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Time Warner Cable Navigator - Page 608

post #18211 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

TiVo stopped innovating years ago. They exist almost solely on patent lawsuits now as the subscriber base dwindles. I don't see anything groundbreaking on the horizon coming from TiVo.
TiVo has made great strides in the last 2 years.

Summer 2011 - TiVo 4 Tuner Q released to TiVo's MSO partners
Fall 2011 - 4 Tuner TiVo Elite/XL4 w/ 2TB HDD released
Winter 2011/12 - Major overhaul of the UI, Second CPU Core enabled, IP streaming (MRS) between Series 4 Premieres
Sept 2012 - TiVo Stream iOS transcoding IP device released
Winter 2012/13 - Comcast Xfinity VOD available on retail TiVo Premieres (in most markets)
March 2013 - TiVo Mini thin client IP/MoCA streaming STB released

Fall 2013
Expecting the release of all new hardware including a 6 Tuner TiVo
http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2013-04/tivo-hopes-fcc-will-allow-santa-to-deliver-new-dvrs/
http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2013-06/tivo-series-5/
post #18212 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan_CoxPHX View Post

TiVo has made great strides in the last 2 years.

Summer 2011 - TiVo 4 Tuner Q released to TiVo's MSO partners
Fall 2011 - 4 Tuner TiVo Elite/XL4 w/ 2TB HDD released
Winter 2011/12 - Major overhaul of the UI, Second CPU Core enabled, IP streaming (MRS) between Series 4 Premieres
Sept 2012 - TiVo Stream iOS transcoding IP device released
Winter 2012/13 - Comcast Xfinity VOD available on retail TiVo Premieres (in most markets)
March 2013 - TiVo Mini thin client IP/MoCA streaming STB released

Fall 2013
Expecting the release of all new hardware including a 6 Tuner TiVo
http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2013-04/tivo-hopes-fcc-will-allow-santa-to-deliver-new-dvrs/
http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2013-06/tivo-series-5/

And none of that is exactly earth shattering. The XL series was a bust. They took away OTA, still don't support VOD, and have mediocre whole home. 6 tuners are common place and basically the standard now for a whole home system. I'll give them the software advantage because Navigator is absolute crap. However, I can build a system far better with more options via an HTPC and not spend $15 a month for it.

We'll see if TiVo can bring something to the table, but I doubt it.
post #18213 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

And none of that is exactly earth shattering. The XL series was a bust. They took away OTA, still don't support VOD, and have mediocre whole home. 6 tuners are common place and basically the standard now for a whole home system. I'll give them the software advantage because Navigator is absolute crap. However, I can build a system far better with more options via an HTPC and not spend $15 a month for it.

We'll see if TiVo can bring something to the table, but I doubt it.

I am not trying to argue - I use an HTPC myself but...

- VOD is less and less of an issue with Amazon/Netflix/Hulu - and you know full well it is TWC keeping VOD off TiVo, not TiVo.
- 6 tuners are not commonplace - sorry they are not. I bet less than 1% of installed STBs have 6 tuners
- Not everyone can build an HTPC - and there is no support system
- The $15 is basically their rent-to-own plan. The cost outright is $900 for 4 tuner or $1050 for 6.

Yes - this is expensive - but it is the ONLY viable alternative for those without the technical skill and sheer willpower to get an HTPC solution working.

xnappo
post #18214 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

And none of that is exactly earth shattering. The XL series was a bust. They took away OTA, still don't support VOD, and have mediocre whole home. 6 tuners are common place and basically the standard now for a whole home system. I'll give them the software advantage because Navigator is absolute crap. However, I can build a system far better with more options via an HTPC and not spend $15 a month for it.

We'll see if TiVo can bring something to the table, but I doubt it.

I had no idea that 6 Tuner DVRs were now common place.

What are the two most common 6 (or 4) Tuner DVRs currently deployed by the top 5 MSOs?
post #18215 of 18549
I'm saying that 6 tuner options are widely available aince Ceton released the infini6 Ethernet. I should have been more clear and I would state the infini4 is probably more commonplace at this point. The tech is commonplace. The point being any MSO (but we are talking TiVo here) releasing any whole home solution from this point forward is living in the past. xnappo makes all valid points.

The only MSO with a true While Home solution that I've found is Buckeye Cable. They are out there, but the big players choose not to use them. They go the cheap route because the customers don't know any better.
post #18216 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

I'm saying that 6 tuner options are widely available aince Ceton released the infini6 Ethernet. I should have been more clear and I would state the infini4 is probably more commonplace at this point. The tech is commonplace. The point being any MSO (but we are talking TiVo here) releasing any whole home solution from this point forward is living in the past. xnappo makes all valid points.

The only MSO with a true While Home solution that I've found is Buckeye Cable. They are out there, but the big players choose not to use them. They go the cheap route because the customers don't know any better.

You're saying that the Cisco 9800 series is the cheap route?

http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/video/ps11488/ps12334/ps12291/9800_multi-screen.pdf
post #18217 of 18549

Quote:

Originally Posted by Satch Man View Post

Are we saying that if you don't reboot a Cisco 8742 by the first of the month, it slows down due to a presumed memory leak? This was supposed to be fixed in ODN 6.0 for all boxes.
...
I go to my Diags channel in the Favorites list. There's another way to get to more advanced pages of dialog but I forget what that was. Someone will post. If you have a Diags channel in Favorites. If it's there it will be on your highest listing of channel. You tune to that channel. Wait about 30 seconds for Diags to load the data. Than use the Page +/- key to find Software version, which I think is on Page 6. This won't hurt anything. Problem is some divisions hide Diags Settings.

The more advanced way has about 30 pages of dialog. I don't use it, because there's a command that if you do it wrong, called "PERGE" which will mess up your box.

Jack

 

 

So, I can add Channel 1900 (named "Install") to my Favorites list. Strange it doesn't appear in normal Guide channel list. So, using Favorites trick, it loads for a while into a special (blue skinned) screen

 

Mystro - InstallerApp
OD Service Group: 1421

ODN Version: 6.1.0_5  2013/03/14  11:10

(Just one page and misc other items excluded from above)

 

I can try NOT doing my manual monthly reboot, and see how long it lasts without locking-up.

 

Oh, and my DVR Compensation (functionality and options) seem to be missing now as well.


Edited by Tesla1856 - 7/8/13 at 7:27pm
post #18218 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by RDO CA View Post

Dave I agree that the DVR comp going away is a problem for me, as now I always miss some programing as they don't jump back any for me now. I asked a level "4" tech about it and he did not even know that they once had it.

I also running a 8742 on 6.1.0_5 but I just have WholeHouseDVR with normal RoadRunner and free Digital Phone (one line).

 

I just verified DVR-C has been removed as well. A really good feature just gone. Due to patent litigation or reps say performance or even customer complaints (ya right).

 

http://forums.timewarnercable.com/t5/Equipment/DVR-Fast-forward-Removal-of-enhancement/td-p/224

 

It was much too precise to be based on time-markers. Pretty sure it was watching for 2 (or very few) consecutive black frames between commercial at start of program. Had an old VCR that watched for those and it was great. Seems like any tech used for the successful skipping of commercials is always short-lived... pressure from advertisers?


Edited by Tesla1856 - 7/8/13 at 8:56pm
post #18219 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

I'm saying that 6 tuner options are widely available aince Ceton released the infini6 Ethernet. I should have been more clear and I would state the infini4 is probably more commonplace at this point. The tech is commonplace. The point being any MSO (but we are talking TiVo here) releasing any whole home solution from this point forward is living in the past. xnappo makes all valid points.

The only MSO with a true While Home solution that I've found is Buckeye Cable. They are out there, but the big players choose not to use them. They go the cheap route because the customers don't know any better.

Interesting.

 

I wonder what this will be called (Signature Home Plus?) and how much will it cost?

 

http://www.fiercecable.com/story/time-warner-cable-deploy-souped-dvr-second-half-2013/2013-01-31

 

... and will it run Crysis will it have DVR Compensation (sad it's a power-user option now).

post #18220 of 18549
Not looking forward to the cloud-based IPG.

Cablevision in NY/NJ uses it and waiting for the guide to appear after that first button push is as painful as waiting for an oven to pre-heat.
post #18221 of 18549
People are confusing what I mean by "options" with actual set top offerings. You can easily use two Silcon Dust tuners, a Ceton infini6 or inifni4 with addition QAM tuner. There are alternatives. However, my point was more that any subsequent DVR's should have a minimum of 6 tuners for a Whole Home application.
post #18222 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

People are confusing what I mean by "options" with actual set top offerings. You can easily use two Silcon Dust tuners, a Ceton infini6 or inifni4 with addition QAM tuner. There are alternatives. However, my point was more that any subsequent DVR's should have a minimum of 6 tuners for a Whole Home application.
I understand what you are saying now. But that 6 Tuner option is only available if you roll your own HTPC. There is no stand-alone 4 or 6 Tuner DVR option other than TiVo currently for most.

TiVo does currently have a very good Whole Home Solution and will be even better when the 6 Tuner and Dynamic Tuner Allocation is released, probably this Fall.

My TiVo Whole Home Solution is:
1 - 4 Tuner Premiere XL4 w/ 2TB
1 - 2 Tuner Premiere upgraded to 2TB
1 - TiVo Mini

All TiVo devices can access all recordings on both TiVos and will only get better when Dynamic Tuner Allocation, for the Mini, is released for the 4 Tuner Premieres. 6 Tuners are expected to have it at launch. One 6 Tuner TiVo and 2 to 4 Minis will be a great WHDVR solution.

My SD HomeRun Prime was an experiment, (I preferred the TiVo experience) and is now dedicated to the office for LiveTV on my PC.
post #18223 of 18549
Agree and I would like to see TiVo innovate and succeed. TiVo needs access to VOD though. I'm in search of a commercial "one box solution". It'd be nice to have a fully functional set top that also handles streaming content. Like a Whole Home Unit with Roku built in or a Roku Media Extender.
post #18224 of 18549
Perfection is always just a few days away mad.gif
post #18225 of 18549
Wisconsin lost DVR Compwnsation last night ODN 6.1.05. In a non-related move we also lost our NBC sub stations because of another "Roll over or get tough contract dispute with TWC over rates." Supposedly they have to keep our main NBC station (WTMJ-4) on till the end of Sweeps ratings-July 24th I think. It will be hell for TWC-Milwaukee, losing DVR Compensation and the possible NBC stations around the same time.

Jack
post #18226 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satch Man View Post

Wisconsin lost DVR Compwnsation last night ODN 6.1.05. In a non-related move we also lost our NBC sub stations because of another "Roll over or get tough contract dispute with TWC over rates." Supposedly they have to keep our main NBC station (WTMJ-4) on till the end of Sweeps ratings-July 24th I think. It will be hell for TWC-Milwaukee, losing DVR Compensation and the possible NBC stations around the same time.

Jack

It looks like I may have gotten out just in time. I watch TMJ4 more than any other local station, including local news and NBC Nightly News.

The DVR compensation thing is odd. If it's a patent issue, why does DirecTV still have it? I guess they could have paid Tivo for it. I liked the DVR compensation better with TWC, though. With DTV, it doesn't bounce back quite as far.

BTW, DTV has plenty of its own little bugs and glitches. It's better than Navigator, but it's far from perfect.
post #18227 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by badlands7 View Post

It looks like I may have gotten out just in time. I watch TMJ4 more than any other local station, including local news and NBC Nightly News.

The DVR compensation thing is odd. If it's a patent issue, why does DirecTV still have it? I guess they could have paid Tivo for it. I liked the DVR compensation better with TWC, though. With DTV, it doesn't bounce back quite as far.

BTW, DTV has plenty of its own little bugs and glitches. It's better than Navigator, but it's far from perfect.

Yes,

Direct TV or whoever has it, may have to pay residuals to Tivo. Same with TWC if they want it back. While Direct TV has a more modern guide, discounts are harder than with TWC once Promotion rates expire. All third party venders have Retransmission Consent Negotiation contracts and requirements. No vender is immune form them. I believe Direct TV lost U-Verse for awhile, now NBC Sports. Dish Network has lost several channels also due to retransmission contract disputes.

Jack
post #18228 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satch Man View Post

Yes,

Direct TV or whoever has it, may have to pay residuals to Tivo. Same with TWC if they want it back. While Direct TV has a more modern guide, discounts are harder than with TWC once Promotion rates expire. All third party venders have Retransmission Consent Negotiation contracts and requirements. No vender is immune form them. I believe Direct TV lost U-Verse for awhile, now NBC Sports. Dish Network has lost several channels also due to retransmission contract disputes.

Jack
The ultimate solution is to have an antenna to receive local channels when these disputes cut-off cable/satellite access to the local channels. Unfortunately, the DVRs that most people have don't work for OTA. But you could watch live via the ATSC digital tuner on your set.
post #18229 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Satch Man View Post

Wisconsin lost DVR Compwnsation last night ODN 6.1.05. In a non-related move we also lost our NBC sub stations because of another "Roll over or get tough contract dispute with TWC over rates." Supposedly they have to keep our main NBC station (WTMJ-4) on till the end of Sweeps ratings-July 24th I think. It will be hell for TWC-Milwaukee, losing DVR Compensation and the possible NBC stations around the same time.

Jack

So I guess Time Warner just wants you to grit your teeth and bear it? biggrin.gif
post #18230 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by stannc View Post

So I guess Time Warner just wants you to grit your teeth and bear it? biggrin.gif
ENJOY "BETTER"rolleyes.gif
post #18231 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by stannc View Post

So I guess Time Warner just wants you to grit your teeth and bear it? biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by davehancock View Post

ENJOY "BETTER"rolleyes.gif

They know they have people stuck in a rut and don't care. Most are not knowledgeable enough to actually see how bad it is, so they just accept it as "that's just the way it is". The other option is to just turn it off, but even then TWC has some of us over the barrel because they are the only game in town for Internet. I'm still awaiting the phone call back from TWC to discuss pricing for my downgrade. Yep, I talked to two differenenr reps and they couldn't tell me how much service would be for their products. Someone has to call me back to tell me how much my bill will be if I drop from Sig Home to 30/5 Internet & just the CableCard? I'm sure that call will never come.
post #18232 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post


They know they have people stuck in a rut and don't care. Most are not knowledgeable enough to actually see how bad it is, so they just accept it as "that's just the way it is". The other option is to just turn it off, but even then TWC has some of us over the barrel because they are the only game in town for Internet. I'm still awaiting the phone call back from TWC to discuss pricing for my downgrade. Yep, I talked to two different reps and they couldn't tell me how much service would be for their products. Someone has to call me back to tell me how much my bill will be if I drop from Sig Home to 30/5 Internet & just the CableCard? I'm sure that call will never come.

It does seem that the average Dish sub is more knowledgeable than the cable sub. How is Direct TV/Dish Network's Customer Service Relationship? Do they seem to care? Or is there just as much knowledge and disparity depending on who you get and where you live like with TWC? My guess is that the Dish customer relationship is better because it is not so diverse with different nodes, boxes, divisions, and micro-management. To get things balanced, TWC needs better CSR and cable TV boxes/guides across the board. Dsih systems need the greatness of TWC Phone and Internet,, in addition TWC's great retention deal discounts. Cable in our area also has more HD, but again there is large disparity with cable from division to division, I think for ALL major cable operators. The competition gives you a better TV STB/Guide. TWC gives better deals, Phone, Internet, and discounts. The catch twenty-two is, I think you have to be a Triple Play sub, forced into their crappy boxes and guide to get the best deals, and know how to call about once a year for discount rates. The competition sucks most of the time for discount rates, once your one to two year promotion expires.

Jack
post #18233 of 18549
Jack, I'm simply asking for what the standard rate is for 30/5 Internet with a CableCard? That's it! -nothing more, nothing less. Nobody knows. It's some giant secret. If they want to offer a promo rate then fine. I'm just trying to get the rate so I can decide if keeping cable is worth it or not. It's a friggin joke.
post #18234 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

Jack, I'm simply asking for what the standard rate is for 30/5 Internet with a CableCard? That's it! -nothing more, nothing less. Nobody knows. It's some giant secret. If they want to offer a promo rate then fine. I'm just trying to get the rate so I can decide if keeping cable is worth it or not. It's a friggin joke.
From your description (30/5 Internet with a CableCard), it sounds like you want digital cable service but don't want to pay for it. You, of course, need digital cable service to use that CableCard with. I don't think that the TW scripts know how to deal with that. (Of course, if it isn't on the script the CSR can't deal with it.)
post #18235 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by davehancock View Post

From your description (30/5 Internet with a CableCard), it sounds like you want digital cable service but don't want to pay for it. You, of course, need digital cable service to use that CableCard with. I don't think that the TW scripts know how to deal with that. (Of course, if it isn't on the script the CSR can't deal with it.)

Err - why would he want a cable card without digital cable..? Here they WILL NOT tell you over the phone. They will ONLY ask for everything you want, then give you a total.

Here are the prices in Austin for reference.


Digital TV $49.99
CableCARD with Tuning Adapter $2.50
Extreme (up to 30Mbps) $64.99
Total Charges* $117.48

I did this using the web system with a fake address as a new customer and making sure not to select any 'package' deals.

I totally agree they are VERY annoying about not having a straight-forward pricing system. I am sure you could get this for $90 or less if you negotiate a package. Right now here you can get the above for $79.99 WITH HBO for a year.

I have resigned myself to having to call and complain every year - which has worked for me but is ANNOYING.

xnappo
Edited by xnappo - 7/16/13 at 8:21am
post #18236 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenJF3 View Post

Jack, I'm simply asking for what the standard rate is for 30/5 Internet with a CableCard? That's it! -nothing more, nothing less. Nobody knows. It's some giant secret. If they want to offer a promo rate then fine. I'm just trying to get the rate so I can decide if keeping cable is worth it or not. It's a friggin joke.

Oh I agree Ben!

Too many frigging secrets over at TWC! I years ago was looking for general consolidated price lists, found nothing!

Jack
post #18237 of 18549
On the first page of my printed bill this month is a separate page giving me a "special" offer to increase my Internet speed to the next tier for only $10/month (price good for 12 months). There's crap on there about offering it to their best customers, increased data rate for streaming media, enjoy speeds "up to 20Mbs", blah, blah, blah.

So, I fire up speedtest.net and measure my download speed......I averaged 23 to 26Mbs over several tests on different days.....I'm wondering if I pay them $10 more per month are they going to cut my speed down to 20Mbps or what biggrin.gif
post #18238 of 18549
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhall1 View Post

On the first page of my printed bill this month is a separate page giving me a "special" offer to increase my Internet speed to the next tier for only $10/month (price good for 12 months). There's crap on there about offering it to their best customers, increased data rate for streaming media, enjoy speeds "up to 20Mbs", blah, blah, blah.

So, I fire up speedtest.net and measure my download speed......I averaged 23 to 26Mbs over several tests on different days.....I'm wondering if I pay them $10 more per month are they going to cut my speed down to 20Mbps or what biggrin.gif

Same here. I pay for 15Mbs and get 25.

Not complaining on this one smile.gif

xnappo
post #18239 of 18549
When I say CableCard I mean digital cable. I don't want any set tops. I'm not asking for anything free. I am determining if the rate with digital plus Internet is worth it. If not, I'll go Internet only. I thought about going into a base package for net as downstream speeds are generally faster than advertised. However, I need a better upstream than 1mbps for file transfers. I've resigned to the fact that the household can live without cable. Even the wife doesn't care. If the price is right we'd keep it to have. Otherwise, we are content with OTA via Media Center and streaming options.
post #18240 of 18549
Try talking to them, but from a different direction: First choose which Internet Speed Level that has the UPLINK Speed you can live with:
http://www.timewarnercable.com/en/residential-home/internet/internet-service-plans.html.html
For example, Turbo ($54.99/mo) is 20 Mbps Down and 2 Mbps UP whereas Extreme ($64.99/mo) is 30 Mbps Down and 5 Mbps UP. Note that these prices are valid for one year, so you should ask whether these are a special introductory rate (probably not)....they can't tell you the rate at the end of one year cuz THEY don't know, but it doesn't hurt to ask about locking down a TWO-YEAR rate which they frequently offer.....but you might need to wait a few months before they'll reconsider.

MOST cable systems are equipped with remotely programmable Tier Filters that are intended to either kill ALL channels or kill just the "Expanded Analog" Tier from about Ch20+ thru about Ch70+ (numbers vary from system to system).....which may be shrinking as they go (almost) "All Digital".

Since they aren't equipped with Tier Filters that can kill ALL channels EXCEPT for the Cable Modem Frequencies, it is HIGHLY LIKELY that an Internet ONLY package will also let through the the lower analog channels (e.g. Ch2 thru your Ch14) and ALL digital tier channels on QAM carriers above about Ch70 or maybe 100. So MOST LIKELY you'll also be able to watch UNENCRYPTED QAM channels, such as local HD stations, government, e.g. CSPAN and some shopping channels and MAYBE some of the local FM channels (unless they moved them to (your) Ch15 to Ch70+ band and kill them with the Tier Filter). You don't NEED a CableCARD to watch these Unencrypted QAM channels, but it can help to map the frequently changing QAM channel assignments (e.g. 121.3742) into a more recognizable virtual channel number.

If you want one or more of the Digital Tier offerings, TWC reps don't seem to understand how to sell them without also including at least one STB rather than just CableCARDS...must not be a menu item on their computer screen to delete. Perhaps you need to go-along with letting them give you an STB as part of the Bundle/Tier package plus however many CableCARDS you need and then RETURN THE STB FOR CREDIT....this is probably easier to do IN PERSON....where they can readily grab a supervisor to help out with your unusual order.

Obviously (?), you won't see exactly what you want offered as a standard Bundle (bottom of webpage cited above)....but it may turn out their "Digital TV + Basic Internet" ($79.99/mo, incl 40 Music Choice & 160+ TV Channels) is a good starting point to inquire about the additional cost to upgrade to either Turbo or Extreme Internet Speeds.

BTW: The channel listing pdf link isn't working....and I needed to enter a valid street address (I randomly picked a Sports Bar in East Syracuse) to see some additional info..."What's Included" did NOT say whether the cost of one or two STBs was included, so I'm assuming that hardware will be priced separately, whether CableCARD or STB or DVR (which should have an additional "DVR Service" Fee...but these prices aren't mentioned here).

If you sort by price, you should see all of the Bundle offerings (read fine print at bottom), plus a (mostly useless) link re CableCARD, plus links to Customize your order and (FINALLY) a link to see the Channel Lineup (NOT working???? Read fine print at bottom)...and the pdf download link WORKS:
http://www.timewarnercable.com/content/twc/en/residential-home/tv/channels/channel-lineup.html
Note that remaining Analog channels "Basic Tier" are in BLUE.

When I followed the process to order a Bundle, it allowed me to select JUST the number of CableCARDs I wanted with NO STBs. I also had a full selection of Internet Speed, Digital Tiers, Premiums, etc. Here is what I got:
Code:
Digital TV + Basic Internet Bundle (200+ Channels of which 40 are Music Choice):

TV:
Selections      One-Time Charges        Monthly Charges
Bundle Price                            $79.99
For 12 Months
        
Digital TV                              Included
No Special Offer                        Included
3 CableCARDs™                           $7.50           [$2.50 Each]
2 Outlets                               Included        
Outlet          $24.99  [I think this is initial one-time CableCARD set-up fee]
        
Internet:
Turbo (up to 20Mbps)                    $20.00
Internet Modem                          $ 4.99          [Unless you buy your own DOCSIS 3.0]
Outlet                                  Included        
Total Charges*  $24.99                  $112.48

Edited by holl_ands - 7/16/13 at 12:33pm
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