I can solve my PC input problems, even though I'd still like to have another one in the set to watch when the MCE machine is recording things. If I can't make up for this deficiency, I'm sure that I do not want this set. I guess I'm just OCD, but back in 2003, I returned my first HDTV ever because the set would lock to 16:9 aspect in 480p and no receivers would process video back then for adding pilliar-boxes to 480p video (Gamecube progressive scan mostly). If there isn't a way to fix this, I will be missing a significant amount of 1080p content that even the cheaper sets of the future will easily handle. This bugs me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by petmic10 View Post

1080p with VGA on the 40" and 46" only.
1080p with VGA and Component on the 52"

Did you try adjusting the Horizontal center, Vertical center, and Wide Mode
adjustments when using VGA. See if that helps.

I guess this answers my question about the PS3 1080p over component and the "Any problems with an XBOX360" question.
post #3188 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by CZroe View Post

I forgot to ask about whether or not this set can deinterlace 1080i film sourced material to 1080p, but I see that it failed this test here. Is there a high-end receiver that can make up for this deficiency? I can make up for the lack of CableCARD with a Vista Premium HTPC IF I can solve my PC input problems, even though I'd still like to have another one in the set to watch when the MCE machine is recording things. If I can't make up for this deficiency, I'm sure that I do not want this set. I guess I'm just OCD, but back in 2003, I returned my first HDTV ever because the set would lock to 16:9 aspect in 480p and no receivers would process video back then for adding pilliar-boxes to 480p video (Gamecube progressive scan mostly). If there isn't a way to fix this, I will be missing a significant amount of 1080p content that even the cheaper sets of the future will easily handle. This bugs me.



I guess this answers my question about the PS3 1080p over component and the "Any problems with an XBOX360" question.

It fails the deinterlace test in DRC "mode 2" but passes in "mode 1" or DRC set to
"OFF"
The Sony STR-DA5200ES provides analog to HDMI video upconversion to 1080p
with a Faroudja DCDi cinema scaling. 1080p compatible HDMI digital video switching (3 in, 1 out).

Sony STR-DA5200ES review
post #3189 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by petmic10 View Post

It fails the deinterlace test in DRC "mode 2" but passes in "mode 1" or DRC set to
"OFF"
The Sony STR-DA5200ES provides analog to HDMI video upconversion to 1080p
with a Faroudja DCDi cinema scaling. 1080p compatible HDMI digital video switching (3 in, 1 out).

Sony STR-DA5200ES review

Thanks! That's actually what poped up in Google when I searched for one. My OCD is telling me to wait for an HDMI1.3 version but the "Why you don't need HDMI1.3" thread is telling me to ignore that. Anyway, the deinterlacing test for 24fps source material is what they call the 3:2 Film Cadence test and they refer to something else as the deinterlacing test. The 3:2 test failed with no asterisks denoting a solution. This is the test I am most concerned about... not because it is the only one without a work-around, but because it is the type of deinterlacing that results in truely added detail per-fream. The deinterlacing of 1080i television content doesn't concern me because any detail added is false detail. Having a work-around is nice though. Any way to tell if the STR-DA5200ES would fail this same test?

Another random HD question:
1080i = 30 full 1080-line frames per second consisting of 60 interlaced fields per second (field != frame).
1080p = 60 full 1080-line frames per second consisting of 60 non interlaced fields per second (field = frame).

Is this correct? Will deinterlacing 1080i will require twice the refresh rate? You know, as in 60 full resolution images per second vs. 30 "frames combined to be full resolution" frames per second.
Is this correct?as defined in the HD spec and ATSC 1080 lines
post #3190 of 3414
Having a problem guys,

I have a new 40XBR3 with my nvidia FX5900XT hooked up with a DVI-->HDMI cable. The picture is great at 1900 x 1080. When i turn the TV off and leave the computer running i will come back and turn the TV on but receive nothing but a blank screen. I have to unplug and replug the dvi on the back of the computer and the XBR3 will come back on. I have also had this problem when just surfing the internet or using the computer, the screen will flicker to a blank screen and might come back on after ~30sec. Any idea, would the DVI doctor from monoprice solve this isssue? I am very upset after spending 3K on my TV and wall mount setup.
post #3191 of 3414
No problems with blank screens at this end. My XBR3 works very well with my PC on the VGA input but when using a DVI to HDMI adapter, there is a whitish halo of pixels aroundthe text being displayed.

I have had no issues with overscan or artifacts like some of theother reports on this thread. Anyone one else getting the same thing?
post #3192 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by theRchitect View Post

According to the HD Guru (http://www.hometheatermag.com/hookme...ook/index.html), it doesn't properly do inverse-telecine on 1080i material (just 480i), so even if it does deinterlace 1080i/60 properly to 1080p, it won't handle motion correctly for HD 24fps (film) sources.

This issue has been bothering me for some time, and is the only issue stopping me from buying a XBR2.

Does anybody know if this issues occurs with unflagged 3:2 material, flagged 3:2 meterial, or both? I doubt the test pattern they used was flagged as 3:2. I wonder if the set handles the 3:2 pulldown correctly with flagged material. Don't most film based DVD's, HD-DVD, Blue-ray contain a 3:2 flag?
post #3193 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gad Zookz View Post

No problems with blank screens at this end. My XBR3 works very well with my PC on the VGA input but when using a DVI to HDMI adapter, there is a whitish halo of pixels aroundthe text being displayed.

I have had no issues with overscan or artifacts like some of theother reports on this thread. Anyone one else getting the same thing?

yeah the white shadow in DVI>HDMI is annoying, it's an artificial contrast enhancement you may be able to reduce with some advanced video settings (use Custom instead of Vivid, but there are lots of settings)

I use Text mode on the PC input, tiny fonts are true. But changing to Video mode on the PC input adds some of the fake enhancement too.
post #3194 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin_barr View Post

yeah the white shadow in DVI>HDMI is annoying, it's an artificial contrast enhancement you may be able to reduce with some advanced video settings (use Custom instead of Vivid, but there are lots of settings)

I use Text mode on the PC input, tiny fonts are true. But changing to Video mode on the PC input adds some of the fake enhancement too.

Thanks for this. I fiddled around with the settings quite a bit when I first bought the set but finally gave up and switched to VGA which works very well. I guess there is no magic bullet here.
post #3195 of 3414
hello owners and future owners of XBRs!!!

I would like to know where did you buy or are going to buy your XBR2/XBR3?

Was planning to buy a KDL-40XBR3 on ebay but wanted to get your views if buying on ebay(or other online stores) is a right choice. What problems/advantages would I face if I buy the TV on ebay?

Thanks
post #3196 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin_K View Post

There already is a native 1080p 360 game. NBA Street Homecourt came out a few weeks ago and it does 1080p quite nicely

Lost Planet has been out for a bit too and it looks sweet. 1080p. I mulled over the 1080iv1080p thing for a while and what it boils down to for me is that I have one of the best looking sets on the market and I did not spend all this money to sit around discerning the difference between the pic quality of 1080i and 1080p. Enjoy your sets. Mine looks awesome.
post #3197 of 3414
I have a 40xbr2 that I tried to do dvi to hdmi on with a bfg geforce 6800 gt card in it and the text looked very blurry/distorted. I connect the computer via VGA and it worked/looked normal. I'm running windows xp media center edition. Are there any special settings I might be missing to get my TV to work with my computer via dvi-hdmi without it being blurry?
post #3198 of 3414
Hello owners!

Please help me decide where to buy my first XBR2/3.....

I have been reading a lot from J&R.... Just want to know how many bought their XBR2/3 from J&R??? How was the experience? How about their shipping???
post #3199 of 3414
I bought my 46" XBR2 at Best Buy last week along with a Sanus tilting mount.

Everything is set up and works perfectly (except for the slight clouding).
post #3200 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by yujin59 View Post

hello owners and future owners of XBRs!!!

I would like to know where did you buy or are going to buy your XBR2/XBR3?

Was planning to buy a KDL-40XBR3 on ebay but wanted to get your views if buying on ebay(or other online stores) is a right choice. What problems/advantages would I face if I buy the TV on ebay?

Thanks

You posted twice about this, so I figured I'd usher in an opinion If you must buy online, I would advise to buy from any authorized retailer (look at the list available at sonystyle.com when you click to buy a 40XBR3). About J&R, they're Sony authorized, so I would buy from them if they have a low price. Check their feedback on places like resellerratings to make sure though. About eBay, Advanteges: Lowest price you can probably get on the TV. Disadvantages: Warranty might not be honored by Sony and other factors that I cannot generalize for all the eBay sellers (i.e. they might use lesser quality trucking companies to deliver the product). You better call and ask a lot of questions before you buy it on eBay and make sure you and the seller have a clear understanding of the terms and if there are any problems that might arise such as a TV arriving broken. Make sure you're not buying a refurbished product either.

As for your other question, I bought a 40XBR3 online from an authorized Sony dealer (not J&R) that had the lowest price at the time (not counting eBay). I got an August build that had a VERY LOW serial number with no clouds. This was in December. I would always advise to buy it from a physical retail store for this reason. Anyway, buying it authorized gives the peace of mind of KNOWING your warranty is valid for 1 year and 6 months is more than worth the price IMHO, but I've heard stories of people saying Sony will honor non authorized places so long as you can show them some sort of receipt (again that's WHAT I HEARD, not from my own experience with Sony, as they are usually very picky about these things so I didn't want to risk getting into a debate with them if a service rep decided to play the "you're out of luck, you didn't buy it from an authorized store" card).
post #3201 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by yujin59 View Post

Please help me decide where to buy my first XBR2/3.....
I have been reading a lot from J&R.... Just want to know how many bought their XBR2/3 from J&R??? How was the experience? How about their shipping???

I did BOTH! I bought my 46XBR2 from Circuit City, but price-matched J&R. In fact, CC price-matched the price I price-matched at Best Buy, which was LOWER than the J&R price w/o shipping. It got very exciting. So, get your best on-line price and then go to the local B&M and get them to price-match. And get your warranty through Sony Style. It's cheaper than CC or BB. I carried my TV home in the back of a Volvo station wagon, so shipping was not an issue for me.
post #3202 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by petmic10 View Post

HD DVD:
Toshiba HD-A2: 720p & 1080i
Toshiba HD-XA2: 720p, 1080i, & 1080p
Toshiba HD-A20(not released yet) same as XA2 but cheaper.

BluRay:
Sony PS3 currently only plays dvd's at 480p but a fw upgrade is rumored
to be released that will upscale dvd's to 1080p.
Pioneer BDP-HD1 does.
Sony BDP-S1 does.

All over hdmi.

Just for information sake that some might not know -
The main difference between the Toshiba HD-XA2 and the HD-A20:
HD-XA2 supports HDMI 1.3 ($609.99 at Amazon)
HD-A20 supports HDMI 1.2a ($599.99 at Amazon when available)

The Sony XBR2 and XBR3 support only HDMI 1.2a.
post #3203 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by CZroe View Post

1080p = 60 full 1080-line frames per second consisting of 60 non interlaced fields per second (field = frame).

1080p/30 = 1920x1080 @30fps progressive scan (non interlaced)
1080p/60 = 1920x1080 @60fps progressive scan (non interlaced)

I have also seen encodes of:
1080p/25 = 1920x1080 @25fps progressive scan (non interlaced)
1080p/50 = 1920x1080 @50fps progressive scan (non interlaced)


1080i signals are converted to 1080p/60 utilizing "inverse telecine" also known as "3:2 pulldown reversal".
post #3204 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldscubaguy View Post

Just for information sake that some might not know -
The main difference between the Toshiba HD-XA2 and the HD-A20:
HD-XA2 supports HDMI 1.3 ($609.99 at Amazon)
HD-A20 supports HDMI 1.2a ($599.99 at Amazon when available)

The Sony XBR2 and XBR3 support only HDMI 1.2a.

I disagree. The significant difference between the two models is that the XA2 comes with the SiliconOptix Reon video chip, which performs true HQV upconverting of standard DVDs, to 1080p. The A2 (or A20, as it is also known) does not have this HQV chip - nor does any other available HD-DVD or BluRay player just now. That's a MUCH bigger, real-world, right now difference that helps makes the XA2 a great player. It's essentially a first-rate high-end upconverting DVD player that happens to play HD-DVDs at 1080p, too. It also has discrete 5.1 DD outputs if that matters, but the Big Deal is the fantastic upconversion of DVDs this thing does. Something that a little online reading about and first-hand viewing of the A2 and XA2 reveals. This is huge if you have a good-sized personal library of DVDs. Think of the HDMI 1.3 support as a bonus for the future...

FWIW, none of the current BluRay players are it's equal in DVD upconversion, but the new Samsung BR player is supposed to come with a Reon so that will change.

Cheers!
-3Gun
post #3205 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3Gun View Post

(Since that was the only channel with the issue) there can be no doubt the problem was with your signal, so only D*TV or CBS can help you. I suggest complaints directed at your provider and the network would be appropriate. If consumers don't complain about this sort of stuff, the signal providers/sources have little incentive to improve the signal. Threaten to vote with your consumer dollars, that is our leverage.

Cheers!
-3Gun

The networks can throttle up or down the bandwidth pumping out the minimum HD signal of 11Mbps to about 45 Mbps. By contract they can't go lower than 11 Mbps for HD I think, or whatever is negotiated with the providers. It makes for a crappy HD signal that low though. That is why you see differences in HD quality being broadcasted.
post #3206 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSDearborn View Post

The networks can throttle up or down the bandwidth pumping out the minimum HD signal of 11Mbps to about 45 Mbps. By contract they can't go lower than 11 Mbps for HD I think, or whatever is negotiated with the providers. It makes for a crappy HD signal that low though. That is why you see differences in HD quality being broadcasted.

Aye. And the "...whatever is negotiated with the providers...", there's the rub. There are all too many low-bandwidth channels (both SD and HD) from all providers at this time. They all seem to be caught up in the race of "# of HD channels" they offer, losing sight of the fact that with HD, it's Quality over Quantity that really counts. Let's face it, with a great low-compression feed most people will sit and watch a flower open on one of these 1080p sets. So again, they need direct feedback from the consumers (that being us) to encourage them to give us more bandwidth per channel - even if it means losing a bunch of home shopping and re-run channels...

Prosit!
-3Gun
post #3207 of 3414
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3Gun View Post

Aye. And the "...whatever is negotiated with the providers...", there's the rub. There are all too many low-bandwidth channels (both SD and HD) from all providers at this time. They all seem to be caught up in the race of "# of HD channels" they offer, losing sight of the fact that with HD, it's Quality over Quantity that really counts. Let's face it, with a great low-compression feed most people with sit and watch a flower open on one of these 1080p sets. So again, they need direct feedback from the consumers (that being us) to encourage them to give us more bandwidth per channel - even if it means losing a bunch of home shopping and re-run channels...

Prosit!
-3Gun

Look at it this way.....bandwidth has become a commodity. The less you use the less $$ you spend. And it is expensive. I used to sell IP pipes up to optical carrier level. I went back to the car biz after the WorldCom debacle. Oh well its all transport....One of these days someone will teleport something with bandwidth.

And I would love to sit and watch a flower open in 1080p. I just watched Casino Royale on my PS3 Blu-Ray and it was stunning.

Jeff
post #3208 of 3414
Here is a silly question...

I have had my 40xbr2 since Dec and noticed something odd. For whatever reason the other night, I wanted to see what exactly the light sensor did. I turned it on and it dimmed the picture. I figured it had something to do with how bright my room was since it, in theory, would dim according to ambient lighting. I turned down the brightness of the lighting and the dimming never changed. I turned off all the lights and the dimming was still just as dark.

Is this normal for it to not work as I thought it should? Is the light sensor really just another way to turn power savings on low? They seem to yield the same results.
post #3209 of 3414
If you have Power Saving mode on, you may see little or no difference when you turn on the Light Sensor.
post #3210 of 3414
no no, power savings is off. I was just explaining that the results are the same if i use light sensor or power savings in low.

To me this doesn't matter, but I figured since this feature was built into the set, I should see what it does..which appears to be nothing more than setting power savings to low.
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