or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › HDTV › HDTV Recorders › Time Warner Cable Navigator
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Time Warner Cable Navigator - Page 556

post #16651 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Has anyone noticed if you are near the last eight or less minutes of the program, if you use the FF (to skip a break), then go back into play, the end of recording screen appears blocking the viseo, but the audio continues on? You have to rewind a couple of minutes to get the video back.

It happens with ODN 5.0 as well. I've noticed it as early as 5 minutes from the end if I'm FF 3x or 4x speed. If I FF at 2x closer to the end it reduces the chance of it occurring. Also, it only takes a short rewind like pressing rewind and then immediately press play to clear it. Still annoying that it brings up the screen way before it's actually at the end.
post #16652 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satch Man View Post

As I understand,
A long term goal for TWC will be to move away from the boxes and have everything be "Cloud Based."

Seems like any time my Samsung box has to go out to bring back new data from the outside, it takes forever. (ex. populating any OD menu). Can't imagine how slow it would be if the box (and everyone elses box at the same time) had to look outside for everything.

Processing power and memory has gotten relatively cheap. Why not simply make the STBs at least as powerful as a cheap cell phone?
Edited by Derfram - 7/16/12 at 8:16am
post #16653 of 18537
Quote:
I’ve been using set top boxes from one provider or another since 1998, I couldn’t imagine not having one, and I don’t see what the big deal is. I want my TV to be a dumb box. I don’t want it to have a tuner of any sort, I don’t want it have any 9 thousand inputs I’ll never use, I don’t want it to have a built in anything, I don’t want it running any sort of advanced firmware. I want it to have an HDMI input or two and an Ethernet jack.
I believe they are called "monitors". wink.gif

Quote:
I have no use for OTA, analog cable or unencrypted QAM, and therefore have no use for those tuners. I have never even used my new TVs internal tuner
Well, you are in the minority AFAIC. Then you don't "watch TV" as most would define it.
OTA is one of the benefits of living in the US (and a lessor extent Canada). It's available to most everyone except one that want to be isolated or live in a apartment prison. All basic services on 'cable' should be 'in the clear' just like the basic analog has always been, Grandfathered in. Leave the encrypted stuff to the upper tiers. Why should I want to use a separate box to watch regular TV; OTA and/or a 'standard' CATV tier?

Quote:
To be legally called a TV a device has to have a tuner and today the tunner must be ATSC capable. Without a tunner it has to be called a monitor.
According to what he posted, he doesn't watch "TV". rolleyes.gif
.
Edited by videobruce - 7/16/12 at 8:38am
post #16654 of 18537
Quote:
A long term goal for TWC will be to move away from the boxes and have everything be "Cloud Based." By reducing the needed hardware,
What reduction in "hardware"?? You still need some type of interface box.
Stupid idea. They are in a "cloud" just like M$ (it was M$ wasn't it) that apparently came up with the lame idea.

They need to worry about short term goals like providing proper documentation.
post #16655 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Quote:
A long term goal for TWC will be to move away from the boxes and have everything be "Cloud Based." By reducing the needed hardware,
What reduction in "hardware"?? You still need some type of interface box.
Stupid idea. They are in a "cloud" just like M$ (it was M$ wasn't it) that apparently came up with the lame idea.
They need to worry about short term goals like providing proper documentation.

The interface box was supposed to be the CableCard slot in a Tru2Way system. Pop the card in, plug in the cable wire and your done. For some reason, the big cable ops refuse to embrace third party ideas - we still don't have a DVR that gives full function with Time Warner.
post #16656 of 18537
Because the FCC didn't enforce the rules and TWC (and all the other MSO's) didn't want it. mad.gif
And then there are the corporate fan boys that support big business no matter what.
post #16657 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Because the FCC didn't enforce the rules and TWC (and all the other MSO's) didn't want it. mad.gif
And then there are the corporate fan boys that support big business no matter what.

And why didn't the FCC enforce the rules? Lobbyists - the MSO's have become too big, just like the cell phone companies. There is no reason we shouldn't have multiple third party options right now. The Tru2Way worked - it was demoed in 2009 fully integrated with the guide and everything on the TV - it would have saved a bundle for MSO's to have embraced it, so there has to be something else in play.
post #16658 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Quote:
A long term goal for TWC will be to move away from the boxes and have everything be "Cloud Based." By reducing the needed hardware,
What reduction in "hardware"?? You still need some type of interface box.
Stupid idea. They are in a "cloud" just like M$ (it was M$ wasn't it) that apparently came up with the lame idea.
They need to worry about short term goals like providing proper documentation.

Actually,

I wouldn't worry about cloud services too much. The boxes aren't going away anytime soon. (Estimates are that we will see the boxes for another 5-8 years.) There is still MUCH, MUCH work to be done on getting the guide, current boxes, and nodes, all up to a more uniform standard. Too much fluctuation in service performance from state to state, city to city, and node to node. The guide still has a long way to go in many areas:

*Improved keyboard speed with multiple listing data on many ODN boxes.

*Set search options for the keyboard to search for all instances of keywords across the boxes as the default. I hear complaints from many customers who say the keyboard being title based only is restricting their ability to find their shows. Sports shows, almost never organized by the guide keyboards default Title Search, illustrate the problem with the system. (i.e current system key in Football does NOT show all Football games on the keyboard. This is 2012. I'll say this till it's added, NO EXCUSES WHY A MODERN STB KEYBOARD CAN'T DO KEYWORD SEARCHES ACROSS ALL BOXES! The not enough memory argument is b.s! Passport did this a decade ago, TWC can't do it now?

*Advanced search options for Whole House and Signature Home Subs should default to "All" instances of a search on the keyboard, and stay their until the setting is changed.

* A true guide filter that allows the physical removal of channels from the guide in searches until changed by the customer.

*The ability for DVR Manager to store shows and settings on the server, so that when a box is exchanged, the shows and settings can be transferred back to the box.

Jack
post #16659 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

The interface box was supposed to be the CableCard slot in a Tru2Way system. Pop the card in, plug in the cable wire and your done. For some reason, the big cable ops refuse to embrace third party ideas - we still don't have a DVR that gives full function with Time Warner.
Not quite: CableCard was around long before (2003) "Tru2Way" (2008).

The CableCard was the result of the 1996 Telecommunications law that as intended to:
Quote:
"...assure the commercial availability to consumers of multichannel video programming and other services offered over multichannel video programming systems, of converter boxes, interactive communications equipment, and other equipment used by consumers to access multichannel video programming and other services offered over multichannel video programming systems, from manufacturers, retailers, and other vendors not affiliated with any multichannel video programming distributor."

The problem was, the CableCard was a decoding device only, and did not provide any sort of back communication. I understand that there were discussions of including backwards communication needed for SDV or OnDemand (which were just starting to emerge at the time) and that the Consumer Electronics industry opposed that due to added costs.

After the first CableCards were deployed this shortcoming was realized and the cable industry (under pressure from the FCC) developed OCAP (Open Cable Application Platform), which was later renamed "Tru2Way"). That, BTW, is the basis for ODN (OCAP Digital Network). Panasonic came out with a few "Tru2Way" Plasma TVs in late 2007 in a few cities that had Tru2Way implemented (by Comcast). They dropped those sets in 2010.

So, unfortunately, the original objectives of the 1996 Telecommunications law have not been met. However, the FCC is still charged with implemented that law. Now they are pursuing a new approach (AllVid), but progress on this seems slow (at least any progress is not visible to the outside world.

The real problem with this sort of thing (the government dictating that something be done) is that the actual technology moves much faster than the regulatory mechanism.
post #16660 of 18537
Quote:
Well, you are in the minority AFAIC. Then you don't "watch TV" as most would define it.
OTA is one of the benefits of living in the US (and a lessor extent Canada). It's available to most everyone except one that want to be isolated or live in a apartment prison. All basic services on 'cable' should be 'in the clear' just like the basic analog has always been, Grandfathered in. Leave the encrypted stuff to the upper tiers. Why should I want to use a separate box to watch regular TV; OTA and/or a 'standard' CATV tier?
Not sure how I’m in the minority.

Analog Cable – is dying a slow death, many Comcast systems have already drastically cut back on analog, other MSOs will be following. Bandwidth is needed in other areas.

OTA – There are 100 million pay TV subscribers in the US, there are 116 million TV households in the US, well over 80% of the population does not use OTA

Unencrypted QAM – How many people outside of enthusiast sites like this even now what QAM is?


I watch tons on TV, just not on an internal tuner, just look a good chunk of the US population.

Speaking of tuners, If you want to talk about eliminating set top boxes, how will providing multiple digital tuners for recording and buffering of multiple channels work? My cable boxes have 2 tuners and require only one run of coax, my DirecTV box has 5 tuners and only requires one drop of coax. Cable companies and TV manufactures would need to come up with their own version of DirecTVs SWiM set up.
post #16661 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by davehancock View Post

Not quite: CableCard was around long before (2003) "Tru2Way" (2008).
The CableCard was the result of the 1996 Telecommunications law that as intended to:
Quote:
"...assure the commercial availability to consumers of multichannel video programming and other services offered over multichannel video programming systems, of converter boxes, interactive communications equipment, and other equipment used by consumers to access multichannel video programming and other services offered over multichannel video programming systems, from manufacturers, retailers, and other vendors not affiliated with any multichannel video programming distributor."
The problem was, the CableCard was a decoding device only, and did not provide any sort of back communication. I understand that there were discussions of including backwards communication needed for SDV or OnDemand (which were just starting to emerge at the time) and that the Consumer Electronics industry opposed that due to added costs.
After the first CableCards were deployed this shortcoming was realized and the cable industry (under pressure from the FCC) developed OCAP (Open Cable Application Platform), which was later renamed "Tru2Way"). That, BTW, is the basis for ODN (OCAP Digital Network). Panasonic came out with a few "Tru2Way" Plasma TVs in late 2007 in a few cities that had Tru2Way implemented (by Comcast). They dropped those sets in 2010.
So, unfortunately, the original objectives of the 1996 Telecommunications law have not been met. However, the FCC is still charged with implemented that law. Now they are pursuing a new approach (AllVid), but progress on this seems slow (at least any progress is not visible to the outside world.
The real problem with this sort of thing (the government dictating that something be done) is that the actual technology moves much faster than the regulatory mechanism.

Quite indeed - Tru2Way was based upon the CableCard that already existed or in some cases referred to as CableCard 2.0 (albeit incorrectly). That said the system was based upon a CableCard being required for decoding the signals.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0Z2WBfUTpc

Now, firmware would probably have to have been adapted for SDV. The Tru2Way system was in place and available by 2009, but died from lack of support from MSO's and was discontinued by 2010 as you stated.

http://hd.engadget.com/2010/07/29/retail-tru2way-devies-are-officially-doa-even-panasonic-stops-t/

It really had potential as the software could have allowed for DVR feature offered simply be connecting an external drive.
Edited by BenJF3 - 7/16/12 at 2:47pm
post #16662 of 18537
Quote:
well over 80% of the population does not use OTA
Their loss. Either through laziness or lack of awareness (with the assumption OTA signals are available and of sufficient quantity to be worth while to install some type of antenna other that "rabbit ears")

Close to 20% is still a substantial number. wink.gif
post #16663 of 18537
OTA should always be an option. ATSC tuners are inexpensive and don't add much cost to any device. In fact, one of the main reasons I balked at the new Tivo 4 TTuner model was lack of OTA. (The other remains lack of VOD). If Tivo and Time Warner come to an agreement to allow VOD, I will likely be done with Navigator. In a dual market where Time Warner or DirecTV/Dish refuse to carry out actual HD locals in lieu of the DMA boundry, having OTA is a great way to get both.
post #16664 of 18537
The hard drive in my 8300HD died and my local service center only had 8300HDC's available as a similar replacement. I connect via component to my HDTV and use the RF out on the DVR to run to a TV in my bedroom. Unfortunately, my 500GB esata drive, which worked wonderfully with the 8300HD, isn't working with the 8300HDC. The HDC has the black guide, so is running the lastest software. Upon initial power-on of the esata drive, the HDC recognized it and said it was paired with another DVR. After selecting "A" to continue, nothing happened. Grasping at straws, I formatted the drive with NTFS then tried connecting it to the DVR once again. This time, though video on the TV paused briefly, there was no recognition of the drive. I haven't found anything definitive (and recent) in the forum as to whether this should work or not.

The 8300HDC is slow as snails compared to the 8300HD, particularly when it comes to switching the native resolution when changing channels and when searching for shows using the keyboard. Perhaps I should give up on the RF out and find another solution for duplicating the DVR video to two TVs (I'm willing to upgrade my bedroom TV from standard def, if needed smile.gif). Any ideas either getting the esata drive to work or for solutions to broadcast television from a single DVR to multiple TVs? I haven't looked into the price hit for the "whole home DVR" option yet.

Thank you!
Chris
Edited by rollcage - 7/17/12 at 8:54am
post #16665 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollcage View Post

The hard drive in my 8300HD died and my local service center only had 8300HDC's available as a similar replacement. I connect via component to my HDTV and use the RF out on the DVR to run to a TV in my bedroom. Unfortunately, my 500GB esata drive, which worked wonderfully with the 8300HD, isn't working with the 8300HDC. The HDC has the black guide, so is running the lastest software. Upon initial power-on of the esata drive, the HDC recognized it and said it was paired with another DVR. After selecting "A" to continue, nothing happened. Grasping at straws, I formatted the drive with NTFS then tried connecting it to the DVR once again. This time, though video on the TV paused briefly, there was no recognition of the drive. I haven't found anything definitive (and recent) in the forum as to whether this should work or not.
The 8300HDC is slow as snails compared to the 8300HD, particularly when it comes to switching the native resolution when changing channels and when searching for shows using the keyboard. Perhaps I should give up on the RF out and find another solution for duplicating the DVR video to two TVs (I'm willing to upgrade my bedroom TV from standard def, if needed smile.gif). Any ideas either getting the esata drive to work or for solutions to broadcast television from a single DVR to multiple TVs? I haven't looked into the price hit for the "whole home DVR" option yet.
Thank you!
Chris
You could always cancel TW because of poor box performance. Schedule the disconnect 2 weeks, or so, out to give you time to install satellite. The next working day you will get a call from TW retentions offering a deal of some sort. They offered me a deal for Multi-Room which included two 8742 DVRs (each had 500GB storage) at a price lower than I was paying for my single SA8300HD.

BTW: The SD RF out still works on the 8742 when using HDMI out for additional SD TVs (when watching the same program, of course).
post #16666 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Mehs View Post

OTA – There are 100 million pay TV subscribers in the US, there are 116 million TV households in the US, well over 80% of the population does not use OTA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Quote:
well over 80% of the population does not use OTA
Close to 20% is still a substantial number. wink.gif
The two services are not mutually exclusive. It's been estimated a substantial number of households with pay TV subscriptions also make use of OTA -- i.e. cable box in the family room and smaller sets in the bedrooms with rabbit ears. It is difficult to get a true estimate of households using OTA, the numbers vary quite a bit -- but it is clear that the numerical difference between TV households and pay-TV households is just a lower bound.
post #16667 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by davehancock View Post

The SD RF out still works on the 8742 when using HDMI out for additional SD TVs (when watching the same program, of course).

Dave, if you turn off the TV connected via HDMI, does the RF out stop working after a short period of time? I had this issue with my 8300HD due to HDCP. I switched to component rather than HDMI to get around that problem.

I wonder if they'll let me have an 8742 without going to multi-room.

Chris
post #16668 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollcage View Post

Dave, if you turn off the TV connected via HDMI, does the RF out stop working after a short period of time? I had this issue with my 8300HD due to HDCP. I switched to component rather than HDMI to get around that problem.
Yes, it works fine with TV turned off (just double checked).
Quote:
I wonder if they'll let me have an 8742 without going to multi-room.
Chris
I doubt it. As I understand it, the 8642s &8742s have been reserved for multi-room. But if you can get multi-room for less then you are paying now - why not get it?
post #16669 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by davehancock View Post

I doubt it. As I understand it, the 8642s &8742s have been reserved for multi-room. But if you can get multi-room for less then you are paying now - why not get it?

I know for a fact that customers in my division have been given 8642's and were only basic DVR subs. YMMV depending on location.
post #16670 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

I know for a fact that customers in my division have been given 8642's and were only basic DVR subs. YMMV depending on location.

My theory is that because Charlotte, NC and Saracuse, NY are designated new test sites for updates, (they get them first before anybody else.) is that those divisions are willing to give out new boxes. Sometimes the new boxes can be in short supply too. It really varies depending on your location.

I'm still surprised that MDN (legacy, no-C) boxes got the new guide update (MDN 3.2.) ODN (newer boxes, C-Models, and Samsungs) got ODN 5.2. Interesting that TWC choose to incorporate MDN in this update, thought FOR SURE MDN boxes were going to be abandoned. However, there are still millions of MDN boxes in the field, and I know there is a division in Pennsylvania, that is ONLY giving out MDN boxes, unless you are a whole house/Signature Home Sub.

I heard San Diego, which used to be a first software test site, not so much anymore is only giving Cisco/Samsung boxes to Whole House/Signature Home Suns. A source told me that in about six months they WILL start giving out the modern Cisco's/Samsungs to everyone, provided that they have the inventory to do that.

Most divisions because of the economy are waiting for the legacy boxes to get completely phased out of the system. (At least three-five years yet) than the techs will start swapping them out on a case-by-case basis. There is one guarantee way to get a modern box, no matter what. Subscribe to Whole House DVR or Signature Home Service.

Jack
post #16671 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollcage View Post

The hard drive in my 8300HD died and my local service center only had 8300HDC's available as a similar replacement. I connect via component to my HDTV and use the RF out on the DVR to run to a TV in my bedroom. Unfortunately, my 500GB esata drive, which worked wonderfully with the 8300HD, isn't working with the 8300HDC. The HDC has the black guide, so is running the lastest software. Upon initial power-on of the esata drive, the HDC recognized it and said it was paired with another DVR. After selecting "A" to continue, nothing happened. Grasping at straws, I formatted the drive with NTFS then tried connecting it to the DVR once again. This time, though video on the TV paused briefly, there was no recognition of the drive. I haven't found anything definitive (and recent) in the forum as to whether this should work or not.
...
Thank you!
Chris
Go and read and ask here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/516559/8300hd-and-external-sata-it-works

/Dan
post #16672 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollcage View Post

The hard drive in my 8300HD died and my local service center only had 8300HDC's available as a similar replacement. I connect via component to my HDTV and use the RF out on the DVR to run to a TV in my bedroom. Unfortunately, my 500GB esata drive, which worked wonderfully with the 8300HD, isn't working with the 8300HDC. The HDC has the black guide, so is running the lastest software. Upon initial power-on of the esata drive, the HDC recognized it and said it was paired with another DVR. After selecting "A" to continue, nothing happened. Grasping at straws, I formatted the drive with NTFS then tried connecting it to the DVR once again. This time, though video on the TV paused briefly, there was no recognition of the drive. I haven't found anything definitive (and recent) in the forum as to whether this should work or not.
The 8300HDC is slow as snails compared to the 8300HD, particularly when it comes to switching the native resolution when changing channels and when searching for shows using the keyboard. Perhaps I should give up on the RF out and find another solution for duplicating the DVR video to two TVs (I'm willing to upgrade my bedroom TV from standard def, if needed smile.gif). Any ideas either getting the esata drive to work or for solutions to broadcast television from a single DVR to multiple TVs? I haven't looked into the price hit for the "whole home DVR" option yet.
Thank you!
Chris

I've used 160GB esata drives with 8300HDC units. Perhaps its the size that matters (no pun intended!)

Also, you can buy component cable splitters for a few $'s. So splitting the component shouldn't be an issue. You can even buy component to S-Video converters in case your other TV doesn't support component. Good luck!
post #16673 of 18537
co worked came up to me today and was pissed. seems his box got the NEW UPDATE the other day now his FIREWIRE is going crazy. anytime the computer connects to the box it SHUTS the box off and reboots it. I was just reading about a person with a HDMI issues sounds kind of like the same type of problem.
he called tw and told them about the firewire and they said we will have to roll a truck out. im like really to make the firewire active again u need to roll a tech out.

did anyone else have this problem with the new update SAY BYE BYE TO FIREWIRE
post #16674 of 18537

This is in violation of the FCC guideline, as cableco's must provide a 1394 STB for those that want one.

post #16675 of 18537
Since the 5.2 update, my boxes have been turning on to the Channel 1 barker instead of "Last Channel", as they are set for. Not 100%, but at least 80% of the time.

It's happening on the 8640, the 3260s and the 4250. Not a serious issue but still very annoying. Anybody else?
post #16676 of 18537
You can go into the menu and set that to the last channel viewed or any specif channel of your choice, other than that useless 'barter' channel. (Sorry, I can't tell you exactly where that setting is)
post #16677 of 18537
I'm assuming you checked the settings and they are set for last channel. If this is the case your boxes might be rebooting and causing the start up channel to default to channel 1. When I reboot any of my boxes they will always start up on channel 3, but the settings still show last channel. If no reboot occurs they start up on last channel. I'm not sure why your boxes would keep rebooting, could be power interruptions or signal from head end. Or maybe I'm totally wrong about this. Good luck.
post #16678 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvfan2005 View Post

This is in violation of the FCC guideline, as cableco's must provide a 1394 STB for those that want one.

it sure is and he even told them on the phone - he will have to wait for the TECH to show up to enable it again



-
well last night my cable box rebooted about 3am and then never came back on said BOOT then B108 then BOOT again over and over i called TW and they said i need a new box LOL
2 years with this samsung DVR and now it goes bad and dont wanna turn on.
post #16679 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

You can go into the menu and set that to the last channel viewed or any specif channel of your choice, other than that useless 'barter' channel. (Sorry, I can't tell you exactly where that setting is)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacko15 View Post

I'm assuming you checked the settings and they are set for last channel. If this is the case your boxes might be rebooting and causing the start up channel to default to channel 1. When I reboot any of my boxes they will always start up on channel 3, but the settings still show last channel. If no reboot occurs they start up on last channel. I'm not sure why your boxes would keep rebooting, could be power interruptions or signal from head end. Or maybe I'm totally wrong about this. Good luck.

Startup channel is - and has always been - set for "last channel". Since the 5.2 update, its not respecting that setting, and its doing it on all four boxes.

It's definitely not a reboot issue... last recorded reboot dates are relatively old and manually performed by me.
post #16680 of 18537
Quote:
Originally Posted by p0tsm0ke View Post

it sure is and he even told them on the phone - he will have to wait for the TECH to show up to enable it again
-
well last night my cable box rebooted about 3am and then never came back on said BOOT then B108 then BOOT again over and over i called TW and they said i need a new box LOL
2 years with this samsung DVR and now it goes bad and dont wanna turn on.

What's the box doing now? Do you have a truck roll? You could try a cold reboot. Turn off everything (box, TV, all cable related equipment.) After everything is set to off, unplug the box for 20-30 minutes. Now, without turning anything back on, plug the box back in, and don't turn it on until the clock shows in the boxes' display and stays there for about 15 seconds.

If the unplug and 20 minutes wait time does not solve the issue, (years ago we had a box that got stuck too-had to swap it out.) you will need to swap it out.

Jack
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: HDTV Recorders
AVS › AVS Forum › HDTV › HDTV Recorders › Time Warner Cable Navigator